Linda Parelli teaching how to hit with the snap

[Spudlet]

Em no, it's this thread that's (more than) a little off Echo Bravo ....

Please could you try to explain what is going in as per my questions?

 

[Lippyx]

I just can't stand listening to her! Have you ever noticed the tone in her voice, its like she really wants to hurt the horse, and when her pupils get it wrong, she snatches the "tools" and shows them how its done!! The pupils don't seem to mind though... as though they are brain washed?

Any one seen the "The Horse Apprentice" thats on H&CTV at the mo? OMG! I refuse to watch it! It is like a cult!! All happy families together, being spiteful to the horses!!

 

[Munchkin]

The haters group is alive and well, thanks

 

[Spudlet]

The haters group is alive and well, thanks

I still haven't had my explanation yet though

I would genuinely like to know what the rationale behind that film was, and what someone more knowledgeable about these methods makes of it.

 

[Honey Bee♥]

i cant believe she just did that! what a rat! that just goes against all they stand for!! and after that last incident, do they really think they should be doing this to win the fans back- who were fans simply because they believed all the work which was done was purely for the benifit of the horse? well i for one and going to stop parelli work on my mare. and im also going to burn their dvds. this is just sick

 

[Golf Girl]

Explain then!

ANother brainwashed LP fan! With a head shy confused horse no doubt.

Don't you DARE presume to judge me, you don't know me or anything about me.

 

[Munchkin]

Good luck with that, Spudlet. The only explanation you'll get is that you're too stupid to understand.

 

[Spudlet]

Good luck with that, Spudlet. The only explanation you'll get is that you're too stupid to understand.

Am used to that

But seriously, Golf Girl. Please can you explain to me? Please?

Or anyone?

 

[Roasted Chestnuts]

Don't you DARE presume to judge me, you don't know me or anything about me.

We are asking for explanations to why this ISNT a disgrace in your eyes.

If you explain it then maybe people wont judge you or your horse. All we can see is a horse being skelped wiht the metal clip just to make it back up when i can think of a dozen things off hand that i would do before even remotely considering hitting a horse in the face with stainless steel.

Nikki

 

[Sarah Sum1]

Don't you DARE presume to judge me, you don't know me or anything about me.

Erm didn't YOU judge us?

I'll do what I darn well like. I know you are obviously rude. You won't offer an explanation as to why that video is deemed okay in your eyes? There is no explanation because it's cruelty. Pure and simple.

 

[Dolcé]

I've heard her say that alot. I always think "HA HA Linda come and try that with Horrid, He'll launch himself at you and stamp on you with both front feet"
I'd never let her near him realy, She'd undo 8 months work in 8 seconds with the way she handles horses

Do you know Laura, I thought the same thing about Eeyore for a second, and then realised that he would act in exactly the same way as the poor arab and would end up reacting the way she wanted him to, too scared to walk anywhere near her. I am actually quite upset by that and NOBODY can say anything that would, for one second, make me believe that behaviour can lead to a positive out come for the horse! This is only the second video I have seen of 'that woman' and I hate her with a passion. For a woman who has made a bloody fortune out of horses it would appear she has no respect, and certainly no affection, towards them. I have to be honest and say that this video in particular has turned me completely against anything Parelli and that woman!

 

[Sarah Sum1]

You get some random coming on here calling us haters and bitches, yet she can offer no explanation. Say's it all!

Linda is that you?

 

[lauraanddolly]

This is just one video in a long line of parelli rubbish I have seen, rubbish is the best word I can find to describe it - I'm sure LP didn't start off as a horse abuser but the methods she uses and teaches now are no more than that - ABUSE.
What I would like to know is how these methods are supposed to work!
I remember the Catwalk thread and I'm sure it was mentioned on there(by a parelli follower) that the techniques used on Catwalk were advanced that is why us normal(I make no apologies for the use of this word) horse owners didn't understand the lesson we were seeing.
Well if this video is from a level one dvd then Parelli must be a very advanced horse training experience because I don't understand what is supposed to be being taught here? (I can guess - and I wouldn't be doing that to correct the horse, as i'm sure lead properly the horse would be fine)
I've been around horses for more than half of my life, I have trained on yards and studied at a college, worked on yards - had sole charge in some cases, but I don't understand a parelli level one dvd ?
Something is wrong there - and I know its not me!

