A musing from a grumpy old git.

[hollyandivy123]

Well, yes, and from reading your 'project' thread, probably about the same kind of impressive achievement for them both.

Those kind of comments make it all worthwhile, for various reasons don't they? A few months ago I was stopped at the scoreboard by my judge, asking if I had 'the cob'. I said yes, wondering what was coming next... he said that was the kind of horse more people needed at this level (Novice BD at the time),that would come in and do a job without making a fuss, and consequently win the class. It was one of those days when the lovely smart WBs were all farting about being generally ridiculous. Made my heart swell with pride.

love the quote from the judge, this is something i have often thought whilst watching, the BE80/90, BD novice comps etc. I was at one yard that I soon noticed if a livery with disposable money came. They normally were on a "cob type" (I have one not knocking them) and going out competing at the middle to upper end of the local level, but having fun and improving as well through the levels. These would soon be in the eyes of the YM, who would persuade them that they needed the next WB/competition model up to progress more. The next model would be purchased and then they seemed to get stuck, the YM team would then take over the riding, some ended up as owners with riders doing the competitions and some never seem to gain the confidence back in themselves to continue moving forward.

 

[little_critter]

Agree. There is a woman at the yard who winds me up by whining about how 'lucky' some people on the yard are.
No. It's not luck, it's hard work, making sacrifices and training. Not doing just a few schooling sessions a month then blaming your lack of dressage success on the "harsh judge"

 

[Micropony]

Thank you PaddyMonty, this is a really interesting thread. Two years ago I would probably have been mildly offended by it, but today I am inspired by it instead.

So I rode a little bit as a child, non-horsey family etc. and we are talking a fairly rubbish local riding school. Came back to horses in my late 20s, couldn't afford to any earlier. By then I had a reasonably stressful job and was studying for a part time MBA, and thought it would be good for me to engage in some non-goal oriented activity and to do some exercise. Hah!

TBH I might as well have been starting again from scratch.

After three or four years I'd had a couple of promotions, could afford to increase from one lesson a week to a lesson and a hack.

Then I got the opportunity to ride someone's competition horses occasionally. They were fairly unsuitable (one was fond of spending time on her back legs, and the other didn't really appreciate rein aids and much preferred to be ridden from the seat, a preference she could express in a variety of moderately hair raising ways). So possibly not ideal for someone fresh out of riding school, but I was delighted to have the opportunity, and openly admitted I had more confidence than ability, so that was all good.

Then my RS instructor introduced me to my share horse. A retired 4* TB eventer, so not exactly a dobbin, but a complete gentleman. Had a wonderful year riding him twice a week and still having weekly RS lessons. Then he moved out of the area with his lovely owner and at the grand old age of 36, I acquired my first horse. I didn't go out shopping for him, and didn't think I had the time or money to have my own, but 'would you exercise him a couple of times a week' turned into 'would you like him'.

He was, really, completely unsuitable and I was very over horsed. Once he started to get a bit fit, he let me know in no uncertain terms that I wasn't really good enough to be riding him. But he also had a range of issues that meant it was me or the glue factory, and I loved him, so I got on with it as best I could. He only caused 2 hospital visits, neither of them serious, but there were many near misses and many falls. He was too big for me (17.1 and chunky, and I am 5' 5" with stumpy legs). He was a very big moving dressage bred German warmblood who was also very unbalanced. I rode 6 times a week without fail because if I didn't he would be even spookier and more thuggish and it just wasn't fun. I had a lesson every week and really tried my best to practice my homework in between and improve.

It was 4 years before I could canter him large round the school in sufficient balance that he wouldn't break into trot or throw in a flying change.

By the time I'd had him for 6 years, we could ride a reasonable novice test in little fun shows at home and I felt ready to take him out in public at prelim without fear of people either laughing at us or running away in fear of being trampled by a totally out of control horse. Unfortunately he went lame the day I put the entry in, and ended up having to be PTS, so we never got to do that, but it would have made me so proud.

He taught me masses, but I had to make all my goals so small, and it took us so long to achieve each one that I got used to the idea that was normal.

Now I have a new horse who is much more suitable and straightforward and it's only now I realise how much confidence I lost in myself as a rider with my last boy. I am lucky to have a trainer who has more confidence in my riding than I do. I would still feel a bit arrogant and silly saying 'I want to ride at Medium and Foxhunter' or whatever. I still wouldn't want to go out competing at a level we're only just managing at home. I still think no rider has any right to point a horse at a fence they're not 100% committed to, especially as youngster like mine is. And I still think if you can't ride a perfect line with good corners and a good punchy balanced canter over a course of poles on the ground, you've got no business with fences.

