What do you do if a horse bites, kicks, or threatens to?

Belt them with such a fast reaction that they are in no doubt what action of theirs caused my reaction.
 
Oh OK, I don't feel like a horse beating monster now: I'd smack them too, hard, on the muzzle if they bit/tried to and wherever is closest if they kicked/tried to.
 
agree timing is everything and for biting or kicking they have to know that it's absolutely never ever acceptable.

I'm quite firm on that too. I don't think you have to whack them hard, it just has to be completely clear. A more sensitive individual would only need a small reminder, for instance, and I think it's important never to wallop a horse in anger because than can result in more force been used than necessary.

A horse can be in pain and express that in a non-violent way. I think I know my horses well enough to pick up on signals more subtle than a hoof or teeth flying my way!
 
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Depends why. Not much point hitting a terrified horse that you have overfaced. I never hit the head or face.
I would whack the chest or shoulder pretty damn hard though if I felt it was deserved.
 
Short, sharp wallop on whatever bit of the horse is most convenient at the time - timing is everything.

Although I do think it's important not to punish a horse which is terrified, has been put in a situation where it has no alternative, or if you miss the moment. It's corrective training, not revenge!
 
JFTD said:
Short, sharp wallop on whatever bit of the horse is most convenient at the time - timing is everything.

Although I do think it's important not to punish a horse which is terrified, has been put in a situation where it has no alternative, or if you miss the moment. It's corrective training, not revenge!
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Yarp .. this innit :)

My mare nipped me Tuesday night when i went to wash her down .. not acceptable, she got a quick smack and a stern no BUT she was communicating with me so although biting is not acceptable i still got the message and we will re look at the saddle (was wiping saddle patch down) and perhaps I was wiping down a bit too rushed or hard? Either way I have heard her and she has heard me and we will deal with it together .. without the need to escalate to biting or nipping because they will not be tolerated but being a mare I'm always open to a chat about things :) (makes life easier)
 
An instant growl and smack with my hand.

New pony came with sore back and sensitive to be girthed, she threatened to bite when tacking up. Got her pain sorted but the memory was there, when she threatens to bite I’d reassure her and proceed gently. Now she doesn’t do it at all.
 
A swift smack on the closest body part, D recently struck out at me in frustration with being brought in half an hour after being turned out (keeps breaking through fencing after being on box rest) and he got a very quick smack on the leg while it was still in the air and marched swiftly backwards and asked to walk with me and halt when I asked until he was being polite again.

I try and avoid head and face as he can get flinchy, although a lot of the time just squaring my shoulders and clicking my fingers at him is enough to deter any misbehaving if he gets excitable.
 
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Depends on the horse to be honest my evil from birth gelding would kill you if you hit him I generally throw things at him and shout. drive him away. A horse that is just trying it on would get either a kick on the shins for biting or a sharp smack on its neck if attempting anything else. I am firm but fair but dont believe in hitting horses on the head ever
 
Not something that happens that much with my horses I must say. However on the odd occasion someone has forgot themselves I will slap to the body once. This is not abuse as has been hinted at, it’s no more then another horse would do in the herd to one stepping out of line. It’s usless unless your timing is spot on. For example my pony Moses bit me ( totally bored,naughty, young pony ) when I was showing him, during a run up. I was unable to correct him as I was running , so I had to suck that one. However, he has never repeated it.
 
I don't like hitting because that can trigger a fear aggression response. I just become VERY big and VERY loud, much like herd members would be to a foal that overstepped the mark. Works for me with big stroppy horses, small stroppy ponies and all in between - ignorant bossy QH mare who came to stay learned when she tried to double barrel me as I herded her out of my space. She has never even thought about doing it again, even when I am around her with others' feeds
 
Sandstone1 said:
Find this thread interesting combined with reading the thread about abused horses......
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Me too! One of my boys was definitely abused in a stable and if he ever pulls faces or went to bite I would just ignore it buy turning my back to him and he generally relaxes or doesn't bother to continue with said faces. Or he would just get a very loud growl and a no.
 
Agree with some of the above posters that it depends on the circs. Not something I've ever had to grapple with before I got F, but he is a big lump at times and can out of naughtiness or impatience paw the ground or try to grab stuff (inc me). It's not kicking or biting as such but it is rude.

I tend to give him a firm slap on shoulder or bum and use my voice and body language but he's pretty stubborn and doesn't really pay it as much attention as a lot of other horses would. Have recently decided to change tack and use my voice and movement instead and see if that works better. His behaviour has improved with this so far though, it's just this last vestige of manners that I still haven't cracked.
 
Sandstone1 said:
Find this thread interesting combined with reading the thread about abused horses......
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So ofc it's a case of the circumstances - how often, how hard, and whether done in anger etc. but I really don't think a short firm reprimand for bad behavior now and again equates to abuse. That's what I've read so far on this thread.
 
