Whose horse is it anyway? rant, sorry

Take it from someone who lost their confidence. When you are on a good yard, where people help you and encourage you, it really helps you get it back!
 
Good for you strawberryfields....

Op, hadnt appreciated you had an injury - apols. Hope you manage to find a solution.
 
KrankyKaty said:
I always think i'm the only one :o but i'm going to have a look around and see whats out there.
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I reached a point where I wasn't even sure what confidence was any more! Then we moved to be closer to home. Wow...support at new yard was incredible, and made the world of difference.

Definately find another yard, OP. Ask your friend and your instructor if they know of one.
 
Short answer = he's your horse. Sounds to me like they're not doing the best job if he's still being lunged 15 months on . . . and, as for not keeping you informed, that's ridiculous.

When Kal was on full/schooling livery, I had a text every time he had been worked with an update and I always had the opportunity to go and see him schooled - no questions asked. Other than my trainer, no'one sat on him without my permission. Even now, with Z schooling him for me (and she's a pro), I always know when she's riding, I always watch when she schools and we chat about how he's going - and I'm not paying her!

Honestly, I would move yards and find yourself a trainer to come to YOU so that you always know when he's being worked, can actually see his progress, have control over who sits on him and can discuss the training plan with whoever you choose to school him.

Best of luck.

P
 
Wagtail said:
Three possibilities come to mind when I read your post.

1. The yard owner may take extreme pride in her work and be concerned that another person riding the youngster may be detrimental to his training and look bad on her, as she has been in charge of his training so far.
2. She maybe is not riding the youngster as often as you are paying her for, or at all!
3. The youngster's training is not going well.

I cannot see any good reason why she should not keep you informed of when she is riding him. That is very suspicious to me. Either that or she just prefers to do it alone. Sometimes I prefer to school horses without someone being there chatting to me. People can get on your nerves if they are always around. Some more than others.
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I would also be suspicious as I had the same thing with my horse and also another livery at the same yard experienced this. I would arrange for him to be schooled and occasionally I would like to watch to see progress and what she was doing and funnily enough every time we arranged it I would come up to find he had already been ridden. I found out half the time one of the stable girls was riding him (not what I was paying for) or was just lunged. Another time I had specifically said I would be riding and came up to find he had just been exercised even though I had only spoken to her that morning. Not saying you should be there everytime but you are the client if the girl doesn't like it she shouldn't take your money.
 
To pig it in to perspective, I'm no great rider and have only brought my own on but I was riding a pony for a friend that had only ever had to trot round the outside of the arena since being broken, by the 4th session we had a whole circle of canter with a clean strike off on each rein. He was also trotting beautifly and really stretching over his back in both walk and trot. I'm also staying at a friends with some ponies to bring on one of which hasn't cantered before but I expect her to be by the end of the week and that's with me doing it not a professional.

The yard where mine is has a few in to back and they are walking trotting and cantering happily in the school within a month of being sat on, none pressured in any way and the owners often come and watch.

Personally I'd take him off schooling livery and let your friend ride him. If your going to be watching then you can make sure he isn't being pushed to far (but at almost 5 expecting him to be sat on straight away and having canter buttons installed isn't asking a lot!).
 
jeezz...15 months?!


no offence OP, they are probably rubbing their hands together thats why they are peed off someone else is taking over!!.... (less money for them?!)



get him moved to a nice DIY yard and have your instructor and friend part/loan ! Thrn you can see exactly what goes on - inregards to tack..no-one but me has my horses tack!
 
martlin said:
I tell you what to do, get that horse off that ''schooling livery'', probably move yards and find yourself a proper producer, who will school your horse at an appropriate rate of progress.
I would advise it not to be your friend, just a proper business arrangement. Just to give you an idea, I would be expecting that horse of yours to be going out to shows by now, or, actually, by last Christmas.
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Elsbells said:
If your confidence is at such a low ( And who could blame you if you never rode again tbh) have you not thought of selling him, just so you can focus on getting yourself right with the help of your cobby friend of course?
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noodle_ said:
jeezz...15 months?!


no offence OP, they are probably rubbing their hands together thats why they are peed off someone else is taking over!!.... (less money for them?!)



get him moved to a nice DIY yard and have your instructor and friend part/loan ! Thrn you can see exactly what goes on - inregards to tack..no-one but me has my horses tack!
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I think these are all viable options,but whatever you do do, I wouldn't be leaving him where he currently is, I think they've been milking the situation for long enough.
 
