pi@@ed off about ebay & their promise to refund every b@tch out

[bakewell]

I believe paypal will be holding funds they have removed from the seller's account in escrow until the buyer provides the tracking evidence that the saddle has been returned. Then buyer is refunded. Otherwise either party could very well high tail it with the money and the saddle.

ETA: an "escalation" is a standard part of the paypal/ ebay dispute system whereby a person with a grievance can formally involve paypal's arbitration rather than try to sort it out amongst themselves within the framework provided.

 

[coralwings20]

Yes, sorry, she wasn't refunded, paypal have taken the money out of my paypal leaving me with a minus balance. I had the saddle booked into an I dependant saddlery shop today so annoyed it never arrived plus I had to stay in most of the day waiting!

If buyer has damaged saddle on purpose, as soon as she provides evidence that I have received it, will paypal automatically refund her despite the dispute?

 

[bakewell]

Yes, sorry, she wasn't refunded, paypal have taken the money out of my paypal leaving me with a minus balance. I had the saddle booked into an I dependant saddlery shop today so annoyed it never arrived plus I had to stay in most of the day waiting!

Wait until you get the saddle before relisting/ booking it in anywhere/ swapping for three magic beans. Besides which I would say collecting it from the depot, filming the condition of the package as it's handed to you and opening it on film would be a very good piece of evidence. Fraud is serious business.

If buyer has damaged saddle on purpose, as soon as she provides evidence that I have received it, will paypal automatically refund her despite the dispute?

Ahhhh but there's the crux, did you send a saddle as described and as depicted, and she then damaged it, even though you were going to refund her anyway.... or did she receive a saddle not as described and depicted and send it back.
Or was it Professor Plum with a lead pipe in the library?

 

[coralwings20]

I sent the saddle as listed in my listing - the one she is sending back looks brown not black. Thanks - will video the opening of the box great idea

 

[Moomin1]

I sent the saddle as listed in my listing - the one she is sending back looks brown not black. Thanks - will video the opening of the box great idea

But if it is a different saddle, then you will know by the serial number. So no problem.

 

[coralwings20]

But if it is a different saddle, then you will know by the serial number. So no problem.

will paypal immediately refund her once pod is listed?

 

[Moomin1]

will paypal immediately refund her once pod is listed?

I have no idea, but if you get a saddle back, with a different serial number, simply provide proof of that to ebay.

 

[EmmasMummy]

will paypal immediately refund her once pod is listed?

I believe you have to survey the goods and reply to her/eBay

 

[hairycob]

Have you actually spoken to ebay/sent them your photos as you have been advised many times right from the beginning? Surely they are the right people to be asking the questions of.

 

[coralwings20]

Yes, I have sent the photos and saddlers brief report estimating saddle, what tree ect + seriel number & they got back to me saying they'd look into it but are very busy with complaints atm. Does ebay or paypal authorise refunds? I've always just allowed refunds/partial refund in all the years of selling so never been in a situation where I am adamant It's not the same saddle or has been tampered with.

I don't normal argue with buyers but her photos show a disgusting brown saddle & mine is black with normal wear and tear for a saddle of its age.

Thanks in advance to the people who know how to deal with ebay/paypal complaints. X

 

[Moomin1]

Yes, I have sent the photos and saddlers brief report estimating saddle, what tree ect + seriel number & they got back to me saying they'd look into it but are very busy with complaints atm. Does ebay or paypal authorise refunds? I've always just allowed refunds/partial refund in all the years of selling so never been in a situation where I am adamant It's not the same saddle or has been tampered with.

I don't normal argue with buyers but her photos show a disgusting brown saddle & mine is black with normal wear and tear for a saddle of its age.

Thanks in advance to the people who know how to deal with ebay/paypal complaints. X

The photos show a black saddle which has faded with normal wear and tear. Unless you can get proof that she somehow has miraculously caused this to happen then I doubt you can win any case if I'm honest.

