Panorama tonight - racing industry and slaughterhouses

Laafet

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the footage was from late 2019/early 2020.
Hmm, see that doesn't add up - if they came DUB/HLY - there are health papers done, plus the customs work. Aside from the morality of it - the sheer cost of bringing these horses over post Jan 1st should have stopped all of this. Plus a ministry vet signing off the horse as fit to travel......
 

shortstuff99

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Hmm, see that doesn't add up - if they came DUB/HLY - there are health papers done, plus the customs work. Aside from the morality of it - the sheer cost of bringing these horses over post Jan 1st should have stopped all of this. Plus a ministry vet signing off the horse as fit to travel......
Not if they came over via NI I believe.
 

meleeka

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i can compartmentalise it because there aren’t really options for pigs/sheep. Pigs/sheep also aren’t owned by people with more money than sense and are only bred for food. You can imagine the cost would be prohibitive for a farmer to have the knacker man come to him. These horses have provided entertainment and money to their owners and deserve a dignified end.

I had my pig pts at home, so I don’t think it matters what the species is, I couldn’t do it and as a pet, mine deserved more. if the abattoir was well run i might not mind as much if horses went there.
 

Tiddlypom

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Hmm, see that doesn't add up - if they came DUB/HLY - there are health papers done, plus the customs work. Aside from the morality of it - the sheer cost of bringing these horses over post Jan 1st should have stopped all of this. Plus a ministry vet signing off the horse as fit to travel......
I thought that, too. Surely the cost of shipping from Ireland and associated costs would be more than the £300 or so these horses would fetch as dead weight?

There must have been shennagins going on for these formerly 'pampered' horses to still be eligible to be in the food chain. I sachet of bute at any time and they are required to be signed out for life, aren't they?

The NZ lamb that I see for sale is frozen. It is cheaper than UK produced lamb, which shouldn't make economic sense, but there you are.
 

ester

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I'm dun it was more trainers posts and people responding to them that was bugging me.

Re. sending them to the abattoir vs. food animals there's been a massive amount of research in abattoir layouts etc for food animals in recent years with regards to reducing stress. I'm not sure that's the case for horses, even if just because of their fewer numbers (though maybe a moot point if the current regs aren't being followed anyway).
 

Laafet

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I thought that, too. Surely the cost of shipping from Ireland and associated costs would be more than the £300 or so these horses would fetch as dead weight?

There must have been shennagins going on for these formerly 'pampered' horses to still be eligible to be in the food chain. I sachet of bute at any time and they are required to be signed out for life, aren't they?

The NZ lamb that I see for sale is frozen. It is cheaper than UK produced lamb, which shouldn't make economic sense, but there you are.

The paperwork alone costs around 250 euros, plus there are different health papers for those going for slaughter, if they come over a normal paper they have to be signed out of the food chain and thus 'worthless', most Thoroughbreds are signed out before they reach a year old anyway (or at least all the studs I worked with did it as principle)..... They could have come via NI but again the cost of coming that way would negate any compensation from the abbattoir. I am struggling to see why they came here when there are slaughterhouses that take horses over there.
 

milliepops

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I thought that, too. Surely the cost of shipping from Ireland and associated costs would be more than the £300 or so these horses would fetch as dead weight?

There must have been shennagins going on for these formerly 'pampered' horses to still be eligible to be in the food chain. I sachet of bute at any time and they are required to be signed out for life, aren't they?
definite shenanigans, the number that they said had chips registered to different horses in their necks was a bit of an eye opener.
 

criso

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There must have been shennagins going on for these formerly 'pampered' horses to still be eligible to be in the food chain. I sachet of bute at any time and they are required to be signed out for life, aren't they?

There were some shenanigans. I only caught part of it but saw one bit. A horse injured itself badly and was pts on the course. Might have been Irish grand national, anyway footage of horse pulling up on 3 legs and all very public so had definitely been pts.

This 'horse' turned up in a slaughterhouse which was impossible as it had died several years earlier. It turned out the horse had 2 microchips, it's own and the one of the dead horse. So several levels of corruption for this to happen. What wasn't clear was if this was the tip of the iceberg and the one they found or if the checking processes mean the perpetrator s would be unlikely to get away with this.

