The thread of all Olympic Threads

So far we've had the olympic flag upside down, how appropriate for a distress signal,the seine pollution, and now men battering women in the boxing ring and the blasphemous opening ceremony.
 
Sanversera said:
So far we've had the olympic flag upside down, how appropriate for a distress signal,the seine pollution, and now men battering women in the boxing ring and the blasphemous opening ceremony.
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So you're a glass half full person then.

There's been lots of positives of the games.

The flag upside down, woops, embarrassing, worse things happen.

Do we know Imane Khelif was born male? I can't find anything that says they were.

I thought the opening ceremony was crap but I'm not concerned about it being 'blasphemous'.
 
Sanversera said:
So far we've had the olympic flag upside down, how appropriate for a distress signal,the seine pollution, and now men battering women in the boxing ring and the blasphemous opening ceremony.
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Not a man. She's a woman and she didn't batter anyone. She has a pretty average record and no one complained about her not being feminine enough when she got battered by the Irish boxer a few years ago.

She's from Algeria so is absolutely not transgender.

The boxing rules of weight categories tend to result in some equality across those in each weight category. That means boxing is probably the sport (where men and women compete separately) best able to ensure fairness with athletes who have a genetic condition giving them an advantage over other athletes.

ETA that doesn't mean I don't think there are some issues that sports have to face about testosterone being used as a performance enhancer vs genetic condition.
 
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Bellaboo18 said:
So you're a glass half full person then.

There's been lots of positives of the games.

The flag upside down, woops, embarrassing, worse things happen.

Do we know Imane Khelif was born male? I can't find anything that says they were.

I thought the opening ceremony was crap but I'm not concerned about it being 'blasphemous'.
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Born to intersex has lived as a woman since birth.

There are 6 types of humans according to chromosomes.

  • X – Roughly 1 in 2,000 to 1 in 5,000 people (Turner’s )
  • XX – Most common form of female
  • XXY – Roughly 1 in 500 to 1 in 1,000 people (Klinefelter)
  • XY – Most common form of male
  • XYY – Roughly 1 out of 1,000 people
  • XXXY – Roughly 1 in 18,000 to 1 in 50,000 births
See https://www.joshuakennon.com/the-six-common-biological-sexes-in-humans/

It’s really interesting. And it really isn’t binary.
 
JennBags said:
I'm absolutely loving these Olympics, I think France is doing a fantastic job.

Every time I come to this thread to join in, it moves on so quickly I can't keep up 😂 I'm quite often watching on catch up so don't want to read it as I go as I don't want to see the result. Can we do the hat trick tomorrow?
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I'm often watching on catch up too, so I make sure I stay away from this thread until I'm ready!
 
Parrotperson said:
Born to intersex has lived as a woman since birth.

There are 6 types of humans according to chromosomes.

  • X – Roughly 1 in 2,000 to 1 in 5,000 people (Turner’s )
  • XX – Most common form of female
  • XXY – Roughly 1 in 500 to 1 in 1,000 people (Klinefelter)
  • XY – Most common form of male
  • XYY – Roughly 1 out of 1,000 people
  • XXXY – Roughly 1 in 18,000 to 1 in 50,000 births
See https://www.joshuakennon.com/the-six-common-biological-sexes-in-humans/

It’s really interesting. And it really isn’t binary.
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And that's before you get to androgen insensitivity
 
YourValentine said:
She is female, she identifies as female, the IOC is satisfied she is female. End of discussion.

Any perceived genetic/medical advantage she may or may not have is no different to Michael Phelps having excellent conformation for swimming. It still takes skill and hard work to win medals.
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As much as I agree with you and I feel so terribly sorry for her, I don't think 'she identifies as female' can be used as an argument here.
 
She's a woman, but that doesn't necessary end the dialogue.
For me the issue is one of safety. In athletics this type of condition just gives a biological advantage. Being stronger, having more testosterone, better bone density etc is an advantage. In other sports it may be dangerous, if the level of strength and force attainable is disproportionate. There's a reason boxing isn't mixed. So I can see that rules may be required to ensure bouts are safe (not fair, since that's not the issue IMO).
However, I don't see any evidence that was the case here. The Italian woman got punched but not floored. The Algerian woman had previously been defeated by women, which suggests there wasn't a clear advantage. The Italian woman has previously quit part way through with another competitor, when she was losing, due to twisting her ankle. If you look at the videos it looks contrived.
 
YourValentine said:
She is female, she identifies as female, the IOC is satisfied she is female. End of discussion.

Any perceived genetic/medical advantage she may or may not have is no different to Michael Phelps having excellent conformation for swimming. It still takes skill and hard work to win medals.
Click to expand...

As much as I agree with you, Phelps wasn't punching people. There's a safety issue with boxing, but think that's a discussion for a seperate thread.
 
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YourValentine said:
the IOC is satisfied she is female.
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The IOC’s test is to look at the competitors passport.
It is down to governing bodies to dictate and enforce other standards. Unfortunately the governing body for boxing (The IBA) is russian and suspended by IOC so it defaults to IOC. Both boxers failed the IBA gender test because they have a Y chromosome.

The italian woman is an olympic boxer, she stopped the bout because she feared for her safety, after just 2 punches. Do you think she has never taken a punch? That she just waltzed up and said “sure i’ll give it a go”.

For a boxer to give up her olympic dreams after just 2 punches says a lot about the opposition and not in a a good way.

The sport is separated by sex for safety reasons not just to ensure fairness.
Its a female class, not an “anyone who isn’t male” class.
 
conniegirl said:
The IOC’s test is to look at the competitors passport.
It is down to governing bodies to dictate and enforce other standards. Unfortunately the governing body for boxing (The IBA) is russian and suspended by IOC so it defaults to IOC. Both boxers failed the IBA gender test because they have a Y chromosome.

The italian woman is an olympic boxer, she stopped the bout because she feared for her safety, after just 2 punches. Do you think she has never taken a punch? That she just waltzed up and said “sure i’ll give it a go”.

For a boxer to give up her olympic dreams after just 2 punches says a lot about the opposition and not in a a good way.

The sport is separated by sex for safety reasons not just to ensure fairness.
Its a female class, not an “anyone who isn’t male” class.
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^^^^ well summed up.

There are some excellent articles on the chromosome diseases which lead to women who have the XY chromosome but do not obviously have male characteristics. It isn't one for this thread but ultimately they are biologically male. It is usually - but not always - picked up in puberty.
 
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