Brave people post "good shoeing" pix please

[cptrayes]

The shoes on this horse are steel not aluminium, natural balance shoes. I agree the feet are not shod with enough support for the feet, this may be a result of fear for them being pulled off but no excuse. They are also hind shoes so unless they are on hind feet they dont give they same degree of breakover benefits a NB front shoe would give as well as the fact they perched onto the toe and not positioned correctly for the style of shoe to give its optimum performance.

Even in barefoot its still important for the balancing and foot mapping to be addressed. And from what i have seen in past few years its massively influenced by how the hooves grow from the inside out, the right diet and if necessary supplements have made a massive impact to how i have seen feet improve whether shod or barefoot.

Of course this is all just my opinion and sometimes that accounts for nothing!

Wow, where have you been for 46 pages ?

I was corrected a long time ago on the steel. You are totally right about the diet of course, one of the interesting things about keeping horses without shoes on is to see how they vary from day to day in their ability to step on a stone and not flinch, depending on how the sun shone and the grass grew yesterday or the day before.

 

[trina1982]

Wow, where have you been for 46 pages ?

Ooooh, we've got another farrier! Cool

 

[cptrayes]

I wondered if anyone would like to make their opinions on my horses feet/shoes? He has typical TB's feet with crappy heels and long and flat feet. He seems to have quite thin soles which are sensitive. I am fairly happy with the shoeing but tbh i have no idea really about the horses feet or how they should really be shod. He has heart bars on the front since the start of summer last year to add support as he was lame. Pictures are just after being shod.

Front Left

Back left

It's difficult to be sure because your pictures were not taken from level with his feet, but in two of these shots the foot looks longer on the left hand side. He also has the fairly common change of angle after the first half inch of foot which shows that he really wants to grow a steeper angle of foot, but can't for some reason.

I'm glad the heart bars are working for you, I know they do with many horses. But if at some time in the future they stop working and he is lame again, please don't take his "typical" TB feet to mean that would prevent him having a period without shoes. It should do him a lot of good in building up his heels. You might also check the barefoot threads for diet advice which could help restore some depth and concavity to his feet with the shoes still on. Flatness/lack of concavity often comes from being unable to cope with a diet too high (for the individual horse, they vary a lot) in carbohydrates/sugar.

 

[ferrador]

did you have to use frost nails David ?

 

[cptrayes]

did you have to use frost nails David ?

Ferrador is also a farrier folks, for those who don't know already. Also for those who don't know, frost nails are tungsten tipped nails that are extremely hard and the pimple of tungsten provides loads of grip on slippy tarmac.

Can you explain what you are trying to say, I doubt if I'm the only one who is confused.

 

[amandap]

Ferrador is also a farrier folks, for those who don't know already.

Can you explain what you are trying to say, I doubt if I'm the only one who is confused.

I don't know what frost nails are either or why you would choose them. I'm assuming it's not to do with temperature.

 

[ester]

I was more confused with who David was!

 

[cptrayes]

I'm pretty sure that David is someone who does not want to post openly under his own name, and since Ferrador does not use his own name either, I would ask him not to cause nastiness on this thread which has so far been absolutely brilliant.

Ferrador please, you're a very experienced remedial farrier. If you can help people learn about foot care for their horses, post some stuff that people can benefit from. Otherwise, please can you go and play somewhere else?

 

[cptrayes]

I don't know what frost nails are either or why you would choose them. I'm assuming it's not to do with temperature.

These We cross posted.

http://www.horseshoeexpress.com.au/tungsten-pin-road-safety-nails.html

 

[cptrayes]

Although I have heard of tungsten nails called frost nails, this may be more accurate. Their purpose is the same.

http://www.mustadhoofnails.com/subcat/40/product/1972/page/0/frost_nail/

 

[amandap]

Thanks cptrayes.

 

[Tinypony]

Just want to add my thanks to everyone taking so much time and trouble over this thread, very informative. If I ever have shoes put on one of mine again I'll be back here for a read!

 

[NOISYGIRL]

I'm confused who's David ? this thread is brilliant btw

 

[cptrayes]

Just wanted to give cptrayes the credit deserved for starting such a successful thread

I'm chuffed how interested people have been, and just grateful that it stayed so incredibly civilised

I'm confused who's David ? this thread is brilliant btw

It's someone who, just like you, doesn't want to use their proper name. Farriers recognise each other's shoeing, and the one called Ferrador was just having a little dig at someone whose work he thinks he has recognised. It's his only contribution to the thread in spite of being a remedial farrier whose experience could have helped us all. Please, let it go, it's not relevant or helpful to the thread.

 

[lauraanddolly]

Very interesting, thank you all who have contributed! I am happy with my farrier, however there are a few things I have noticed this time - If I took some pictures (will be possibly over the weekend as not good light before or after work tomorrow) would one of the kind knowledgeable ones please talk me through what they see?

 

[cptrayes]

If you count me as either kind or knowledgeable I'll try

Please be prepared to get dirty We need pictures from the side and the front with the camera on the floor, so you need to be there too.

Do tell us with the pictures if your horse has any foot/movement issues and how long the shoes have been on for.

 

[ferrador]

just like to point out to folk that i am a farrier , i have never claimed anywhere i am a "remedial farrier" , and if folk checked the forums it is common knowledge on exactly who i am .
a frost nail is not a tungsten tipped nail , it is a large headed nail that is sharpened and used to be fitted every day by the handler , they have not been produced for over 80 yrs but have been replaced by many options mainly screw in studs
chris

 

[amandap]

a frost nail is not a tungsten tipped nail , it is a large headed nail that is sharpened and used to be fitted every day by the handler , they have not been produced for over 80 yrs but have been replaced by many options mainly screw in studs
chris

Ah, thank you for that explanation.

