Is there anyone on HHO who disagrees with foxhunting?

[marmalade76]

The irony being, I've never hunted in my life

Then come for a visit, I'm sure we could find you something!

 

[Mike007]

I agree!!

Anyone who states that they enjoy hunting because of the riding can do the same with a drag hunt - although I hear the jumps are often bigger.

And those who state that the bullet isn't always quicker.......it's quicker than being chased to the point of exhaustion before the fox has to accept it's fate.
Round my way, they go out lamping for foxes at night -quicker, no stress to the fox prior to being killed (unlike hunting) and far more effective.
Personally I prefer live and let live - I'm sick of hearing farmers moan about having lost a lambs to fox - get a shotgun licence and deal with it humanely!

Can I just correct a spelling error, surely you meant get a shotgun licence and deal with it inhumanely. If you dont get an instant kill ,you dont get a second shot, and the animal is wounded and you wont find it. It dies of gangreene,or if it is really really lucky, a quick chop by a pack of hounds.I am sick of hearing people who dont know what they are talking about because they have never had to do these things.

 

[JFTDWS]

The OP is asking if anyone disagrees with foxhunting, not whether it is justified or not

Yes, and by asking if anyone disagrees, the OP inviting comments from those who do agree with it - just as if I were to entitle a post saying "Does anyone on HHO think draw reins are the work of satan?", I would get replies from people both agreeing and disagreeing with me, and a discussion would ensue.

It's not acceptable to dictate who can, and who cannot, reply to threads

 

[JFTDWS]

Then come for a visit, I'm sure we could find you something!

I'd probably die I'm a coward! I am planning on taking Fergles sometime though - provided nobody laughs at my midget pony

 

[NeilM]

I'd probably die I'm a coward! I am planning on taking Fergles sometime though - provided nobody laughs at my midget pony

I'm certain nobody will laugh. I am planning on taking the 'fat lad' out next season. I have absolutely no interest in killing anything (I'm done with all that), but I would like to see what all the fuss is about

 

[JFTDWS]

I'm certain nobody will laugh. I am planning on taking the 'fat lad' out next season. I have absolutely no interest in killing anything (I'm done with all that), but I would like to see what all the fuss is about

You have the 14hh2ish NF, right? If you can get away with it, I can, I'm sure

btw, the statement "no interest in killing anything (I'm done with all that)" is slightly ominous Is there a pile of bodies somewhere we will hear about in the news in a few years?

 

[NeilM]

You have the 14hh2ish NF, right? If you can get away with it, I can, I'm sure

btw, the statement "no interest in killing anything (I'm done with all that)" is slightly ominous Is there a pile of bodies somewhere we will hear about in the news in a few years?

Yes I have a 14.2hh NF, called Harry.

As for the bodies, I'd tell you, but.......

 

[Holly Hocks]

Can I just correct a spelling error, surely you meant get a shotgun licence and deal with it inhumanely. If you dont get an instant kill ,you dont get a second shot, and the animal is wounded and you wont find it. It dies of gangreene,or if it is really really lucky, a quick chop by a pack of hounds.I am sick of hearing people who dont know what they are talking about because they have never had to do these things.

Ah, do you know me then? I wasn't aware you knew what I had and hadn't done in my life! Are you my stalker? I have been aware of a strange presence recently....mainly down on the farm, but I put it down to a fox watching me...

 

[AprilBlossom]

I'd probably die I'm a coward! I am planning on taking Fergles sometime though - provided nobody laughs at my midget pony

If marmalade can get her pony back into work you'd be welcome to take my beast...he's rather large so no one would laugh lol!!

 

[JFTDWS]

Yes I have a 14.2hh NF, called Harry.

As for the bodies, I'd tell you, but.......

*waves at Harry the NF in slightly dumb "waving via internet and your owner" manner*

Ahhh, no don't tell, I shall look forward to hearing about it in the papers. If you're on the run and need somewhere to hide Harry in a stable, you know where I am...

