What are they using to get the necks?!
- Thread starter Cam Eq
- Start date
Meowy Catkin
Meow!
Fat horse plus steroids must be a huge laminitis risk... not worth it surely?
Are you implying that vets are giving horses the 'fat pad' look via plastic surgery and silicone implants now?
The only horse I know of that had a plastic surgery hoo ha was Magnum Psyche. I'm pretty sure that his trainer (the infamous American, David Boggs) claimed the horse had some sort of crib biting/wind sucking surgery on his throat but the claim was that the surgery was to make the horse's throat more refined so he'd win more shows. It was a crazy story at the time but I think fake fat pads is possibly crazier.
Melody Grey
Well-Known Member
He looks a really good shape and weight to me @jnbMy cob has a good neck and hasn't been pumped full of anything? He's just a cob (and SOME of these cobs - if that's what we are talking about - have "creative" hogs which give them the illusion of having a bigger neck than they really do).
Mine (will probably get flamed for him being overweight, he's not he is a HW cob and fed rough grass, meadow hay, Equimins Advance and Thunderbrooks Hay Cobs)
PS He is very dirty and happy in this pic having been naked and rolling in the dust
CanteringCarrot
Well-Known Member
Fat horse plus steroids is not worth the risk to most of us. However, there are some people so thirsty for a ribbon/placing and/or money that they don't care. On to the next one if that doesn't work.
I do know of a horse that had testicle implants...that was nuts (no pun intended). It was in the US, a Quarter Horse IIRC, all about looks.
Would plastic surgery in horses surprise me? No, because nothing with horse people does at this point
But I don't think it is really a "thing" fortunately.
Sometimes a good neck is purely genetics.
Meowy Catkin
Meow!
Testicle implants for horses... well you really do learn something every day!
Not_so_brave_anymore
Well-Known Member
I've got a little 12hh native mare who came to me after retiring from a very successful showing career. She now has a hideously deformed fallen crest - it's literally solid fat (she's a decent 3 body condition at the moment, ribs visible at certain angles. I don't think any amount of weight loss would shift it)
NinjaPony
Well-Known Member
Gelding late can also leave a horse cresty. My Welsh is on a constant laminitic diet and you can clearly feel ribs/see an outline, but he still has a fairly cresty neck, albeit soft. He was cut aged 4 and he’s always been like this.
PapaverFollis
Well-Known Member
Crest fat is the last to go I think so you could get a horse fat then slim it down and still have a big neck on it.
Rowreach
Adjusting my sails
I don't think there's any need for people with properly produced and fed show (or otherwise) horses to feel offended
My cob has a muscular neck and a bum, she gets a lot of hacking and hill work, and I was recently told I needed to do more hills "which will soon get rid of that backside"
But, I did recently move yards because the people who were responsible for feeding her at the last place (amateur show people) weren't giving her the forage/feed combination that I had asked them to, but were stuffing her full of all sorts of crap when I wasn't there It made no sense that she was piling on the pounds when I knew how much work she was in, until the day that I caught them out and saw what they had put in her stable - purely because they like their animals obese, and thought she wasn't carrying enough "condition".
It actually makes my blood boil.
My cob has a muscular neck and a bum, she gets a lot of hacking and hill work, and I was recently told I needed to do more hills "which will soon get rid of that backside"
But, I did recently move yards because the people who were responsible for feeding her at the last place (amateur show people) weren't giving her the forage/feed combination that I had asked them to, but were stuffing her full of all sorts of crap when I wasn't there
It made no sense that she was piling on the pounds when I knew how much work she was in, until the day that I caught them out and saw what they had put in her stable - purely because they like their animals obese, and thought she wasn't carrying enough "condition".It actually makes my blood boil.
Goldenstar
Well-Known Member
Showing is just meh,really nasty it has not a place in the modern world .
I don’t think you need to use steroid to get horses looking huge and cresty but I would not be very surprised to hear it’s been done .
