Welcome to HHO Towing Clinic

[rachi20x]

Hi there Rog! I haven't been active on this forum in ages, but have recently purchased a trailer. My lovely boyfriend has his B+E and drives his defender 110 so no problems when he's available. However, he is due to join the marines in September! Well obviously with him being away I will have even more time to go on outings with my little cob. Unfortunately we are both young- 22 and not living together. Chances are his parents will make use of the landy while he's away and I highly doubt I could borrow it (with it being rather pricey and sought after these days...).

I am trying to do some research if my Mum's (who is pre 1997 license holding) volvo xc60 AWD manual could tow my trailer....

1) BE
2 - Unladen/empty weight of the towing vehicle- is this the kerb weight?? if so the volvo website is saying 1879kg.
3 - GVW of the towing vehicle ??? It's an '11 plate if that helps?
4 - GTW and/or towing capacity of the towing vehicle- towing capacity 1800kg
5 - Plated MAM of the trailer or if no plate then the load rating on the tyres- old trailer- bahill (but well looked after)- i bought new tyres last week and if i believe correctly each tyre had a load rating of 700kg so x4= 2800kg? (EDIT- looking at other people's MAM, mine can't be right... will do some research re the trailer)
6 - Unladen/empty weight of the trailer. Can't find this as bahill are no longer in existence but it's a double. I've been advised it weighs no more than 900kg.

Could it tow? Also if I could be insured on this car can I get away with towing on my B license? Not the end of the world, my Mum is happy to be a pony taxi.

If not I will have to consider trading in my lovely little jimny for a bigger 4x4 that can tow my trailer and pony!

I hope I've included the right info!! many thanks!

 

[ROG]

Hi there Rog! I haven't been active on this forum in ages, but have recently purchased a trailer. My lovely boyfriend has his B+E and drives his defender 110 so no problems when he's available. However, he is due to join the marines in September! Well obviously with him being away I will have even more time to go on outings with my little cob. Unfortunately we are both young- 22 and not living together. Chances are his parents will make use of the landy while he's away and I highly doubt I could borrow it (with it being rather pricey and sought after these days...).

I am trying to do some research if my Mum's (who is pre 1997 license holding) volvo xc60 AWD manual could tow my trailer....

1) BE
2 - Unladen/empty weight of the towing vehicle- is this the kerb weight?? if so the volvo website is saying 1879kg.
3 - GVW of the towing vehicle ??? It's an '11 plate if that helps?
4 - GTW and/or towing capacity of the towing vehicle- towing capacity 1800kg
5 - Plated MAM of the trailer or if no plate then the load rating on the tyres- old trailer- bahill (but well looked after)- i bought new tyres last week and if i believe correctly each tyre had a load rating of 700kg so x4= 2800kg? (EDIT- looking at other people's MAM, mine can't be right... will do some research re the trailer)
6 - Unladen/empty weight of the trailer. Can't find this as bahill are no longer in existence but it's a double. I've been advised it weighs no more than 900kg.

Could it tow? Also if I could be insured on this car can I get away with towing on my B license? Not the end of the world, my Mum is happy to be a pony taxi.

If not I will have to consider trading in my lovely little jimny for a bigger 4x4 that can tow my trailer and pony!

I hope I've included the right info!! many thanks!

Do YOU have B+E ?

 

[ROG]

Volvo is about 2500 GVW and trailer is 2800 MAM so that = 5300 which is way over the 3500 max for B licence towing

No probs with B+E as long as no more than 900 is loaded into the trailer

MUM can supervise you driving it with L plates and does not need to be insured unless MUM is driving

 

[rachi20x]

I do not. However the mother is indeed happy to play taxi a few outings next year until I finish university. I currently do a lot of motorway driving to uni so it's not very economical to fork out for a towing vehicle and to do my BE just yet.
That can be on the agenda once I've graduated.

Thanks Rog, good to know the Volvo will help us in the interim.

 

[ROG]

I do not. However the mother is indeed happy to play taxi a few outings next year until I finish university. I currently do a lot of motorway driving to uni so it's not very economical to fork out for a towing vehicle and to do my BE just yet.
That can be on the agenda once I've graduated.

Thanks Rog, good to know the Volvo will help us in the interim.

Are you going to tow it or are you going to make poor MUM do it ?

