Tnavas
Well-Known Member
H is a horse management exam, does not require any riding at all, beyond C certificate level.
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Teaching qualifications
- Thread starter Daisy1905
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H is a horse management exam, does not require any riding at all, beyond C certificate level.
ILuvCowparsely
Well-Known Member
Is hardly promoting an exam for the OP ios it I bet they are thinking twice now taking this exam
When you say Ai's is easy and any numpty can achieve it, why do you not do it and pass eh ??
ILuvCowparsely
Well-Known Member
hardly bullies when this poster constently goes on about my spelling and wording to the point I ask H&H to close the thread, hence why I changed my signature
Yes I am dyslexic, no they cannot change the way my brain words things down, yes I am crap at typing. That is the type of Dissability I have.
No I cannot change it
Saying any numpty can pass is putting us all in that shoe box is it not? That and other coments put us in the firing line and you wonder why we react. Maybe they should have said
*
I have seen a couple AI's who were not good but that is no refl;ect on others !!! * that might have saved us who spent the tinme and money in our training not taking it as a insult againts AI's in general
Tnavas
Well-Known Member
JFTDWS
+++ Out of Cheese Error +++
Why would I promote an exam to the OP which I don't think is necessarily useful to them? I'm under no obligation to, no matter what you think.
Why would I take an exam to qualify me to teach in an RS, when I do not teach, nor do I want to? I have professional qualifications related to my career - I'm not in the habit of throwing money after gaining qualifications I neither want, nor intend to use.
I think you have me confused with sidesaddle, actually.
Anyway, why would I say that? Rubbish AIs do reflect on others. It doesn't mean every AI is similarly rubbish, but it does mean that the qualification will become tainted by their poor reputation. And that is what I have been saying throughout - the AI qualification itself is, to me, meaningless, because based on that alone, how would one know whether the instructor falls into the "just scraped through their s3" category or the "very well trained" categories? If they're an AI who has trained with X at the TTT, worked with Y, or ridden to Z level, you have some means to judge their level (and possibly style of training) before you commit to a lesson.
But I've said this all before, and you're determined to willfully misinterpret my comments. So carry on...
be positive
Well-Known Member
You are now arguing for the sake of it and not reading JFTD's posts correctly, she does not state that any numpty can easily pass but that
"In my opinion, it is entirely possible for a competent rider to get through the current s3 exams with very little effort. And it's entirely possible for numpties to get through it with a great deal more effort, but remain utter numpties at the end of it."
which is the same in many walks of life not just the equestrian world, there are numpties everywhere, some probably highly qualified that have put in a lot of work to gain a professional qualification they wanted but they may never be good at the job, others work hard, strive to improve their experience, knowledge and don't rest on their laurels, they continue learning some within the BHS system others such as Carl Hester, who has his BHSAI, move on outside of the system, it doesn't make them better people but probably makes them better trainers/ instructors.
ester
Not slacking multitasking
Exactly! And that was the person providing the training for the AI friend. Worrying don't you think?
ester
Not slacking multitasking
I'm autistic, it makes it every difficult for me to deal with things that are wrong/incorrect and against the rules, so much so that at least I cringe, at most it causes me physical and emotional distress, whose disability wins out on that then? I try my hardest to be aware of when I should let go of certain points but sometimes it takes quite a bit of effort as I fight an argument about it in my head. No less effort than I imagine using spell check in today's world of technology would be.
ester
Not slacking multitasking
I thought you had put JFTD on UI? And I don't think it is a bad thing that the OP thinks of all the pros and cons of spending time on training and qualifications.
JFTD doesn't want to teach riding, she does ok with the science so why would she spend money taking exams?
Goldenstar
Well-Known Member
So it's not real work teaching children or nervous adults .
Let me state it's my view that those that can teach and improve nervous adults are some of the most skilled .
That is difficult skilled work .
ILuvCowparsely
Well-Known Member
They are now on UI I copied from earlier.
