Linda Parelli teaching how to hit with the snap

[LauraWheeler]

I just watched abit more of the video I realy wish I haddn't. I watched that first grey pony till about 3.04 What are they doing They are walking so fast the poor pony has to jog to keep up then they suddenly without warning change direction. They turn right round to face the otherway. The poor pony has to move very quickly to turn round to and linda smacks the poor pony on the nose with a LUNGE WHIP. They then do it again she tells the owner to flap her arms. All I see is a pony who is scared of being hit on the nose and is showing singnes of becoming head shy. Then LP tells the owner to look SMUG What the hell does she have to look smug about.
and the parelli followers can't see all this. The pony was doing nothing wrong appart from being confused. It was NOT being dangourous. God I wish all the horses who came to me where that dangourous It would make my job so much easyer. I wish Herbs had been like that when he came to me but sadly no I deal with dangourous horses and ponies. Ones who would actualy hurt you if you treated them in this way and to be honest I wouldn't blame them.

 

[riding_high]

that poor horse looked fine until LP started to 'work' with it and the owner.

i understand that horses need to respect personal space and stuff BUT you don't need to confuse it like that. it pees me off because they claim that they are doing things for the good of the horse and condemn people who don't use their methods. sorry i'd rather be condemned than be one of them.

i used to look at parelli and think it was a good thing, being kind to a horse and i even went to a demo of theirs a few years ago, the last 3yrs they have got so into the control and money making that they aren't even bothered about the horses anymore.

 

[Fellewell]

There has to be a fusion of natural and traditional methods at some point. What I saw was an owner who had no control over an opinionated horse. It was pretty clear that the horse wasn't paying attention to its owner and would have tanked off (or worse) given the chance. I agree, the horse became totally submissive within the rails when the Parelli took over, job done, but the owner still had no idea and it was her safety that seemed to be at issue here. Perhaps we should have seen the owner without support/instruction to get a clearer picture?

 

[kittykatcat]

Just going to, ahem, go against the grain here a little bit.....I have watched the video and I agree that the horse did not seem to deserve the treatment it got to such an extreme....

I am not an avid follower of Parelli, I am not an avid follower of Monty Roberts, I kinda make my own methods up, based on a bit of NH, Parelli, common sense, traditional methods and science!

I have however recently employed the help of a 'parelli person' as a last resort to help my horse to load, after a particularly nasty incident. I have to say, my parelli person used the wavey rope in the face thing (i was a bit shocked at the time!) and my horse obviously backed away and then became a lamb (not the bargy, reary monster he was seconds before), she eventually got him to go in the trailer with the front bar up (problem was he would literally drag you through the trailer) which was a real achievement.

So, I guess the point of this post is, sometimes Parelli has it's place, and although some of the methods are 'harsh' I have seen first hand that they work. Although I am still a bit shocked by the 'bull in a china shop' way that LP came down on that pony's ass!!

 

[Luciejjkk]

How can wacking a horse in the face with a stick be justified?!

 

[Sarah Sum1]

Just putting a few facts forward here:
#1 This is a very old video that keeps doing the rounds and keeps being used to fuel the fire
#2 Linda has already made a public statement regarding this clip from a much longer video where more understanding of the situation can be seen.
#3 The owner has given a statement supporting Linda and tells how the horse has been since the 'incident' shown in the clip.
#4 If you can be bothered to read though this thread : http://www.horseandhound.co.uk/forums/showthread.php?t=383408 you might get some answers to your questions.

Seems to me that there has been more than one video (three that I know of) that Linda Parelli has had to 'explain' if it were just the one, then fair enough, but It's not. Saying it is an old video makes no difference, she still used those techniques.

If people want to ruin their horses that is up to them but why is it not one of you 'supporters' can offer answers to our questions?

 

[zefragile]

I don't like Linda Parelli, and I don't do Parelli myself, but I don't believe that all Parelli "followers" follow LP's example and whack their horses with metal clips. Fair enough to attack Linda over this, but to make assumptions about thousands of other people is a little unfair, in my opinion.