On the subject of Bute, my current tb was 5 when he came to me. Had been in a couple of racing yards and one private home. I find it unlikely he had never been given Bute in his whole life but I'm the first owner to sign him out of the food chain. Same with my previous one though I bought him before the horsemeat scandal and people started checking this page more.
 

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I understand that you’re upset but I think the comparisons of horse racing to slavery and the Holocaust is way over the line and you need to stop.
I'm not upset, just incredibly sad that nothing seems to change. Sorry if you find my choice of words 'over the line'... but these are my thoughts and I am entitled to air them on this public forum. I was not comparing horse racing to slavery per se, but trying to highlight that change can be possible if there is the will to make that change. And as for using the admittedly rather dramatic term 'holocaust' I simply cannot find another term to describe humanitys treatment of animals. What word would you use to describe it?
 

ihatework

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This program was about racing and racehorses.

So leaving aside abattoir practises, the need for abbatoirs for the wider equine population, the issues in other equine disciplines, the fate of leisure horses etc.

The BHA has to get their act together. Rich owners need to stop passing the buck and thinking that giving their horses away is all pink and fluffy. Trainers need to take responsibility for the horses in their care, have clear policies that owners sign up to and enforce them.

If a racehorse is either physically or behaviourally unlikely to excel in a non racing home do the right bloody thing and have it PTS at home.

If you are going to pass the horse onto a non racing home then don’t give up ownership. Watertight legal agreement, do the right checks before and during the rehoming and step in if needed afterwards.

There are riders and trainers that do right by the horse as described above.

But there are also those that see them purely as commercial interests and once they aren’t of use any more are happy to let the horses fate be someone else’s fault. Disgusting.
 

milliepops

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it's interesting that the BBC picked up on the racing aspect of it because the stuff animal aid put on their website after the documentary aired was about slaughter of horses in general, with racing only being a part of it. their associated campaign/petition is about reducing breeding of all horses.
 

splashgirl45

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it's interesting that the BBC picked up on the racing aspect of it because the stuff animal aid put on their website after the documentary aired was about slaughter of horses in general, with racing only being a part of it. their associated campaign/petition is about reducing breeding of all horses.
although i dont agree with the way these people go about things, less breeding of all horses especially the coloured cobs bred in their thousands would be a good idea..
 

milliepops

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although i dont agree with the way these people go about things, less breeding of all horses especially the coloured cobs bred in their thousands would be a good idea..
I don't disagree, on the face of it... however i can't think of a way it could be enforced and not become yet another expensive joke enterprise that only penalises the responsible folk.
 

tristar

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Just watched it. I'm furious, apalled, disgusted. Racing has a lot to answer for IMO.

And WTF is with the vet that just watched them shoot horses at a distance? God knows what kind of vet ends up doing that sort of job anyway, albiet of course someone has to, but to let such blatant abuse just slide..


if someone went in a stable and shot a horse in that way they would be prosecuted it would be all over horse and hound, there would be outrage and all hell would break loose

i know some lovely vets, and have met some that should be shoveling shit
 

tristar

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Someone once said to me when she heard one of my horses had been shot at home that I did not love my horses as much as she loved hers as she could bear to do that
This is why I can, having your own horse shot at home is distressing and heartbreaking etc etc.
When I went out last night to have a a little cry into Sky’s mane I was crying for departed friends but for those horses on a slow route to slaughter I could do nothing to help .


oh god GS, i feel the same
 

PeterNatt

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These horse gave their owners much pleasure yet as soon a sthey no longer peform they are just discarded. The trainer was reported to have said that he sold the three race horses to a 'Dealer' and was therefore no longer responsible for them. This needs to be investigated to determine exactly what is goijng on? They also need to find out how the micro-chip of a horse that had been destroyed on the race track was implanted in to another horse? The British Horse Racing Authority need to have a thorough investigation and ensure that in future racehorses are put down peacefully at their yards and not travelled miles to their end. In addittion the matter of injured horses who are in pain or discomfort being made to travel miles before they are put down should be investigated and it should be mandatory to put them down at their yard rather than travelling them.
 

Old school

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Quigleyandme, just to clarify Jim Bolger is not currently banned. He made the claim about doping of racehorse.