Yes it is good to get the pro and cons of a profession from a business aspect as in how much you make - what type insurance .You need to make x amount when freelance and more.
Saying any Numpty can do it refers it is easy and nothing special to train and go through the good times and the bad within your training.
Sheesh some may say the HGV test is easy but it isn't and not all will complete the course or pass
Some might find the training hard as remember it isn’t just about having a lesson and teaching in the middle of the school with your trainer telling you what to do.
It is what goes on behind the scenes when you live andwork and train at you chosen training school.
At Park Farm it included
being woken up in the middle of the night when ponies get out and are in Mount Vernon Hospital, and we have to get up and go in nighties and wellies which was a sight to catch them runinng round the 80 or so acres there, dealing with colic cases, strangles and other ailments all first hand, hard lectures, Weekly exams, weekly practical test - hands on ailment treating, seeing death and birth for the first time. Dealing with difficult clients, rude clients - first aid. That is the tip of the iceberg, not even 1 % of what i went through, the stress that came with it and being bullied by some of the other students and senior staff, drove me to actually jump out the window as I had enough, as at that age it followed on from school bullying. Then I found inner strength and stood up and explained to Sandra who was one of the senior staff who had no patience for me and explained I was Dyslexic.
She said You are?? I said yes, then taken to head office to Miss Wendy Maye, and they completely changed and helped me no end after that, so my progress was down to them and their patience for me. Now I am stronger and will not tolerate ridicule it is what it is.
We should be helping those who are less fortunate to the knowledge of horseman help not dissing the profession to posters who want to make teaching their career.
Its all very well having horses from an early age and judging, but a lot of students or working pupils come from a really horseless background so everything including haynets being put up etc, is all new to them.
AI is like any other qualification is accepted and looked upon as a good standard of work by riding schools since the BHS riding schools employed qualified staff not individuals who may or may not be practicing teaching outside of the yard.
Most students come from a background where they have not had hands on or practical experiance so are experiancing it all for the first time.
Yes it is good to get the pro and cons of a profession from a business aspect as in how much you make - what type insurance .You need to make x amount when freelance and more.
Saying any Numpty can do it refers it is easy and nothing special to train and go through the good times and the bad within your training.
Sheesh some may say the HGV test is easy but it isn't and not all will complete the course or pass
Some might find the training hard as remember it isn’t just about having a lesson and teaching in the middle of the school with your trainer telling you what to do.
It is what goes on behind the scenes when you live andwork and train at you chosen training school.
At Park Farm it included
being woken up in the middle of the night when ponies get out and are in Mount Vernon Hospital, and we have to get up and go in nighties and wellies which was a sight to catch them runinng round the 80 or so acres there, dealing with colic cases, strangles and other ailments all first hand, hard lectures, Weekly exams, weekly practical test - hands on ailment treating, seeing death and birth for the first time. Dealing with difficult clients, rude clients - first aid. That is the tip of the iceberg, not even 1 % of what i went through, the stress that came with it and being bullied by some of the other students and senior staff, drove me to actually jump out the window as I had enough, as at that age it followed on from school bullying. Then I found inner strength and stood up and explained to Sandra who was one of the senior staff who had no patience for me and explained I was Dyslexic.
She said You are?? I said yes, then taken to head office to Miss Wendy Maye, and they completely changed and helped me no end after that, so my progress was down to them and their patience for me. Now I am stronger and will not tolerate ridicule it is what it is.
We should be helping those who are less fortunate to the knowledge of horseman help not dissing the profession to posters who want to make teaching their career.
Its all very well having horses from an early age and judging, but a lot of students or working pupils come from a really horseless background so everything including haynets being put up etc, is all new to them.
AI is like any other qualification is accepted and looked upon as a good standard of work by riding schools since the BHS riding schools employed qualified staff not individuals who may or may not be practicing teaching outside of the yard.
Most students come from a background where they have not had hands on or practical experiance so are experiancing it all for the first time.