 

[AmyMay]

I don't like Linda Parelli, and I don't do Parelli myself, but I don't believe that all Parelli "followers" follow LP's example and whack their horses with metal clips. Fair enough to attack Linda over this, but to make assumptions about thousands of other people is a little unfair, in my opinion.

This is a really good point actually. There are a few 'practioners' on my yard, and I've never seen any of them be remotely violent towards their horses - quite the opposite.

Doesn't detract from how dangerous this woman is though.......

 

[Sarah Sum1]

To add. Even if people are saying her methods work. IMO it is never acceptable to use fear and 'hitting' as a form of training. You could make just about any living being do what you want through violence, but does that make it right?

I am also assuming that other people that use her methods will be doing the same 'training' But Zefragile you are right, I don't know that so will keep this to Linda only.

 

[Pedantic]

I have no axe to grind either way, and use anything that works for me and mine, as long as it isn't cruel or bad for the animal of course, but I do have to say this is the second video I have seen of hers which I don't like, all seems to confuse the poor horse, I also don't like her voice/accent, it gets on my tits, plus why is she walking round like a gay bloke with a strop on and dragging the girl with a drippy attitude about, maybe she should have the horse next to her and the girl 20ft away on a piece of dope, err mean rope.

 

[Tinypony]

Just an aside, don't assume everyone with a rope halter and long rope is following Parelli methods...

 

[jokadoka]

What's with the rope and the constant battering this horse gets one way or another, talk about confusing the animal! Not entirely sure what he's doing wrong in the first place?!
If L P feels the need to be a "safe distance away" from the horse, should she be working with it at all?!
When my horse is "in my space" as they like to call it, my "method" tends to be to ask him in a normal voice to c'mon boy get back, no pulling of ridiciously long ropes, no smacking in the face with a whip, and defo no sunvicer! I guess it's not ever going to make me a millionaire, but it does the trick...

 

[poops]

This needs to be given a new titile - how to make a headshy horse.

 

[Katikins]

I think one of the biggest problems people have with LP is the fact that the program seems to be completely contradictory. I was under the assumption that the whole (original) point of Parelli was to get results the 'natural' way and with no violence towards the horse. However, this is clearly violence towards a horse - regardless of how 'extreme' it is!

I learnt the traditional/BHS way but I can still remember being taught that even if there is a situation that calls for you hitting a horse (oh yes, I've hit my horses, aren't I horrible) you should NEVER EVER under any circumstances hit them around the head. All you will do is create a headshy horse! So if us 'traditionals' are so cruel, how come we are taught not hit a horse round the head but the 'kind parelli way' is to do just that!?

I would actually be very interested to hear from the likes of Golf Girl as to the rational behind this.

On another note, I do know that the likes of Richard Maxwell have hit a horse. I remember an incident with a chronic rearer and he used a knotted rope to hit it under the belly when it went up to recreate the fear of being attacked by a predator in order for the horse to come down to protect its vulnerable areas. However he wasn't beating the horse at all and it was extremely effective (but not recommended for novices to try).

 

[pippinpie]

I and others have spent hours on this forum giving answers to lots of the questions put forward in this thread, but they are not the answers most of you want to hear, they are just turned around and used to beat us with. I did post a link to a thread (here on HHO) that might help some people who genuinely want to understand the methods and theory behind PNH.
Some people on this tread are just plain ignorant and made degrading remarks about the poor young girl with the grey Arab, do you know this girl? do you know if she has 'other' problems? (other than her highly charged arab), you have only seen a snippet of those tapes and you know nothing of the problems those students are having/had with their horses and why they decided to attend the PNH course in Florida. When you know all the facts you may still not like what you saw but at least you will have the right to condemn.

