Saddle sale problem

[PurBee]

What on earth are paypal doing refunding without contacting you about the sale issues the seller has raised with them?

So customer has the product and a refund in their possession, great protection for all eh? NOT!
As LW suggests, let paypal have that steam first thing tomorrow via a phonecall.

 

[TPO]

PayPal wont refund until you receive the item.

Buyer has to return item tracked and upload the tracking reference and keep proof of postage etc

I dont know if the actual refund is when you confirm receipt and that item is ok or if its automatic once item is signed for.

 

[poiuytrewq]

Do paypal sometimes take the money out of the sellers account in the case of a dispute but hold it until the item is posted and received back by the seller (if they have decided on the buyers favour) I’m pretty sure you still have time and opportunity to put your side across and I’d add photographs/screenshots of the correct way to measure a saddle because chances are paypal people won’t have a clue!

 

[holeymoley]

I’m hoping this is the case. Also trying to get as much behind me as possible to put that across to them.

 

[Baywonder]

Just a random thought. To add more weight to your case, why not ask a few saddle fitters / saddlers how to measure a saddle correctly? (Including any response from the SMS of course)

 

[holeymoley]

Thank you yes I have a few and I’ve asked online . I’ve sent some emails too so hoping to hear back.

 

[PurBee]

I would give paypal the sellers pic of her measurment from cantle to pommel and also a saddlers pic from their website showing measuring stud to cantle, aswell as link to google search ‘how to measure an english saddle’ while explaining the buyer doesnt know how a saddle is measured.
All this to affirm that the advert and description is accurate for the item she received.

 

[Baywonder]

@holeymoley - I have just PM'd you.

 

[holeymoley]

So the latest is that PayPal are looking into things. Buyer eventually got back to me and said she can’t disclose the Saddler’s name due to GDPR... I’m sorry what?! Hardly.

 

[DaveW]

That’s nonsense, ask them what section of the GDPR regulations they are getting this from, sounds like they are trying to pull a fast one.

 

[holeymoley]

I’m so tempted with a snotty reply but holding myself back. I did study business law which covered a healthy section of gdpr so if they know something I don’t then it’s time to let us all know! It would seem her knowledge of gdpr is as **** as her knowledge of saddle sizing

 

[PurBee]

The saddler i presume is a professional and offers their services to the general public, so should be willing and wanting to have their details available to anyone who wishes to discuss saddlery surely?....than be blocked by internet regulations pertaining to security of info?! Hardly good for business!

Basically its the wrong saddle for her, her horse, maybe theres no saddler even involved, she doesnt wanna suck the bitter pill of buying the wrong size and selling the saddle on so is turning the blame on seller with ‘not as described’ BS and fictitious saddlers.

 

[holeymoley]

Love it! Yes she’s now claiming she requires a saddle with longer flaps too etc ?.

I’ve made a pretty healthy case for PayPal to deal with including the original advert, guides to saddle seat measuring, her measuring photos and screenshots of the conversation where she states she ‘ hopes it fits’I’ve also stated that she didn’t wish to disclose the name of the fitter she used and that I can provide emails from saddlers confirming how to measure correctly.

I actually wouldn’t mind having it back as it is a quality saddle worth a little bit more than I sold it for however I won’t be taken for a mug.

 

[holeymoley]

Laviania Saddles have replied saying their standard seat measurement is from stud to pommel too so there seems to be some rats smelt with the whole story.

 

[conniegirl]

screenshot it and send it to her.
PHONE paypal you will get a better response from them than Via email

 

[PurBee]

Do paypal have live chat these days?
Now youve given them pics/advert and info of the sale, they can reference from those and the conversation will go easier.

 

[eggs]

Sounds like the saddle doesn't fit her horse and she is trying every which way to get a refund. I hope PayPal find in your favour.

 

[cremedemonthe]

I do hope paypal do the right thing but as I have said experience has taught me they sometimes don't and often favour the buyer hence why I never sell saddlery via paypal .
Let us know how you get on, if you need any more help other than what I have PM'd you , just ask, Oz (Saddler)

 

[holeymoley]

Thank you everyone I’ll keep updating as I go along. Everyone has been more than kind with their offer of help. Could do with out it even more now as horse has just came down with cellulitis from a bit of mud fever.

 

[Muddywellies]

I have been through this and simply took the saddle back. The buyer paid postage.I refunded.