However, reading this thread has really crystallised some thoughts for me. I can pretty much ride. I have all the skills I need to meet some realistic goals, even some that are a bit more ambitious than I might have dared set myself three months ago. And once I've met those, I will set some more. I have improved considerably since I got my first horse, so that means I can improve some more. And I am jolly well going to!

 

[HotToTrot]

Hot to trot has hit the nail on the head (and she was probably standing on her head AND multitasking at the time so well done her!).

I've been there (look at my record under my maiden name - Cotes). I've struggled at 90, at 100 (and Intermediate and Advanced!) I'm similar to the OP in that I really wanted to event, so I made changes - changed horses, got good trainers. etc. And then some changes were not even my decisions at all - I wouldn't have got Parrot if Vito hadn't been off games, and if I hadn't got Parrot, I wouldn't have gone Adv.

But whilst I made some decisions and those decisions, together with circumstances falling into place, enabled me to go up the levels, it would have been just as valid - completely and utterly reasonable - of me to have decided that I didn't want to event as much as all that, and I was going to carry on doing other things instead with my horse. That's my point. We all want different things.

 

[Frumpoon]

Transport

Since the driving licences all changed and now folks are only able to drive an expensive 3.5t without doing additional expensive licences I've seen a lot less competing

I didn't go out for years despite horse and I having moves established up to advanced medium and being more than capable of jumping courses of 1m 20 at home

 

[Micropony]

Transport

Since the driving licences all changed and now folks are only able to drive an expensive 3.5t without doing additional expensive licences I've seen a lot less competing

I didn't go out for years despite horse and I having moves established up to advanced medium and being more than capable of jumping courses of 1m 20 at home

You are very right. Going out is a much bigger deal when you're shelling out £100+ for lorry hire each time. I have just been lucky enough to get my own transport and it's amazing the difference it makes. It will be taking a long time for the novelty to wear off!

 

[milliepops]

You are very right. Going out is a much bigger deal when you're shelling out £100+ for lorry hire each time. I have just been lucky enough to get my own transport and it's amazing the difference it makes. It will be taking a long time for the novelty to wear off!

I never had transport until last year either and agree that it changes your life a bit... I'm doing some arena hire tomorrow which I'd have struggled to justify if I'd still been hiring.
Going back to the OP though I don't feel that it held me back that much in training teems over the years. I used to do a lot of work at home and then do 3 or 4 shows a year to assess progress. Much more fun these days though

 

[Frumpoon]

When I were a lass back in the Pliocene, most folks at the yard had or had access to a rackety Land Rover or estate and an old trailer or you could rent one easily for about £20

It's a much bigger deal now, lots more money at stake plus the roads are such that hacking to venues is mostly out of the question

 

[oldie48]

Blimey, I've read all the posts and gone from being depressed to a bit more hopeful. what is it with us "horsey people" that makes us so judgemental? After reading some of the very unkind comments on my last post (now deleted) about a friend with a badly broken collarbone, I now read a load of posts that seem rather critical of the average "leisure rider" (the clue is in the name!). I love to hear about the successes of the more competitive people, it's great to read threads from people who really "know their stuff", I've learned so much from you. I'm sad to hear of the problems that people face but see the support they get from here. What really pisses me off is the lack of understanding that we are all different and get our pleasure in a load of different ways. I'm 67, didn't own a horse until I was nearly 50 and didn't ride as a child except for a few RS lessons. I LOVE my training, the first time I did a flying change by design I had a smile on my face for a week. Do I get nervous? Bloody hell, yes but it reassures me that I'm still alive! Am I over-horsed? Yes, he's safe enough but I wouldn't take him hunting (I'd die) Is it any of your business that I should be out doing a medium test on him? ( actually, I doubt I'll ever be able to sit to his trot) No! My ambition? Well if I'm still riding him into my 70's I shall be very happy. Why is it so hard for us to just let people do what they want?

 

[TheSylv007]

Ok, it seems I need to type more!

I agree with you - to a point.

It has been good to see a post which has sparked debate. There have been so few for so long, I haven't even bothered to post for ages.

However, PM has presented (in my view and clearly in some other posters views) quite a belittling picture of those who are not achieving what he thinks they 'should'.

