Competing at a lower level to 'warm up' - rant!

[ester]

Fwiw it's worth I wasn't considering actual/near collisions more the effect something having issues can have on others in the vicinity.

 

[Under-the-radar]

Fwiw it's worth I wasn't considering actual/near collisions more the effect something having issues can have on others in the vicinity.

IMO the only way a horse can learn to deal with a situation where another horse is having a wobbler, is to be in that situation. For most people, the only way they are going to be in that situation is if they are at a show, or one sort or another.

When I started taking my mare out to shows, she would be horribly distracted by other horses around. But because we kept going out, and just got on with what we needed to do, she learned to concentrate on me, rather than other horses. I am sure that some people have horses who are more focused on their riders then mine is, but the only thing that was going to help my mare was keep going out to shows

 

[cptrayes]

I'm glad you like the name. Sorry Princess, but I don't think am apology is warranted. You had a horse with what read on your posts to me like a morbid fear of tractors. And you consistently took him to high class venues where you could have come across a tractor at any time. The venue you were at has told me that they have you a five minute warning, but it's your word against theirs, so we'll never know the truth of that one. It matters little, anyway, in venues the size that you go to there will always be heavy machinery around, and it really does read to me as if you have different expectations of other people's abilities to control their horses than your own. The fact that he escaped you while you were leading him and ran into a passing ridden stallion while loose shows me, no matter how close to you the tractor was, that is the case.

I've never seen anyone at a competition who was competing in an Intro class cause the slightest problem to anyone else. I've had more trouble with the high level riders suddenly coming across the arena in half pass, throwing a pirouette, or doing canter to halt in front of me. I think your desire to prevent less experienced people having fun is sad, and thankfully I don't think it will ever happen, because venues need the money.

I think you are very brave, with a two year old to start, to be posting on record that any amount of preparation can stop a young horse at his first real party from misbehaving!

 

[Prince33Sp4rkle]

yes and i get that.

also FWIW i took great care to always keep him in his own space and not to get boxed in. I do think rearing is slightly less obnoxious than say explosive bucking on a scale of upsetting other peoples horses! only once was it mentioned in five years(by the steward noted in my previous reply) , i NEVER had any other person in the warm up mention it to me and i think that record speaks for its self as we all know how quick dressage divas are to snap if they think someone is in the wrong(me included lol!!!!!). I doubt he could have be consistently upsetting other horses for 5 years and never had it mentioned by a single rider, or team member, or ground crew or family member??????????

however, this has all become very CS based and i think the OP is probably pretty fed up so can we leave it at that.

 

[Prince33Sp4rkle]

I'm glad you like the name. Sorry Princess, but I don't think am apology is warranted. You had a horse with what read on your posts to me like a morbid fear of tractors. And you consistently took him to high class venues where you could have come across a tractor at any time. The venue you were at has told me that they have you a five minute warning, but it's your word against theirs, so we'll never know the truth of that one. It matters little, anyway, in venues the size that you go to there will always be heavy machinery around, and it really does read to me as if you have different expectations of other people's abilities to control their horses than your own. The fact that he escaped you while you were leading him and ran into a passing ridden stallion shows me, no matter how close to you the tractor was, seems to indicate that.

I've never seen anyone at a competition who was competing in an Intro class cause the slightest problem to anyone else. I think your desire to prevent those people having fun is sad, and thankfully I don't think it will ever happen, because venues need the money.

I think you are very brave, with a two year old to start, to be posting on record that any amount of preparation can stop a young horse at his first real party from misbehaving!

im not sure where i actually said that CPT?! in fact i actually said the opposite-that im sure he WILL make me wince....yep just checked and thats what i said....

......what i also said was that i personally dont think intro classes contribute much to the general standard of dressage and that people shouldnt go out in public before they can canter safely, in balance, and without being scared to the point of not being in complete control.

i also said that in my opinion correct preparation includes multiple arena hires.

i also said that i will have done multiple arena hires and thus will feel as well prepped as i can when i take Goofs out

although all that said i kind of hope he plods round like a donkey, ill get you a lovely pic, just for you CPT, howza bout it?

you are very good at twisting the truth,i need a gold star emoji...........

 

[Perfect_Pirouette]

im not sure where i actually said that CPT?! in fact i actually said the opposite-that im sure he WILL make me wince....yep just checked and thats what i said....

......what i also said was that i personally dont think intro classes contribute much to the general standard of dressage and that people shouldnt go out in public before they can canter safely, in balance, and without being scared to the point of not being in complete control.

i also said that in my opinion correct preparation includes multiple arena hires.

i also said that i will have done multiple arena hires and thus will feel as well prepped as i can when i take Goofs out

although all that said i kind of hope he plods round like a donkey, ill get you a lovely pic, just for you CPT, howza bout it?

you are very good at twisting the truth,i need a gold star emoji...........