It sounds like they're taking the pee, big time. After 15 months, he should be doing some really decent shows.

If you can't bear to sell, part share with your mate: she does the riding, you do groundwork and inhand. The ym is taking you for a ride, pardon the pun. The horse should be cantering beautifully by now with no need to lunge first.
 
Get the horses moved, let your friend share for free, and pay for her to have a lesson once or twice a week with your instructor.

I've also lost masses of confidence in the past, and although you say you're happy there, I suspect the YO's attitude is actually setting your confidence back quite a bit even if you don't realise it.

There are stacks of nice yards out there that will be supportive and encourage you in eventually getting on board your own horse - you have a rider and an instructor, so get looking and everything will fall into place! :)
 
Theocat said:
Get the horses moved, let your friend share for free, and pay for her to have a lesson once or twice a week with your instructor.

I've also lost masses of confidence in the past, and although you say you're happy there, I suspect the YO's attitude is actually setting your confidence back quite a bit even if you don't realise it.

There are stacks of nice yards out there that will be supportive and encourage you in eventually getting on board your own horse - you have a rider and an instructor, so get looking and everything will fall into place! :)
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This. Theocat, she speaks the truth.

P
 
OP - I cannot believe they have had the horse for 15 months and he is still not able to understand canter transitions. That is ludicrous.

Even a relative novice would normally have made more progress with a horse in that time.

I'd expect a horse that had been broken and worked for a year and a quarter to be fairly established and working nicely in all three paces (without needing lunging first!) and popping a small course of jumps at the very least.
 
Why dont you explain to the YM that it is a recession and finances are tight. There for you can not afford schooling livery any more.

Your eventer friend is going to loan/part loan the horse again to help with finances. Tell The YM that you have been happy with their work so far but finances are so tight that if you dont do this you would have to give up the horse ;)


The YM does not need to know about any financial arangement between you and your friend.

You can draw up a part loan contract. Just because she is loaning dosnt actually mean money has to change hands it just gives you an outline of what you expect from each other. Anything from just riding to full care.

For one loan I paid notthing I rode when ever I liked and the days I rode I did yard jobs.

For another I paid just for shoing and just rode no care

Another I had full loan and all costs to pay.

This way I think you can minimise bad feeling between you and the YM which is important if you stay on this yard.

I do feel the horse should have progressed further but at least he hasnt been rushed to much to young and he has been in consistant work
 
In a way you are paying full livery and this girl is producing it. I have horses in livery being produced for competition and I think they'd react in a similar way if I started asking my friends to come and haves ride.
Just seeing it from the other angle.
 
It's not full livery, it's training livery who have had the horse for 15 months - the horse isn't off the lunge and doesn't know canter aids?!
 
The whole thing seems to have been a shambles from start to finish, you need to take ownership of the horse as its owner and move forward.

As for the YO's behaviour.........seems they've taken you for a ride and ignoring you and your friend tonight shows an immaturity beyond belief. Wouldn't let someone with that attitude clean my tack let alone school my horse!
 
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On reading more of the posts, I'd move it and pay your friend to school it. 15 months with little progress! She's taking the p**s!!
 
KrankyKaty said:
Wish you were local, I could send him to you! Friend didn't offer as a professional thing really, more she's desperate to keep her riding and I have a horse who needs riding so she kind of offered on a part loan/share basis so she was going to pay me towards his keep to share him. this wouldn't work so well on the schooling livery anyway though because she likes to ride several times a week.

Do you think part loaning him 5 days a week would be a bad idea? not that i really want to take money from her for schooling him because that seems weird but as a loan thing arther than a professional relationship, or would you just not go there?
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Thanks for the vote of confidence, but again, you would be making a mistake in sending him to me without doing proper research ;) You don't know me, haven't seen me work any horses or ride at all :) I would be happy to take your horse in if I was local and you came and had a good look around, talked to my clients past and present etc, but not before that. After all, it needs to be the right yard for you and your horse.