Maybe a while ago I might have had a similar attitude but lots has happened to me recently which has really helped to shape my changed view. In addition I've been doing lots of dressage judging in attempt to get my listing (fingers crossed - soon!) and there really is no way to describe the complete joy on some riders faces when they get to the end of their Intro test that they really have been training for, for 18 months plus. What does is matter if it's taken that long - what does it matter if they never get there at all - what does it matter if someone else thinks it's no achievement at all because they're off trying to achieve their own heady heights?

As Horsemad12 said early on in the thread, reading comments like those from the OP could destroy someone's confidence - what right has anyone got to do that?

Completely agree with this. Usually really enjoy the OP's posts but the original post came across as a massive humblebrag.

 

[Irish gal]

Oldie fair play to you! If I can do what you're doing when I'm 67 I'll be happy indeed. It's really inspiring to read stories like that because most of us find our bottle diminishing with age, sadly, but it's a fact. So to be buying your first horse at 50 is just brilliant and to be training away heading for your seventies is inspirational. Talk about having a passion for horses...

 

[daffy44]

I didnt read the OP in the same way, i think? I never have any problem with people doing what makes them happy, whatever that is, if hacking is your thing, thats great, if you love to train but not compete, also great, we are all different, and thats a wonderful thing.

I saw the OP as musing on the people that seem dissatisfied with their lot, complain that the horse isnt good enough etc, want to do better but without the reality check of how much work it takes, that sort of thing.

For all the aspiring people, remember every professional/experienced person was once the person starting with their first horse, everyone started somewhere.

I'm sorry some posters seem to feel defensive, no one needs to defend what they do to be happy!

 

[milliepops]

I didnt read the OP in the same way, i think? I never have any problem with people doing what makes them happy, whatever that is, if hacking is your thing, thats great, if you love to train but not compete, also great, we are all different, and thats a wonderful thing.

I saw the OP as musing on the people that seem dissatisfied with their lot, complain that the horse isnt good enough etc, want to do better but without the reality check of how much work it takes, that sort of thing.

For all the aspiring people, remember every professional/experienced person was once the person starting with their first horse, everyone started somewhere.

I'm sorry some posters seem to feel defensive, no one needs to defend what they do to be happy!

^^same

 

[laura_nash]

I firmly believe any horse(that is sound) could achieve elementary dressage, SJ to 1.10mtr and event BE100
They just need to be trained and the riders believe it is possible.

As a teenager I watched a 10 year old (YO's son) having a lesson from a top show jumper. He was riding a well bred and talented youngster but it wasn't going well and he started blaming the pony. The instructor told the boy that up to a certain height any sound horse or pony can do it and its entirely the rider, then told him to choose a pony from the trekking centre (attached to the yard) for him to ride and they'd have a competition. SJ'er then soundly beat him riding the slowest plod in the trekking stables, they did two perfect clear rounds and it was like seeing a different animal. The jumps weren't massive by their standards, but they were by mine, and its always stayed with me.

 

[ycbm]

I didnt read the OP in the same way, i think? I never have any problem with people doing what makes them happy, whatever that is, if hacking is your thing, thats great, if you love to train but not compete, also great, we are all different, and thats a wonderful thing.

I saw the OP as musing on the people that seem dissatisfied with their lot, complain that the horse isnt good enough etc, want to do better but without the reality check of how much work it takes, that sort of thing.

For all the aspiring people, remember every professional/experienced person was once the person starting with their first horse, everyone started somewhere.

I'm sorry some posters seem to feel defensive, no one needs to defend what they do to be happy!

There's nothing at all in the first post about people being dissatisfied with their lot or complaining about lack of success. It's only about why people aren't achieving what he is.

This sentence at the end didn't help, either:

I just don't understand why the horse world seems to be sinking in to mediocraty

 

[Leg_end]

At the moment I probably fit into both camps. Current horse was bought to event but was very gangly as a youngster so took my time with him and spent 18 months hacking with basic schooling. I was content in that as it was all about the long game. He then got injured but has been back for 4 years. In that time we've affiliated and evented but I've not got where I want to (1*).. Hes got all the scope but his brain needs more work and to get him to the horse I want I'd need to take him xc schooling every week which just isn't realistic time wise for me (full time job with lots of travel and I do like to spend time with my husband occasionally ) it's not something I could do consistently and there's no point otherwise.

I decided this year to take a year off eventing and train. Train hard. And I have but it's made no difference, when we go schooling he will wobble if I ride even slightly defensively which, when he very often stops at the last minute, is necessary for me to keep my confidence. So I made a decision that he would focus on dressage (as I hate pure SJ) and now our aims are advanced (I've just got to get into tails!).

