Saddle sale problem

[milliepops]

Feeling dense- would that not cover the buyer? Technically as a seller I'm out too for the £12 transaction fee from Paypal! Honestly

I thought that reply was directed at TPO as she's out of pocket on her return.

 

[KINDMARE]

Just out of interest - what method of payment would you use for higher value items? i was under the (now false) impression paypal was good!!!
thanks

 

[Leo Walker]

Feeling dense- would that not cover the buyer? Technically as a seller I'm out too for the £12 transaction fee from Paypal! Honestly

No your not. If you refund via paypal, which is the only way to do it, that goes back into the amount.

You dont have to refund at this point. I'd be arguing the toss with them over the length. Get your saddler to write a report and have that ready to submit as soon as the dispute is opened and that should put a stop to it.

 

[Firefly9410]

I insist on bank transfer if posting or cash on collection. I would prefer not to sell the thing than risk being ripped off by PayPal.

Just out of interest - what method of payment would you use for higher value items? i was under the (now false) impression paypal was good!!!
thanks

 

[Leo Walker]

Just out of interest - what method of payment would you use for higher value items? i was under the (now false) impression paypal was good!!!
thanks

Paypal! Always paypal goods and services. No buyer will use anything else unless they are absolutely idiotic as its the only way to safeguard themselves from being scammed. Paypal IS good. They have good customer service if you call them if theres an issue. Some of the things written on this thread either arent true or are down to sellers not using paypal properly.

They will not refund a buyer and let them keep the saddle. They will only refund the buyer in this instance if its not as described and the saddle is returned in the same condition it was sold in. It is as described so the OP has nothing to worry about.

 

[holeymoley]

No your not. If you refund via paypal, which is the only way to do it, that goes back into the amount.

You dont have to refund at this point. I'd be arguing the toss with them over the length. Get your saddler to write a report and have that ready to submit as soon as the dispute is opened and that should put a stop to it.

Fab!

I'm not jumping to anything, still waiting on their measurement. My saddler hasn't seen the saddle since June 2019- on her notes that she's given me a copy of, it only states that 'current saddle is too long and would be better in 16" or 16.5" '

 

[cremedemonthe]

Just out of interest - what method of payment would you use for higher value items? i was under the (now false) impression paypal was good!!!
thanks

As a business seller I use bank transfer for higher value items, been scammed TOO many times by paypal and so have some of my customers, some have lost saddles and expensive bridles as well as rugs through paypal chargebacks and thieving buyers.

 

[holeymoley]

It looks like it'll need to be refunded. It's been measured (albeit from pommel to cantle) and somehow measures smaller. Joy!

 

[PurBee]

It looks like it'll need to be refunded. It's been measured (albeit from pommel to cantle) and somehow measures smaller. Joy!

I may be wrong but i thought standard saddle sizes were measured from cantle to the front nail head on the skirt?
Isnt that the measure saddlers also use?
In which case your measurements from your saddler would still stand. And your seller rights and accuracy of advert.

Cantle to pommel would be at least an inch shorter!

 

[PurBee]

Get your buyer to send you this pic with tape measure of your saddle.

http://www.darkhorsesaddlery.com/english-tack-fitting.html

 

[holeymoley]

My thoughts too, I've always measure stud to centre of cantle. She's stating her saddler said it's all a fallacy about measuring stud to cantle... likewise with d-d. I can understand d-d as they're all placed differently on each saddle but surely seat size is fairly standard.

I'm worn with the whole situation- providing it gets to me in the same state I sent it, she can get a refund and I'll try and sell to a saddlers.

 

[PurBee]

Her saddler doesnt agree with most saddlers and industry standards, fair enougn, doesn’t mean you advertised it incorrectly, and still have every right to refuse refund, and suggest they sell the saddle on.
I’d personally state that.

It does take it out of you when a customer is a pain in the proverbial. If you have run out of juice on this, at least request tracked insured return delivery (mimic your posting out method). Dont refund until you receive saddle in condition you sent it out.

 

[Mrs. Jingle]

But that is totally incorrect way to measure and English saddle? Stud to cantle centre is the right measurement - if her saddler is saying that the correct measurement is from pommel to cantle he is not a very experienced saddler!

 

[Melody Grey]

My thoughts too, I've always measure stud to centre of cantle. She's stating her saddler said it's all a fallacy about measuring stud to cantle... likewise with d-d. I can understand d-d as they're all placed differently on each saddle but surely seat size is fairly standard.

I'm worn with the whole situation- providing it gets to me in the same state I sent it, she can get a refund and I'll try and sell to a saddlers.

Is there not some master saddlers or similar guidelines that state measurements are from stud to centre of cantle? ....even better measurements from manufacturers website?

