When you're done with horses but horse is unsellable?

[SpotsandBays]

Most of my easiest, soundest horses have had no recorded breeding so whether they were carefully bred (which I very much doubt) or the result of field liasons, who knows?

Mine too, but I put that down to luck to be honest. And some people really do pull the short straw.
Learning and reading about more and more issues that are arising as we progress scientifically though is why I personally think that the laws on breeding should be tighter.

 

[ponynutz]

It’s not that we shouldn’t breed from “generic” horses. And if somebody has a good mare that can no longer be ridden because of an injury but they’d like a foal from her to keep for themselves then that’s not an issue at all!
Im talking more about selling a horse labelled as a broodmare just because she has no other “purpose” in life. The rescues are already beaming full of companions/young horses. I don’t think people should breed just for the sake of breeding.
(sorry for derailing the thread!)

Didn't derail!! Totally agree with you and I don't think it was your post that was the one which seemed slightly short-sighted x

 

[teapot]

Was rather shocked to see a well known and well respected equine college advertising a horse for a companion only home on Facebook earlier today ? Gone are the days of taking a lorry load to Potters.

I was surprised too, expected better frankly.

 

[nagblagger]

I have been reading this thread daily and am horrified at some of the comments.
I am in a similar situation, my 29yr old home bred is getting 'stiff', i know he's on the slippery slope. It is hard because he whinnies everyday and loves his cuddle, pleased to see me - but is he enjoying life? I don't know! He has a best friend who is 27 years (started to lose weight) - they are inseparable so do i organise for both to go together or will i be called a murderer?
At least there is only 1 other person where i keep them and she is fully aware of the situation and is nonjudgmental, its such a hard final decision so for other owners who have been criticised by fellow horse owners i admire you! Most of us will have to make this decision at some time and we, as horse owners, should be supportive at this distressing time not critical and b#tchy.
At the moment i am avoiding the decision because i have a'sensible' vet coming out next week for other equine vaccinations, she will give me an honest opinion. This is not my first time and won't be the last - but a horse i bred and have had for 29 years is definitely one of the hardest.

In summary, OP, I support whatever you decision you make.

 

[Barton Bounty]

I have been reading this thread daily and am horrified at some of the comments.
I am in a similar situation, my 29yr old home bred is getting 'stiff', i know he's on the slippery slope. It is hard because he whinnies everyday and loves his cuddle, pleased to see me - but is he enjoying life? I don't know! He has a best friend who is 27 years (started to lose weight) - they are inseparable so do i organise for both to go together or will i be called a murderer?
At least there is only 1 other person where i keep them and she is fully aware of the situation and is nonjudgmental, its such a hard final decision so for other owners who have been criticised by fellow horse owners i admire you! Most of us will have to make this decision at some time and we, as horse owners, should be supportive at this distressing time not critical and b#tchy.
At the moment i am avoiding the decision because i have a'sensible' vet coming out next week for other equine vaccinations, she will give me an honest opinion. This is not my first time and won't be the last - but a horse i bred and have had for 29 years is definitely one of the hardest.

In summary, OP, I support whatever you decision you make.

You do what you feel is right and sod everyone else, if they cant be supportive then that say more about them than you!

 

[paddy555]

You do what you feel is right and sod everyone else, !

I think threads like these are interesting and there are a lot of different views. However I would never, ever in a hundred millions years ask for advice as to whether I should have a horse PTS on here. No way.

The only person I ask is myself. Then I say to OH "I don't think this (illness/problem) is going to turn out too well" and just about all the time he agrees so we go into it with a united front. Then we tell the vet what is going to happen, no examination, no questions just get on and do it.
Still sadly a miserable experience but no worse than it needs to be.

 

[Barton Bounty]

I think threads like these are interesting and there are a lot of different views. However I would never, ever in a hundred millions years ask for advice as to whether I should have a horse PTS on here. No way.

The only person I ask is myself. Then I say to OH "I don't think this (illness/problem) is going to turn out too well" and just about all the time he agrees so we go into it with a united front. Then we tell the vet what is going to happen, no examination, no questions just get on and do it.
Still sadly a miserable experience but no worse than it needs to be.