I am lucky that my job means I can afford another and so I'm looking for a schoolmaster to help me fulfil my aims of getting to 1*. But not everyone can do that and so sometimes you have to settle if you are unwilling to sell the horse (which I am).

I think there are plenty of factors around why people change or lower their aims and I applaud everyone for pushing their comfort zone and doing something they've dreamt of. I make sure when I do my goals for the year that 'having fun' is number one and that should be the case for everyone. I love nothing more than galloping my donkey through the fields and do it regularly but that brings some out in a cold sweat - why should their goal not be to just have a hoon in a field with a grin on their face?!

 

[oldie48]

Quote from OP "Is it a lack of rider confidence, are instructors not pushing their pupils anymore, is the pat on the back mentality we have for the slightest of success lowering expectations or do people just not want to put the effort in anymore? Have people lost sight of what can be achieved with correct training and effort? I just don't understand why the horse world seems to be sinking in to mediocraty."

Seems pretty judgemental to me but perhaps I'm just a tad too sensitive. I think the horse world is made up of lots of different people who ride for lots of different reasons and as long as their horses are well cared for then why not let them do what they want. Why OP thinks the horse world has sunk into mediocrity is beyond me. Certainly it is more accessible, more non horsey parents encourage their children to ride, more people take it up in later life and people (like me) are staying active as riders for longer. Equestrianism supports of lot of rural life these days and isn't just the privilege of the wealthy, Isn't this a good thing? I didn't ride as a child because I lived in a big city and I came from a working class family. The only horse I saw as a child belonged to the rag and boneman. Not for me (and lots of other people like me) the opportunity of joining PC and all that comes with that. The few rides I had as a child that totally captivated me were very rare treats and I feel so very lucky to have been able to have horses in later life but my goodness it's a very steep learning curve and I've sometimes felt completely out of my depth. My riding's been pretty mediocre at times though, probably still is but it's not through lack of trying or training it's basically lack of talent! PM you should be pleased there are so many of us around who are so lacking in your work ethic, drive and success, it makes you shine even more brightly!

 

[Red-1]

I have been musing over this thread for a few days now. I have several thoughts...

I was once a teen with a dream to event. I was from a non horse family, not rich, not well connected. But, with determination went to an eventer, a SJ-er and a dealer, and would ride whatever. I hit the deck, not as much as I could have as I learned fast, but I was the one who would get on anything and go. I was at a fairly gung ho yard with my own horses, and we did loads of stuff, the whole yard would go out with bloodhounds, the more experienced picking the less experienced up when necessary and seeing each other home. I did team chasing, with a belly full of whisky (and I hate whisky!).

It took years to go BE, and at that time it started at PN. I bought a horse that had PN before, but had some issues, had one lesson and went. I think my determination got us round, in fact over two seasons and to Novice we never faulted XC.

I then found good trainers, and eventually went to Intermediate and did some CCI*.

Then, I hurt my back. It made me less resilient. I was in danger of not being able to do my job. In fact, years later it has indeed stopped me doing my job.

My plans now? Hacking, a bit of unaffiliated, hopefully still BE90, maybe even 100. TBH I just want to enjoy my time with my horse. I guess I feel I have proved myself, whatever that means, and I am unlikely to go higher, and I am lucky to still be able to ride.

I also teach, mainly confidence clients. I did this even when I was kicking on competitively. I could see a difference in their ambitions and mine, and TBH I am happy to help with whatever. A couple of clients had owned a horse for a long time, but never got on, some others had a horse that they had not ridden in a long time. That was their ambition, to get on. I have found that they had had the help of various trainers, who concentrated on getting on. We tackled it at a more base level, learning horsemanship, from grooming, catching, leading and on to lungeing and long reining. By then mounting was just the next step, and they were skilled in their own rights, and could make sound decisions, so the transition to mounted work was easy.

So, I do get the disparity with what people want to do, and what they are doing. I do not want a return to the days of my youth and the gung ho livery yard, it was not always best for the horses. But, we certainly learned from the bareback races in the fields, the jumping higher and higher comps, the whole yard hunting. No one told us we "should not" do stuff because it was dangerous. We did it. If we got hurt we found a new way to do it. Everyone was encouraged to have a go.