Depends on the circumstance. If a Horse was just putting its ears back and not following through I would just ignore the behavior. If they bit and I was certain it wasn't pain related or fear then they would get a smack on the muzzle and a hard "Ah Ah" or NO!.

If they threatened to kick (again not pain or fear related) they would get a whack on the arse.

Obviously if it is fear related I would bring a specialist in to help if I had made no movement with the Horses behavior.

If pain related then obviously I would consult my vet (my mare started biting a bit when she was diagnosed with arthritis, I gave her a quick sharp "ah ah" and then pushed her head away from me.
 
Sandstone1 said:
Find this thread interesting combined with reading the thread about abused horses......
Click to expand...

I have no qualms about hitting a horse as a reprimand - if the timing is good, and the response is proportionate and appropriate. None of the horses I've had around over-react to stimuli or give any indication of abuse or fear, but they're all mannerly and easy to handle, and rarely - if ever - need to be reminded of their manners. I know plenty of soft-hearted owners with unruly, ignorant horses, who are confused and ill-served by their owners' hesitation and lack of clarity in their handling.

The kindest thing you can do for a horse is to instill manners - a good horse has the best chance of a good life. I've yet to encounter any system which does not involve appropriate and timely physical reprimands, which can routinely achieve this.
 
JillA said:
I don't like hitting because that can trigger a fear aggression response. I just become VERY big and VERY loud, much like herd members would be to a foal that overstepped the mark. Works for me with big stroppy horses, small stroppy ponies and all in between - ignorant bossy QH mare who came to stay learned when she tried to double barrel me as I herded her out of my space. She has never even thought about doing it again, even when I am around her with others' feeds
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This is what I do. Thats not to say i would never give a smack on the shoulder, but id never hit a horse on the head or nose etc. I wasnt accusing anyone of abuse just saying reading the two threads is interesting.
 
JFTD said:
The kindest thing you can do for a horse is to instill manners - a good horse has the best chance of a good life. .
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couldn't agree more. there are a few on my yard whose owners totally dote on them but they rear at the farrier, walk all over their owners, are generally thuggish and it's appalling to watch.

My horses know the absolute boundaries and they know which ones they can push and they are happy for it (snuffling in my pockets is tolerated with good humour but biting my hand is not, for instance).

i don't think it's abuse of the horse to instill into it that rearing at x y or z professional is absolutely not to be tolerated. And you don't have to be rough to achieve that. Just mean what you say, and say what you mean.
 
I don't think it's ever acceptable for a horse to kick or bite in normal circumstances and I would have no hesitation in giving it a slap and a sharp "no", however, as my horses have always been very mannerly I would certainly think there was probably a pain related reason for it rather than naughtiness and I would look for a cause.
 
An attempt to bite is usually met with a sharp accidental elbow, although mine occasionally gets a tiny smack on the nose if he's just pushing his luck. I would never slap a horse which was threatening to kick. If tied up I would get well out of the way and approach from a different angle and if loose, I would drive away with a fair bit of arm waving and possibly some swearing...
 
As others say, installing good manner in a horse is helping to set it up for life. How you install those manners depends on the horse and its individual circumstances.

The late chestnut git, who I posted about in the other thread, was born a brash self confident toerag who if you gave him an inch, he took a mile. He needed VERY firm handling and a fair few wallops. I made significant progress with him after he went to corner me in the stable, I sidestepped as he went to double barrel me and he kicked the stable wall hard instead, and shook himself up. He treated me with new respect after that. I was younger and more agile then, I wouldn't care to take on a similar horse now!

The rescue foster ponies who I've had needed a very different approach. Both of them, through nerves and anxiety, were inclined at first when being led in hand to strike out with a foreleg. I decided the best course of action was to ignore this, as I was sure it was due to lack of confidence, and to make sure that I positioned myself safely when handling them. Both ponies, as they settled in, stopped this habit within a fortnight.

The second pony, who had been much more nervous generally (she had been feral), started a few months in, as she got more confident, to nip me. A full on retaliation as I'd have needed to use on the late chesnut git would have been disastrous on this pony. Instead, when she nipped me I made myself quite big and backed her up smartly, and she soon gave up nipping without having any sort of meltdown. Both ponies have gone on to lovely forever homes.
 
I *never* smack the head or nose, although I certainly allow anyone who thinks of trying to bite to walk hit my elbow with their own face.
I would certainly smack, immediately, for a kick, or a near miss. I teach my horses to be well-mannered and have only ever had to correct bad behaviour caused by previous owners. I watch my horses' body language carefully, so that I can pre-empt unwanted behaviour.
 
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