Flatout
New User
You could well be right. She's certainly never been in a battle before, she probably didn't realise what was happening.
Black Caviar
- Thread starter Spiritedly
- Start date
You could well be right. She's certainly never been in a battle before, she probably didn't realise what was happening.
Crugeran Celt
Well-Known Member
She has the weirdest trot I have ever seen. Looked almost lame trotting back there!
I thought that as she was walking around before the race and she had such little movement in her neck and head compared to the others (don't know much about racing). I didn't think she was a good looking mare either sorry, am I alone there?
cefyl
Well-Known Member
Sorry it didn't live up to your huge expectations. She came halfway around the world after never having run outside of OZ, excuse me if she didn't win by 10 lengths due to (possible) jock errror or anything else she has not been previously exposed to .
AmyMay
Situation normal
Cefyl, is there a reason why someone can't post thier thoughts on here about a much hyped race, without some purile response from a fellow poster?
Crugeran Celt
Well-Known Member
I don't think anyone is critisizing the mare's ability but just that they expected her to win by a fair way. That didn't happen and she could so easily have lost that some people feel dissapointed by the performance. If most, like me are not avid race watchers but were drawn to watching this mare because of the hype it was a little dissapointing but that doesn't take away anything from the mare's outstanding history and the fact that she has travelled so far for this race. What she has achieved in her 22 races is outstanding and she will be remembered as an exceptional mare regardless of how she won today. Still think she was lame before race though.
Slinkyunicorn
Well-Known Member
According to posts from Ascot straight after the race she overeached which has caused her lameness but was checked by the vets and was ok - the stewards were also investigating the jockeys ride
kinnygirl1
Well-Known Member
She has the weirdest trot I have ever seen. Looked almost lame trotting back there!
Glad its not just me - I said to husband when she was trotting after the race that she looked lame! Her head was noticeably nodding.
PolarSkye
Well-Known Member
According to posts from Ascot straight after the race she overeached which has caused her lameness but was checked by the vets and was ok - the stewards were also investigating the jockeys ride
Thanks for this Slinks . . . so did she overreach before or after the race b/c she looked funny/her trot looked odd/uneven on the way down to the start? That said, it that may just be the way she goes.
The overreach thing is interesting, though, because Willy Carson commented on her overtrack several times in the paddock and pointed out that she was wearing O/R boots.
P
cefyl
Well-Known Member
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They are criticising her ability by the very obvious dissapointment she did not win by 10+ lengths.
How do YOU define a fair way? She has travelled halfway around the world, basics aside has no one here ever suffered jet lag which can go on for weeks ?! (JUST a note). There is no criteria for it. It
is not the text of the postings but the negative intonation of some
posters who just cannot appreciate the achievement. Enjoy the
moment. Or if you could have trained / ridden her / planned the trip
better then quit griping and get out there and do it. Everyone
came back safe and sound ( as far as YOU know - the immediate
connections know best and will make an announcement if she is
not).
I am just saddened by how many are schocked / sad / surpsrised / that she did not win by blazing a firey trail of glory winning by 30 lengths without pausing for breath. A " fair way" is in the eye of the beholder, to some it may be a nose, to others 1 furlong - yes that is an extreme. If she had won by 5 lengths then all we would hear is "poor quality field".
They are criticising her ability by the very obvious dissapointment she did not win by 10+ lengths.
How do YOU define a fair way? She has travelled halfway around the world, basics aside has no one here ever suffered jet lag which can go on for weeks ?! (JUST a note). There is no criteria for it. It
is not the text of the postings but the negative intonation of some
posters who just cannot appreciate the achievement. Enjoy the
moment. Or if you could have trained / ridden her / planned the trip
better then quit griping and get out there and do it. Everyone
came back safe and sound ( as far as YOU know - the immediate
connections know best and will make an announcement if she is
not).
I am just saddened by how many are schocked / sad / surpsrised / that she did not win by blazing a firey trail of glory winning by 30 lengths without pausing for breath. A " fair way" is in the eye of the beholder, to some it may be a nose, to others 1 furlong - yes that is an extreme. If she had won by 5 lengths then all we would hear is "poor quality field".
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ester
Not slacking multitasking
I think it is fair to define 'a fair way' as more than a head!
Crugeran Celt
Well-Known Member
You just don't get it, I am sure everyone was delighted that she won, me included but due to the hype expected a more spectacular finish. That doesn't take away her fantastic racing history and never will, just expected more due to the pre expectations of the whole racing world not just a few on this forum. We are not alone!
Brigadoon
Well-Known Member
Jockey error but at least she won. Racing is hard enough and both flat and jump racing needs heroes and heroines. It keeps the sport "up there" and people interested.
