Fosse Park Leicester horses

[missmatch]

The decomposed horse died from natural causes, it was not removed as there was no access to the site. The RSPCA had a jcb on there as soon as they were able too. The horse pts, was attended by the rspca who called a vet out and had the horse humanely euthanised. According to the law there is a legal requirement that owners have to provide their animals, believe it or not this has been adhered too within the law. Whilst it is not too our standards it conforms to legal standards. Should the rspca seize these horses that is theft. Next up will be the fb page stating the rspca stole their horses. Damned if they do , damned if they dont. The horses are the property of the owner if he wants to shoot them all he can. The rspca can do nothing about this. They cannot in any way shape or form stop him slaughtering his livestock. There are so many things wrong here but please know that the rspca are as handbound as you all are. We need to change the law, sign the petition to start that ball rolling. This is a multi agency rescue and has been for quite some time. Everything has to be done by the book.

 

[diamonddogs]

genuinely interested-i too have driven past these horses probably on average every other week, for the last 6/8 years.
i even commented to NMT last time (just prior to the floods) that they looked very well (or those we could see up against the fence did anyway).

they always have hay in bad weather and water.

have i missed something? are there emaciated ones away from the road view?...

I know these fields well, and there's a big river (which I believe is part of the main canal through Leicester) which overflows just about every winter running through the fields. And these fields are massive, so very likely there are areas where the horses have been OK at certain times of year (laminitis aside of course). I wonder if they congregated in that particular area as this is where they had their occasional meals, though it doesn't sound like it if there was no access to move the foal's carcass, therefore no access to bring in forage.

There are two problems here though - one, I'd give my right arm for a field like that, and I'd make sure I managed the pasture properly, cleaned it up and fenced off the dangerous areas - some of it is obviously unusable for grazing, but not all. Then the horses would be moved around regularly so the pasture had time to recover. But nobody cared enough to do this - Everards are absent landlords, so never checked all was well (do landlords have any responsibility to check the land is being looked after?) and the tenant was happy as long as he had somewhere cheap to keep his animals till he could cash them in. I don't believe these poor horses were deliberately hidden from view as the field is so big.

The other problem is, these poor animals, victims of indiscriminate breeding (for whatever purpose - they don't look as though you'd get a decent meal off the whole herd put together) after a long period of time become invisible to the public, who only become aware when something awful like this happens.

Keep sharing and signing the petition. There are probably thousands of horses, ponies and donkeys living in these conditions or worse, and it makes me weep because we can't help them all.

 

[FionaM12]

The Fosse Park "owner" has said he is having all the horses put down this afternoon, despite many offers to rehome them. I have never been one for the "RSPCA bashing" I have seen on this forum and others, but if they just stand by and watch this happen, they are a b****y national disgrace.

But what can they do? They have to act within the law.

 

[Moomin1]

The Fosse Park "owner" has said he is having all the horses put down this afternoon, despite many offers to rehome them. I have never been one for the "RSPCA bashing" I have seen on this forum and others, but if they just stand by and watch this happen, they are a b****y national disgrace.

That is a ridiculous comment. Nobody can possibly prevent someone humanely pts'ing their animals for any reason. There are enough people on this forum who have pts due to all sorts of reasons other than health ones...

 

[Adopter]

But what can they do? They have to act within the law.

Agree, it is not the charities at fault, but the owner. So many seem to want to blame the hard working charities, police etc, but as you say they have to act within the law.

It is the law that needs making fit for purpose and all the problems currently being experienced.

 

[Janesomerset]

That is a ridiculous comment. Nobody can possibly prevent someone humanely pts'ing their animals for any reason. There are enough people on this forum who have pts due to all sorts of reasons other than health ones...

Well, pardon me for being ridiculous, but I stupidly thought RSPCA stood for Royal Society for the Prevention of Cruelty to Animals. So it's not cruel to watch scum kill a horse which could have had a happy life with someone else?
If said scum doesn't have passports for these animals, I don't see why they cannot be taken away to safety.

 

[ester]

thanks, do we know why the one down in the water WAS down?trapped?injured?emaciated and weak?

just trying to be very careful and clear about this as the horses have always looked fairly ok and the hay i could see was gold/greeny/yellowy up to 2 weeks ago but obviously i have not actually been in to the field, just driven past.

agree it is clearly not ideal though.

video of the down horse PS, although I don't think that will fully answer your question.