I see these days people stopped by fear of getting it wrong. People scared of getting hurt. Now especially, I get that! I think that what is missing is the hanging out with horses, setting a task, and finding a way to get it right. Like riding one and leading 2 up from the field. When I was young even the local BHS approved riding school had us do this, on a 1/2 hour treck from summer grazing to the yard. So, in today's traffic this is not practicable, but it is practicable in the riding arena.

I spent almost 20 years training Police horses and riders. Those riders had to learn to be pro riders in 16 weeks, and these were people who were mature already. We also had tight health and safety, rightly so. What I did know though, was that they still had to learn horsemanship. So, we did long reining, round an obstacle course. We did ride and lead, on the school or in a field. We practised nearly losing our seats, side to side and front and back. They had a ride with no saddle, somersaulted off the horse, dismounted at trot, rode up and down hills at canter, went bank scrambling, went ditch hopping, jumped down a line of fences whilst singing and doing the actions to YMCA, rode in a group ride over rough country, went down banks so steep that the horses brace their legs and slide from top to bottom.

These are the lost arts I think. In the days of health and safety riding seems to have been sanitised. I wholly agree with health and safety, but many people seem to have taken it that activities have been banned. I became a risk assessor just so I could "modify" the experiences to be risk assessment compliant, whilst the learners could still learn the lessons from the exercises. WE carefully went from easy to harder, and kept it within the "fun" range.

Safety is paramount, but to progress as OP says people could, that requires controlled exposure to some unpredictability. Hunting used to do that. Being a kid being daft on a horse used to do that.

As a trainer it is easier to keep people in an arena. It is clean, sanitised, easier to risk assess. It is harder to box out to a sloping field to learn to balance a horse on a hill. It is hard to find somewhere suitable for ditch hopping, and harder still to have the rider's horse trained enough to help the rider to learn. Some riders are astounded that their homework is to build up until they can stand in the stirrups, without bum touching saddle, for minutes at a time. Then go do it on a slope... It is hard to arrange a group, and to have a horse suitable to lead the group. This is the stuff that matters. This is the stuff that brings confidence in yourself and your horse, that means you overcome difficulties before they are even a difficulty, and THIS is where confidence comes from.

Gosh, that was long.

 

[milliepops]

Well i guess this just shows the extent to which we all read the written word through the prism of our own experiences. I didn't read any such judgement, I read this as a genuine enquiry.

E.g.

I'm wondering if people set their expectations and goals far too low these days and why.

To me this read as a theory that people may be underestimating their capabilities or potential. NOT that people *wanted* to be at the entry level of the sport forever and that was wrong or to be frowned upon

On the flip side I see post after post about people schooling their horse for 12-18 months and feel they might be able to do an intro test soon

Again this didn't read as judgemental to me or insisting people should stop what they are doing and compete at a high level immediately. I saw this as more hinting at either a lack of confidence to *have a go* or a failure of the training system to demonstrate that this is within their grasp OR a suggestion that perhaps those people don't know how to prepare for it. The mention of wanting to do an intro test in this example would suggest that is an eventual goal so the person in question does have some kind of competition aspiration, therefore it's not a criticism of happy hackers (for want of a better phrase) etc

Is it a lack of rider confidence, are instructors not pushing their pupils anymore, is the pat on the back mentality we have for the slightest of success lowering expectations or do people just not want to put the effort in anymore? Have people lost sight of what can be achieved with correct training and effort? I just don't understand why the horse world seems to be sinking in to mediocraty.

The stand out element here for me was a genuine set of questions not the "accusation" that others saw of mediocracy. I know PM , like me, finds pleasure in helping other people out with their horses. It's almost a compulsion for me but I learnt a long time ago not to offer advice or help unless asked , lol! But it does mean you can see potential improvements in results, and *most importantly * happiness and enjoyment all over the place, and it makes me wonder why people kind of accept what they've got or set limitations on their ambition when it could be better. It's not judgey or snooty or belittling. For me it's an honest love of the sport and desire to help others get as much out of it as I do.

God that was hard to type on phone, sorry for typos

 

[D66]

I have been musing over this thread for a few days now. I have several thoughts...

I was once a teen with a dream to event. I was from a non horse family, not rich, not well connected. But, with determination went to an eventer, a SJ-er and a dealer, and would ride whatever. I hit the deck, not as much as I could have as I learned fast, but I was the one who would get on anything and go. I was at a fairly gung ho yard with my own horses, and we did loads of stuff, the whole yard would go out with bloodhounds, the more experienced picking the less experienced up when necessary and seeing each other home. I did team chasing, with a belly full of whisky (and I hate whisky!).

