Lottie and Everdale latest test wins, God help us rewarding this disgrace.

This horse won today in Neumünsterm I’m not familiar with the rider or the horse.

I found the forelegs very distracting, over exaggerated movement and during the passage style steps, the horse was holding the leg up and it was dangling almost for half a beat extra, I’m not really sure how else to explain it but it just looked very strange to me.

https://twitter.com/x/status/1759187699188072761
 
Maddie Moo said:
This horse won today in Neumünsterm I’m not familiar with the rider or the horse.

I found the forelegs very distracting, over exaggerated movement and during the passage style steps, the horse was holding the leg up and it was dangling almost for half a beat extra, I’m not really sure how else to explain it but it just looked very strange to me.

https://twitter.com/x/status/1759187699188072761
Click to expand...
You are right.It does look odd.
 
Maddie Moo said:
This horse won today in Neumünsterm I’m not familiar with the rider or the horse.

I found the forelegs very distracting, over exaggerated movement and during the passage style steps, the horse was holding the leg up and it was dangling almost for half a beat extra, I’m not really sure how else to explain it but it just looked very strange to me.

https://twitter.com/x/status/1759187699188072761
Click to expand...
Very spidery legs!

I know a lot of them are hyper mobile but I wonder if this one is more extreme.
 
. Very odd movement. Up and backwards kind of front leg action in the piaffe. The off foreleg seems to get higher than the near.Why don’t they use Hackney horses in dressage. They have that kind of movement 😀
 
shortstuff99 said:
There was an interesting discussion I came across earlier about whether WFFS is contributing to this very massive (but slightly strange) action in modern dressage horses. Everdale is a carrier, so is Apache, Totilas etc.
Click to expand...
That's interesting - so the possibility that one copy of the gene leads to a certain level of hyper mobility?
 
Then it should be considered a significant conformational fault and heavily marked down.

No stallion carrying the gene should be bred from either. So certainly shouldn’t be graded.

People are bonkers rewarding genetic abnormalities. Like in some dog breeds. What’s wrong with us!
 
That article is basically just saying stallions carring the gene should not be paired witn mares carrying the gene - but should still be used as breeding stallions because of their 'quality'. So nothing about the fact that it can't be a coincidence that a rare defect is found in SO MANY top stallions - because hypermobility is rewarded not punished. It all comes back to the dire state of dressage judging. There needs to be root and branch reform of all of it. What is desirable in terms of movement, re-focus on harmony and relaxation, penalities for any tension. If that hypermobile movement was marked down for the defect it actually is, then those horses would not be bred from, as they would be seen as conformationally very flawed.
 
Ambers Echo said:
That article is basically just saying stallions carring the gene should not be paired witn mares carrying the gene - but should still be used as breeding stallions because of their 'quality'. So nothing about the fact that it can't be a coincidence that a rare defect is found in SO MANY top stallions - because hypermobility is rewarded not punished. It all comes back to the dire state of dressage judging. There needs to be root and branch reform of all of it. What is desirable in terms of movement, re-focus on harmony and relaxation, penalities for any tension. If that hypermobile movement was marked down for the defect it actually is, then those horses would not be bred from, as they would be seen as conformationally very flawed.
Click to expand...

I’m just going to pull this up for clarification of what you are saying here, because the way I read it you are saying that one copy of the gene causes hypermobility.

As far as I’m aware, there is no evidence to support this and given you work in a clinical field I’m sure you understand the significance of such a statement.

Now there is a hypothesis that it might have some influence (in addition to plenty of other things!) on the hypermobility. It is a valid and interesting hypothesis that should be high in the funding for research list. But it is not a statement of fact.

Personally, in the interim I’d be very supportive of horses with one copy, bred from X date on, not being eligible to go into breeding registers. This would then naturally over time breed out the gene.

But I’d be a little wary of completely excluding good sound performance Sporthorses proving their worth from the entire gene pool just yet.

This isn’t just a dressage horse thing. It’s sj and eventing too.
 
ihatework said:
I’m just going to pull this up for clarification of what you are saying here, because the way I read it you are saying that one copy of the gene causes hypermobility.

As far as I’m aware, there is no evidence to support this and given you work in a clinical field I’m sure you understand the significance of such a statement.

Now there is a hypothesis that it might have some influence (in addition to plenty of other things!) on the hypermobility. It is a valid and interesting hypothesis that should be high in the funding for research list. But it is not a statement of fact.

Personally, in the interim I’d be very supportive of horses with one copy, bred from X date on, not being eligible to go into breeding registers. This would then naturally over time breed out the gene.

But I’d be a little wary of completely excluding good sound performance Sporthorses proving their worth from the entire gene pool just yet.

This isn’t just a dressage horse thing. It’s sj and eventing too.
Click to expand...
This! BUT, if there is a sense that a genetic defect which can actually have quite devastating effects, is 'useful' in creating or enhancing the extraordinary movement of some sport horses; without really understanding the clinical impact of the 1copy of the gene, that seems massively irresponsible and very, very distasteful imo. There is a wider problem of soundness and longevity in sport horses generally so using the potential of a genetic blip, or even just believing that it's useful, is pretty revolting to me.
 
I didn’t think that video was as bad as everyone said, his test look more harmonious than many that are out there at the moment, if his front hadn’t been scrunched up it would have been better but I still don’t like the over extravagant front legs. His piaffe was more correct than many as well. I can see why he got high marks but don’t necessarily agree with them. I loved the commentator mentioning that he might be a bit behind the vertical sometimes, he was BTV the whole time but the movements etc looked correct mostly so I would have docked him a mark for each movement for being short in front and mouth opening
 
What is the point of having these breeding programmes for ‘elite’ horses and interfering to create the ideal dressage horse if we are going to knowingly breed from horses with genetic defects and allow them to continue to populate the gene pool? Sorry it’s just madness and actually quite despicable.
 
To breed in genetic defects makes my blood boil! To stand stallions knowing they carry this gene, and to say , 'well its ok , if the mare doesnt carry it' - what about the next generation , and the one after that. Percentage of carriers grows until it will be a s***show. As breeding is increasingly big business with AI and lots of foals born to these over extravagent WFFS sires, the problem will hit the dressage world very soon.
 
You must log in or register to reply here.
Top