 

[rachi20x]

My poor MUM has assured me she is happy to, she used to ferry my old pony and our old single trailer around when i was younger! Of course I would show my gratitude with all the red wine and cheese (after the driving of course!)

I would like to stick the L plates on and have her as a passenger so i can get some practice in. That would give us an option of sharing the driving too.

 

[ROG]

My poor MUM has assured me she is happy to, she used to ferry my old pony and our old single trailer around when i was younger! Of course I would show my gratitude with all the red wine and cheese (after the driving of course!)

I would like to stick the L plates on and have her as a passenger so i can get some practice in. That would give us an option of sharing the driving too.

Ask MUMs insurer how much to have you fully comp on the car and then YOU do all the towing and reversing because that will be great practice for any future B+E test as well as keeping the cost right down - possibly do training AM and test PM

 

[rachi20x]

Great shout Rog. Will speak to her later and get onto it. Thank you.

 

[flat3]

Hi ROG

I'd be grateful for some advice on my situation.

I have a Nissan Qashqai (https://www.carleasingmadesimple.com/car-leasing/nissan/qashqai-hatchback/73659/) and am in the market for a trailer for my cob who weights about 550kg. I will only tow him and it'll be for short, local journeys on good surfaces.

1 - What licence they hold - B
2 - Unladen/empty weight of the towing vehicle - 1365kg
3 - GVW of the towing vehicle - 1910kg
4 - GTW and/or towing capacity of the towing vehicle - max towing capacity is 1350kg
5 - Plated MAM of the trailer or if no plate then the load rating on the tyres - no trailer yet
6 - Unladen/empty weight of the trailer - no trailer yet

My car's GVW + my car's towing capacity = 3260kg, and this is our GTW, which is fine for me with a B licence as it's under 3500kg.

Your section of post 300 "There is no law or rule which states that the towing capacity of a vehicle must be able to cope with the plated MAM of a trailer but there are plenty of internet myths on this" made me wonder; would I still need to get a trailer downplated when my car's towing capacity effectively stops my B licence limit from being a restriction?

I just wanted to be clear whether I can look at older/foreign lightweight trailers where the manufacturer may not be available for downplating.

Apologies if it's a daft question, your help is much appreciated!

 

[ROG]

Hi ROG

I'd be grateful for some advice on my situation.

I have a Nissan Qashqai (https://www.carleasingmadesimple.com/car-leasing/nissan/qashqai-hatchback/73659/) and am in the market for a trailer for my cob who weights about 550kg. I will only tow him and it'll be for short, local journeys on good surfaces.

1 - What licence they hold - B
2 - Unladen/empty weight of the towing vehicle - 1365kg
3 - GVW of the towing vehicle - 1910kg
4 - GTW and/or towing capacity of the towing vehicle - max towing capacity is 1350kg
5 - Plated MAM of the trailer or if no plate then the load rating on the tyres - no trailer yet
6 - Unladen/empty weight of the trailer - no trailer yet

My car's GVW + my car's towing capacity = 3260kg, and this is our GTW, which is fine for me with a B licence as it's under 3500kg.

Your section of post 300 "There is no law or rule which states that the towing capacity of a vehicle must be able to cope with the plated MAM of a trailer but there are plenty of internet myths on this" made me wonder; would I still need to get a trailer downplated when my car's towing capacity effectively stops my B licence limit from being a restriction?

I just wanted to be clear whether I can look at older/foreign lightweight trailers where the manufacturer may not be available for downplating.

Apologies if it's a daft question, your help is much appreciated!

It would not matter if the GTW was listed as 4000 for example because the B licence max of 3500 is the vehicle GVW + the plated MAM of the trailer added together

Licence wise you have 1590 to play with in regards to the trailer plated MAM ..... BUT .... actual weight is restricted to the towing capacity of 1350

The load/horse weighs 550 but allowing for a little leeway I would say you need a minimum of 600 for the trailer load

1350 - 600 = 750 max weight for the empty trailer

Bateson Derby weighs 675 empty but is plated at 1700 so would need contact with Bateson to reduce/down plate the MAM to a max of 1590 but I would opt for a down plate to 1400 so that it gives more vehicle options in the future - costs about a tenner with Bateson to do this.
http://www.batesontrailers.com/shop/horse-trailers/derby-lightweight-horse-pony/

In virtually all down plating it is up to you yo remove current plate then send it to manufacturer with the money where upon they send you new plate to fix on yourself - metal drill bit and pop rivet gun needed

Another trailer might be the Cheval Liberte gold one which weighs 720 empty but has a plated MAM of 1600
http://www.chevaltrailers.co.uk/gold-one


If no plate on a trailer then the total of all the tyre load ratings is deemed as the MAM

 

[flat3]

Very speedy and helpful response, thank you ROG

For something without a plate or from a manufacturer abroad/out of business, if the total of all the tyre load ratings gives a MAM that is too high for my set up does that mean that trailer is a no go or is there someway of restricting it like downplating does?