Normally I don't post on these threads, I'm not a Parelli follower and I never will be, these methods will never be used on my horse or any other horse I have involvement with as i see no value in them.

 

[amandaco2]

shes an idiot and a bully

 

[Dolcé]

but isn't the percentage of this parelli rubbish taught in America?

It is Rosie, and it ought to stay there, they should be banned from performing over here!!

 

[Bedlam]

I don't think that Linda Parelli is an idiot, and I don't think she's a bully.

I think the girl handling the grey in the video was very ineffective. I think that the combination of a self opinionated arab and an ineffective girl is likely to become dangerous.

I'm not a Parelli disciple.

But I cannot abide the blind hatred of everything 'Natural' on this forum........

 

[Onyxia]

Please, please avoid them at all costs lest you be be damaged. Don't look at them, don't listen to them, and don't let them near your horses...see no Parelli, hear no Parelli, speak no Parelli...save yourselves.

That has got ot be the most funny thing said on here in a long time


There is always a mini debate about what is abuse in these threads.
http://oxforddictionaries.com/view/entry/m_en_gb0002970#m_en_gb0002970
^points one and two thanks
A horse does not need to look like the poor creatures that came out of Spindles Farm to have been abused.

 

[Roasted Chestnuts]

I don't think that Linda Parelli is an idiot, and I don't think she's a bully.

I think the girl handling the grey in the video was very ineffective. I think that the combination of a self opinionated arab and an ineffective girl is likely to become dangerous.

I'm not a Parelli disciple.

But I cannot abide the blind hatred of everything 'Natural' on this forum........

Blind hatred??? i think not!!! So basically you advocate hitting a horse with steel clips then??? You think its acceptable to belt a horse round the head for being bolshy when there as PLENTY of other less painful ways to get the same result???

Having been dealing with a bolshy, pushy mare myself I have to say the worst she has got was a smack in the chest with a stick to get her to move back, after that a growl and a warning suffices, no metal involved. how dissapointing huh???

Nikki xxx

 

[Onyxia]

I don't think that Linda Parelli is an idiot, and I don't think she's a bully.

I think the girl handling the grey in the video was very ineffective. I think that the combination of a self opinionated arab and an ineffective girl is likely to become dangerous.

Agree,but that is not the way to deal with it.
Given that the girl owner was still weak and ineffective under the watchfull eye of LP,how well do you think trying to replicate those methods on a cold winters day when horse does not want to go and is feeling nice and sharp will pan out?
NOTHING about horses is fast,anything worth learning or teaching takes time mixed with kindness and patience-and plenty of it!

I'm not a Parelli disciple.

But I cannot abide the blind hatred of everything 'Natural' on this forum........

Come off it!
There are plenty of people who practise NH on here and many more who like myself think the best thing to do for the horses in our lives is to learn as much as possable from ALL sources and apply what seems to be the best fit regardless of which "camp" the idea came from.
Monty Roberts and Kelly Marks would never be subject to this sort of forum bashing because they don't treat the horses they work with badly,the Parellie's do.

 

[Crazydancer]

I used to be at a yard where a lady did parelli with her horse, it worked well for them. Another girl had problems with her horse, not respecting her space, he could be annoying to lead, which I was well aware of as I turned him out for her during the week. They worked with him using the parelli methods, the end result - a horse that reared (and still did not respect your space)
Yeah, great improvement that.

 

[scally]

I dont think there is blind hatred on this forum for things "natural" at all.