It took years to go BE, and at that time it started at PN. I bought a horse that had PN before, but had some issues, had one lesson and went. I think my determination got us round, in fact over two seasons and to Novice we never faulted XC.

I then found good trainers, and eventually went to Intermediate and did some CCI*.

Then, I hurt my back. It made me less resilient. I was in danger of not being able to do my job. In fact, years later it has indeed stopped me doing my job.

My plans now? Hacking, a bit of unaffiliated, hopefully still BE90, maybe even 100. TBH I just want to enjoy my time with my horse. I guess I feel I have proved myself, whatever that means, and I am unlikely to go higher, and I am lucky to still be able to ride.

I also teach, mainly confidence clients. I did this even when I was kicking on competitively. I could see a difference in their ambitions and mine, and TBH I am happy to help with whatever. A couple of clients had owned a horse for a long time, but never got on, some others had a horse that they had not ridden in a long time. That was their ambition, to get on. I have found that they had had the help of various trainers, who concentrated on getting on. We tackled it at a more base level, learning horsemanship, from grooming, catching, leading and on to lungeing and long reining. By then mounting was just the next step, and they were skilled in their own rights, and could make sound decisions, so the transition to mounted work was easy.

So, I do get the disparity with what people want to do, and what they are doing. I do not want a return to the days of my youth and the gung ho livery yard, it was not always best for the horses. But, we certainly learned from the bareback races in the fields, the jumping higher and higher comps, the whole yard hunting. No one told us we "should not" do stuff because it was dangerous. We did it. If we got hurt we found a new way to do it. Everyone was encouraged to have a go.

I see these days people stopped by fear of getting it wrong. People scared of getting hurt. Now especially, I get that! I think that what is missing is the hanging out with horses, setting a task, and finding a way to get it right. Like riding one and leading 2 up from the field. When I was young even the local BHS approved riding school had us do this, on a 1/2 hour treck from summer grazing to the yard. So, in today's traffic this is not practicable, but it is practicable in the riding arena.

I spent almost 20 years training Police horses and riders. Those riders had to learn to be pro riders in 16 weeks, and these were people who were mature already. We also had tight health and safety, rightly so. What I did know though, was that they still had to learn horsemanship. So, we did long reining, round an obstacle course. We did ride and lead, on the school or in a field. We practised nearly losing our seats, side to side and front and back. They had a ride with no saddle, somersaulted off the horse, dismounted at trot, rode up and down hills at canter, went bank scrambling, went ditch hopping, jumped down a line of fences whilst singing and doing the actions to YMCA, rode in a group ride over rough country, went down banks so steep that the horses brace their legs and slide from top to bottom.

These are the lost arts I think. In the days of health and safety riding seems to have been sanitised. I wholly agree with health and safety, but many people seem to have taken it that activities have been banned. I became a risk assessor just so I could "modify" the experiences to be risk assessment compliant, whilst the learners could still learn the lessons from the exercises. WE carefully went from easy to harder, and kept it within the "fun" range.

Safety is paramount, but to progress as OP says people could, that requires controlled exposure to some unpredictability. Hunting used to do that. Being a kid being daft on a horse used to do that.

As a trainer it is easier to keep people in an arena. It is clean, sanitised, easier to risk assess. It is harder to box out to a sloping field to learn to balance a horse on a hill. It is hard to find somewhere suitable for ditch hopping, and harder still to have the rider's horse trained enough to help the rider to learn. Some riders are astounded that their homework is to build up until they can stand in the stirrups, without bum touching saddle, for minutes at a time. Then go do it on a slope... It is hard to arrange a group, and to have a horse suitable to lead the group. This is the stuff that matters. This is the stuff that brings confidence in yourself and your horse, that means you overcome difficulties before they are even a difficulty, and THIS is where confidence comes from.

Gosh, that was long.

very good though! I did most of this as a kid, now, in late fifties I have a horse that is a bit too bouncy for me but nice natured, who has had a couple of issues, and am having difficulties finding a trainer to help at my very low level. So, Im underperforming.

 

[catkin]

some tangential musings:

Since when has competition been the be-all and end-all of having horses? What's wrong with having decent ponies and working hard at training for the sheer pleasure of enjoying the company of a well-schooled, well-bred horse? (oops - maybe that's what's meant by horses 'being wasted' )

If at the end of the month I have money to either have a lesson or do a competition I now get more fun out of the lesson, as I think the ponies do too. We enjoy the odd foray to a decent show, and our strike-rate is actually quite good for the little we do because the ponies are very beautiful (heck, I keep them at home, I have to spend all day looking at them- they may as well be pretty ) - but the thought of travelling miles to trot circles round some dull shed (aka dressage) ain't inspiring anymore.