 

[ROG]

Very speedy and helpful response, thank you ROG

For something without a plate or from a manufacturer abroad/out of business, if the total of all the tyre load ratings gives a MAM that is too high for my set up does that mean that trailer is a no go or is there someway of restricting it like downplating does?

Trailer would be a no go

 

[flat3]

Good to know, many thanks!

 

[Ravenwood]

Hi, please could I have some help too - its all so confusing!
1. License - yes (I'm old!)
2. Empty weight of car - 1710kg
3. GVW of car - 2505kg
4. GTW of car - 4505kg
5. MAM - 2700kg
6. Unladen weight of trailer - ? (Its a new HB511 but I don't understand the type plate and can't find anything on Google to explain it but suggests the trailer should weigh 1000kg but the only two figures on the plate are 2700 & 1400 kg?)

My horse weighs 600kg maximum in the summer and the recommended max towing weight in my car handbook is 2000kg so if my trailer does weigh 1000kg I should be fine right? But how do I find out and whats the 1400kg on the type plate? (Wish I knew how to add a photo and I could show you!
Thank you

 

[ROG]

Hi, please could I have some help too - its all so confusing!
1. License - yes (I'm old!)
2. Empty weight of car - 1710kg
3. GVW of car - 2505kg
4. GTW of car - 4505kg
5. MAM - 2700kg
6. Unladen weight of trailer - ? (Its a new HB511 but I don't understand the type plate and can't find anything on Google to explain it but suggests the trailer should weigh 1000kg but the only two figures on the plate are 2700 & 1400 kg?)

My horse weighs 600kg maximum in the summer and the recommended max towing weight in my car handbook is 2000kg so if my trailer does weigh 1000kg I should be fine right? But how do I find out and whats the 1400kg on the type plate? (Wish I knew how to add a photo and I could show you!
Thank you

Max load for trailer = 1000kg

If I remember correctly 1400 is the minimum it can be down plated to ..... not certain on that but not that important

 

[Ravenwood]

That's great thanks.
So I'm good to go?
(Once I get a tow bar fitted!)

 

[ROG]

That's great thanks.
So I'm good to go?
(Once I get a tow bar fitted!)

Good to go with your B+E licence and no more than 1000kg in the trailer

 

[popsdosh]

Max load for trailer = 1000kg

If I remember correctly 1400 is the minimum it can be down plated to ..... not certain on that but not that important

The 2700 I think is MAM on trailer and 1400 is MAM on any of the individual axles. 1000 is the unladen weight.

 

[ROG]

The 2700 I think is MAM on trailer and 1400 is MAM on any of the individual axles. 1000 is the unladen weight.

I think you may be correct as it makes sense

 

[ROG]

Thank you!





LICENCE
B or B+E = B

VEHICLE
GVW = 2260kg
Towing capacity = 2000kg
Kerb weight = 1797kg

TRAILER
Un-laden/empty = 1000kg
MAM = 2700kg

Is there a way to travel one horse legally without the B+E licence? Thank you

No

You have 2260 + 2700 = 4960 so 1460 over the 3500 B licence tow limit

Need a vehicle with perhaps a GVW of 2200 with a lightweight trailer weighing 700 empty which is plated (or down plated) at 1300 leaving 600 for the trailer load

 

[tiger_buzz]

No

You have 2260 + 2700 = 4960 so 1460 over the 3500 B licence tow limit

Need a vehicle with perhaps a GVW of 2200 with a lightweight trailer weighing 700 empty which is plated (or down plated) at 1300 leaving 600 for the trailer load

Thank you

 

[EmmaLou]

Hi Rog, new here and joined just to ask about my proposed set up so here goes :
Car: Kia Sportage KX-3 (satnav) 2.0 AWD manual 2013
My car has these figures on inside of passenger door.. Top line 2140kg which I am told is vehicle weight. 2nd line 4140kg which I am told is gross train weight so tows 2000kg
Licence - B
Trailer down plated at 1300kg. Gross weight 650-750 depending if I pick Bateson Derby or Ifor William HB403

Pretty sure from your previous posts I have this sussed out as a legal option for me.