Exactly! No one needs any permission or feel the need to explain themselves either ?

 

[marmalade76]

I have been reading this thread daily and am horrified at some of the comments.
I am in a similar situation, my 29yr old home bred is getting 'stiff', i know he's on the slippery slope. It is hard because he whinnies everyday and loves his cuddle, pleased to see me - but is he enjoying life? I don't know! He has a best friend who is 27 years (started to lose weight) - they are inseparable so do i organise for both to go together or will i be called a murderer?
At least there is only 1 other person where i keep them and she is fully aware of the situation and is nonjudgmental, its such a hard final decision so for other owners who have been criticised by fellow horse owners i admire you! Most of us will have to make this decision at some time and we, as horse owners, should be supportive at this distressing time not critical and b#tchy.
At the moment i am avoiding the decision because i have a'sensible' vet coming out next week for other equine vaccinations, she will give me an honest opinion. This is not my first time and won't be the last - but a horse i bred and have had for 29 years is definitely one of the hardest.

In summary, OP, I support whatever you decision you make.

My YO had her last two horses PTS together, one had only one eye and was going blind in the remaining eye, the other, a homebred, had been retired for years and was becoming more & more unsound. Although it's hard for us (took my YO a while to get over it) it's the best thing for a pair of friends who've spent many years together.

 

[meleeka]

I think threads like these are interesting and there are a lot of different views. However I would never, ever in a hundred millions years ask for advice as to whether I should have a horse PTS on here. No way.

The only person I ask is myself. Then I say to OH "I don't think this (illness/problem) is going to turn out too well" and just about all the time he agrees so we go into it with a united front. Then we tell the vet what is going to happen, no examination, no questions just get on and do it.
Still sadly a miserable experience but no worse than it needs to be.

That’s how it worked for me too. The only person that has to be at peace with the decision is the person making it. It’s them that has to live with it, nobody else.

 

[whizzer]

A few years back I rehomed a young,unrideable horse to be a surrogate for embryo transfer foals,I'd also looked into the blood bank as well. If neither of these had worked out I would've had her euthanized. I'd already spent a lot of money trying to get her rideable & I couldn't afford to keep her & get another one to ride.

 

[Winters100]

A few years back I rehomed a young,unrideable horse to be a surrogate for embryo transfer foals,I'd also looked into the blood bank as well. If neither of these had worked out I would've had her euthanized. I'd already spent a lot of money trying to get her rideable & I couldn't afford to keep her & get another one to ride.

Sorry, I know that I am perhaps in a minority here, but to me it is astonishing that it could be considered socially acceptable to PTS just for the purpose of replacing a horse with something more 'useful'.

I 100% agree that when funds do not allow one to offer proper care, or when the horse is too 'broken' to have a happy retirement, that this is the right course of action, because it is in the best interests of the horse. But you would have PTS just to replace the horse? Is it in the best interests of the horse to be PTS just so that his/her place may be taken by another? We all talk about respecting our animals and not treating them as machines, to me to put one of mine to sleep just to have something to ride is exactly that. If you simply view your horses as tools fine, but in my opinion living beings are not just tools or toys.

 

[paddy555]

Sorry, I know that I am perhaps in a minority here, but to me it is astonishing that it could be considered socially acceptable to PTS just for the purpose of replacing a horse with something more 'useful'.

I 100% agree that when funds do not allow one to offer proper care, or when the horse is too 'broken' to have a happy retirement, that this is the right course of action, because it is in the best interests of the horse. But you would have PTS just to replace the horse? Is it in the best interests of the horse to be PTS just so that his/her place may be taken by another? We all talk about respecting our animals and not treating them as machines, to me to put one of mine to sleep just to have something to ride is exactly that. If you simply view your horses as tools fine, but in my opinion living beings are not just tools or toys.

I agree with you as I did last night. However I think we may be in a minority of 2 ATM. Anyone care to join us?

 

[Barton Bounty]

I agree with you as I did last night. However I think we may be in a minority of 2 ATM. Anyone care to join us?

