The dealer that cannot be named

jhoward said:
I don't totally disagree, however the arguments so to speak will come up when people want to take it further.

If a horse is on sales livery, but has been sent on trial 3 times, paid for 3 times, sent back twice ( now still with 3rd person) but no money returned to anyone who actually owns the horse?

Who kept the passport?

If ownership wasn't transferred which regardless of a possible trial it should of been done.. what if new owner wanted to insure? Livery yards often want passports..if none of this was done it was never a true sale.
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All very good questions. The only answer I have is that for the 2 I bought, the passports did come with them in the trial period. And that for another person I know that trialled a horse, the dealer recommended she take out trial insurance which is a thing, and was very expensive.

I have removed my screenshot above of the agreement, because it contains the name of the nameless one and it would be a shame for this thread to be removed. Happy to share by PM if anyone wants it.
 
But they're all liars, right? So many different people, so many stories, but none are the truth.....according to she who shall not be named.

Apparently someone has a horse with she who shall not be named and it is going to be put to sleep today. I assume because she who shall not be named has (supposedly) filed for bankruptcy, so is clearing her stock, and also clearing stock that does not belong to her.......or she who shall not be named is using her usual manipulative techniques to make people go away and stop talking.

Awful, awful woman needs closing down for good.
 
And these are the sort of questions that will be put to people.
The police are great at side stepping facts especially where animals are concerned this is why people need to think of these things before presenting a case to them especially if a owner has sent a horse on sales livery and is trying to find it/get it back.
 
Apizz2019 said:
But they're all liars, right? So many different people, so many stories, but none are the truth.....according to she who shall not be named.

Apparently someone has a horse with she who shall not be named and it is going to be put to sleep today. I assume because she who shall not be named has (supposedly) filed for bankruptcy, so is clearing her stock, and also clearing stock that does not belong to her.......or she who shall not be named is using her usual manipulative techniques to make people go away and stop talking.

Awful, awful woman needs closing down for good.
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Apparently the horse is injured and I believe the owner is abroad and can't go and get it

If she with no name was even more awful..those horses left would be sold cheap and on the back of a lorry off across the water never to be seen again.

I really hope those with horses on sales livery manage to get them back.
 
jhoward said:
Apparently the horse is injured and I believe the owner is abroad and can't go and get it

If she with no name was even more awful..those horses left would be sold cheap and on the back of a lorry off across the water never to be seen again.

I really hope those with horses on sales livery manage to get them back.
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Yet she wanted to buy this horse for herself - cynical me doubts the horse is injured at all. It's all very convenient if you ask me.

I'd not be surprised if those remaining will be offloaded across the water. After all, that's where most of her horses come from in the first place.
 
I wonder if for a horse sold on sales livery,whether Lynn was acting as their agent and effectively holding the sales proceeds on trust for them.

I wonder if that protects their money.to.some.degree as it's not Lynn's and puts them in a different category of creditors to people who are owed money from being sold a dodgy horse

I don't think her behaviour quite fits the theft description as I don't think it would meet the 'intention to permanently deprive' requirement but surely it's obtaining money by deception.
 
If I were someone who had a horse with her, I would be very afraid. As I understand it, when someone files for bankruptcy, the premises is locked and no one can get even their own goods back. All goods are sold and the owner of goods is considered as a creditor, same as everyone else.

I was told this after someone had a saddle with someone who went bankrupt, for repair. They were technically unable to get their saddle back, as it was to be sold as 'stock.' I believe they stormed the premises, as it was also somewhere the person bankrupt lived, and retrieved it that way, but they did not have right to do so.

I was also nearly caught when one of the big carpet/sofa warehouses/shops went down. People had paid for the carpets and sofas, they were there ready to be delivered, paid for and belonging to the customer, yet they were unable to get them.

A friend worked at one and was going to sell me carpets. He was mortified when it went bust, as he'd no idea the (large) company was even in difficulty. He'd sold, even the day before, goods that were now paid for and the customer would not receive. Those who'd paid by credit card were refunded, but other payments were not. Those customers just joined the list of creditors to wait and see what %, if any, they would get back. I simply wasn't available for a few days, hence not being caught in it myself. Since then, I've always paid for large purchases by credit card!

I would certainly kick up a fuss about the horse due to be euthanised. I believe SWCBN has a duty of care to safeguard stock/goods.

I am not a solicitor and, in their case, I would be contacting one first thing!