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JFTDWS
+++ Out of Cheese Error +++
Fwiw, GS, I agree with you. That post was poorly worded - I mean real gymnasticising work for the horse, rather than teaching the rider in a child-friendly manner, dealing with nerves and all those other inter-personal skills, which are essential for anybody (AI or not) marketing themselves at that demographic (which are of no interest to me, since I am neither child nor currently in the throes of confidence issues). They're valuable skills and incredibly important in the RS, PC and other markets - they're just not what I look for in a trainer, so to me, they're of no interest (at present).
ILuvCowparsely
Well-Known Member
I can appreciate it is fustrating reading a post with things spelt wrong and punctuation mistake, but when someone has a genuin dissability what can they gain by repeated attacks on a member about it in many of their posts. What can be gained by it apart from someone getting someone hurt or upset or angry about it being meationed all the time. Remember we sometimes say it as it sounds or reading things wrong or genuially write down how our brains tells us which may be right or wrong, but that does not give others a free rein to ridicule someone and turn a thread into a biotching slanging match, which my last one did just because I spelt Bought wrong.
I see this done to others too and it is always the same members dishing out the coments.
I hope the OP does not now see the AI as a waste of time and not respected after seeing some of the coments on here
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ester
Not slacking multitasking
You don't seem to have understood what I have said, because of my, also genuine, disability it often goes beyond frustration - I think you will note I used the words emotional and physical distress- does that really sound like just frustration to you? I am aware that it is ridiculous to have a physical response to a misspelled word but I do, can't help that but I have to put up with it if I am going to frequent forums and try (and fail!) and not let it affect me.
I think you should understand that sometimes people aren't saying things just to get at you, that they sometimes have other reasons behind it.
What can be gained from it? Maybe they will use a spell check more and save us all from ourselves?
I judge having not had horses from an early age. I had occasional riding lessons intermittently and at 14 I got myself to the nearest riding school (hence the slighly dubious quality as I was on my bike) and immersed myself in them for occasional rides. I didn't get Frank until I was 21 and as such am still on my first pony.
I think the OP has plenty of information from both sides of the coins about BHS and other options and can make their own, informed decision.
I think you should understand that sometimes people aren't saying things just to get at you, that they sometimes have other reasons behind it.
What can be gained from it? Maybe they will use a spell check more and save us all from ourselves?
I judge having not had horses from an early age. I had occasional riding lessons intermittently and at 14 I got myself to the nearest riding school (hence the slighly dubious quality as I was on my bike) and immersed myself in them for occasional rides. I didn't get Frank until I was 21 and as such am still on my first pony
.I think the OP has plenty of information from both sides of the coins about BHS and other options and can make their own, informed decision.
ILuvCowparsely
Well-Known Member
I did not get my first mare till 23 years old in 1983You don't seem to have understood what I have said, because of my, also genuine, disability it often goes beyond frustration - I think you will note I used the words emotional and physical distress- does that really sound like just frustration to you? I am aware that it is ridiculous to have a physical response to a misspelled word but I do, can't help that but I have to put up with it if I am going to frequent forums and try (and fail!) and not let it affect me.
I think you should understand that sometimes people aren't saying things just to get at you, that they sometimes have other reasons behind it.
What can be gained from it? Maybe they will use a spell check more and save us all from ourselves?
I judge having not had horses from an early age. I had occasional riding lessons intermittently and at 14 I got myself to the nearest riding school (hence the slighly dubious quality as I was on my bike) and immersed myself in them for occasional rides. I didn't get Frank until I was 21 and as such am still on my first pony
I think the OP has plenty of information from both sides of the coins about BHS and other options and can make their own, informed decision.
I was reffering to those who are so called perfect and never make typos, getting frustrated and comment on others mistakes and turn the thread into a school yard picking on the individuals weakness, as per my innocent thread about a gadget I wanted to share and a select few turned into a biotching match and making fun of the fact I spelt a word wrong. I was not speaking about you. I have said the spell checker does not work on this computer even though it is switched to on. It also crashes without reason so I cannot do anything about checking the spelling.