Michen in Ireland lots of brainy folk make it to vet college. Most want to be in practice. My experience of govt vets is that they don't have the interpersonal/ people skills for dealing with Joe Public. They end up in abbattoirs or behind desks in regional offices. In my twenty years experience of them they normally create more animal welfare issues than they prevent.
 

tristar

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This is what shocks me the most.
I honestly thought everyone knew that this was the story.
I spoke to grooms in the 80s who loaded horses at yards for the slaughter house.it broke their hearts.it's just not possible to use the vast amount of horses for such a short amount of time then care for them for the rest of their natural lives.
I thought this was just a sad fact of life that everyone accepted and that I was a soft shite for feeling so sad about it.
Does anyone honestly think that now that owners and trainers have supposedly just found that it will change.
They will ride the tiny little storm of the moment then back to business as usual.
Money is king


the more people are aware of what happens the nearer we move to dignity for all animals
 

Equine_Dream

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I watched this and it has really truly upset me. We as the human race need to take a good hard look at ourselves. My husband put it so well as we finished watching yesterday evening....horses owe us nothing, yet we owe them everything. They truly deserved better. Watching the way they were lead away from the holding pens, ever compliant and trusting, some clearly terrified, but still they went......That image will stay with me for a very long time.
I'm aware euthanasia has it's place in the racing industry. Some horses just can not be rehomed. But not like this. No horse should have to watch it's companion shot, only to then have the gun pointed at them. As for the gunman taking a shot from across the room from the animal....I'm utterly lost for words.
 

luckyoldme

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I thought that. Somebody on the inside must have got the chip out of the dead horse then replanted it into the other one?
There can't be that many people involved between the horse being put down and the knackery.
Having said that it took 40 years + for them supposedly to notice that 4000 horses a year were going for slaughter so I don't expect they will be very quick at actually finding out who is digging microchips out of dead horses
 

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I have no issue with horses being PTS but it should be done at home on a yard they know not transported hundreds of miles to a slaughter house! There is no excuse for it! especially in the horse racing world where money is plentiful to ensure a dignified end for an animal that has given its all for an owner/trainer.
 

fankino04

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These horse gave their owners much pleasure yet as soon a sthey no longer peform they are just discarded. The trainer was reported to have said that he sold the three race horses to a 'Dealer' and was therefore no longer responsible for them. This needs to be investigated to determine exactly what is goijng on? They also need to find out how the micro-chip of a horse that had been destroyed on the race track was implanted in to another horse? The British Horse Racing Authority need to have a thorough investigation and ensure that in future racehorses are put down peacefully at their yards and not travelled miles to their end. In addittion the matter of injured horses who are in pain or discomfort being made to travel miles before they are put down should be investigated and it should be mandatory to put them down at their yard rather than travelling them.
That shouldn't just apply to racehorses.
 

Polos Mum

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My OH, a firearms officer in the past was appalled by the weapon of choice and how it was handled.

The guy waving it about over his head could easily have killed someone behind / above him and almost never been close enough to the horse to be at the right angle vs. a pistol.

If nothing else there should be questions about his gun licence with that approach to using it.
 

Birker2020

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Not all slaughter houses are the same, when we take one of our cattle to be killed for the freezer, we drop the tail board the heifer goes straight in to the kill pen, I take comfort by the time I am a mile down the road the animal has been dispatched, the on site vet is strict and the workers are professional and show compassion.
But you can never really know what goes on behind closed doors. There will always be an element of cruelty towards animals, when they are seen as nothing but a 'failed reject' which is sadly what they are classed as. As in life there are always those that delight in cruelty towards animals because they lack empathy and moral fibre. This will eventually, in most cases, transfer over to humans.

Of course not all slaughter men are like that, I went out with one who used to slaughter livestock for a living in Ireland. When he moved over to Birmingham he worked at a halal meat processing plant where they slaughtered the animals on site - he walked out after three days as he couldn't stand the level of incompetency, cruelty and barbaric treatment of the animals.

Like the man who sat on the dead horse, the horse didn't care. But that wasn't the point. It was the lack of respect towards that animal. THe lack of respect towards the racehorses at Drurys was appalling in the clips that we saw (or didn't see as they were censored) but it makes you wonder how badly they were actually treated prior to slaughter.

I wonder if the slaughterman taking pot shots at that horse was sacked after all this came to light? It was never mentioned.
 
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