 

[scats]

I was a very competitive and successful junior show jumper, but on the move up to horses my ride was injured and had to be retired. This took me out of the game for a few years and I lost the desire to get back into it. Branched into showing very successfully in my twenties and then I was struck down by a health issue (that had actually started when I was 11). My health is bad enough that I find it difficult to trot around an arena once without extreme pain and fatigue (I have lupus). I am pushing myself back into the competition world, but have decided that in reality, dressage is the only one I can truly cope with now. Currently I cannot manage more than an intro test, and even then I suffer for days afterwards.

I found it quite hard to rock up to a venue, having been so well known as a gutsy and competitive rider locally for so many years, and now appear red-faced and in pain just doing walk and trot. But I'm doing it.

Sometimes life doesn't give you the best, but you have to make the best of what it does give you.

 

[gunnergundog]

I wonder if the various views are partly a generational thing?

I am in my sixties and when I started out I had a dream to event; at that time the lowest affiliated level (Novice) meant that you had to be competent over 3 foot 7. Nowadays if I wanted to start eventing I would only have to aspire to 2 foot 7. Therefore, you don't need the same level of skill/skillset or horse power to commence eventing nowadays as you did previously. People can therefore fulfil their ambition of saying 'I am an eventer' without having to develop to the same level. Maybe this is the mediocrity that the OP perceives?

Society has changed too. People keep horses purely as pets nowadays - this was really not the case in my youth. Your horse either worked in some capacity (hunting, driving, competing, down the pit) or was a broodie. The instructors I had (Dick Stilwell et al) put the fear of god up you, but they got you working and striving. You never said no to them and if they made you cry or want to cry, you bit your lip and got on with it regardless. I see so many instructors nowadays telling their clients what they want to hear; the truth sometimes hurts though and if one of my instructors made a disparaging remark about something I did, I made doubly sure not to give them that opportunity again. Perhaps people need to toughen up a little nowadays? It appears everyone takes umbrage whenever possible and believes they are the beautiful princess that everyone on facebook tells them they are!


To those that cite the cost of lessons as an inhibitor, then earn some more money - I frequently had two or three jobs on the go at once to make ends meet. Sell anything you have that has worth if you no longer use it/need it. Cut back on your outgoings. In other words make sacrifices. Good lessons always have been expensive. You can't have it all unless you are from a wealthy background, so if you want to event or whatever and are just a normal Joe Bloggs then you really have to WANT it to make it happen. That hunger appears to be lacking nowadays. As said above, society has changed.

 

[{97702}]

To those that cite the cost of lessons as an inhibitor, then earn some more money - I frequently had two or three jobs on the go at once to make ends meet. Sell anything you have that has worth if you no longer use it/need it. Cut back on your outgoings. In other words make sacrifices. Good lessons always have been expensive. You can't have it all unless you are from a wealthy background, so if you want to event or whatever and are just a normal Joe Bloggs then you really have to WANT it to make it happen. That hunger appears to be lacking nowadays. As said above, society has changed.

Totally agree with this!

 

[Fellewell]

Blimey, I've read all the posts and gone from being depressed to a bit more hopeful. what is it with us "horsey people" that makes us so judgemental? After reading some of the very unkind comments on my last post (now deleted) about a friend with a badly broken collarbone, I now read a load of posts that seem rather critical of the average "leisure rider" (the clue is in the name!). I love to hear about the successes of the more competitive people, it's great to read threads from people who really "know their stuff", I've learned so much from you. I'm sad to hear of the problems that people face but see the support they get from here. What really pisses me off is the lack of understanding that we are all different and get our pleasure in a load of different ways. I'm 67, didn't own a horse until I was nearly 50 and didn't ride as a child except for a few RS lessons. I LOVE my training, the first time I did a flying change by design I had a smile on my face for a week. Do I get nervous? Bloody hell, yes but it reassures me that I'm still alive! Am I over-horsed? Yes, he's safe enough but I wouldn't take him hunting (I'd die) Is it any of your business that I should be out doing a medium test on him? ( actually, I doubt I'll ever be able to sit to his trot) No! My ambition? Well if I'm still riding him into my 70's I shall be very happy. Why is it so hard for us to just let people do what they want?

I hope I didn't write anything unkind about your friend. Apologies if I did.