As to the loaning/part loaning/mates rates arrangement - in my experience, things like that nearly always go wrong, but it is just my personal opinion and experience, and I, personally, just wouldn't go there at all.
When you pay somebody a professional rate, you can expect, and demand, professional service; when you have a mate helping you out, things get awkward in the demands and expectations department ;) :o
 
Another one for spluttering over 15 mths! Scrolled right back to check it said last year! TBH unless the horse was an utter fruitloop I'd still have spluttered over riding on the lunge after 15 wks!

Is something geting lost in translation?
 
Just catching up with this.
Yes, you need to rescue your horse from the current training. All that lunging shouldn't be necessary fifteen months on and will sour him at the least.
He will likely come on quicker with the eventer friend taking him out and showing him the world and having some consistency of aids.
Be strong and good luck.
 
If you are desperate to stay on the yard I think the "I can't afford it any more so I am forced to loan him to friend and thanks for your hard work" story is a good idea.

However. It seems to me they are destroying your self confidence (I don't mean riding). Owning a yard is a business. That means the YO must be professional at all times. Even if she cannot stand a livery, giving them the silent treatment is ludicrous and if she is meant to be your friend, well.

Move on, move up :)
 
Krankykaty, I think it's time you pushed the boundaries of your comfort zone and take your horse back.. I've just sat here and read your posts.. (please don't take this the wrong way) you've got to find that inner strength and stop being the ostrich with the head in the sand.. Take YOUR horse back XX
 
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Just catching up with your recent posts, OP. Same as everyone else...15 months and not able to be cantered off the lunge is gobsmacking! No wonder she doesn't want you watching and finding out how little progress your thousands of pounds have bought you :(
 
Jus to throw something else into the frame though guys.... 4 years old and in work for 15 months...so he started as not quite 3? But as a four year old should now be able to hack out and have basic schooling in place. The 4 year olds in our yard are jumping small fences and starting to go out and about though how quickly they progress then depends on the horse. Would also say they are not worked hard as they are babies so the suggestion of a share wanting to rode 3 plus days a week seems off plus the work you want to do.

With regards to your injury, can I suggest you try a session with Jon Pitts, Fit to Ride, his website is very helpful if you have a look. I have had a couple of sessions with him and will go again after my holiday. He is at Littleton manor in Reigate for monthly clinics and really focuses on how to improve your own position ( and gives you homework off the horse too!) his approach would really help with your concerns and you would see if you are compensating for your injury. He has made a huge difference to my riding in my youngster and my seat is far more independent and secure. Just as a reference he is actually working with the aussie Olympic team and worked with team GB previously so knows his stuff. Oh and move your horses to where you will be involved and not just paying out. My boy is in part livery and I have chucked him at my YO for boot camp to improve his jumping as she is a professional eventer and he is heading off to a BYEH class next week! So I have no issue in asking someone else's help to push him on but am very very closely involved. I know my own horse best and between us we can work out the best way to train him.
 
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Bertolie said:
Horse is 5 next month so would have started as not quite 4 ;)
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Thanks for clarifying ..so same age as mine. He was backed and turned away at 3, back into light work before Xmas, sold to me as starting to hack, trotting in the school and just starting small amounts of canter. Now hacking properly and off to BYEH on Wednesday. Granted I have had help and YO will ride him at the show then back to me for some BE 80s before the season finishes..mine is ISH but gives an idea of where said horse ought to be.
 
My fly on the wall whispered to me that maybe the OP has had a chat with her "friend who is a very experienced rider - but didnt take on the horse in the first place to bring-on??" and said she would like to know exactly how her horse is getting on so "friend" said she would get on it and tell her, to me YO is maybe aware of this and doesnt like the behind the back tactic, or hasnt been riding the horse as much as she should have, or doesnt want the horse spoilt by someone who might actually not be as an experienced rider as they say. They need to sit down like adults and discuss but OP also needs to ask herself why she is in the situation she is in right now and is any of the above correct?
 
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