 

[Katikins]

I and others have spent hours on this forum giving answers to lots of the questions put forward in this thread, but they are not the answers most of you want to hear, they are just turned around and used to beat us with. I did post a link to a thread (here on HHO) that might help some people who genuinely want to understand the methods and theory behind PNH.
Some people on this tread are just plain ignorant and made degrading remarks about the poor young girl with the grey Arab, do you know this girl? do you know if she has 'other' problems? (other than her highly charged arab), you have only seen a snippet of those tapes and you know nothing of the problems those students are having/had with their horses and why they decided to attend the PNH course in Florida. When you know all the facts you may still not like what you saw but at least you will have the right to condemn.

In that case could you please inform us about why it is OK to hit a horse around the head with a piece of metal when we've been taught from day 1 that this should never be done? I'm not trying to be insulting or inflammatory, I'm genuinely interested in the reasoning behind it. And also, please let me know how the horse in the video is meant to know when its doing the right thing because I couldn't see how it was meant to know what was the right thing and I'm a human. Again, I'm genuinely confused by this bit!

 

[Fairynuff]

I don't think that Linda Parelli is an idiot, and I don't think she's a bully.

I think the girl handling the grey in the video was very ineffective. I think that the combination of a self opinionated arab and an ineffective girl is likely to become dangerous.

I'm not a Parelli disciple.

But I cannot abide the blind hatred of everything 'Natural' on this forum........

'Self opinionated arb'..where....? I thought he was a completely normal neddy who was quite content to follow his owner around! FFS, what do we want.Robots?

 

[tongue~n~cheek]

In that case could you please inform us about why it is OK to hit a horse around the head with a piece of metal when we've been taught from day 1 that this should never be done? I'm not trying to be insulting or inflammatory, I'm genuinely interested in the reasoning behind it. And also, please let me know how the horse in the video is meant to know when its doing the right thing because I couldn't see how it was meant to know what was the right thing and I'm a human. Again, I'm genuinely confused by this bit!

read this
http://www.horseandhound.co.uk/forums/showthread.php?t=383408

i spent well over three weeks, honestly anwering, honest questions.

no patronizing, just answers.

Not everything, is as it seems.

I answer questions about the video, lead ropes, snaps and so forth.

if you have an honest question about anything, likely i have already answered it.

I am not a Parelli Proffesional, employee, or wolfe in sheep clothing.

Just a student who has been doing parelli for close to 9 yrs.

ps. not a fan of the video either

 

[Mbronze]

Does anybody have a suitably vicious horse that Linda could come and visit,just to give her a taste of her own medicine

 

[lillith]

Tongue-n-cheek If you wouldn't mind answering one more question please?

Where in this video during the parading around (I am assuming that the aim is to get the horse to walk with her at a certain distance, stop when she stops and back when she backs) is the pressure released? All I see with my untrained eye is a horse quickly learning to stay in place and back when she does but getting increasingly stressed when it cannot keep up with the quick changes of pace/direction and the lack of release.

I have trained both youngsters to lead respectfuly (from scratch) and taught an older VERY opninionated arab to lead respectfully for me (knew how, I had to persuade her it was worth doing for me) and on neither occasion had to flap, hit the horse with the metal clip, or ended up with a horse backing with its nose in the air twitching. Firm handling, voice commands and quick rewards got me decent progress in half hour sessions.

 

[SophieRIDSH]

I think LP is afraid of horses. I really don't think she likes them either.

She wants to keep them at a "safe" distance and as soon as she thinks she has a problem she goes for the big guns rather than a slower escalation of pressure.

 

[Rosehip]

I can understand the *theory* behind what the idiot is trying to do...to keep 'personal space' and teach the horse to be respectful of it...but the method used is deplorable!
Melly would have gone over/through LP within seconds of the treatment starting, and she would have gone up and struck out if she was hit in the face like that.
Melly is mentally (and physically) scared because of harsh treatment in her past, no nessesarilly pirelli, but from physical abuse like that show on that video. Sickening. If you saw a dog being treated like that there would be an immediate RSPCA investigation, but nothing seems to be done about this woman....beyond belief.