That way I got the saddle back intact and was able to sell on again.

It is not right but it is less hassle.

Exactky this. get saddle back and refund the pennies. I wouldn't refund their postage tho. Life's too short and it's likely this would drag on and get worse before it got better. Make sure you get it inspected before you refund the money.

 

[myheartinahoofbeat]

I sold a saddle on Ebay last year and after a week the buyer said it didn't fit. She didn't even contest the measurements just said it didn't fit her horse. Like you, I thought buying online meant you just took a punt. It went to dispute and I ended up giving her a refund. Real pain as if it was me buying on eBay and it didn't fit, it wouldn't occur to me you could send it back. Sorry no help to you though!

 

[CanteringCarrot]

I have sold saddles on eBay before with no issue, and I've bought them as well. I know that buying them is a risk as you cannot guarantee fit. I can do my best with certain measurements, but if it doesn't fit, I just resell. That's the nature of the game.

I take thorough photos of items that I sell, including measurements in the photos, but if someone wants a specific measurement not in the photos, that is on them to ask and I will happily oblige. Otherwise, you buy as is. If you didn't do your due diligence as a buyer to get these specific measurements that you covet so much, that is on you. Now, if the saddle arrived and was absolute rubbish (heavily worn, scratched, different from the photos) that is one thing, but that is not the case here.

I have had to file PayPal disputes before, but it has always been with a company when they didn't issue a refund within their window ...even when they received the returned item (registered mail - so signed for at the proper address), or when they charged me and just never sent the item, or just ghosted. PayPal has been on my side and the process was easy, but I had fair cases. I had evidence through emails, tracking, etc. but PayPal never needed them because I guess in these cases the sellers knew they were in the wrong and just sent the refund?

I really didn't know you could return a saddle unless the seller specifically states a return is allowed or a trial period is allowed (usually a short contract accompanies this).

 

[sbloom]

Just a random thought. To add more weight to your case, why not ask a few saddle fitters / saddlers how to measure a saddle correctly? (Including any response from the SMS of course)

Two of us answered .

If it was a Lavinia saddle then you've done 100% the right thing going to the company, the vendor can't argue with the maker/designer of the saddle!

 

[Pinkvboots]

I can also confirm that LM saddles are measured that way I have 2 and Lavinia fitted mine, there Mark 1 saddles do come up longer than the newer models though.

 

[little_critter]

Some buyers are muppets, I’ve just sold a gilet on eBay it’s BNWT and I listed it per the size stated on those tags, a photo of the tags was on the listing now the buyer wants to return it saying it’s not the size listed...err read the tags!
I hope ebay will be reasonable and see that it’s exactly as listed

 

[holeymoley]

Still awaiting PayPals outcome.
Very convieniently saw an advert for the exact same saddle I sold and someone had the seat with tape measurements stud to cantle. It was clear if the tape moved to the pommel about an inch was coming off the length! I’ve posted that too ??

 

[FestiveFuzz]

In your shoes I would be calling PayPal now for an update, as if the saddle is coming back to me I’d want it back sooner rather than later. Also in my experience they’re a lot easier/quicker to deal with by phone. Good luck either way, I’d hope after all the evidence you’ve shared there’s no way they could side with the buyer.

 

[holeymoley]

Just an update for this- PayPal have eventually reviewed my information and they’re ‘waiting on the buyers response’ so unsure what that means. I called them as well as writing almost war and peace about measuring, with photos, screenshots of conversation etc I also came across an advert for the exact same saddle as mine, with a very clear photo of the tape measure cantle to stud which showed if it was cantle to pommel, you would lose about an inch off seat size so I added that too with buyers photo of measurement.

I also had a message this week off the buyer with the cheek to ask if I’d heard anything from PayPal!

 

[holeymoley]

So I’ve lost the case... it’s due to get sent back to me and she has 10 working days to do so. I won’t be shy in stating who this person is on the saddlery for sale pages that she bought from. As for PayPal, I’m not impressed with them and won’t be using them again.

 

[Roxylola]

Oh that seems very unreasonable. I've been looking at saddles recently, took a chance on one that I decided was too narrow when we tried it. It's at home for now and will hang on til we see the saddler at the end of this month but there is no way I'd try to send it back - and that is to a retailer, I didn't ask for a trial I bought it so it is my problem. I think you would be absolutely right to tell people she's likely to try and pull a fast one!