 

[Moomin1]

Well, pardon me for being ridiculous, but I stupidly thought RSPCA stood for Royal Society for the Prevention of Cruelty to Animals. So it's not cruel to watch scum kill a horse which could have had a happy life with someone else?
If said scum doesn't have passports for these animals, I don't see why they cannot be taken away to safety.

What is cruel about humane pts?

Last time I checked, there was no offence in having your animal pts humanely....

 

[zigzag]

Well, pardon me for being ridiculous, but I stupidly thought RSPCA stood for Royal Society for the Prevention of Cruelty to Animals. So it's not cruel to watch scum kill a horse which could have had a happy life with someone else?
If said scum doesn't have passports for these animals, I don't see why they cannot be taken away to safety.

He is breeding them for meat, they die today or in a few months

 

[Janesomerset]

Nothing, if there is no alternative, but these horses have been offered a chance of a decent life, which I believe they deserve as much (if not more) as any other living creature.

What is cruel about humane pts?
Scum isn't proposing doing this as a humane gesture. There is nothing humane about him.

Last time I checked, there was no offence in having your animal pts humanely....

 

[LaMooch]

*dons tin hat*

If these horses are living a miserable life and destined to be transported for meat anyway..... Is it really so bad for them to just be out of it this afternoon?

I'm as fluffy as the next, trust me, but if the alternative to being PTS today is to paddle around being hungry for a few months then be killed anyway.....is it much of an alternative?

I agree. Too many unwanted horses needing home's so it be best all round and for these horses to have these horses put out of their suffering

 

[FionaM12]

It is distressing thinking of them all being pts this afternoon, I understand that.

However, there are far more horses in need than there are good homes, we have a massive problem of too many poorly-bred unwanted horses. Them being pts at least ends their suffering.

As for "sanctuary" having been offered, do we know where and who? Many of the so-called rescues aren't able to adequately care for their animals either in the present climate.

I agree with Ladyinred, the trouble is they may not be pts but simply dispersed by the owner to suffer elsewhere.

 

[chestnut cob]

Nothing, if there is no alternative, but these horses have been offered a chance of a decent life, which I believe they deserve as much (if not more) as any other living creature.

Would you be saying that if they were cattle or sheep? These horses were bred and kept for meat so that fate is going to come to them anyway. There is nothing cruel about having those horses put down.

Can I also ask what you propose happens to these horses once they are "rescued"? They are probably not v well bred so possibly won't have the best conformation. I'd imagine they come with a whole host of potential veterinary problems (worms at the very least, along with weight issues plus anything else associated with being kept in that manner), as well as probably being not terribly well handled. They will need to be completely rehabilitated and begin their educations with the aim of *possibly* going on to be safe, well rounded riding horses. I hate to say it but the charities are overwhelmed as it is. There are so so many horses out there who are already useful riding horses which need homes. Only so many horses can be "rescued" and rehomed. Being put down isn't the worst fate that could befall an animal, and certainly not one destined for the bullet sooner or later for meat anyway.

 

[Janesomerset]

I believe that even if only one life is saved, it's worth it. My horse is a "rescue" horse. He was worth saving. Please, whatever your opinions, sign the petition to try to improve animal welfare. This is my last post on this forum.

 

[Patterdale]

I believe that even if only one life is saved, it's worth it. My horse is a "rescue" horse. He was worth saving. Please, whatever your opinions, sign the petition to try to improve animal welfare. This is my last post on this forum.

You will find on this forum passion for horse welfare, but tempered with reasoned debate.

You cannot simply 'go and get them,' as they are not yours. There ARE fates worse than a humane end.

It is very easy to simply rant and rage but in reality - it doesn't solve anything.

 

[AmyMay]

You will find on this forum passion for horse welfare, but tempered with reasoned debate.

You cannot simply 'go and get them,' as they are not yours. There ARE fates worse than a humane end.

It is very easy to simply rant and rage but in reality - it doesn't solve anything.

Completely agree.

 

[Moomin1]

Nothing, if there is no alternative, but these horses have been offered a chance of a decent life, which I believe they deserve as much (if not more) as any other living creature.

Humane gesture?! It doesn't matter whether it's a 'humane gesture' or an inhumane cruel minded gesture, so long as the horses are pts HUMANELY.

The horses can't understand his thoughts or feelings.

 

[digitalangel]

ive been banging my head against the facebook page pretty much all day. they are meat horses, if they are going to potters/turners they will have passports, the owner can do as he likes, nothing the public can do as they arent seen to be suffering. being in breach of the AWA isnt a criminal act in itself. Its all a very emotive business but there are horses in worse places and theres already a crisis with charities being full to the brim. Why dont the people offering these ponies a home offer one from a rescue centre?