ETA - It sounds like, because several horses were sold even when not available, as they were already sold elsewhere, and people are getting together and proving proof of that with bank statements, it is being treated as fraud. Because of that, people may get their money back from the bank, even when they haven't paid by credit card. I have no doubt that SWCBN has spent the days where she said she would refund everyone in moving money out of her accounts and into somewhere 'safe' for her.
 
Abacus said:
I have removed my screenshot above of the agreement, because it contains the name of the nameless one and it would be a shame for this thread to be removed.
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One of the staples of dodgy dealers is to create their own contracts which give you less rights that your actual legal consumer rights in law. You can't actually sign away your legal rights but people do get convinced by these contracts. Hopefully this is something that Trading Standards can use.
 
Abacus said:
I have removed my screenshot above of the agreement, because it contains the name of the nameless one and it would be a shame for this thread to be removed. Happy to share by PM if anyone wants it.
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Can you edit their name out from the screenshot and re post the agreement on here without including any personal details?
 
I've learnt I had a very lucky escape! I trialled a mare in 2022 who was not as described at all. She was meant to be anyone's ride, not phased by anything, and sadly turned out to be phased by literally everything. Terrified to be mounted, and if I did get on, felt like she was going to bolt. Shame as she was actually very sweet on the ground, but had a personality change when the lorry came to collect her, I felt terrible for sending her back.
I only had to wait 3 days for my money back, but did get several excuses in that time... her banking app was down, the bank was shut when she went into town and then she didn't know her ID for telephone banking.
She actually returned my money with an extra £100 as a 'thanks for being so patient.'
I am really devastated for all the people that may lose their money, and for those with horses in her care. I hope she gets what she deserves.
 
nutjob said:
You're still entitled to get your own horse back from sales livery to have it examined and treated by your own vet rather than getting a ultimatum from the dealer that it will be euthanised. Especially in the case that the injury has occurred at the point where the horse is no longer able to be "sold" to any more customers on the trial scheme as your business practices have been exposed on social media and you have stated that you have filed for bankrupcy.

At the very least the owner should be allowed to get a representative to go to the yard to see the horse for themselves before this character has it killed. You need to be certain that it hasn't been sold to someone and the money pocketed.
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The poor guy who owns this horse is currently in Thailand, and is tearing his hair out!
 
When I was looking last year, so many of the unnameable one's met the bill (for an aging, sometimes less than confident out of the saddle for a few years due to retired horse) at that stage all the reviews were still good, but I didn't like the buying unseen even with a trial idea and it seemed difficult to pin down a time for viewing. We thought maybe I could try a few at once as would have been a long drive for us. Reading those stories is heart breaking for the horses and people, I don't know what happened to the unnameable one that turned them from a serious and reputable seller to an agent of such misery. I hope the horses all had soft landings, and people owed get their money and go on to be as happy as I am with the horse I did end up buying, and that they are held accountable for their actions.
 
jhoward said:
But if the horse was on sale livery she didn't own it did she.
So putting it on trial was a "loan"
The horse is sold when the OWNER has the money and legal ownership has been transferred.
Which if this woman was doing correctly ownership would of been transferred at point of person paying the money. And a receipt provided.

From what I've read this never happened.
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I think only some of her stock were sales livery. I think job lots bought from sales in Ireland. Put up for sale soon after arrival without any real settling in or work put in to justify the glowing descriptions or the presumably massive profit on modest cost of buying and importing
 
Poing said:
Am I reading correctly that most people have handed money over to her for unseen horses?
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yes, pay for horse and get 2 week trial, refund if not suitable


or you could go and view the horse, but she'd make that difficult, and you couldn't then trial it afterwards.

Historically a friends Dad used to do a fair bit of transporting for her and iirc he said about half would go back at that time.
 
I believe so... you had the choice of buying unseen and having a trial period within which you could send horse back for full refund (buyer also had to pay delivery costs) or if you went and viewed, no trial and bought with standard buying a horse terms.
 
