Clodagh
Well-Known Member
Basically KC registered means absolutely nothing at all.
CRUFTS 2024 roll call!
- Thread starter EllieBeast
- Start date
Cortez
Tough but Fair
They look like every Jack Russell I've ever seen, unlike the example seen at Crufts which looked like something else entirely. I've had Jack Russells for over 50 years (not the same ones....)
EllieBeast
Well-Known Member
Finally home, unpacked, rental van returned and ponies done.
Having a bit of a rest before I tackle the online orders.
Not sure if I met any of you
Erik is currently enjoying his black Goughnut ring
we were served by a lovely helpful gentleman on Saturday afternoon 
druid
Well-Known Member
An interesting observation that the BIS winner, the Bitch CC in Jack's and Res Dog CC were all featured in Show dog media last week ahead of Crufts just like Orca and the catalogue photo last year.
SkylarkAscending
Well-Known Member
I did smile at “not the same ones” - I know they tend to be long-lived but that would be amazing
Tiddlypom
Carries on creakily
Is that happy coincidence or rather fishy?
EllieBeast
Well-Known Member
That’s quite spooky!!
SkylarkAscending
Well-Known Member
Ditchjumper2
Well-Known Member
Same as horse showing! And that's most definitely a fact.Thats dog showing for you….
SkylarkAscending
Well-Known Member
To be honest I’ve never got into horse showing, mainly because I assumed it would run like dog showing! I suppose really any showing activity has the potential to have a dodgy side
Ditchjumper2
Well-Known Member
@SkylarkAscending me neither. But I had a quality horse who someone showed for me for one season. What I experienced proved beyond all doubt its is who you are and who you know.
palo1
Well-Known Member
I am another one familiar with many presentations of the JRT.! My grandfather had dogs so similar to @SkylarkAscending that it is uncanny! His son, my uncle had more variety and had a couple more like the Crufts reserve.
In terms of function, short legs were a significant advantage; allowing the dog to go underground easily and for its head and jaws to be the first thing to meet the quarry, rather than the paws and legs of the longer legged type. It could make a serious difference to the safety of the dog. People still quibble over t he leg length; technically for a dog going down a hole after something, short legs would be more correct. For a dog working more above ground, whether ratting, rabbiting or something else, possibly requiring pursuit, longer legs would be more useful and possibly safer, in terms of avoiding bites to the belly. But both types are functional and were BITD universally accepted, in my experience under the JRT banner. The KC are likely to ruin this too!!
In terms of function, short legs were a significant advantage; allowing the dog to go underground easily and for its head and jaws to be the first thing to meet the quarry, rather than the paws and legs of the longer legged type. It could make a serious difference to the safety of the dog. People still quibble over t he leg length; technically for a dog going down a hole after something, short legs would be more correct. For a dog working more above ground, whether ratting, rabbiting or something else, possibly requiring pursuit, longer legs would be more useful and possibly safer, in terms of avoiding bites to the belly. But both types are functional and were BITD universally accepted, in my experience under the JRT banner. The KC are likely to ruin this too!!
Cinnamontoast
Fais pas chier!
How long do you have?! They have done precisely sod all to ensure welfare (that I can see) since forever. Assured breeders sometimes have no visits (from what I'm told) so how are they 'assured'?
I read about the best of breed some years ago who was known to have syringomyelia having produced at least 50 litters. How can this be allowed and who the hell was having their bitch covered by him? Surely the first thing you do when considering breeding from a breed known for it, you'd ask for the clear certificate? Yet the KC carried on registering his puppies.
The Kennel Club - A Force for Good? Or Profiteers from Poorly Puppies? - Vet Help Direct
Do the kennel club do enough to promote, encourage and ensure the welfare of the UK’s dog population? Or are they in it for the money? According to their website, the kennel club was set up in 1873 to develop a consistent set of rules for governing the popular new activities of dog showing and […]vethelpdirect.com
“Dogs that have been identified as being at risk of producing offspring that would have reduced welfare due to their genetics or the results of screening, are not actively prevented from breeding or being able to register with Kennel Club; so there are no direct consequences for breeders making poor choices leading to producing puppies with poor welfare.
Some diseases that are common in breeds, e.g. syringomyelia in Cavalier King Charles Spaniels, are not protected. There is no recommendation or requirement to not breed those that are affected by this disease.”