Maxi cob classes are fully of dangerously obese horses , if you say that you may be told that you don’t understand about show condition , if I don’t I am glad .
It’s very hard work to keep cobs ID’s and the like slim they are work horses bred to toil hours a day they need little food because they did not breed in the past from poor doing mares .
I don’t think you need to use steroid to get horses looking huge and cresty but I would not be very surprised to hear it’s been done .
Maxi cob classes are fully of dangerously obese horses , if you say that you may be told that you don’t understand about show condition , if I don’t I am glad .
It’s very hard work to keep cobs ID’s and the like slim they are work horses bred to toil hours a day they need little food because they did not breed in the past from poor doing mares .
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Casey76
Well-Known Member
That is absolutely horrific they were feeding things outside of your instruction! What would happened if she had fallen ill as a consequence of the extra/wrong (extra wrong?) food
That really makes me angry. I’m not surprised you moved to another place.
That really makes me angry. I’m not surprised you moved to another place.
I don't think there's any need for people with properly produced and fed show (or otherwise) horses to feel offended
My cob has a muscular neck and a bum, she gets a lot of hacking and hill work, and I was recently told I needed to do more hills "which will soon get rid of that backside"
But, I did recently move yards because the people who were responsible for feeding her at the last place (amateur show people) weren't giving her the forage/feed combination that I had asked them to, but were stuffing her full of all sorts of crap when I wasn't there
It actually makes my blood boil.
Cam Eq
Well-Known Member
That is exactly why I am asking this question here in the first place!! I don’t know what they are doing but I know some people would do anything to stand out in a ring and win
AdorableAlice
Well-Known Member
Are you suggesting that a vet would inject steroids at the request of an owner to facilitate conformational change ?
Meowy Catkin
Meow!
Yes, I think they are.
AdorableAlice
Well-Known Member
As in you think vets are doing that or the OP is suggesting that happens ?
Meowy Catkin
Meow!
Sorry I should have been clearer. I have never met a Vet who would inject a horse with steroids or implant silicone pads in the horse to change its conformation.
I do think the OP thinks it might happen.
AmyMay
Situation normal
I absolutely disagree. I was very good friends several years ago with someone who had considerable success in the show ring. The horses were kept and produced beautifully- not a side rein or a risk of laminitis through obesity to be seen anywhere.
Just because some practices are abhorrent, don’t tar everyone with the same brush.
AdorableAlice
Well-Known Member
Perhaps a little education and understanding is needed.
ycbm
Einstein would be proud of my Insanity...
Fillers used for cosmetic surgery are freely available on the internet. It wouldn't surprise me one bit if the showing folk who think nothing of over feeding, dehydration as a calmer, drilling of ponies by over size adults as a warmup, etc would also think nothing of injecting human lip fillers into the neck of a show pony if they thought it would get them higher up the line.
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ycbm
Einstein would be proud of my Insanity...
There are definitely two sides to it though, aren't there AM? And one side isn't very nice at all.
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Red-1
I used to be decisive, now I'm not so sure...
I do think that someone, somewhere will be doing just this. Goodness me, some shady dealers got a vet to give them undetectable pain killer and also do positive vetting, knowing that the horses were lame. Not all vets are equal!
I find it bad that people have hock injections done as a matter of course. But then, many people do this too, vets do it. Not that much of a stretch to think that some vet, somewhere, is using a chemical to bulk a horse up for showing.
You only have to look what people do to Big Lick horses to see how depraved people can get for the sake of fame fortune and a ribbon.
Not that I think that every showing person does this.
I do think that most showing winners are over weight. While ever judges keep making obese horses into winners, that will continue.
I find it bad that people have hock injections done as a matter of course. But then, many people do this too, vets do it. Not that much of a stretch to think that some vet, somewhere, is using a chemical to bulk a horse up for showing.