 

[FestiveFuzz]

The photos show a black saddle which has faded with normal wear and tear. Unless you can get proof that she somehow has miraculously caused this to happen then I doubt you can win any case if I'm honest.

I think this is the crux of it and without pictures showing the front of the saddle before you sent it vs. how it's being returned I think you're going to struggle, particularly if the serial number matches. As myself and others have mentioned the discolouration shown in the pics would be hard to cause in a matter of days as it's just the standard fading that a well used saddle would get. I can't think how anyone could intentionally cause that.

 

[*hic*]

Whilst this has been very entertaining, I think that really you'd do well to take it to the ebay forums and get some advice from people who deal with this sort of thing day in and day out.

 

[coralwings20]

Thanks guys - in the advert it described the saddle as normal wear & tear which is what you guys are saying it is?! It certainly wasn't sent like that. It is brown in her photos & black in mine!

 

[coralwings20]

So how is it not as described?

 

[Moomin1]

Thanks guys - in the advert it described the saddle as normal wear & tear which is what you guys are saying it is?! It certainly wasn't sent like that. It is brown in her photos & black in mine!

I'm struggling to see how you cannot understand this. The photo of the saddle you say is 'damaged' shows nothing but normal discolouration which occurs with wear and tear over time to most black saddles. The discolouration can't have possibly been caused by any intentional action over a few days.

So IMO, either the saddle is a different saddle, or it was originally buffered up to appear a lot darker than it was.

 

[marmalade76]

I see you have form for not describing things correctly, you listed a Weymouth as a Pelham three times..

 

[Moomin1]

I see you have form for not describing things correctly, you listed a Weymouth as a Pelham three times..

Yes OP's OH's Ebay feedback shows a number of items were not as described - mostly saying they were described as 'good condition', but were in fact 'damaged'.

 

[marmalade76]

Obviously viewing their items through rose tinted glasses. I tend to go the other way, describe stuff as rough, tatty, old and well used. Still sell stuff well and have 100% and 5 out of 5 stars.

 

[coralwings20]

I see you have form for not describing things correctly, you listed a Weymouth as a Pelham three times..

Ops need to change that, thanks.

 

[Wagtail]

OP, you seem to be hard of understanding. The saddle in the buyers photographs is not a horrible brown colour, it is a perfectly normal colour for a black saddle that has faded naturally. It has NOT been damaged by the buyer. That would be impossible. So that leaves two possibilities, either that the saddle was like that when she received it (or you had covered up the fading colour with black boot polish or similar), OR the buyer is sending you back a different saddle. However, you have repeatedly ignored calls from people on here asking if you have photos of the damage and the serial number and so one can only assume that you know it is the right saddle. Correct me if I'm wrong.

 

[coralwings20]

Have amended, you also have to remember that there are a lot of buyers out there who complain for the sake of a partial refund & if I refuse, they leave bad fb. Partial refunds are a new scam and 50% of buyers try it on. I resold the bucas rug for more money & they were as happy as Larry - she wanted a partial refund which I refused as she got a bargin as it was & I paid her return postage. She still left me negative! You can't please everyone x

 

[Wagtail]

Have amended, you also have to remember that there are a lot of buyers out there who complain for the sake of a partial refund & if I refuse, they leave bad fb. Partial refunds are a new scam and 50% of buyers try it on. I resold the bucas rug for more money & they were as happy as Larry - she wanted a partial refund which I refused as she got a bargin as it was & I paid her return postage. She still left me negative! You can't please everyone x

Really? 50% of buyers try to get a partial refund? Blimey. I've been really lucky then. I have sold around 40 equestrian items over the past couple of years and no one has requested a refund, either fully or partial. But then I post photos of all damage or scratches.

 

[sychnant]

Partial refunds are a new scam and 50% of buyers try it on.

Rubbish. I have never had anyone ask for a partial refund. I describe what I sell as honestly as I can, warts and all, with pictures from every angle.