It's never a good idea to become a shining beacon of light to your fellow liveries. That kind of attitude will generally come back and bite you on the bum.

IME people who are quite accomplished don't go around telling everyone else that they're under-achieving (maybe if you pay them)As in any sport they know there is always a metaphorical brick wall waiting out there.

Next time you approach with the tack, ask your horse if he thinks he's a leisure horse. If he's ROR he probably thinks life just got a lot tougher! Reward the try, horses always give a lot more than they get, wherever they are ;-)

 

[alainax]

Sometimes I think it's completely the opposite!

What's the bloody rush!

Seems more and more often we find people going out there buying huge flashy warm bloods, completely over facing them selves. In a rush to hammer onto competitions. Then when either the horse is broke, or they are, horse gets thrown back on the pile with a whole new set of bad habits. Throw away society.

What happened to working on the basics. Both for horse and rider. Nowadays it's seems it's all about a quick fix, ram on some gadgets and crack on to the next show. Get the horse fat to win, not fit. Want to jump higher, piaffe before there is any understanding of rhythm. Slam the horses head in to some sort of position without any idea of what it is to work over the back.

What's the bloody rush. Why force the idea that everyone should be out competing. Goals like establishing consistency, rhythm, schwung, for a horse to be properly through should not be poo poo'd as stuff for noobs.

I would much rather see someone spend many lessons working on something as simple as rhythm than skip it all together.

Of course, that's as generalising as it is to say that those who don't move through the levels quickly are not trying hard enough. I am sure there are many who can whizz through the levels without the need for gadgets and what not. However I don't think it is wise to further encourage the notion of rushing things.

Sometimes you are faced with a horse that you need to undo a lot of what came before in order to re establish some true foundations. To get to a point where building from there will be smooth and strong. Rushing such things is not the answer. I have a goal at the moment for consistency. Must seem very boring to many. But the feeling of riding a horse who has not long learned to use his back, becoming consistent and strong, is better than any rosette to me.

 

[milliepops]

Wow, not sure where anyone has said that horses should be rushed? You'll always come unstuck sooner or later by papering over cracks, 100% agree

 

[Lexi_]

I'm an ex-riding school kid with a share horse, no transport, no money and no competitive spirit whatsoever, so probably shouldn't comment on this thread at all but there's something that's been grating on me for a while.

I'm definitely not aiming this at anyone in particular in this thread - "you" is a shorthand for all those people I've met within eventing who have the attitude that "eventing was better back in the old days when the lowest level was Novice and all the plebs stayed at home" . It always seems to come with an inherent smugness and judgemental attitude and it saddens me. Why shouldn't the sport be more accessible and welcoming? Why is a standard from 20 years ago somehow the magical bar that should still hold today? Why are you better than someone else just because you and your horse can jump a Novice course and they can jump a 90? And basically how dare you suggest they don't deserve to be there enjoying the sport just because they don't match your level.

I volunteer at events from 80T to 3* and it's just as much of a delight to see a child on a pony or a 60 something on a very untypical eventer popping round an 80 and looking absolutely delighted with themselves as it is to watch an Olympic eventer cruising effortlessly round a massive international course.

Apologies if that was off topic. Needed to get it off my chest!

 

[Butterbean]

This has been a fascinating thread and I have to say it has really got me thinking and questioning my own approach, what I want to aim for, and what I want to get out of my training. Thank you OP!

In the last couple of years I've been lucky to have a wonderfully genuine and enthusiastic horse that has taken me to the - to me - heady heights of BE90. To me (a not particularly brave middle aged rider) this is AMAZING. A few years ago I would look at BE80 fences and wonder how anyone had the nerve to jump them. This was despite regular lessons and a horse that had competed at BE100 (with a different rider). Unfortunately as a combination that horse and I just didn't click and I don't think any amount of training would have ever got us round 1.10 sj or BE100 as was suggested in a previous post. But with my current horse .. different story. The right horse can build confidence and made BE90 feel effortless and fun.

However horse is currently recovering from injury and it will be a few months before he is fit (and no guarantee he will jump again). So I am thinking over what our aims are - before his injury I think I had got a bit stale in my regular lessons, don't think we were really making any progress because as far as I was concerned we had already reached our pinnacle ... Now I realise this I'm going to have a good think about what I do want to achieve.

 

[ycbm]

To those that cite the cost of lessons as an inhibitor, then earn some more money

What a lack of empathy and understanding this statement shows. You had several jobs to pay for your lessons? Bully for you. Not everyone finds life that simple.