Well, you don't, but...

 

[JFTDWS]

If marmalade can get her pony back into work you'd be welcome to take my beast...he's rather large so no one would laugh lol!!

Sounds ominous Have you seen the photos of me riding? There's a lovely one of the "good vs bad riding" thread, y'know Nobody in their right mind would trust me with a horse

Unless you mean a rocking horse, in which case, I'll get my tweed

 

[marmalade76]

I'd probably die I'm a coward! I am planning on taking Fergles sometime though - provided nobody laughs at my midget pony

Take a look here :-

https://picasaweb.google.com/113022263092645819322/NewYearsEve#5692336671618550130



This is our hunt, plenty of adults come out on ponies. My own is 14.2/3 (although I have been hunting AB's big lad recently) and no-one is a bigger wimp than me these days.

 

[AprilBlossom]

Sounds ominous Have you seen the photos of me riding? There's a lovely one of the "good vs bad riding" thread, y'know Nobody in their right mind would trust me with a horse

Unless you mean a rocking horse, in which case, I'll get my tweed

I take it you never saw my thread where one photograph sums up my complete lack of riding finesse - I am unable to even hold my own head in the correct 'look where you're going' position and instead decide to ride whilst checking out my own cleavage rather intensely!! He's a very tolerant chap

 

[marmalade76]

Sounds ominous Have you seen the photos of me riding? There's a lovely one of the "good vs bad riding" thread, y'know Nobody in their right mind would trust me with a horse

Unless you mean a rocking horse, in which case, I'll get my tweed

AB's horse would never jump like yours did in those pics, but I will provide you with a neckstrap just incase!

 

[Ibblebibble]

I agree!!

Anyone who states that they enjoy hunting because of the riding can do the same with a drag hunt - although I hear the jumps are often bigger.

And those who state that the bullet isn't always quicker.......it's quicker than being chased to the point of exhaustion before the fox has to accept it's fate.
Round my way, they go out lamping for foxes at night -quicker, no stress to the fox prior to being killed (unlike hunting) and far more effective.
Personally I prefer live and let live - I'm sick of hearing farmers moan about having lost a lambs to fox - get a shotgun licence and deal with it humanely!

a shotgun is not the best weapon to use to shoot a fox!!!! the ideal gun is a rifle, a very good friend has an open ticket so can shoot anything anywhere, he would never use a shotgun on a fox as it is too hit and miss whether the lead shot would kill outright, a rifle bullet will, although it can also travel up to a mile if it misses so to shoot with one you have to be very aware of where you are aiming. Shows how much you really know if you think shooting a fox with a shotgun is humane!!
Oh and a fox is a prey animal , it's natural enemies would have been wolves and eagles, it has the flight instinct the same as a rabbit.

 

[Abz88]

I think part of the problem also comes from how far people are distanced from meat production. It doesn't look fluffy or cute in the supermarket shelves and when people see a whole rabbit in the butchers or in a supermaket the looks of disgust and comments along the lines of 'I don't know how anyone can eat that'

Those that are exposed to the killing of animals however fluffy, cute or ugly for food etc seem to find hunting a lot easier to accept. Humans must be by far the largest consumer of meat, but so few people are involved in its production.

You dont eat the fox. Point is totally invalid.

I am strongly against fox hunting, I have a pet dog and a horse....but feel NO urge to go out an catch an animal. I also have no issue buying and eatoing a rabbit full hung in the butchers. I fish and have no issue catching killing and gutting the fish to be eaten. The fox is brutally murdered, run to within an inch of its life then ripped apart....nice. Then, just left to rot.

 

[NeilM]

Take a look here :-

https://picasaweb.google.com/113022263092645819322/NewYearsEve#5692336671618550130



This is our hunt, plenty of adults come out on ponies. My own is 14.2/3 (although I have been hunting AB's big lad recently) and no-one is a bigger wimp than me these days.