Some like to make themselves big by making others look small.Now I think this thread has gone as far as it can go and it is not helping the OP anymore, TN and me have explained why we feel the way we do, even though it was said as a global statement which I might add included us as we are both qualified.
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ester
Not slacking multitasking
It didn't include you! 'In general' and 'most' did not include you.
How do you know that those others don't have issues that cause them to react the way they do? That was my point.
How do you know that those others don't have issues that cause them to react the way they do? That was my point.
Auslander
Well-Known Member
The AI qualification is a bit like the driving test - it's the exams you take to start off your career with a recognised basic level of competence. I would expect an AI to be able to teach beginners and intermediate RS riders to a decent level, but I would not expect anything more from them, unless the individual was competing successfully in a particular discipline, and was able to communicate their knowledge. If it was any more than that, there wouldn't be an II, an I, or a Fellowship-the higher level exams, where students are encouraged to specialise, to think for themsleves, rather than doing everything the "BHS" way.
Not knocking AI's at all, as there is always going to be a need for basic instruction, but I don't see that particular qualification as anything more than entry level teaching.
Not knocking AI's at all, as there is always going to be a need for basic instruction, but I don't see that particular qualification as anything more than entry level teaching.
Leo Walker
Well-Known Member
You keep talking about training schools. I dont think they exist in the way you remember them. As someone who worked as an instructor, so did the training myself and trained tens of others, what you are talking about is not what happens. There have never been any weekly exams of any sort, lectures werent really a thing either at any of the places I worked, other than the place I did my inital training. People learnt on the job and then got specific training in how to pass the exams.
I never worked on a yard that wasnt BHS approved. I also never met a single person who hadnt at the very least come up through the ranks of helper at the yard, but most had more experience than that.
EventingMum
Well-Known Member
Totally agree with this, unfortunately many see it as the be all and end all. Once achieved it is then up to the individual to progress further or not and if they decide to progress in which direction. Not everyone is lucky enough to have the resources to be able to own horses and compete and so can't, even if they had the talent, build a reputation for themselves that way. However there are many riders who will benefit from those who cannot pursue a competition career - the riding school rider, novice horse owner etc. The AI will have taught them safe working practices and horse management skills that should mean they can help and advise these riders and their horses.
Those more ambitious riders are likely to have their own horses and will look for a coach who has experience in their chosen field however from personal experience not all successful competition riders are good coaches. At this level I feel it's important to find someone you click with and it may be a case of trial and error to find the right person. That person may or not have traditional qualifications but they should hold insurance.
The UKCC has opened up a new way of becoming qualified and as it can be discipline specific has attracted many supporters, my one concern is that especially at the lower generic levels there is no horse care element and if you are teaching, say a novice horse owner, advising them on aspects of horse care may also be required.
Over the years I have gained coaching / teaching qualifications from BHS, EFI, UKCC, RDA and PC and have practical experience in producing young horses, show jumping and eventing - I have learned different things from each and they all help in my current roles none of which are high powered but are nevertheless diverse. I currently work with RDA riders with a range of difficulties, competent riding school adults, students pursuing qualifications, horse owning clients with a big range of abilities and ambitions and PC members competing at intermediate and open area level. Each group requires different skills and in general a different approach however my BHS training did give me the platform to develop these skills from. I have also been a BHS assessor and have to say the exam system has evolved over the years and efforts have been made to keep it relevant to the industry and deserves credit for this.
What I have learned over the years is that each coach will have their own individual qualities and style, regardless of their qualifications and you may have to search to find someone who suits you, if one doesn't work for you they may well be ideal for another person. For example when my son was eventing we used two flatwork trainers - one was a dressage rider who was really good and thinking "outside the box" and finding what worked for each horse as an individual, the other was a judge and was excellent at looking at things from that perspective. Taking things from each really helped and gave a better result than just working with one did.