 

[A Guilding]

just like to point out to folk that i am a farrier , i have never claimed anywhere i am a "remedial farrier" , and if folk checked the forums it is common knowledge on exactly who i am .
a frost nail is not a tungsten tipped nail , it is a large headed nail that is sharpened and used to be fitted every day by the handler , they have not been produced for over 80 yrs but have been replaced by many options mainly screw in studs
chris

There are many terms for farriers, Remedial, Corrective, Referral etc, Chris is a good farrier and that is the highest level in my mind you can reach in the trade.
As I have said elsewhere on the forum beware labels, people judge you for the label, some of the best work I have seen done in the world has been by quiet unassuming professionals who serve there customers well, keeping sound horses sound and relieving the consequences of pathology and disease.
All of the jobs on this thread have been in my mind ranged from good working jobs to excellent.

 

[LadyRascasse]

Make of this what you will, I won't be offended! Horse was crippled before and after

so Before's are after the vet removed his shoes and the afters are what the vet prescribed to help with his lameness

Near Fore Before

and after

Off Fore Before

and after

Near Hind Before

and after

Off Hind Before

and After

 

[A Guilding]

I am going to say it before anyone else does, in order to see the finished article lets clean them and get all the dirt wet and mud off them as it is hard to see where the hoof starts and the leg finishes. what did the vet diognose was the cause of lameness?

 

[amandap]

Yes, I'd be really interested in the reasons for the angle change in the off fore especially.

 

[HashRouge]

I'm finding this thread fascinating - glad it's still going!

 

[cptrayes]

just like to point out to folk that i am a farrier , i have never claimed anywhere i am a "remedial farrier" , and if folk checked the forums it is common knowledge on exactly who i am .
a frost nail is not a tungsten tipped nail , it is a large headed nail that is sharpened and used to be fitted every day by the handler , they have not been produced for over 80 yrs but have been replaced by many options mainly screw in studs
chris

My deepest apologies for having promoted you Chris. I was sure you said you did remedial work, I am sorry if that is not true.

Frost nails, as is clear from googling the term, are also permanently placed sharp headed nails, and I'm sure that I have heard people refer to tungsten tip nails (commonly called road nails around here) as frost nails, clearly in error as you point out.

Now, was there anything else that we can learn by you asking why another farrier used them? Do you disapprove of their use or particularly approve of their use, for example?

 

[cptrayes]

Ladyracasse we need, pretty please:

clean photos taken at ground level from the front and the side.

an explanation of what the diagnosis was of your horse's lameness.

I have to say that because of the research I have done into them, I am personally very anti wedges for anything but a very short term relaxation of an injured tendon to allow it to heal. (1 shoeing, perhaps, then half size for another so as not to stretch the tendon suddenly by removing them all in one go). I wouldn't, personally, use them for tendon injury inside the foot, because I think that heals better if you allow the frog to work to support the foot, only for ones higher in the leg. I am not a vet, or a farrier, or even a paid trimmer. These are very much my personal beliefs, but based on research carried out by people who are qualified to judge.

 

[LadyRascasse]

I am going to say it before anyone else does, in order to see the finished article lets clean them and get all the dirt wet and mud off them as it is hard to see where the hoof starts and the leg finishes. what did the vet diognose was the cause of lameness?

Slightly difficult now as these are 3 years old and the horse is dead. The vet never managed to diagnose it however, I changed farrier when to a lightweight shoe with no clips and in 3 shoeing he was sound. I posted them as example of bad feet/shoeing.

 

[LadyRascasse]

I have to say that because of the research I have done into them, I am personally very anti wedges

I would NEVER allow a farrier to put a wedge on my horses feet ever again! this regime by the vet and old farrier crippled my horse, making his lameness much worse than it ever was. However you have to live and learn, was a rather harsh and steep learning curve

 

[LadyRascasse]

Right I think this is the first shoeing by the 'new farrier'

Near fore

Off Fore

Near Hind

Off Hind

 

[lauraanddolly]

Here are mine, I'm totally not sure pictures are good enough but do what you can with them!

Right Fore

The longer edge on this worry's me, not sure why it is like it is?

Left Fore

Right hind

Again same as the front one, only like this on front and hind on the right side

Left hind

Shoes where a new set on the 24th January.

 

[cptrayes]

L&D I would also be worried about the shoe being longer on one side than the other by quite a long way in the sole shots, with one side lying right on top of the frog and the other some way away from it, with the heel bulbs out to one side of the shoe.

I'd also be concerned about the balance of at least one of the feet. If it looks like that in real life, then it looks imbalanced - taller on one side than the other - and you should ask your farrier if there is a problem.

The final thing that concerns me is the shape of your horse's feet. Again, unless it is the photos misleading me, they all look as if the line of the toe is convex. Your farrier might have rasped the toe to make them that shape, but to me they look like they might be growing that way, because the outward curve looks higher than it would normally be if it had been rasped in or worn that way by working in a sand school and dragging her toes. If they are convex, (bullnosed is another term if you want to search the forum for information) then it might indicate that she is getting more carbohydrate/sugar than she can happily digest.



ps I've just noticed how incredibly low the nails are put in on the last photo. Do you know why your farrier has done that? It is truly extraordinary and I have never in my life seen clenches so low on the hoof wall. It looks to me like it's begging for the shoe to pull off and take the bottom of the foot off with it.