Love the pony pic, but I'm a little concerned at the almost total lack of male followers. Had you frightened them all off?

 

[JFTDWS]

AB's horse would never jump like yours did in those pics, but I will provide you with a neckstrap just incase!

And whose fault is it that my home broken pony jumps like a knobber, I wonder?

AB's horse is clearly a lot better mannered than mine

I take it you never saw my thread where one photograph sums up my complete lack of riding finesse - I am unable to even hold my own head in the correct 'look where you're going' position and instead decide to ride whilst checking out my own cleavage rather intensely!! He's a very tolerant chap

Lol, he sounds like a gent! I've never found myself staring at my cleavage, but I do regularly find bits of myself where I'm not expecting them

Take a look here :-

https://picasaweb.google.com/113022263092645819322/NewYearsEve#5692336671618550130

This is our hunt, plenty of adults come out on ponies. My own is 14.2/3 (although I have been hunting AB's big lad recently) and no-one is a bigger wimp than me these days.

Great photos - loving the hounds scrambling over the style Reassuring to think I might not be alone on the midget pony!

 

[Abz88]

Oh and a fox is a prey animal , it's natural enemies would have been wolves and eagles, it has the flight instinct the same as a rabbit.

Incorrect. Prey animals have eyes on the sides of their heads, such as rabbits, cows, horses. To give best vision while grazing grass,.....every animal which has forward facing eyes, humans, dogs, lions, cats and fox's are preditors. Preditors have enemies, but this does not make them prey creatures.

 

[Mike007]

Ah, do you know me then? I wasn't aware you knew what I had and hadn't done in my life! Are you my stalker? I have been aware of a strange presence recently....mainly down on the farm, but I put it down to a fox watching me...

No, I dont know you,but I do know that you know absolutely ++++all about shooting,and gunshot wounds.

 

[Holly Hocks]

a shotgun is not the best weapon to use to shoot a fox!!!! the ideal gun is a rifle, a very good friend has an open ticket so can shoot anything anywhere, he would never use a shotgun on a fox as it is too hit and miss whether the lead shot would kill outright, a rifle bullet will, although it can also travel up to a mile if it misses so to shoot with one you have to be very aware of where you are aiming. Shows how much you really know if you think shooting a fox with a shotgun is humane!!
Oh and a fox is a prey animal , it's natural enemies would have been wolves and eagles, it has the flight instinct the same as a rabbit.

No, I don't do shooting myself, although my OH has done a lot in the past (although strangely we've never discussed what guns he used as apart from a big gun and a handgun I wouldn't know the difference!) Whatever they use for lamping round here though is pretty effective - I've regularly seen landrovers with quite a few dead foxes in which they seem to think I might want to look at! I suppose doing it at night minimises the risk when you're in the middle of nowhere though.
My ONLY concern with shooting as opposed to hunting would be that shooting wouldn't necessarily rid the elderly and infirm, whereas with hunting I suppose the younger healthy foxes have a better change of escape whereas it is the sick ones that get caught. Survival of the fittest and all that....

 

[NeilM]

The fox is brutally murdered, run to within an inch of its life then ripped apart....nice. Then, just left to rot.

This is just the kind of inflammatory nonsense that actually detracts from the anti-hunting argument.

For a start, a human cannot murder a fox, as the definition of murder is the unlawful killing of one human being by another. And for another thing, the fox is not run within an inch of its life, it is killed.

I can fully understand that people cannot agree with killing an animal for sport, but a reasoned argument can be persuasive, inflammatory and emotive language (the weapons favoured by LACS and others to persuade the gullible) just treats those on the other side of the argument like idiots, which they are not.

 

[Keimanp]

I agree!!

Anyone who states that they enjoy hunting because of the riding can do the same with a drag hunt - although I hear the jumps are often bigger.