My tuppence worth's is she is a cracking mare. Big, chunky and full of presence. Clearly well loved by all her connections and an international fan-club. Her future is safe.
I have seen all her races and, sure, this performance was not in her usual league but as many are saying, she came over here, different routine etc etc and won. Nolen has realised his mistake and won't do that again. Ever. On any horse.
I hope she has a long and happy retirement after racing.
Even when a film about her life is made I am sure I will still have goosebumps when they re-enact her races!!
Cheerio Nelly..Racing has been all the richer for having you here!
My tuppence worth's is she is a cracking mare. Big, chunky and full of presence. Clearly well loved by all her connections and an international fan-club. Her future is safe.
I have seen all her races and, sure, this performance was not in her usual league but as many are saying, she came over here, different routine etc etc and won. Nolen has realised his mistake and won't do that again. Ever. On any horse.
I hope she has a long and happy retirement after racing.
Even when a film about her life is made I am sure I will still have goosebumps when they re-enact her races!!
Cheerio Nelly..Racing has been all the richer for having you here!
bonny
Well-Known Member
She's hardly the first or the last horse to travel round the world and win a race but she's the first that I can remember who came with such fanfare and hype....everyone was expecting great things and however you look at it we didn't get it. What we got was a fairly ordinary 6 furlong race where they all finished in a heap and another few strides the outcome could have been very different.
Mince Pie
Well-Known Member
I wonder if LN had actually ridden the race from start to finish whether the outcome would have been different. If he's used to being several lengths in front every time she runs then I could see why he didn't although it's no excuse. I was impressed by the mare, it hardly looked like she had broken out of a canter until the end where it got a bit scrappy.
I do think the mares connections are a bit full of themselves, I mean many horses are flown round the world but who else brings their own stalls handler?!
I do think the mares connections are a bit full of themselves, I mean many horses are flown round the world but who else brings their own stalls handler?!
louisawilliams07
New User
I hate these forums its an excuse to bitch when you have ridden and trained winners comment
cefyl
Well-Known Member
oh I do " get it", some just expect machine like performance to transcend time zones / countries / tracks / biological atributes, not real life. "We are not alone"? Too much Star Trek?
ester
Not slacking multitasking
no but fantastic performances will always capture the imagination more than what was seen today.
BBH.. I would.. if I was bothering the bring the mare I wouldn't snub and extra ticket for the stalls dude!
BBH.. I would.. if I was bothering the bring the mare I wouldn't snub and extra ticket for the stalls dude!
Mince Pie
Well-Known Member
Well off the top of my head I can think of 1 person on this thread who has had a big winner this year, and I'm not a regular poster!
JanetGeorge
Well-Known Member
Maybe the jockey didn't push her as she didn't feel 100%?
If he'd pushed her harder and, IF, she is now lame ya'll would be saying a lot worse about the jockey.
Just being a devils advocate
Exactly!! "Jockey Nolen eased up on Black Caviar in the closing stages of the race, and he blames himself for the ride.
"I underestimated the testing track of Ascot," he admitted. "She'd had enough and that big engine throttled right down. "
The trainer said: "if she's as tired and worn out when she gets home, she may have graced the track for a final time."
I don't think either of those quotes suggests arrogance - the arrogance is displayed on this thread by some of you who know bu**er all about this mare, her career, the problems she's had and the way she's been nursed and carefully set up to win 22 races in a row!!!
I'm damn glad that the jockey didn't flog her to win by 10 lengths!!
This mare had nothing to prove. The cash attached to today's win was peanuts compared to some of the races she's won. It was the jockey's first ride at Ascot, which presents its own challenges.
Crugeran Celt
Well-Known Member
Unfortunately you obviously don't get it as I think even her trainer expected a more convincing finish. As the star treck comment, never seen it so I don't get that! Before you get back on your very high horse
just like to say that I am delighted she won and will follow her career with much interest and really hope her winning streak continues ans she keeps well and safe.
HollyWoozle
Well-Known Member
Nobody is denying that Black Caviar travelled a long way to be here, was in a new territory with different ground, climate etc. And from what I can see, nobody is saying that the mare lacks talent or that she doesn't have an impressive race history. It's simply that there was a lot of hype and publicity surrounding her participation in the race (I hardly ever watch the racing and even I watched as I'd heard so much about her) and this led people like me to believe she was likely to win the race very easily. Yes, she won and has added yet another win to her track record, it just wasn't by the margin some of us (or me at least) were expecting.
Of course it's not the mare's fault and I don't think she'll be too upset by what people are saying on a forum. The trainer and staff involved with her certainly deserve to be proud, but they set themselves up for comments like those we're seeing here by seeming so confident that she would win it more easily than she did. But at the end of the day they have an undoubtedly wonderful mare who will go down in racing history, fair play to them.