 

[cremedemonthe]

Centre of saddle nail to centre of the cantle IS the right way to measure a saddle.
I trained in 1987 in Cordwainer's college in Hackney the only full time saddlery training establishment in the Uk at the time and was taught by 2 traditional as well as modern trained up to date saddlers, saddlers with a collective experience of approx 70 years, they taught me that is the way to measure a saddle. Could be your buyer is bull shitting and has no real saddler involved as it smacks of inexperience and ignorance on basic English saddle measuring.
I suggest you get the name and business details of the said saddler and check them out.
Unless by some miracle all saddlers and saddle makers now measure from centre of the head to cantle and not take in to account the cut back head, I stand by what I say.
Oz (Saddler)

 

[holeymoley]

Centre of saddle nail to centre of the cantle IS the right way to measure a saddle.
I trained in 1987 in Cordwainer's college in Hackney the only full time saddlery training establishment in the Uk at the time and was taught by 2 traditional as well as modern trained up to date saddlers, saddlers with a collective experience of approx 70 years, they taught me that is the way to measure a saddle. Could be your buyer is bull shitting and has no real saddler involved as it smacks of inexperience and ignorance on basic English saddle measuring.
I suggest you get the name and business details of the said saddler and check them out.
Unless by some miracle all saddlers and saddle makers now measure from centre of the head to cantle and not take in to account the cut back head, I stand by what I say.
Oz (Saddler)

I had thought there was maybe a bit of bs’ing going on here too and was tempted to ask who they used. I might just to be nosey.

 

[cremedemonthe]

I had thought there was maybe a bit of bs’ing going on here too and was tempted to ask who they used. I might just to be nosey.

Get the saddler's details, I'd like to talk to them

 

[fredflop]

Friend of mine had a similar issue. The purchaser was not a customer of the saddler that said the “saddle had arrived damaged”.

 

[TPO]

From what I can tell no. As the buyer of a fraudulent item I I ro pay postage to return the item then I have to make a claim to paypal. As far as I can see paypal pay up to £15 but dont claim it back from the seller.

I thought that reply was directed at TPO as she's out of pocket on her return.

 

[DressageCob]

If their notes say the saddle is too long and it would be better in a 16" or a 16.5", surely that suggests that the saddle you sold is not a 16.5". It's longer, which is fine because you sold it as a 17".

The measurement is from the centre of the nail to the cantle. That's how the seat size is determined, so her photo of pommel to cantle doesn't change anything.

 

[sbloom]

My thoughts too, I've always measure stud to centre of cantle. She's stating her saddler said it's all a fallacy about measuring stud to cantle... likewise with d-d. I can understand d-d as they're all placed differently on each saddle but surely seat size is fairly standard.

I'm worn with the whole situation- providing it gets to me in the same state I sent it, she can get a refund and I'll try and sell to a saddlers.

Yes D to D is a fallacy, in terms of it being a useful measurement, but centre of nail head to centre of cantle (I'd argue the photo shows a slightly more generous measurement than that) is absolutely correct as I think you've been assured by now with us all ranting lol. I'm sure the SMS would be happy to answer that question or perhaps direct you to an approved graphic.

 

[holeymoley]

Get the saddler's details, I'd like to talk to them

I've PM'd you

 

[conniegirl]

the saddler doesnt happen to be based in birmingham does he? I've met one from there that was adamant that saddles were measured the way the buyers saddler is saying, tbh as soon as it came out of his mouth I disregarded everything else he said. Every other saddler i've used (many very well respected and highly qualified people) has said button to center of cantle.

I'd go back to your buyer, ask for the saddlers qualifications and why they believe that thier view trumps the industry standard?

 

[holeymoley]

I would love to but trying to think of a way that won't sound argumentative! It seems to be more south of York/humber area... not familiar with that area unfortunately.

 

[conniegirl]

ohh, let me know which saddler as i'm in that area and it will be good to know who to avoid
ETA I wouldnt worry about sounding argumentative. I think the buyer is trying it on with you and being a PITA so a little bit of argument should be expected

 

[Melody Grey]

I would love to but trying to think of a way that won't sound argumentative! It seems to be more south of York/humber area... not familiar with that area unfortunately.

Sounds like they’re trying to pull a fast one, you have every right to sound argumentative or at least question them!

 

[holeymoley]

I'm going to contact the society of master saddlers to see if there's anything in black and white that the saddle must be measured stud to cantle... What a nightmare, wishing I hadn't bothered now.

 

[holeymoley]

Well! I’m still waiting for the name of the saddle fitter and now she’s escalated a dispute on PayPal so guess who has received a refund. The steam is coming out my ears. I’ve swiftly made a very unhappy email to paypal describing what’s gone on. I won’t let this lie.

 

[Leo Walker]

Well! I’m still waiting for the name of the saddle fitter and now she’s escalated a dispute on PayPal so guess who has received a refund. The steam is coming out my ears. I’ve swiftly made a very unhappy email to paypal describing what’s gone on. I won’t let this lie.

Ring them tomorrow before she has chance to send it back

 

[holeymoley]

Ring them tomorrow before she has chance to send it back

I’m more concerned that it doesn’t get sent back either. Surely PayPal would need some proof of postage or something before issuing a refund?! What a joke.