However, Linda Parrelli seems on a self destruct course, bully and violent in her methods through teaching "non violent" methods, which are more violent than a lot of "good old fashioned" methods have have worked well through the centuries.

She evens strikes the poor horse on the nose with a whip to back it off, the poor horse his body language is showing you he is so confused, he wants to be with his owner for comfort and even then gets pushed away so he uses his own instincts to get away from these horrid people that he can now no longer trust and go to his own kind, to only have Linda give him more abuse when he is running backwards from her.

Please do not confuse Monty and Kelly under this banner of "Natural Horsemanship" as this is one thing they disagree on strongly is any violence towards horse or human.

 

[Dolcé]

I don't think that Linda Parelli is an idiot, and I don't think she's a bully.

I think the girl handling the grey in the video was very ineffective. I think that the combination of a self opinionated arab and an ineffective girl is likely to become dangerous.

I'm not a Parelli disciple.

But I cannot abide the blind hatred of everything 'Natural' on this forum........

Let's be honest here, all the 'natural' forms of horsemanship originate from the traditional methods anyway, I learned the traditional way and I can honestly say there was nothing traditional, or natural, in that video. People deal with bargy, pushy horses in different ways and so there will me many different methods used just within this group of forum users. I have dealt with two in recent years, one a haffy that took off every time she came out of her stable and a 17.2 CB that did the same, regardless of where he was, every time he was led in hand. Neither were hit a single time and the problem was completely sorted, for both, within a couple of days - I used treats - not conventional and may be frowned upon, but it worked without trying to pit my weight against a ton of horse that is determined to go. Both walked alongside me beautifully, stopping every few paces and waiting for a treat, a treat when the stable door was opened meant they waited rather than barging out, a treat when their headcollars were removed meant they waited to have it taken off rather than shooting off with it. I simply reduced the treats and replaced with scratch once they understood, problem sorted, no hitting, no stress. (and just have to add, neither of them bite!!)

I consider natural to mean not using weapons against the horse, I don't hate all things natural but I do hate (after seeing that video) all things parelli, I would be very interested to hear from expert trainers such as Kelly Marks and Richard Maxwell (both for whom I have a lot of respect - and I have never seen them hit a horse) what they think of that particular method to achieve whatever what meant to be achieved. I don't believe there is any comparison between the parelli methods and the methods of all the other natural/intelligent trainers but perhaps as 'advanced horse people' they will understand what was supposed to be happening whereas it is too advanced for us plebs!!

 

[pippinpie]

Just putting a few facts forward here:
#1 This is a very old video that keeps doing the rounds and keeps being used to fuel the fire
#2 Linda has already made a public statement regarding this clip from a much longer video where more understanding of the situation can be seen.
#3 The owner has given a statement supporting Linda and tells how the horse has been since the 'incident' shown in the clip.
#4 If you can be bothered to read though this thread : http://www.horseandhound.co.uk/forums/showthread.php?t=383408 you might get some answers to your questions.

 

[JoJo_]

Just putting a few facts forward here:
#1 This is a very old video that keeps doing the rounds and keeps being used to fuel the fire
#2 Linda has already made a public statement regarding this clip from a much longer video where more understanding of the situation can be seen.
#3 The owner has given a statement supporting Linda and tells how the horse has been since the 'incident' shown in the clip.
#4 If you can be bothered to read though this thread : http://www.horseandhound.co.uk/forums/showthread.php?t=383408 you might get some answers to your questions.

So have they changed their training methods since this video and no longer teach people to hit their horses with metal clips?

I understand exactly what she was trying to achieve by keeping the horse out of her space but I cant believe she was teaching such a harsh technique. Considering Parelli is meant to be kind.

Some of the principles of Parelli I agree with as its just common sense really but I dont like the overuse of the stick and rope. Too many horses get head shy etc because of it.

 

[Kallibear]

Golf girl hasn't been back to enlighten us.............