Dont get me wrong, feel sorry for them and i dont think theyre being kept properly, ive just seen this too many times before with the RSPCA.

 

[kp31]

ive been banging my head against the facebook page pretty much all day. they are meat horses, if they are going to potters/turners they will have passports, the owner can do as he likes, nothing the public can do as they arent seen to be suffering. being in breach of the AWA isnt a criminal act in itself. Its all a very emotive business but there are horses in worse places and theres already a crisis with charities being full to the brim. Why dont the people offering these ponies a home offer one from a rescue centre?

Dont get me wrong, feel sorry for them and i dont think theyre being kept properly, ive just seen this too many times before with the RSPCA.

The issue is if they were cattle or sheep they would not be treated in this way. Yes they may destined for meat but they are entitled to a certain level of care and consideration, neither which have been applied. I have lived in this area or my life and reported these horses along with other people numerous times and each time the RSPCA has done nothing. Is it right that dead carcasses are left in the field rotting, ponies get down that can't get up? Have you seen the news of the farmers delivering hay and feed to those in Somerset and surrounding areas hit by the floods, who can't get to their cattle? Farmers would care more for these animals than what this so called man has, and why should they be PTS so he can have his 5 minutes of fame? it makes an absolute mockery of us that we as an animal loving nation allow things like to happen. So good luck to those who are willing to put themselves out there and hopefully make a difference, change has to start somewhere.

 

[LaMooch]

The issue is if they were cattle or sheep they would not be treated in this way. Yes they may destined for meat but they are entitled to a certain level of care and consideration, neither which have been applied. I have lived in this area or my life and reported these horses along with other people numerous times and each time the RSPCA has done nothing. Is it right that dead carcasses are left in the field rotting, ponies get down that can't get up? Have you seen the news of the farmers delivering hay and feed to those in Somerset and surrounding areas hit by the floods, who can't get to their cattle? Farmers would care more for these animals than what this so called man has, and why should they be PTS so he can have his 5 minutes of fame? it makes an absolute mockery of us that we as an animal loving nation allow things like to happen. So good luck to those who are willing to put themselves out there and hopefully make a difference, change has to start somewhere.

So true

 

[Moomin1]

The issue is if they were cattle or sheep they would not be treated in this way. Yes they may destined for meat but they are entitled to a certain level of care and consideration, neither which have been applied. I have lived in this area or my life and reported these horses along with other people numerous times and each time the RSPCA has done nothing. Is it right that dead carcasses are left in the field rotting, ponies get down that can't get up? Have you seen the news of the farmers delivering hay and feed to those in Somerset and surrounding areas hit by the floods, who can't get to their cattle? Farmers would care more for these animals than what this so called man has, and why should they be PTS so he can have his 5 minutes of fame? it makes an absolute mockery of us that we as an animal loving nation allow things like to happen. So good luck to those who are willing to put themselves out there and hopefully make a difference, change has to start somewhere.

So what sort of law would you suggest gets passed in order for certain people to be allowed to pts their animals, and others not?

It also depends, with regard ponies getting down and not back up, why they do so. There are instances where they may go down suddenly with colic for instance. As the majority of horse owners will know. We cannot be there 24/7 watching our horses. They get ill, we cannot always be there.

I repeat again, if the RSPCA have done nothing in all of this time these horses have been neglected, then why didn't BHS or WHW step in?

 

[honetpot]

The issue is if they were cattle or sheep they would not be treated in this way. Yes they may destined for meat but they are entitled to a certain level of care and consideration, neither which have been applied. I have lived in this area or my life and reported these horses along with other people numerous times and each time the RSPCA has done nothing. Is it right that dead carcasses are left in the field rotting, ponies get down that can't get up? Have you seen the news of the farmers delivering hay and feed to those in Somerset and surrounding areas hit by the floods, who can't get to their cattle? Farmers would care more for these animals than what this so called man has, and why should they be PTS so he can have his 5 minutes of fame? it makes an absolute mockery of us that we as an animal loving nation allow things like to happen. So good luck to those who are willing to put themselves out there and hopefully make a difference, change has to start somewhere.

Like this.
All animals should be treated with care and consideration whether they are going to end up on someone's plate or not, our welfare legislation is a joke.

