Yikes, thats some attitude...!!!

SatansLittleHelper said:
So basically I have properly screwed this up already :(
I don't want to mess this poor guy up.
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He's still got time to learn his proper social skills with other horses, get him somewhere for this spring and he'll grow up learning things from a group and hopefully will end up more balanced.
 
Have a look at youngstock livery at the large studs around you (or even a bit further away), they might have something suitable. My current beast (now 4) ran in a group of colts and geldings with only basic handling from weaning until he was ready to begin work and he is so incredibly confident with great social skills with other horses.
 
I'm not sure where there are youngstock yards...I'm near Shrewsbury in Shropshire if anyone knows of anything?
I'm a bit stuck as I will still have to pay my field rent for current field as well in order to keep my space There.
 
I think you need to change your attitude ASAP. If you are discouraged like this from just a few days interaction, I can't really see you sticking it long term and he will not respond favourably at all.
Take a deep breath and step back for a few days at least to give him and yourself some breathing room. Luckily there are several excellent suggestions of how you can address his stressed behaviour at the moment:

There is nothing wrong with leaving him be and just hanging out in the paddock with him. He will most likely overcome his anxiousness with natural curiosity, probably quicker than you may think. I suggest wearing a hat and taking a lunge/dressage whip in with you for your safety if things go South.
You need to change his living situation, in order for him to grow up well adjusted he needs a herd to interact with. I would never put a horse of his age in with one other horse only (I understand if circumstances are difficult, but you really need to try with this one IMO it's the most important change you can make for him).

I think you'll find you can reassess the situation by taking a step back and making the changes he needs, and these changes will be repaid fully in time. Good luck and remember you've only had him a short time, it will get better :)
 
Yeah don't be panicing yet! You'l get it sorted :)

If I was in your boat i'd stick him out with a herd in a youngstock yard, and then get a pro to back him when he's ready. If he's a sensitive, clever type you can do more harm than good doing groundwork/handling incorrectly. that's not to scare you, its just a fact that the basic's need to be instilled properly at the start and it's very hard to undo a badly started horse. Had you planned to break him yourself?
 
SatansLittleHelper said:
I'm not sure where there are youngstock yards...I'm near Shrewsbury in Shropshire if anyone knows of anything?
I'm a bit stuck as I will still have to pay my field rent for current field as well in order to keep my space There.
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Why would you need to keep your space? Do you have another horse there?

I think spacefaer is in that neck of the woods might be worth PMing her
 
SatansLittleHelper said:
No I wasn't intending on breaking him in myself, I planned to send him to a professional.
I'm going to make some calls tomorrow to see what I can sort out in terms of turnout with other youngstock for a while.
I'm not going to give up on him, I know I sound really negative but I don't mean to be.
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ah its always a bit of a shock when a new horse arrives and is very full on like that!
He will learn more being out in a herd for a bit. otherwise (in your current setup) you risk having a horse who will become clingy to a partner and upset when spilt up. If he's out with a herd he can settle, mature and be socialised properly, and you will get back a different horse at the end of it. It will take so much pressure and stress off you.
 
Not sure what you expected but this sounds want I would expect from what you told you where buying.
People don’t normally part with a homebred through a third party without a good reason.
What would I be doing very little but what I was doing I would be doing well.
Catch ,tie up feed check over I would not be leading him about there’s no point until he’s settled .
Give him a month to settle in .
I also agree with those who have said a group of geldings is what he needs .
 
After some long talks with my friend, who owns the other horse in the field, it looks like I have 3 options here:
1) Find youngstock livery and suck up all of the extra costs that will involve. Maybe get a loan horse for the field.
2) Keep him where he is but get a companion so he isn't left on his own when the other horse goes out. Keep to basic handling til he's ready for more.
3) Accept that I may have made a monumental cock up and sell him to someone with better facilities.

I've emailed several stud farms to see about youngstock livery but they all seem to be race horse type yards so I don't know how that will pan out with the flu problems at the moment?
 
I liked him from what I saw but he looks like quite a sporty type, more quality than what you were initially describing you wanted.

Thinking longer term, even if you find a herd to turn him out with and getting him professionally backed, is a field with a tie up point really the right set up to ride on a 4yo from? Especially one that might have something about it?

I’d be looking around for a different yard, and ideally one that had decent group turnout, stabling and an arena then keep him there for the foreseeable
 
Is Janet George near you? If so, she should have the set up and experience to help.