*slinks back under rock*
druid
Well-Known Member
The ABS is a joke, it does nothing to stop puppy farmers signing up effectively
AShetlandBitMeOnce
Well-Known Member
Well you learn something new every day, admittedly I am not remotely up on dog breeding nor showing as we have always had either mutts or working dogs, but what is the point in being registered at all if it provides you nothing close to a guarantee of anything, health, lineage or otherwise?! Just a waste of money.
CorvusCorax
Justified & Ancient
I'd rather have a(ny) kennel club registration than not, it is (some) proof of breed/ID (the microchip should be included), proof of ownership, allows you to participate in a lot of sports and is a document onto which health test results can be stamped.
The European breed clubs (which handle the issue of pedigrees/registrations) have a better handle on it, for example, an A4, four page booklet with the registration details, colour names of all the siblings and their details and breeder details, five gen pedigree on inside pages, room for all health test results, a section where dentition is recorded and the entire back page is for competition results and any transfer of ownership, the document stays with the dog for life. Pedigrees/reg certificates in these islands belong to the owner and a lot of detail can be lost upon transfer/re-issue.
The European breed clubs (which handle the issue of pedigrees/registrations) have a better handle on it, for example, an A4, four page booklet with the registration details, colour names of all the siblings and their details and breeder details, five gen pedigree on inside pages, room for all health test results, a section where dentition is recorded and the entire back page is for competition results and any transfer of ownership, the document stays with the dog for life. Pedigrees/reg certificates in these islands belong to the owner and a lot of detail can be lost upon transfer/re-issue.
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Tiddlypom
Carries on creakily
But can you trust any of it (the KC)?
ihatework
Well-Known Member
Ha ha! I have never considered dog showing because I assume it’s the same as horse showing
CorvusCorax
Justified & Ancient
It's all there is, anything else isn't recognised by the FCI and doesn't mean jack.
Annette4
Well-Known Member
Don't think we met but Fen loves his Goughnut.Finally home, unpacked, rental van returned and ponies done.
Having a bit of a rest before I tackle the online orders.
Not sure if I met any of you
Clodagh
Well-Known Member
Well I always do buy KC reg as it’s better than nothing. And as I don’t buy many I tend to know the breeders and like to think they are honest individuals.
Look at some prefixes though (Devongem?) and these people are registering 100’s of pups, how is that being done properly? And KC do not care a jot.
AShetlandBitMeOnce
Well-Known Member
I can see the reasoning, and what CC has posted about being able to compete, but it doesn't sound like it provides you much more protection than the due dilligence you would do irrespective of the KC Reg
Britestar
Well-Known Member
My big brotherErik is currently enjoying his black Goughnut ring
Annette4
Well-Known Member
Sounds about right, someone in sports has had 2 'lifetime' bans and is still back competing at major televised events, involved in judging and pumping out several litters of puppies every year. I've seen them post ban picking up dogs by their ears and alpha rolling dogs who wouldn't run.
Smitty
Well-Known Member
I don't watch Crufts. I like the types of JRT you see at working terrier and lurcher shows.
satinbaze
Well-Known Member
The breed standard for the Jack Russell Terrier was drawn up by the FCI in 2012 before they were recognised by the KC. Many of those shown in the UK come from Australian stock were they have been shown for a number of years. Here is a link to the FCI breed standard
By the way the Flatcoat best of breed is my puppies sire
By the way the Flatcoat best of breed is my puppies sire
palo1
Well-Known Member
Thank you for that. Of course it means now that what many people have known as a very familiar JRT type - such as my grandfather had, is not represented in reality by the KC. The breed standard seems fine actually but it still does not quite conjure up the historic reality!
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Clodagh
Well-Known Member
that is true, and as I don’t breed registration makes no odds to me. You so rarely find unregistered ones that are fully health tested, sadly, though.
And I suppose it does make it marginally harder for fraudsters. They have to go to a little more effort.
malwhit
Well-Known Member
When I used to get Dog World, the week before Crufts there was always a supplement that highlighted the top winners from the previous year. Often with full page adverts from the owners / breeders
The top dogs often didnt get to win the group a week later, and in some cases not even Best of Breed. If judges get influenced by advertisements and the dog's previous wins, they shouldn't be judging
MurphysMinder
Well-Known Member
I'm not sure if it was mentioned on here, but the coonhound that was lost from Crufts has been found !