 

[LaMooch]

Like this.
All animals should be treated with care and consideration whether they are going to end up on someone's plate or not, our welfare legislation is a joke.

a complete and utter joke

 

[honetpot]

So what sort of law would you suggest gets passed in order for certain people to be allowed to pts their animals, and others not?

It also depends, with regard ponies getting down and not back up, why they do so. There are instances where they may go down suddenly with colic for instance. As the majority of horse owners will know. We cannot be there 24/7 watching our horses. They get ill, we cannot always be there.

I repeat again, if the RSPCA have done nothing in all of this time these horses have been neglected, then why didn't BHS or WHW step in?

The BHS and WWF have not the resources of the RSPCA which seems to have become the judge and jury on animal welfare, the government have 'contracted out ' prosecutions to the RSPCA, because they are mainly done as private prosecutions it doesn't supposedly cost the tax payer money and the what ever government that is power are happy to defer to the RSPCA as experts. The government doesn't really want to get their hands dirty, its a PR nightmare.
The only good thing to come out of the horsemeat scandal is perhaps it will end the limbo of horses, if they are going for meat they should be subject to all the regulations that sheep, pigs and cattle keepers have to go though. There is no money in breeding horses for meat, far easier to buy a young TB racing reject straight from training.

 

[Moomin1]

The BHS and WWF have not the resources of the RSPCA which seems to have become the judge and jury on animal welfare, the government have 'contracted out ' prosecutions to the RSPCA, because they are mainly done as private prosecutions it doesn't supposedly cost the tax payer money and the what ever government that is power are happy to defer to the RSPCA as experts. The government doesn't really want to get their hands dirty, its a PR nightmare.
The only good thing to come out of the horsemeat scandal is perhaps it will end the limbo of horses, if they are going for meat they should be subject to all the regulations that sheep, pigs and cattle keepers have to go though. There is no money in breeding horses for meat, far easier to buy a young TB racing reject straight from training.

BHS and WHW do not prosecute. But they are there for horse welfare. If these horses had/have welfare issues, they should have stepped in also.

It's a complete myth/rumour that either of these charities 'can not' act 'if the RSPCA say there is nothing wrong' as is often stated on these FB groups etc. They can do as they wish. The RSPCA are a charity just like them, they have no bearing on how or when other charities intervene. That is up to the other charities.

 

[AmyMay]

The RSPCA are a charity just like them, they have no bearing on how or when other charities intervene. That is up to the other charities.

Unfortunately it's often the case that the likes of WHW will not do anything if there is already an RSPCA involvement. And as far as this situation goes, that is certainly the case.

 

[honetpot]

Most of the welfare cases are private prosecutions, anyone can do this but the RSPCA has the money if you look at the charities commission website, Reg number 219099 http://www.charitycommission.gov.uk/find-charities/
has an income of ....132million (accounts 2012) , where as the BHS has 8.2million and seems to spend most its income which comes mainly from members and has a wider remit of access and safety.
The WWF and the BHS just do not have the resources to do private prosecutions, the Crown Prosecution Service should be doing it rather than the money from individuals.

 

[Regandal]

Agree. Sadly I don't think this is what he will do. He is more likely to herd them onto a lorry and disappear them amongst family members.

And so the cycle will continue. Far better they are PTS now. Poor creatures, well better out of it.

 

[Moomin1]

Unfortunately it's often the case that the likes of WHW will not do anything if there is already an RSPCA involvement. And as far as this situation goes, that is certainly the case.

I'm afraid that is not true Amymay.

Both WHW and RSPCA officers work extremely closely on a daily basis and are very effective at working together on situations. If both charities are made aware of the same situation, they will speak with each other directly and come to an agreement on the action to be taken. Sometimes this involves WHW taking the reins, or vice versa. But in no way, shape or form whatsoever will one charity stand by and visibly watch the other allow a neglect situation to continue with NO action taken by either charity. WHW will usually liaise with RSPCA, and gather the facts along with the RSPCA, and both will come to a decision as to who will 'take the reins' and deal further to achieve the best result. And vice versa.

There is little point in two lots of charities dealing with one incident in most cases. Therefore when both are satisfied with the facts they have, they will make the decision as to who deals further.

To suggest WHW turn a blind eye to another charity who is allegedly 'allowing' neglect to continue under their nose is hardly very fair on WHW.

 

[Honey08]

Interesting Moomin1. I don't think that AM was saying one charity would turn a blind eye, I read it as one charity not getting involved if the other was already involved to save tripping over each other's work and both charities wasting money doing the same jobs.. Its nice to know they do work together though.