And those who state that the bullet isn't always quicker.......it's quicker than being chased to the point of exhaustion before the fox has to accept it's fate.
Round my way, they go out lamping for foxes at night -quicker, no stress to the fox prior to being killed (unlike hunting) and far more effective.
Personally I prefer live and let live - I'm sick of hearing farmers moan about having lost a lambs to fox - get a shotgun licence and deal with it humanely!

When you go out lamping you tend to use a rifle, most farmers use shot guns. The rifle is a single bullet where as the shot gun is lots of little lead balls generally. To get a rifle you need an advanced firearms licence and a lot of land and space including back drops to use it legally. A shot gun licence is a lot easier to get in comparison but it is a much more crude weapon and works over a shorter distance due to the spread of the shot.

 

[orionstar]

I did, partly because I like animals and partly because of the treatment I received at my first hunt, however - I havent seen a fox in over a year, I mentioned this to a shooting friend recently and the response was this - now that foxes are being shot there is no longer an element of escape. He recently went to Scotland for a shoot to be told that it was pointless, because they got 12 last week. This speaks for itself and if Hunting with dogs restores the balance then we need to do it!

 

[marmalade76]

Love the pony pic, but I'm a little concerned at the almost total lack of male followers. Had you frightened them all off?

Possibly. It's just as well, really, my husband wouldn't allow me out otherwise!

 

[Shantara]

Incorrect. Prey animals have eyes on the sides of their heads, such as rabbits, cows, horses. To give best vision while grazing grass,.....every animal which has forward facing eyes, humans, dogs, lions, cats and fox's are preditors. Preditors have enemies, but this does not make them prey creatures.

Was going to say pretty much the same thing, so I'll just quote you

 

[Mrs B]

I have never, since I joined HHO, read so much bull hooks on one thread!

 

[Keimanp]

You dont eat the fox. Point is totally invalid.

I am strongly against fox hunting, I have a pet dog and a horse....but feel NO urge to go out an catch an animal. I also have no issue buying and eatoing a rabbit full hung in the butchers. I fish and have no issue catching killing and gutting the fish to be eaten. The fox is brutally murdered, run to within an inch of its life then ripped apart....nice. Then, just left to rot.

The Point isn't 'totally invalid' as humans don't eat the fox, the hounds do, the carcas isn't wasted. My point was merely putting forward why the majority of people (not everyone) who are distanced from the killing of animals for whatever reason find the death of an animal difficult to deal with especially as they are presented with the fluffy emotive versions. It doesn't help for a constructive and level debate!

 

[Keimanp]

Incorrect. Prey animals have eyes on the sides of their heads, such as rabbits, cows, horses. To give best vision while grazing grass,.....every animal which has forward facing eyes, humans, dogs, lions, cats and fox's are preditors. Preditors have enemies, but this does not make them prey creatures.

Was going to say pretty much the same thing, so I'll just quote you

Really, That is a fixed rule that if an animal has eyes in the front of its head it is just a predator and not prey and not a general rule of thumb? So the fox has no predators? And a Shark isn't a predator?

In the wild, bobcats, lynxes, panthers, and wolves will take down a fox if they are able, and the bear or wolverine will kill a fox if it can, though the fox is generally too quick and wiley. The young of the fox are vulnerable to larger birds of prey where the adults are not such easy marks and are generally avoided.
In general, any larger predator will tackle any fox that is found within its range. That's the general rule of thumb - the larger predator will prey on a smaller predator if the opportunity presents itself. Bears, larger canines, or any large cat can be trouble for a fox, as can any large bird of prey.

 

[Shantara]

Really, That is a fixed rule that if an animal has eyes in the front of its head it is just a predator and not prey and not a general rule of thumb? So the fox has no predators? And a Shark isn't a predator?

Foxes have enemies, but no animal has a diet of fox. Fish are a different story entirely.
That would make humans pray, because sometimes we get eaten by lions. We're top predator!
Just because one animal kills another, doesn't mean the dead animal was pray. I've witnessed a horse kill a dog (A dog that had done nothing wrong to the horse) does that make a horse a predator? No.