Do you have photos of the alleged damage?

 

[Sugar_and_Spice]

Whilst this has been very entertaining, I think that really you'd do well to take it to the ebay forums and get some advice from people who deal with this sort of thing day in and day out.

That would be even more entertaining :biggrin3: . Which is maybe why the OP is on here.

 

[marmalade76]

Really? 50% of buyers try to get a partial refund? Blimey. I've been really lucky then. I have sold around 40 equestrian items over the past couple of years and no one has requested a refund, either fully or partial. But then I post photos of all damage or scratches.

Same. Have also sold two saddles on there, both buyers were delighted.

 

[*hic*]

That would be even more entertaining :biggrin3: . Which is maybe why the OP is on here.

:biggrin3:

 

[foxy1]

I have sold more than 600 items on ebay and have never been asked for a partial refund.
In the opening post it says the op took more than 60 photos of the saddle- can you post some photos of the seat area so the condition/colour can be seen?

 

[bakewell]

Fact is OP, you are going to sell the saddle again when you get it back.... your actions have already shown that. And I think you're going to try and sell it for the same ballpark figure. I also think you would not hesitate to gloss over (ha!) any imperfections, in both saddle and listing.

By your own account half of your buyers (all independent unique purchasers) push for a partial refund; we also have the current problem of someone saying the item is so unlike the description they want a full refund; and listings (the bit, tho haven't seen this myself) currently live which are inaccurate. That's a lot of inaccuracy and bad feeling with one common denominator. You.

If the saddle returned to you is your saddle* and you wish to argue that the seller willfully damaged it**, and therefore take this up with ebay, you will need to demonstrate, convincingly***, that beyond reasonable doubt that was the course of events.
The question is, "which is most likely".
Now it might not be the case, which is ok because no-ones going to die here, but I think the most likely is that you covered up the wear on the saddle to an extent that caused the buyer to assume the saddle was in better condition than it really was. That's ok, whoopsie poopsie, sometimes we all make mistakes. Relist it accurately, sell it for what it's worth. I think you got stung in the first instance of purchasing this saddle at £700. I'm sorry that happened but you can't keep passing the buck of misfortune in the hope that someone else literally pays for your mistake.

*serial number consistent
** even though she had no need to in order to secure a refund, by your stated terms and the ebay dispute system.
*** using evidence, not just really wanting/ believing it to be the truth

 

[Red-1]

I have sold on ebay too, and even with saddles have 100% satisfaction, and no refund, partial refunds etc. I do list all defects, photo any damage etc. One saddle was £150, one £600 and one £1,200, so a fair spread. I also pay for insurance on the more expensive ones, and have them signed for. All no issue. As is the case for bridles, rugs, girths, numnahs, boots....... the list is huge.

As a buyer I once asked for a partial refund on an item that arrived in a damaged package, it was damaged inside too, and the courier admitted to the damage. I handed the package back to the courier (as in refused delivery due to damage) and arranged a return. The courier then re-delivered the next day and left with a colleague when I was out. I called the seller and amiably arranged a 30% refund so they did not have to front up their courier. Their choice, very amicable.

This is how ebay works IME.

It does not endear you to me when I find you have partial refund requests from 50% of your clients! The saddle in the ebay photos does look over prepared, with black polish and sillicone wipe sponge. For work I prepared tack for parades, and this is how we did it to cover up defects short term, but it only lasted one ride. Plus black polish is no fun on white Jodhs.

If people have "stalked" you I suspect it is because we were scratching our heads in bewilderment, as to what on earth was happening, why you started the thread in the first place, why you were so rude....... contradictory in your story, defensive, it is a worry. I actually thought it was a wind up.

In all seriousness, as another poster has already said, I think you could do with a trip to your GP. With your commitments to toddler, baby, house, horses, refurbishment, etc etc you seem to be under a lot of stress. They may be able to help. Especially f you are also posting on another forum similar but not related issues.