No, I agree with you both. As I have said above. PTS only after all other avenues exhausted. Not just willy nilly pts for the sake

 

[nagblagger]

I think having 16 field ornaments speaks for me! No I don't own land.

 

[stangs]

I agree with you as I did last night. However I think we may be in a minority of 2 ATM. Anyone care to join us?

I’ll join.

My boy’s non-ridden presently, and I don’t know if he’ll stand up to any kind of proper ridden work. I miss riding, but seeing how much fun he has going for hacks in hand more than makes up for it. And he makes a great walking companion for me, better companion than most people I’ve walked with. I can’t fathom the idea that another owner might have put him to sleep because he isn’t rideable.

Until death do us part, I would have thought, not “until I can’t use you to achieve my ridden goals”.

 

[Soap On A Rope]

Birker .. marmalade gave an opinion that is all . forgive me if I’m wrong here , but it looks as though you are taking this thread too personally.
I understand you are having a tough time and I’m sorry for that . But for your own sanity step back . Lari is lucky to have you fight his corner and I hope he improves . God knows you need to good luck .

As for the PTS debate .. here’s my Opinion.. it’s no one’s business apart form the person who owns the horse and the vet treating .
What would I do ? If I was in OP situation I’d like to think I’d PTS. Way too many horror stories out there .
My old girl is 24 and has been retired for quite some years now . Is she completely pain free , I’m hazarding a guess no . But at the minute I can say with a good degree of certainty that she is happy . The minute I think she’s not I will let her go . But while she’s bucking, farting and galloping with her grandkids she will be left to enjoy her retirement. I will know when the time is right . After all I see her every day and have done for the past 19years . So think I’m best placed to make that call rather than a load of forum members who don’t know her or our set up .

Birker always takes threads too personally...

 

[marmalade76]

I agree with you as I did last night. However I think we may be in a minority of 2 ATM. Anyone care to join us?

You can add me too, I've never had a horse PTS so I could replace it, I had mine PTS when their health issues became too much. The first, I only had him so just didn't ride (apart from a bit of hacking on mates' horses), with the others, I had more than one.

 

[Bernster]

I’ve known people keep their horse for far longer than I would before PTS. And others who have PTS when I wouldn’t. Whilst I would have taken another path it’s not my decision and I’m not going to judge them when I’m not in their shoes. The amount of judgement, and apparent lack of empathy on this thread, make me sad.

 

[Laurac13]

I have 2 field ornaments one is a pony companion the other my 11 year old horse was retired over a year ago due to neurological issues, so I haven’t ridden for a very long time, can’t afford a 3rd but I love caring for my boys ?

 

[DizzyDoughnut]

I agree with you as I did last night. However I think we may be in a minority of 2 ATM. Anyone care to join us?

I'd like to join, I haven't had a rideable horse for years now but I have had very happy ponies that have lived a good healthy life with me until a time where it was in their best interests to PTS due to illness or old age catching up with them, I could not put them down just because I couldn't ride them and I won't sell them on so they stay and enjoy their life with their friends. I wouldn't however keep a horse going that was ill or in pain, they would get a put down at home where they were happy. I do now have a 3 year old as well so hopefully next year I might finally get to ride one of my own ponies but if for whatever reason he turns out not to be rideable but is otherwise happy and healthy he will also have a home for life with me. I also don't have my own land or unlimited funds. However I would never judge someone that did decide to PTS it's just not the choice for me unless it was a choice between them and or food for my family.

 

[ponynutz]

I agree with you as I did last night. However I think we may be in a minority of 2 ATM. Anyone care to join us?

I'm with you. II'm just enjoying seeing everyone's opinions and so far it's been a fairly tame thread in regards to it not being derailed with arguments

 

[whizzer]

Sorry, I know that I am perhaps in a minority here, but to me it is astonishing that it could be considered socially acceptable to PTS just for the purpose of replacing a horse with something more 'useful'.