 

[laracroft]

Watched it all - so do not get it. Shocking.

 

[Kallibear]

I and others have spent hours on this forum giving answers to lots of the questions put forward in this thread, but they are not the answers most of you want to hear, they are just turned around and used to beat us with. I did post a link to a thread (here on HHO) that might help some people who genuinely want to understand the methods and theory behind PNH.

I think most people understand the theory behind what LP is trying to achieve. The point is she's doing it badly. VERY badly. I cannot see how anyone, inc the ardent parelli worshipper, can say the womans doing a good job of training a horse using 'natural' methods.

I KNOW what the horrible woman is trying to do. I have used it myself. But I was better at it - much much better (hard not to be really ). Unlike LP I have timing and the ability to praise for good behviour. And enough knowledge to try something else when the current stratergy doesn't work - LP just ups the anti more and more and more until it because abuse.

As for the 'opininionated' and dangerous arab - where? Why are parelli worshipers so bad a reading horses that they see this stressed and confused horse (who hasn't been shown the manner expected of him) and think it's being dangerous and disrespectful?

People are not angry at LP behaviour because of the methods and theories used (most of them are sound and useful) but because LINDA PARRELI IS RUBBISH AT THEM! She is a hypocrite and does not practise what she preaches! NOTHING about her actions in the video is 'natural'.

 

[Toast]

The woman is a retard im sure of it.
I cant fathom how any of what she was doing was beneficial to the horse or owner at all! I can almost see the confusion on that horses face.
The people who actually pay money to be taught by this woman are equally, if not more retarded. Can they not see theyre being conned out of their money and being made to look like idiots?! That woman was marching around with Linda attatched to her with that poor grey in tow.. someone needs to show her the video and tell her what a fool she looks. Perhaps i should start teaching people to ride with their hands in the air and their legs over the knee rolls because its a more natural way of riding..... for sure.
x

 

[pippinpie]

The woman is a retard im sure of it.
I cant fathom how any of what she was doing was beneficial to the horse or owner at all! I can almost see the confusion on that horses face.
The people who actually pay money to be taught by this woman are equally, if not more retarded. Can they not see theyre being conned out of their money and being made to look like idiots?! That woman was marching around with Linda attatched to her with that poor grey in tow.. someone needs to show her the video and tell her what a fool she looks. Perhaps i should start teaching people to ride with their hands in the air and their legs over the knee rolls because its a more natural way of riding..... for sure.
x

OMG I'm a raving idiot and I needed you and all your gobby immature friends to tell me, gosh after 40years in the horse business many of them as a professional, dragged through the BHS system to stage 4, organised more competitions that most of you have had hot dinners, won more top championship with my show horses that I can remember, but something must have happened to me, I've joined a cult, and I waste all my money and best of all I'm being taught to beat my horses up.
Thank god I came on this wonderful forum where I can chat and be as bitchy as I want and no-one will care because its the norm.

 

[QUICKFIRE]

VILE woman, that being Linda Parelli

 

[MissMistletoe]

That poor horse. The worse part for me was hearing LP cheer when the young owner finally achieved a proud strike in the horse's jaw with the clip, and was then told to look smug. Pathetic.

Also, half way through, the horse is leading very sweetly behind LP where it has been told to stay, but all of a sudden for no reason LP gets out the rope again and sends the poor horse backwards again. Silly women.

There is only a thin layer of skin covering those jaw bones that the clip is bashing on, rather like our ankle bone; and I know how much that hurts when you bash it on something hard.

 

[Dobby]

OMG I'm a raving idiot and I needed you and all your gobby immature friends to tell me,

organised more competitions that most of you have had hot dinners

won more top championship with my show horses that I can remember

Thank god I came on this wonderful forum where I can chat and be as bitchy as I want and no-one will care because its the norm.

Can I refer you to your signature quote?!

 

[RSL]

A small hit with the rope stings like hell why the heck would you teach someone to do that! Just goes to show that they shouldn't be doing horse training as a job.