I think what I'm trying to say in a really long winded way is coaching is a two way relationship, or three way if we include the horse, and like all relationships it can take some searching to find someone to suit you - if you're really lucky you may find "the one" early on but it's more likely you may have a few broken relationships along the way and what you require from the relationship will vary as you continue along your training path. Unlike a love life there's nothing morally wrong with having more than one coach at a time either!
ester
Not slacking multitasking
Excellent long winded summing up EM 
EventingMum
Well-Known Member
Tnavas
Well-Known Member
I think you will find that HGA-12 is referring to the worldwide famous training centres. Park Farm, Talland, Porlock Vale, Radnage, Fulmer, Crabbet Park, Patchetts Green, Suzanne's, and others. They specialised in the training of riders for the BHS exams, you could be fee paying or be a working pupil. You learnt 'on the job' with lectures, riding lessons, and tests. They were also working riding schools. All those schools mentioned trained riders right through to BHSI.
Being a working pupil meant your training was longer, you worked on the yard in exchange for your tuition and possibly board too. Fee paying students were often those from wealthy families or overseas. They had an intense training.
In these times riding was still a sport for the wealthy and many little rich girl took her AI before heading off to finishing school. Now with the advent of colleges running these courses, student loans and the like anyone can have a go. Sadly they do rather miss out on the depth of practical experience.
But finally we still must remember that the AI is just the first step in the exam system.
Leo Walker
Well-Known Member
I understand that, but its no use talking about them as if thats the training experience people have now. They dont.
Mooseontheloose
Well-Known Member
I think your friend will have had to do at least her B test before taking AH, which would have included xc.
Goldenstar
Well-Known Member
She would have to have her B to do the H.
PolarSkye
Well-Known Member
I'm a little bit confused . . . what you're describing is running a yard and all that goes with it. Plenty of people up and down the country manage to do this without any qualifications whatsoever . . . some do it well, some don't. In my mind, what really counts is knowledge, experience and willingness to learn and be open minded.
BHS (and Pony Club) qualifications have their place . . . the BHS certainly bangs the safety drum and someone certainly has to in a world where more and more non-horsey people are taking up the sport. Learning basic horse care within the BHS structure is a good start (although I wish they'd update some of their guidelines - feeding for a start). However, there's no substitute for good old fashioned experience.
As for training . . . I am much more interested in whether someone can actually share/impart knowledge in a constructive manner and with both eyes on horse welfare than whether they (or not) they have letters after their name. For years I was in the BHS system . . . I learned a lot. Then I left and learned that I had a great deal left to learn. I believe the BHS (and the Pony Club) provide a decent foundation, especially for those coming from non-horsey families. But I also believe that there is a whole world of perfectly legitimate methods of teaching and management outside the BHS.
Bottom line - I don't judge a yard owner, instructor, trainer, etc. by whether (or not) they have letters after their name - I judge them on whether they are effective horsepeople - in every respect. On the ground, in the saddle, with clients, with the horses. I really don't care whether or not people have letters after their name . . . by which I mean, it's fine by me either way . . . what I care about is whether (or not) they are good at what they do - getting the very best out of the horses and people who pay for their knowledge and experience.
P
PolarSkye
Well-Known Member
_GG_
Well-Known Member
OP - It's pretty simple...qualifications, be they early BHS or UKCC, will show people that you have passed basic levels of skill and knowledge, giving potential clients some reassurance in your abilities. That is never a bad thing.
That said, some of the best teachers I've had haven't been qualified and they knew more than the FBHS friends I have...friends who also chose to be taught by them. Being taught how to teach doesn't make someone a good teacher.
Being able to teach someone means being able to find a way for the student to understand the lesson. Sometimes different students at the same time. I have taught in the past, fully insured, didn't accept payment, but managed to, on many occasions, help students understand the mechanics of how and why...enabling them to perform correct lateral work, changes, collection...or even just how to always start rising on the correct diagonal, where they had struggled with qualified instructors for months or years. That's not blowing my own trumpet...I just understand how horses move and how riders have to open up and balance/position themselves before the standard aids as taught by the BHS can be effective. That is a slight criticism of the BHS, but a valid one because if I had a pound for every time a BHS instructor was unable to tell me why they teach a certain way, I'd be loaded by now. Some are brilliant, but that's more to do with them than their qualifications.