I for one just hope that Black Caviar is OK now and goes on to live out many happy years.
ETA: there seem to be a few comments in this thread suggesting that those who don't follow racing avidly should avoid commenting because we don't know what we're talking about. I think if people only ever commented on things they consider themselves to be experienced in, we probably wouldn't have too much to talk about!
Of course it's not the mare's fault and I don't think she'll be too upset by what people are saying on a forum.
The trainer and staff involved with her certainly deserve to be proud, but they set themselves up for comments like those we're seeing here by seeming so confident that she would win it more easily than she did. But at the end of the day they have an undoubtedly wonderful mare who will go down in racing history, fair play to them. I for one just hope that Black Caviar is OK now and goes on to live out many happy years.
ETA: there seem to be a few comments in this thread suggesting that those who don't follow racing avidly should avoid commenting because we don't know what we're talking about. I think if people only ever commented on things they consider themselves to be experienced in, we probably wouldn't have too much to talk about!
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cefyl
Well-Known Member
thank you
Alec Swan
Well-Known Member
If we wish to see Brash or Ebullient, and we can add Vulgar, then all we need to do is watch just about any of our Festivals. I thought that the filly's connections were well mannered, courteous and contained.
Sour grapes, anyone?
Exactly as her jockey stated. Despite that, the wonderful horse, wasn't herself, and the ground would have been new to her, despite her time here, on the gallops. A different horse to Frankel, but in her own way, his equal.
Alec.
Ets, Well said, Mrs. George. a.
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bonny
Well-Known Member
well said ....I agree with everything you've said.Nobody is denying that Black Caviar travelled a long way to be here, was in a new territory with different ground, climate etc. And from what I can see, nobody is saying that the mare lacks talent or that she doesn't have an impressive race history. It's simply that there was a lot of hype and publicity surrounding her participation in the race (I hardly ever watch the racing and even I watched as I'd heard so much about her) and this led people like me to believe she was likely to win the race very easily. Yes, she won and has added yet another win to her track record, it just wasn't by the margin some of us (or me at least) were expecting.
Of course it's not the mare's fault and I don't think she'll be too upset by what people are saying on a forum.
I for one just hope that Black Caviar is OK now and goes on to live out many happy years.
she wasn't the only horse either at ascot who came from the other side of the world or even the only one who came a long way and won !
AmyMay
Situation normal
BBH, I think its fantastic that so much thought went in to her management. I don't think that's connections being full of themselves, just wanting to give their horse the best chance. She can be tricky to load, so no point travelling all that way if you can't get her in to the stalls. And she's their superstar so no expense would have been spared.
There's only one thing that let that horse down - her jockey.
There's only one thing that let that horse down - her jockey.
firm
Well-Known Member
JG - It was not the jockey's first ride at Ascot, to be completely accurate, as he had ridden Medicean Man earlier in the week into 4th place.
Crugeran Celt
Well-Known Member
Nobody is denying that Black Caviar travelled a long way to be here, was in a new territory with different ground, climate etc. And from what I can see, nobody is saying that the mare lacks talent or that she doesn't have an impressive race history. It's simply that there was a lot of hype and publicity surrounding her participation in the race (I hardly ever watch the racing and even I watched as I'd heard so much about her) and this led people like me to believe she was likely to win the race very easily. Yes, she won and has added yet another win to her track record, it just wasn't by the margin some of us (or me at least) were expecting.
Of course it's not the mare's fault and I don't think she'll be too upset by what people are saying on a forum.
I for one just hope that Black Caviar is OK now and goes on to live out many happy years.
ETA: there seem to be a few comments in this thread suggesting that those who don't follow racing avidly should avoid commenting because we don't know what we're talking about. I think if people only ever commented on things they consider themselves to be experienced in, we probably wouldn't have too much to talk about!
Perfectly put.
cefyl
Well-Known Member
Her trainer has never ever said or claimed to expect she would win, he is on record as being happy IF she won by a nose. Unfortunately sport and outcome, contrary to whatever fairy tail one likes to live in, does not always conform to expectations, it's called horses and life in this case. Sorry you are so let down Nelly did not run away and trounce the opposition by a mile.
firm
Well-Known Member
I am really pleased she won.
I think the arrogance comments may have stemmed from her trainer saying "It is strange that we have to travel three quarters across the world to race against inferior competition for inferior prize money" to prove his filly's worth and he also was interviewed saying he could not understand Frankel's rating when he just beat the same old horses all the time.
I think the arrogance comments may have stemmed from her trainer saying "It is strange that we have to travel three quarters across the world to race against inferior competition for inferior prize money" to prove his filly's worth and he also was interviewed saying he could not understand Frankel's rating when he just beat the same old horses all the time.
Mince Pie
Well-Known Member
Thank you!