It makes me so cross watching that. Esp when I imagine it being my horse and how they would react - Toby would go nuclear and blind panic then never come near a human again. Piper would accept and tolerate it but be thoroughly frightened and confused It almost makes me cry, imageing that being my horses and their frightened, worried little faces

I do understand what she's trying to do and I've have used a similar (but much less agressive) method but she has no timing and gives no release or reward, nor does she show the horses what she DOES want so it can try it.

I have watched various videos of her 'working' with horses and in every one it's obvious she has no real skill for training animals - she doesn't make the right thing easy, she just makes the wrong thing hard (and painful and frightening). She doesn't try to shape good behaviour, she just punishes bad. She never offers a rewards for the horse trying, she only stops being agressive and violent towards it, under the delusion that this alone is 'reward'.

And most importantly, she often 'tricks' the horse into making a wrong move simply so she can punish it and 'teach it a lesson'. She actually seems to enjoy being violent and agressive towards the horses

 

[JessandCharlie]

Oh, one more thing.

I was given heaps of Parelli stuff by somebody who was giving up riding and watched some of the stuff. This is quite old and the nose/face area is dubbed, by them, as a DELICATE AREA THAT SHOULDN'T BE HIT.

Hipocritical much? LP smacked the poor horse in the nose with that bleedin' orange stick!!

 

[misterjinglejay]

Where's Tongue in Cheek when we need her!

 

[LauraWheeler]

Em no, it's this thread that's (more than) a little off Echo Bravo ....

There are alot of Parelli fans who just pop into this thread tell us all we are nasty, Bitchy, Parelli haters. Yet they never explain why we are wrong. They never try to justify LPs actions are even explain this magical point we are missing.
They probably never even read my posts about Herbie. They probalbly don't want to admit the damage this method can do.
As for hateing all natural horsemanship, I can tell you I don't, I do my own form of NH. Yes it has cost me a fair bit of money to lurn but I've had the best teachers money could buy. Lucy was my first main teacher and now Herbs has taken over. I have had lots of other teachers as well. Yes I have been taught by the horse the best NH teacher there is. I have been able to turn round so many written off ponies who would have ended up as dog food if I haddn't taken them on. They have all turned into happy, safe horses. Especialy my beloved Lucy she went from extreamly dangourous to the kindest, gentelist, bravest pony you could ever meet.
Why don't the Parelli followers ever show us examples of Happy, sucessful horses that have done Parelli. Inclu evidance of this so called dangourous behavour. Having had Lucy I know what truly dangourous behavour is, None of the horses in the videos look dangourous they tell to watch the whole video to see how the horse was before but never post the begining on here. Maybe that footage doesn't exist or maybe it's a marketing ploy getting us all to buy the videos? I tell you all what put your money where your mouth is PM me the footage if you don't want to post it on here. I will never line LP and PPs pockets, but I could tell you truthfuly how dangourous those horses are.
Well Parelli followers the balls in your court. Prove to me i'm wrong show me this dangourous behavour.

 

[Chavhorse]

I for one love my horses to walk quietly next to me , not a mile behind, for one, you can't see whats its doing, if it panicks its going to run straight through you.

Ditto this....I like to have his eye level with my shoulder so I can see what he is doing and thinking if he is 6 feet behind me and freaks out I am going to get flattened. Still have him on a long line so if it does all go pear shaped I have room to let him run and bring him back.

Madness total madness

 

[amandaco2]

I don't think that Linda Parelli is an idiot, and I don't think she's a bully.

I think the girl handling the grey in the video was very ineffective. I think that the combination of a self opinionated arab and an ineffective girl is likely to become dangerous.

I'm not a Parelli disciple.

But I cannot abide the blind hatred of everything 'Natural' on this forum........

i dont hate all natural things at all.
but there is nothing natural about learning how to smack a horse on the face with a metal clip. so i dont even see why that comment is relevant?