Personally, in your shoes, at this stage I would be looking for a suitable environment for him to further his long-term well-being and not be worried that it's not within daily commuting distance. Put him on a full grass youngstock livery and visit at weekends.....removes the temptation to do too much as well as putting you in an environment where you can watch others deal with youngsters and pick up hints and tips from them. Assuming you can find somewhere suitable, albeit at a distance, I would leave him there for a couple of years until backed and ridden away before considering bringing him back closer to home so I would relinquish your current field and re-assess his needs in a couple of years.

He needs a herd to teach him his p's & q's.....a herd will do it much more efficiently than you or just one other horse! So, having just seen your post 47, option one is the one to go for in my opinion.
 
Pearlsasinger said:
I certainly wouldn't be lunging a 2 1/2 yr old. I would give him some time to settle before trying to do much with him tbh.
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Not lunging, no. But a lunge rein nevertheless. You need this so that you are safer, and to also give you the advantage of leverage. This youngster, as far as he is concerned, is in charge, and you (or someone) needs to show him that he isn't.

A good book is an Australian publication by Tom Roberts, called Horse Control -- The Young Horse. He talks a lot about the use of leverage.
 
Near me you can find full grass youngstock livery from about £100 a month so it doesn't have to break the bank. Chuck him out. Visit him occasionally to keep an eye on him and then bring him back when hes ready to start work.

I hate to say it but its going to be very difficult to manage where you are. I'm at a yard now, that's similar in terms of no facilities, although I have settled herd turnout and a stable. There are 4 out on a huge hilly field and its so good for the horses. I'm moving on the 1st. I'm very sorry to lose the turnout situation but its just next to impossible to give a young horse a good start in a place like that and that's despite mine being a very quiet and sweet pony.
 
I think you are on with the best plan, to send him away to mature in a heard of youngsters.

The yard does not have to be close to you at all. This horse has never been taught to be a horse in a group situation. I do believe horses can live in a pair or even alone, but only once they are mature and secure, and are doing something with their human daily to provide stimulus and to be told what is required. So, from 5 years upwards, Younger than that their needs are different.

Getting him backed professionally is a good move, but I agree with another poster that to then return to a field with no other facilities is not a good plan with a horse that is all there, especially if just backed. In summer you may cope with being able to ride in a field, but in winter, to saddle up and go out on the roads, quite possibly after snow has meant to work for some weeks? No, that is a recipe for disaster.

This is good though, if you are committed to this horse then at least it means not paying for this field while he is away learning to be more mature in his outlook. I would have him from a stud type facility to a breakers yard as a 3yo, just to be loosely backed and then turn away again. Back to a pro at 4 yo for 3 months to re-back and ride away. then to a livery yard with good facilities where he will have company and you will have support.

When he is 5yo he may be suitable to see about re-hiring the field you like. but, by then you may have decided that you prefer a yard with more facilities anyway.
 
SatansLittleHelper said:
3) Accept that I may have made a monumental cock up and sell him to someone with better facilities.
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I'm afraid I favour going straight to option 3. This horse is way off spec from the straightforward, easy and chunky type that you set out to buy. You do not have the facilities, experience or finances to cope with him, and he just isn't what you want or need right now.

He's not going to be easy. He can be straightened out, but he needs the right handling and enviornment to do it. He will always need careful handling.

He's a very attractive horse, he should sell on quickly.

ETA He reminds me very much of the Late Chestnut Git. He was only 10.5 months old when I got him, but he's already learned that he could get his own way with heels and teeth. I got the manners and respect installed, and I kept him til he was PTS age 25, but I could NEVER drop my guard with him.
 
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Red-1 said:
I think you are on with the best plan, to send him away to mature in a heard of youngsters.

The yard does not have to be close to you at all. This horse has never been taught to be a horse in a group situation. I do believe horses can live in a pair or even alone, but only once they are mature and secure, and are doing something with their human daily to provide stimulus and to be told what is required. So, from 5 years upwards, Younger than that their needs are different.
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I do agree with this. I don't think keeping horses in a pair is always the best thing and certainly not for youngsters! My mare and gelding live in a pair and are besotted with each other, but it only works as well as it does because they are both retired and don't need to go anywhere without each other. As it stands, if I have them both on the yard and lead one away to the hosepipe, the other one will have an absolute paddy. For a quiet life, they both have to go to the hosepipe at the same time! This doesn't matter with two oldies, but would with a younger, ridden horse.

Tiddlypom said:
I'm afraid I favour going straight to option 3. This horse is way off spec from the straightforward, easy and chunky type that you set out to buy. You do not have the facilities, experience or finances to cope with him, and he just isn't what you want or need right now.

He's not going to be easy. He can be straightened out, but he needs the right handling and enviornment to do it. He will always need careful handling.

He's a very attractive horse, he should sell on quickly.