I 100% agree that when funds do not allow one to offer proper care, or when the horse is too 'broken' to have a happy retirement, that this is the right course of action, because it is in the best interests of the horse. But you would have PTS just to replace the horse? Is it in the best interests of the horse to be PTS just so that his/her place may be taken by another? We all talk about respecting our animals and not treating them as machines, to me to put one of mine to sleep just to have something to ride is exactly that. If you simply view your horses as tools fine, but in my opinion living beings are not just tools or toys.

My horse,my choice, wasn't asking for opinions.
I'd spent 2 years & somewhere in the region of £12,00 trying to sort this mare out. And yes if I'd not been able to rehome as surrogate or to blood bank I would've PTS her, I wasn't prepared to pay out to keep her for 15-20 odd years & not be able to afford one to ride,they're an expensive pet,neither was I going to risk rehoming to some random person as a field companion. If money was no object or I had my own land it would be a different story. I don't view my horses as tools or machines at all,in fact at the same time I had this mare I also had a retired horse who I'd had through thick & thin for nearly 20 years,I expected him to be with me for quite a few more years & that was also a deciding factor in not keeping her as I couldn't afford them plus a 3rd,I lost him to colic 3 days after she went. I didn't come here for an argument or other people's opinions so this is my only & final reply on the matter.

 

[Peglo]

My horse,my choice, wasn't asking for opinions.
I'd spent 2 years & somewhere in the region of £12,00 trying to sort this mare out. And yes if I'd not been able to rehome as surrogate or to blood bank I would've PTS her, I wasn't prepared to pay out to keep her for 15-20 odd years & not be able to afford one to ride,they're an expensive pet,neither was I going to risk rehoming to some random person as a field companion. If money was no object or I had my own land it would be a different story. I don't view my horses as tools or machines at all,in fact at the same time I had this mare I also had a retired horse who I'd had through thick & thin for nearly 20 years,I expected him to be with me for quite a few more years & that was also a deciding factor in not keeping her as I couldn't afford them plus a 3rd,I lost him to colic 3 days after she went. I didn't come here for an argument or other people's opinions so this is my only & final reply on the matter.

I agree, it’s your horse, your decision and I don’t judge you for that. But everyone is just saying what they would do.

personally I wouldn’t PTS to replace. For years I had my 2 oldies and enjoyed having them more than riding. I was in a position to have a 3rd horse so one wasn’t left by herself when the time came for one to be PTS and that’s what happened. 2 is a more comfortable amount for me but I did love having my 3

on the other hand I wouldn’t spend £12,000 to try and fix a horse if they could be happy in the field not ridden. I don’t think I’m right or wrong in that as I don’t think you were wrong to try. It’s just what I would do.

 

[maya2008]

On the ethics front, it is not a welfare issue to pts a horse. We live in a country where most people eat meat - the cows we have watched grow up on the local farm went to market last week. If it is socially acceptable to send them to slaughter to eat them, then it’s ok to pts an unrideable horse so the owner has the funds to get another. Apparently even PETA think pts is ok since they like to do so for healthy puppies etc that could find loving homes!

 

[ycbm]

For years I had my 2 oldies and enjoyed having them more than riding

This is the crux of it all, really, though it may be too much psychological gobbledegook for some.

In all our actions in life we all do what makes us feel best. In some situations that's what makes us feel least bad, but it's the same thing. So people who are keeping horses alive that others would not are doing what makes them feel right in their heads and comfortable in their skin. And people who have horses PTS earlier are doing exactly the same. And some people would fall apart completely if they couldn't ever ride their own horse again, and can't afford to keep another. And unless people have the ability to get inside that owner's head, they have absolutely no moral right to voice their criticism of what anyone else legally chooses to do with their horse.
.

 

[Slightlyconfused]

Wow this thread has really taken off!

Its definitely helped reassure me that pts would be the best option given the circumstances.

This type of horse is the perfect candidate to end up being passed on or being pushed to do more than she is capable of. She hides her lameness well - so well that the physio and original vet who assessed her told me I was imagining things and it was only when I pushed for referal and full lameness work up plus xrays and scans that her issues were identified.

Her sweet itch and weight issues are a huge deterrent and I have real concerns about my long term ability to manage her weight and avoid lami since she's retired (she's obese despite being on restricted grazing since last summer).

