Can British breeding ever be anything but a bit crap?

[Asha]

I'll be along to see your young stock if I ever lose Ludo ?
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Let’s hope that’s quite some time in the future and you have many happy years with Ludo. But you are welcome to pop by anytime , especially next year when the 2 foals are on the ground ?

 

[ycbm]

There are some warmblood lines with known problems that still breed because they make young horse winners. So even having registered breeding is no guarantee breeders are doing it for ethical reasons.

I believe Sandro Hit is a suspect for PSSM and I (personally) have yet to meet a horse sired by Johnson that has lived past 10 years old.

I don't think recording parentage is magic bullet for ethical breeding either.

I bought a horse by a local stallion used prolifically in this area because he was a looker, himself quiet, a newly fashionable "warmblood" and produced good looking athletes. I had one friend use him and two others with mares by him, both very quirky. Mine was carefully selected by the breeder to match the mare physically. It was only after I had him out and about that people said "is that a Rosewall Grandure? oh he's well known for throwing difficult horses". Tim Stockdale's mare Winston Bridget was by him and she was notorious for her quirkiness. He continued to be bred from locally until he died.

Somebody this year will buy the offspring of an elite WB stallion and an elite graded mare for a lot of money, not knowing, or having any way to find out, that the mare was practically gifted to the stud after being retired for failing to stand up to any serious level of work.

And I'm sure that's just the top of the iceberg.

If mandating recorded breeding really would cure all ills, then I'm all for it.

 

[ycbm]

Let’s hope that’s quite some time in the future and you have many happy years with Ludo. But you are welcome to pop by anytime , especially next year when the 2 foals are on the ground ?

I'd love to, I'll PM you.
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[TPO]

Haha. Quarter Horse people keep breeding, buying, and showing Impressive lines with HYPP. And they win shows too. Just shows knowing the pedigree -and in this case, everyone knows those lines have an issue- doesn’t stop unsound horses from being bred.

But that's the point. They are doing it *knowingly*. It's not some surprise that they don't know where its come from. So recording and knowing breeding does help.



The ethics and morals is a whole other ball game.

But having that kind of proven information would empower breed societies who would take a stand against such practices

 

[ycbm]

But having that kind of proven information would empower breed societies who would take a stand against such practices

I agree with this but it should say "might" or "could" not "would" take a stance.

The AQHA know about HYPP, they know it is ONLY in stock with Impressive lines and they could eradicate the disease of they refused to register any horse with Impressive anywhere in the heritage unless they could prove they were free of HYPP. But they don't.

Many US Arabs are fully registered mutants that look like they came in on a space ship.

HWSS was known about for a long long time in Connies and the campaign to do something about it started, from what I know, in New Zealand, not Ireland.

Lusitanos are being bred WAY outside their natural size and anecdotally there are soundness problems with that and I've heard the same of Friesians.

Pretty colours, particularly in Arabs and Iberians, are being bred completely disregarding health and temperament.

If only humans were trustworthy!

I don't, btw, disagree that whole life data of all offspring would not be a very valuable thing for horse buyers and breeders
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[TPO]

I agree with this but it should say "might" or "could" not "would" take a stance.

Yeah, I was speed typing while filling buckets and didn't word it correctly, apologies.

I meant that the information would empower societies who were of a mind to make changes. Not that the information, or lack of, was the only thing that has stopped the changes being made to date.

 

[ycbm]

Yeah, I was speed typing while filling buckets and didn't word it correctly, apologies.

I meant that the information would empower societies who were of a mind to make changes. Not that the information, or lack of, was the only thing that has stopped the changes being made to date.

We agree violently ?

ETA I've never been happier to be in livery than in these temperatures!

 

[LEC]

Plenty of people continue to overinflate their ability and exaggerate their needs. They get the wrong horses for their ability and those horses/bloodlines get the bad rep. Even in here some (non continental) horses get talked badly of and really the issues lie at the feet of the current owners

I see it on the forum and at RC everyday. Middle aged woman has a ford fiesta horse which has been great then goes and buys
1)horse version of BMW 3 series sport and can’t cope
2) thinks horse prices are over inflated so buys unbroken or green 4yo and makes a poor job of it.

 

[ShowjumpingPrincess]

A lot of good points. I would add that my observations from dipping my toe in the world of breeding (on a very small scale!) and observing the dressage/event breeding world from afar that one of the big problems seems to be lack of knowledge amongst buyers about what is a horse with good breeding and a horse with top breeding. Particularly when it comes to mare lines (which goes for both breeders and buyers), whereas our European counterparts are much more knowledgable on this.

Genuinely world class broodmares (not just a mare with Donnerhall 5 generations back and who's brother won an elementary once) cost an lot of money, as much as a quality riding horse, but will reward you with offspring for the top sport. Unfortunately there just isn't the market for the offspring of such mares over here- if two foals are by the same stallion I've found that their prices will be pretty similar regardless of their damline unless you are one of the two or three big name studs in the UK. I've made this mistake then struggled to sell the youngstock for even half what I paid for the mare and just ended up keeping them (and probably wasting what could have been an elite level horse for someone!)