 

[ROG]

Hi Rog, new here and joined just to ask about my proposed set up so here goes :
Car: Kia Sportage KX-3 (satnav) 2.0 AWD manual 2013
My car has these figures on inside of passenger door.. Top line 2140kg which I am told is vehicle weight. 2nd line 4140kg which I am told is gross train weight so tows 2000kg
Licence - B
Trailer down plated at 1300kg. Gross weight 650-750 depending if I pick Bateson Derby or Ifor William HB403

Pretty sure from your previous posts I have this sussed out as a legal option for me.

2140 is the max weight the vehicle can weigh = GVW

2140 + 1300 = 3440 so under the max 3500 for B licence towing

If Derby at 675 empty then max load for trailer = 625
If HB403 at 770 empty then max load for trailer = 530

 

[EmmaLou]

2140 is the max weight the vehicle can weigh = GVW

2140 + 1300 = 3440 so under the max 3500 for B licence towing

If Derby at 675 empty then max load for trailer = 625
If HB403 at 770 empty then max load for trailer = 530

Thank you, I had thought it was legal but wanted to check I had worked it out right. Very educational thread, I was very surprised to find a solution for B licence towing so easily given many say it's impossible. Thanks again.

 

[Fire sign]

Hi ROG , we are a bit new to this . Thinking of buying a 2 horse Chival Liberte trailer with 830 kg unladen weight and a Honda CRV 2.2 CDTi vehicle . Is there any possibility that this could tow 2 TB type 16 hand horses and still be legal and safe ? Am guessing they would be about 1000 kg and the Honda can tow 2000 KG. I passed my test in approx 1990 so licence should have no restrictions. Many thanks

 

[ROG]

Hi ROG , we are a bit new to this . Thinking of buying a 2 horse Chival Liberte trailer with 830 kg unladen weight and a Honda CRV 2.2 CDTi vehicle . Is there any possibility that this could tow 2 TB type 16 hand horses and still be legal and safe ? Am guessing they would be about 1000 kg and the Honda can tow 2000 KG. I passed my test in approx 1990 so licence should have no restrictions. Many thanks

Max tow limit = 2000
Empty trailer 830 + horses 1000 = 1830
170 spare

You have B+E licence

All looks ok to me for weights and licence

 

[Fire sign]

Thank you so much , that's great news , much appreciated

 

[Tayto]

Hello - I have tried to have a search to find this answer but there are so many responses I thought I would do my own post.

I recently passed the trailer test so have a B+E licence however some recent "FB debates" have worried me that my car is not safe to tow with... could you advise?

I have a 2008 2.2 CTDi Honda CR-V (diesel). Manufacturers book states max towing weight is 2000kg.

I have an ifor williams 505 and will be towing one horse weighing around 450 - 500kg... is this an ok match? Someone is trying to tell me that the car has to be capable of towing the max stamped weight (correct terminology?) which I think is around 2300kg for the 505?

Confused.com!

 

[ROG]

Hello - I have tried to have a search to find this answer but there are so many responses I thought I would do my own post.

I recently passed the trailer test so have a B+E licence however some recent "FB debates" have worried me that my car is not safe to tow with... could you advise?

I have a 2008 2.2 CTDi Honda CR-V (diesel). Manufacturers book states max towing weight is 2000kg.

I have an ifor williams 505 and will be towing one horse weighing around 450 - 500kg... is this an ok match? Someone is trying to tell me that the car has to be capable of towing the max stamped weight (correct terminology?) which I think is around 2300kg for the 505?

Confused.com!

B+E licence
2000 tow limit
Total weight being towed around 1500
500 to spare for trailer load
TOTALLY LEGAL

What you have come across is an internet MYTH in regards to the towing limit being able to accommodate the plated trailer MAM and there is no law or rule which states such

 

[Tayto]

B+E licence
2000 tow limit
Total weight being towed around 1500
500 to spare for trailer load
TOTALLY LEGAL

What you have come across is an internet MYTH in regards to the towing limit being able to accommodate the plated trailer MAM and there is no law or rule which states such

thanks so much - that puts my mind at rest as this person was determined I should not be towing with the CRV!