Poing said:
Am I reading correctly that most people have handed money over to her for unseen horses?
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She strongly deterred viewings, pushing the trial option. Extensive videos offered. Consumer rights for distance selling are quite robust, so most customers will have seen the trial as offering a chance to get to know the horse better than a one off trial viewing and ride, with a safety net of the return clearly agreed. Customers will have seen a glowing set of reviews and nothing on the dodgy dealers groups. It's now become evident that return from trial was commonplace and repeated, something customers genuinely didn't realise, let alone that simultaneous payments were taken and held from multiple individuals for the same horse. So yes, many buying without in person viewing. Having had some terrible experiences (and fractures) from trying horses from private sellers I'd suggest that there's no one right way to find a good horse to buy, people are just doing their best, following recommendations and reviews, and being wary. This dealer took in many experienced and sensible people. Please don't blame the victims! 😊
 
Johnny's Star said:
She strongly deterred viewings, pushing the trial option. Extensive videos offered. Consumer rights for distance selling are quite robust, so most customers will have seen the trial as offering a chance to get to know the horse better than a one off trial viewing and ride, with a safety net of the return clearly agreed. Customers will have seen a glowing set of reviews and nothing on the dodgy dealers groups. It's now become evident that return from trial was commonplace and repeated, something customers genuinely didn't realise, let alone that simultaneous payments were taken and held from multiple individuals for the same horse. So yes, many buying without in person viewing. Having had some terrible experiences (and fractures) from trying horses from private sellers I'd suggest that there's no one right way to find a good horse to buy, people are just doing their best, following recommendations and reviews, and being wary. This dealer took in many experienced and sensible people. Please don't blame the victims! 😊
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I agree. I have been one of those people. It actually worked for me, the trials were a great way to try two horses (bought separately, one for me and one for my son). I believe that back in 2022 she was perhaps more straightforward than recently. Certainly a stronger trial than when you have maybe an hour to see a horse on a dealer's yard. There are pros and cons, but her activities are absolutely not the fault of people who have been defrauded.
 
I shouldn't feel as strongly as I do about this as I've not been directly affected, however, as previously noted (comments/threads closed/removed) I have seen this play out first hand with one individual who was on the same yard as me, and with a friend who had to wait weeks for a refund which was received in dribs and drabs - the usual I'm in hospital, bank account is frozen, transfer limit etc excuses nonsense.

I stated a former employee had publicly said she who shall not be named purchased cheap from across the sea and turned them around in a few days, despite claims of horses being owned from birth, full history known etc.

Yet, almost everything single comment I made, despite on one occasion having a screenshot of a message relating to monies owed (details blanked out), was refuted and removed.

She hasnt had employees, ever.
She hasn't ever not refunded a customer.
She has never willingly delayed refunds.
She has not sold dangerous horses.
She has not sold horses with undisclosed issues, physical and otherwise.
She has not used customers money to bankroll her business.
She doesn't import horses and turn around in a matter of days.

And yet here we are, countless individuals, all with the same stories that prove each and every point made by so many of us, some luckier than others, some not so lucky and left with lifelong injuries. And there's the horses to consider. Passed from pillar to post like a tub of sweets being passed around the dinner table.

No care for animal or human alike.

The saddest thing about this is every attempt to call out this appalling (and criminal) behaviour has been shut down, endless gaslighting of complainants, and of anyone who dared to utter a single word that wasn't blowing in the direction of being positive.

She who shall not be named has thrown the slander/libel/defamation card about and everyone with the power to do so has pandered to this manipulative behaviour, when in reality truth is an absolute defence and she wouldn't get a case off the ground on this alone, much less find 150k to take it all the way. A legal professional would laugh her out of the door in any case!


I'm mad, and upset, for every single horse and person who has been affected by her appalling behaviour.

I hope she suffers. I hope she never has the opportunity to set eyes on a horse again, and I hope this follows her like a nasty smell for the rest of her life.

I'm sorry to all her victims.
I'm sorry people didn't listen.
i'm sorry you were ridiculed and shut down.

We must do better!
 
skint1 said:
When I was looking last year, so many of the unnameable one's met the bill (for an aging, sometimes less than confident out of the saddle for a few years due to retired horse) at that stage all the reviews were still good, but I didn't like the buying unseen even with a trial idea and it seemed difficult to pin down a time for viewing. We thought maybe I could try a few at once as would have been a long drive for us. Reading those stories is heart breaking for the horses and people, I don't know what happened to the unnameable one that turned them from a serious and reputable seller to an agent of such misery. I hope the horses all had soft landings, and people owed get their money and go on to be as happy as I am with the horse I did end up buying, and that they are held accountable for their actions.
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Money, money is what happened.
 
All it was is an equine base ponzi scheme.

Quite frankly anyone sending 13k over to an unknown third party for an unseen, unvetted and un tried horse, is bonkers in my view. Maybe I have been on the planet too long and don't understand modern horse buying, but the whole set up stinks, it is unbelievable the amounts of money that changed hands.
 
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