You need a gold medal for patience more like, talk about trying to wind someone up! (I don't mean you!x)

 

[cptrayes]

I apologise for making this personal, but I don't really see any other way I could have pointed out the unfairness of PS suggesting that Intro riders are causing problems for other riders?

If you check back, although, no names were named, it was pretty derogatory stuff.

It was basically telling the OP that she shouldn't even have been there, never mind been mildly annoyed by a pot hunter.

 

[Prince33Sp4rkle]

i said i find lower level warm ups more nerve wracking. I did not imply that any one particular person on this thread or IRL was an issue, at no point have i made it personal

I still do think that being able to canter in balance and without *too* much worry is a good thing to have nailed before going public and if you can do it in the warm up you can defs do it in the ring.

Bless the little Goof ball, ill go home and tell him he's got CPT to impress now, so we had better re-double our de spooking, big love for that little chappy

 

[Under-the-radar]

I apologise for making this personal, but I don't really see any other way I could have pointed out the unfairness of PS suggesting that Intro riders are causing problems for other riders?

If you check back, although, no names were named, it was pretty derogatory stuff.

It was basically telling the OP that she shouldn't even have been there, never mind been mildly annoyed by a pot hunter.

Fairly sure that PS said nothing of the sort to the OP. I read her post that she was advising the OP that people do often compete at two levels, and if you don't want to be beaten, work harder and just get past the people who are pot hunting, as they will eternally stay pot hunting at the same level.

 

[cptrayes]

i

and if you can do it in the warm up you can defs do it in the ring.

We may be getting to the crux of the issue here, because I don't believe this is true. At any venue you can see the people who tense up as they go past A into the arena and begin to be judged. I'm one of them, and I'm in good company. Horses behave differently under those conditions. The only way, as a rider, to overcome that is to compete and to submit yourself to that judgement, and for some people that's easier if they don't need to worry about more than walk and trot.

People who compete at your level seem to have nerves of steel. I hope one day at least to have nerves of copper. Give me a six foot hedge any day rather than a stern faced dressage judge

 

[Prince33Sp4rkle]

you may not be able to do it well, and indeed no one can do it perfectly...........but if you can(physically) canter a circle in the warm up you can (physically) canter a circle in the ring, as can the horse.

i wouldnt over complicate it or you (generic) run the risk of making it a bigger issue than it needs to be.

 

[wench]

My horse went wonderfully in the warm up in the last dressage comp I went to. Best I've ever had. Did it translate to the "real" thing... no. It wasnt videoed so I dont know if it was me, the horse, or a mixture of both.

How is this problem going to be cured? By taking the horse out over and over again to walk and trot tests.

 

[cptrayes]

you may not be able to do it well, and indeed no one can do it perfectly...........but if you can(physically) canter a circle in the warm up you can (physicallyridenter a circle in the ring, as can the horse.

i wouldnt over complicate it or you (generic) run the risk of making it a bigger issue than it needs to be.

But this isn't true of all horse rider combinations Princess, is it? There are horses which have warmed up beautifully, but given the additional pressure of a rider stressed from being judged the horse may buck, spook, stop or do any manner of things in the ring.

I'm sorry to make this personal again, but I know you've experienced this yourself. Several of your competition reports would say how nicely CS did the pirouette or half pass zig zags in the warm up, but not in the ring, where his behaviour would occasionally be spectacular ! It's the same at canter for the rest of us ordinary mortals who are down at Intro level.

 

[Prince33Sp4rkle]

yes but if you desperately want to use that example-it didnt stop me going and doing it did it.

perhaps this is another tangent?

i never used to be brave, but if you want to succeed you have to be, so i faked it until one day i was actually for real, brave.

everyone can do that.

the more you make of it the more it takes you over. I dont let any of my pupils tell me they cant, if i say they can...they can....and they better get on in there and try and fake it until they make it! I teach a lot of people on a lot of horses and thus far this rather mean approach has turned mouses in to lions time and time again.

the amount of over thinking and fannying around some people place on something as simple as this.............its no wonder so many people think they cant progress past prelim.

you can all canter people, yep you can, all of you, and you can all get to elem/medium and if its got more than 1 brain cell and can do a change you can all get to adv med, if you want it enough to fake it for a bit.

now go do...in the nicest possible way

 

[ester]

IMO the only way a horse can learn to deal with a situation where another horse is having a wobbler, is to be in that situation. For most people, the only way they are going to be in that situation is if they are at a show, or one sort or another.