ETA He reminds me very much of the Late Chestnut Git. He was only 10.5 months old when I got him, but he's already learned that he could get his own way with heels and teeth. I got the manners and respect installed, and I kept him til he was PTS age 25, but I could NEVER drop my guard with him.
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I think you are giving up on the OP too easily. I din't see any reason why she shouldn't give things a go with this horse. She's already proven that she is open to advice and has a pro on standby to help. If she can get the right set up for him, why not give it a go? He's only 2 1/2, so there is plenty of time for him to mature and develop.
 
HashRouge said:
I do agree with this. I don't think keeping horses in a pair is always the best thing and certainly not for youngsters! My mare and gelding live in a pair and are besotted with each other, but it only works as well as it does because they are both retired and don't need to go anywhere without each other. As it stands, if I have them both on the yard and lead one away to the hosepipe, the other one will have an absolute paddy. For a quiet life, they both have to go to the hosepipe at the same time! This doesn't matter with two oldies, but would with a younger, ridden horse.


I think you are giving up on the OP too easily. I din't see any reason why she shouldn't give things a go with this horse. She's already proven that she is open to advice and has a pro on standby to help. If she can get the right set up for him, why not give it a go? He's only 2 1/2, so there is plenty of time for him to mature and develop.
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I don’t know the OP at all, she sounds really open to taking advice and I’m sure in the right set up and with the right professional help they could make it work.

My concern is that they are on a tight budget and have no clue what it costs to produce a young horse like this.
 
Leo Walker said:
Near me you can find full grass youngstock livery from about £100 a month so it doesn't have to break the bank. Chuck him out. Visit him occasionally to keep an eye on him and then bring him back when hes ready to start work.

I hate to say it but its going to be very difficult to manage where you are. I'm at a yard now, that's similar in terms of no facilities, although I have settled herd turnout and a stable. There are 4 out on a huge hilly field and its so good for the horses. I'm moving on the 1st. I'm very sorry to lose the turnout situation but its just next to impossible to give a young horse a good start in a place like that and that's despite mine being a very quiet and sweet pony.
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i would also say give up the space on the yard and look for somewhere else once he is backed because he does not seem to be the type that will be easy to manage with no facilities available, having them on the right yard is half the battle with any horse let alone a young one that needs consistency.
 
CALM DOWN!!!!!
I recon it is all going to be just fine with a bit of time.
Stop trying to do anything other than turning up to feed and giving perhaps a brief brush over and tie up to pick out feet.
If his companion is regularly leaving to work another companion would be ideal. I also find a group of three is better than a pair as they have options so aren’t always glued to one. However, if he has others in site and it’s only briefly then I would be tempted to leave alone. He is used to leaning on a mare for security, but he will survive and learn they will be back shortly. Assume horses in neighbouring field?

I personally would stay put. Give him at least two months before any proper handling and even then he is sill a baby
 
I am not saying to run him into the ground, just to pop him on the lunge and get him to walk on, stop a few times and then once he has got that get a few strides of trot, then a pat and back to the field. Clicker training can include stopping, walking (or stopping) over a pole, touching a chair with his nose, you standing on the chair and patting him, walking (an then stopping) between 2 cones, accepting to be touched with a saddlepad etc... it is a build up and get them looking forward to work with you.
Pros aren't soft with horses, they generally don't have time to mess about. The horse could be in with a shock when he would be asked to start working properly, a bit of preparation goes a long away.
 
Good grief what a lot of panic from all sides about this horse! SLH, you don't know what you've got yet. He's young (How young? Surely he's almost three and many people would be backing him soon) and you've had him a week. He's upset. I've bought feral two year old and three year old horses and kept them prefectly successfully in company with only one other horse. It's way too early to talk about him needing to live anywhere else and it's way too late to talk about him needing to run with young stock. He needs to calm down (time) and understand that it's now 'handlers' rules' (time and firm consistent training).

My advice to you would be to stop posting on here when you are all up in the air. You probably sound more panicked than you are and other people are reacting to it. Ask for help from your trainer who can see you and him, not us random strangers on tinternet, which will only stir you up even more.

I bought a calm and sweet eight year old over two months ago. He has only just started to feel relaxed enough to lie down to sleep at night. It takes them time to settle.
 
SatansLittleHelper said:
I have to keep my field space as it's where I like keeping my horse. It's down the road from my house and it's where I would want him to come back to?
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Understand though he’s probably going to need that herd turnout for a good while until he’s grown up enough to start doing some work.

I say this having made a mistake really with boggle, although rising five when I got him and we tried to have him out with others he had been cut late and was a nightmare. He ended up on individual turnout and I do think it certainly didn’t help his behaviour long term.
 
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