You only have to look what people do to Big Lick horses to see how depraved people can get for the sake of fame fortune and a ribbon.
Not that I think that every showing person does this.
I do think that most showing winners are over weight. While ever judges keep making obese horses into winners, that will continue.
Goldenstar
Well-Known Member
TBH I think it would be very difficult to use fillers to get a crest you would need a bucket of the stuff and a good degree of skill .
AdorableAlice
Well-Known Member
And be in need of Botox yourself after the horse you are attempting to stick endless pins in, kicks your lights out together with your teeth for good measure.
I have shown at top level for some years and yes there are some undesirable and unethical practices, especially in the pony world. The only way to get a top on a hunter is to work it correctly.
Cam Eq
Well-Known Member
Not vets but yes I have seen enough to suggest it is happening
Cam Eq
Well-Known Member
I wish, but a 4 yr old can’t have been worked correctly for long enough to develop the neck of a PRE horse!!
CanteringCarrot
Well-Known Member
It's nice that some of you all think that a vet would never inject steroids to cosmetically enhance a horse...but some probably would, maybe not any that you know (which is good!). Not all vets are honest and some have questionable ethics, aka, I've seen some sh*t. There's some down right dirty stuff that happens involving vets in various circles. This happens in the US and Europe.
marmalade88
Well-Known Member
I disagree with the comments about correct work producing a crest. How many top level dressage horses do you see with the huge crests you see in the showing world? Yes they are well muscles but not a crest of FAT you see in showing. Most show horses don’t work over the back or core, which you see at the tack strip and are simply pulled into a false outline. Every show horse I’ve ever seen has been at least overweight, most are grossly obese. Ming you it’s been like that for year, it’s just more horses are fat now so it seem less extreme to people. There are people who show that have fit and happy horses but unfortunately the fat horses are rewarded and that’s what we see in the press like the article linked. I saw the pony showing at Windsor a few years ago and that was just as bad. I agree with a previous comment about most show hunters not being able to hunt for 10 minutes. Let alone 5+ hours.
As others have said OP, over feeding is really the only way to obtain an hard solid crest of the size you are thinking of. There are undoubtedly more unhanded practises but you get that in every horse sport and people will do anything to win.
Interestingly I wonder if the BSHA will be reviewing their turnout expectation re trimming of facial hair. Amateurs are far less likely to give showing a go locally if they also do BD now you cannot trim facial hair. Serious showers are unlikely to care as that’s their main sport.
As others have said OP, over feeding is really the only way to obtain an hard solid crest of the size you are thinking of. There are undoubtedly more unhanded practises but you get that in every horse sport and people will do anything to win.
Interestingly I wonder if the BSHA will be reviewing their turnout expectation re trimming of facial hair. Amateurs are far less likely to give showing a go locally if they also do BD now you cannot trim facial hair. Serious showers are unlikely to care as that’s their main sport.
Cortez
Tough but Fair
Well, yes it can.
Rowreach
Adjusting my sails
Well, she did in a way. She was put on a particular diet, after a long chat with my vet, because of certain issues that appeared after she'd been stabled for a month or so. I stripped her back to a bare minimum diet so I could play about with various supplements to find out what worked and what didn't. Then to find she'd been fed certain things which, when you investigate what the ingredients actually are, would explain a lot of things (and not just the rapid weight gain) and which meant that my carefully managed regime was in fact a waste of time. I am beyond incandescent but that's possibly not for this thread!
conniegirl
Well-Known Member
This!
My current lad has been a top show pony and won some top honors, he has never been fat. He has a massive neck as that is the way he is built and he has been schooled correctly since age 3.
When I had my youngsters they were expected to work properly from the second time they were ever sat on and they had been lunged and longreined properly for months before that. They all had correct, well muscled necks.
These first 2 are youngsters who had been under saddle for less than a year. (The first only 3 months if i recall correctly)
These 2 ponies were 20+ years old