I guess that's a big thing that I personally look for. I want to trust that someone teaching me actually understands what they're teaching, why and how it works and that their not just teaching by numbers, telling me something works because they were told it does.
Qualifications are always going to be useful, especially teaching at lower levels, but for more talented, competitive riders, the choice of instructor comes down to the person who can most help them and their horses improve and qualifications aren't really considered.
If you're wanting to earn extra money teaching...have a think about who you want to teach. If it's children and more novice adults, qualifications will do you the world of good. If you want to teach more advanced riders, you'd probably do better to get a few clients, start teaching them and let their improved competition records prove your worth as a coach.
Above all, make sure you have full insurance and don't try to teach anything you don't fully understand yourself yet.
Good luck.
That said, some of the best teachers I've had haven't been qualified and they knew more than the FBHS friends I have...friends who also chose to be taught by them. Being taught how to teach doesn't make someone a good teacher.
Being able to teach someone means being able to find a way for the student to understand the lesson. Sometimes different students at the same time. I have taught in the past, fully insured, didn't accept payment, but managed to, on many occasions, help students understand the mechanics of how and why...enabling them to perform correct lateral work, changes, collection...or even just how to always start rising on the correct diagonal, where they had struggled with qualified instructors for months or years. That's not blowing my own trumpet...I just understand how horses move and how riders have to open up and balance/position themselves before the standard aids as taught by the BHS can be effective. That is a slight criticism of the BHS, but a valid one because if I had a pound for every time a BHS instructor was unable to tell me why they teach a certain way, I'd be loaded by now. Some are brilliant, but that's more to do with them than their qualifications.
I guess that's a big thing that I personally look for. I want to trust that someone teaching me actually understands what they're teaching, why and how it works and that their not just teaching by numbers, telling me something works because they were told it does.
Qualifications are always going to be useful, especially teaching at lower levels, but for more talented, competitive riders, the choice of instructor comes down to the person who can most help them and their horses improve and qualifications aren't really considered.
If you're wanting to earn extra money teaching...have a think about who you want to teach. If it's children and more novice adults, qualifications will do you the world of good. If you want to teach more advanced riders, you'd probably do better to get a few clients, start teaching them and let their improved competition records prove your worth as a coach.
Above all, make sure you have full insurance and don't try to teach anything you don't fully understand yourself yet.
Good luck.
Tnavas
Well-Known Member
Mooseontheloose and Goldenstar
No! At C+ the exam becomes split with the rider being able to sit Riding and HM separately.
If you pass C+ HM you can then go on and take B HM. If you pass B HM then you can move on and sit H.
What you cannot do is pass C+ Riding and move on to B riding. To sit any of the next levels of riding you have to have passed the complete exam at the lower level.
The horse management stage becomes a more important part of the exam from B onwards and Pony Club want to ensure that riders gain as much knowledge as they can. Pony Club also recognises that not everyone will have a B level horse or want to jump the B level jumps.
No! At C+ the exam becomes split with the rider being able to sit Riding and HM separately.
If you pass C+ HM you can then go on and take B HM. If you pass B HM then you can move on and sit H.
What you cannot do is pass C+ Riding and move on to B riding. To sit any of the next levels of riding you have to have passed the complete exam at the lower level.
The horse management stage becomes a more important part of the exam from B onwards and Pony Club want to ensure that riders gain as much knowledge as they can. Pony Club also recognises that not everyone will have a B level horse or want to jump the B level jumps.
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ester
Not slacking multitasking
No you've got confused. My AI friend (didn't do any pony club exams) who avoided the XC part of her stage 3 riding was trained by someone who ran a riding school and whose only stated qualification is pony club H test! That was my point on quality of training (or lack of)