When I started taking my mare out to shows, she would be horribly distracted by other horses around. But because we kept going out, and just got on with what we needed to do, she learned to concentrate on me, rather than other horses. I am sure that some people have horses who are more focused on their riders then mine is, but the only thing that was going to help my mare was keep going out to shows

Absolutely agree

 

[cptrayes]

I don't understand, though. I thought you wanted to stop people from gaining experience of tests with no canter in them?

If the cure is with the horse and rider getting over being judged, then the best way to achieve that is surely more and more tests with no canter, rather than do tests with canter and have the horse behave wrongly in the ring? Doesn't that risk a catastrophic loss of confidence by both horse and rider?

I guess I just don't understand at all why you want to get rid of Intro tests. I think they can be useful for training the rider and the horse, and I think a lot of hobby riders are having a lot of fun doing them. Pretty sure BD and the venues love the money too

 

[Moomin1]

i tend to agree with susie (albeit this is a different topic really and a bit of a tangent.....)

i cant get too worked up -see my earlier point re rules is rules, get a grip...............BUT if you cant canter, should you really be at a show? for whatever reason that may be, are you really competent and is the horse really on the aids enough to be in a busy public warm up, if it cant even canter a flipping 20m circle?!

really?

3yo under saddle tests for mare and stallion grading have canter in them..................

if intro tests were abolished i think general standards would rise albeit then you would only have the whingers and the whiners moaning that so and so used the prelim as a warm up.....!

I am afraid I have to agree with this.

My horse had canter issues up until this year, and I wouldn't have even thought about bothering taking her to a competition.

 

[cptrayes]

I am afraid I have to agree with this.

My horse had canter issues up until this year, and I wouldn't have even thought about bothering taking her to a competition.

Is Minimoo asleep ?

Moomin, do you mean that you would never put her in an Intro test, or just that you would not take her to do any test until she had canter sorted?

 

[eggs]

I don't always do so well with standing still either so removing halt would be just great too

Personally I would like to see fly leaping included at all levels

 

[cptrayes]

Personally I would like to see fly leaping included at all levels

Ah, but can you produce it at the right marker? Accuracy is important you know!

 

[Art Nouveau]

I'd quite like 'wiggle down the centre line and come to a halt with bum poking to the side.'
Maybe we should develop a new type of freestyle dressage.

 

[cptrayes]

I'd quite like 'wiggle down the centre line and come to a halt with bum poking to the side.'
Maybe we should develop a new type of freestyle dressage.

OK let's go for our prefect test. Copy and Paste to add your next move, folks, and see what we get.

1. Enter at A and wiggle down the centre line.

2. Halt at G with bum squished out to one side.

3. Move off as if stung by a bee, stop and stare in amazement at the judge's hair color, turn right.





Over to you! Remember this is a walk and canter only test.

 

[eggs]

OK let's go for our prefect test. Copy and Paste to add your next move, folks, and see what we get.

1. Enter at A and wiggle down the centre line.

2. Halt at G with bum squished out to one side.

3. Move off as if stung by a bee, stop and stare in amazement at the judge's hair color, turn right.





Over to you! Remember this is a walk and canter only test.

well it is anything like one test I did

4. decide that you don't want to track left at C

5. crab round the corner and set off fly leaping at H (that is where there accuracy comes in!!!)

6. pick up perfectly at K and carry on as if nothing happend

 

[ann-jen]

My test on Sunday included....
working canter, circle at A with large buck when passing over X

 

[Art Nouveau]

So we have...

1. Enter at A and wiggle down the centre line.

2. Halt at G with bum squished out to one side.

3. Move off as if stung by a bee, stop and stare in amazement at the judge's hair color, turn right.

4. decide that you don't want to track left at C

5. crab round the corner and set off fly leaping at H (that is where there accuracy comes in!!!)

6. pick up perfectly at K and carry on as if nothing happened

7. Working canter at A and complete 20 metre-ish egg shaped pattern

8. include large buck when passing X


do we then change the rein and repeat?

 

[trottingon]

7. KX walk across diagonal on a long rein
8. XM still in walk proceed to raise horses head as if imitating a giraffe staring at something no-one else can even see in the distance, extra points for snorting

 

[trottingon]

Sorry mine is now 9&10

 

[trottingon]

11 MA sideways crab movement in trot still doing impression of giraffe

 

[humblepie]

Hey our first intro test included stop at f and neigh at horse by gate. Year and a bit later best part of 100 bd points. For me the intro was a good way of getting an away from home experience but second time out we did the prelim even though canter was more luck than skill.

 

[ilvpippa]

I always compete at intro level; but we rarely get placed so I'm happy with the outing which is why Intro was out there in the first place?
My girl was injuried & had to have surgery in July so even now if I wanted to do prelim we couldn't as she wouldn't be able to maintain the amount of canter.