My current plan is to give her one more summer (assuming no health issues arise) and pts September next year (although the thought of this makes me feel quite ill).

I know some people may think I'm just dragging it out but she is happy now, I can afford her for now and if either of those things change I can bring things forward but it gives me plenty of time to come to terms with it and enjoy some time with her rather than feeling it a chore that I'm permanently tied to - I hope that makes some sense!

This is pretty much what we did with our wb mare.

Was only in pain when saddle was on her back with a rider on so retired at 13 with the knowledge that if money got tight she would be pts in the home that she felt safe and wasnt ear twitch or beaten.

We could afford to keep for retired while she was happy bombing about in the feild like a loon ? she was perfect to handle etc. Would never have passed her on as her breeding was amazing and she jumped like a stag so would have been bute up to the eyeballs.

As soon as she started showing mild lameness/being off we mildly imvestigated just for my peace of mind. Then we pts, could have managed her with one danilion a day but it would have been for me not her so we didnt. To look at her you would think she was healthly and sound.

So in a long way of saying it, i think you are doing the right thing for you.

 

[dogatemysalad]

Sorry, I know that I am perhaps in a minority here, but to me it is astonishing that it could be considered socially acceptable to PTS just for the purpose of replacing a horse with something more 'useful'.

I 100% agree that when funds do not allow one to offer proper care, or when the horse is too 'broken' to have a happy retirement, that this is the right course of action, because it is in the best interests of the horse. But you would have PTS just to replace the horse? Is it in the best interests of the horse to be PTS just so that his/her place may be taken by another? We all talk about respecting our animals and not treating them as machines, to me to put one of mine to sleep just to have something to ride is exactly that. If you simply view your horses as tools fine, but in my opinion living beings are not just tools or toys.

This is my attitude too. I would not PTS so that i could replace it with another horse. Mine are always retired, because the day I bought them, was the day I took responsibility to do my best for them. I don't care about my horses because they are rideable, I care for them because they are horses.

 

[paddy555]

This is my attitude too. I would not PTS so that i could replace it with another horse. Mine are always retired, because the day I bought them, was the day I took responsibility to do my best for them. I don't care about my horses because they are rideable, I care for them because they are horses.

totally. The minute I buy a horse I am aware that tomorrow it could become unrideable and may have to spend the rest of it's life in retirement.

 

[Slightlyconfused]

I really dont think it does at all. My grandmother who lived to her 90s was in a lot of pain from arthritis despite all sorts of heavy duty painkillers. Morphine didnt take the pain away, just made her sleep and not care. Obviously, at 90plus she had fairly damaged joints but even in her 60s when it started, she struggled despite pain relief.

You hear people say the same thing over and over. I know paracetamol wont touch the aching in bones I've broken either, but I dont take anything stronger yet.

This

I am on a lot of medication for my arthritis diagnosed at 28 and nearly ten years later i still havent found a pain killer that totally works.

My meds help slow down the process but the pain is just muted a bit. I have constant low level discomfort / pain that i just have to live with and is worse with in activity.

 

[Slightlyconfused]

My worst was getting guilt tripped by a bloody vet!

19yo tb type. Ex-Eventer. Retired at 12 for lameness issues. Cushings from 14 (acth at diagnosis >500). Maintained on Bute and prascend for 5 years. Was dust sensitive so would get snotty if in unless very well managed.

Id always said he could have his retirement for as long as he was happy, sufficiently pain free/limited, and could graze unrestricted in a herd.

At 19 he got mild laminitis.

I called the vet to put him down.

I came away feeling like a murderer and agreeing to X-rays, box rest and remedial shoes.

Next time I just called the hunt.

My 24 year old welsh came down with lami in all four hooves and then coliced from the pain, she was retired anyway. The vet that came out out of hours wanted to try and get her through it and wouldnt listen that she had arthritis and coliced on box rest. We manged to get her through the colic and comfy over night.

The next morning i called the head vet and he came out and pts. He completely agreed with our choice as he had known her for years. He also had a word with the other vet and she left a few months later for some unknown reason.

Its horrid when vets make you feel guilty