Utopia to be sold at Auction with no reserve..

eahotson

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well of course he was?! my point is, that he's quite capable of sorting it out himself and getting someone else to pay livery rather than some random internet people living in cloud cuckoo land.

I take your point.Carl is a big boy and he can look after himself but the gofundme crowd.Some of them will just have cared and been desperate to do something.Unwise perhaps but not bad.
 

MotherOfChickens

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I take your point.Carl is a big boy and he can look after himself but the gofundme crowd.Some of them will just have cared and been desperate to do something.Unwise perhaps but not bad.

I guess I just don't understand the (emotional) investment in a horse that a)they have never met or maybe met in passing b) a horse that will almost certainly be looked after professionally. Or maybe they all just have more money than I do lol. My money goes on my horses and after them, it goes on charities for horses less well off. Had the crowdfunding people considered how to keep the horse rather than just purchasing him?Isnt that the first rule of owning a horse ;)
 

popsdosh

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Well if I could afford it I wouldn't mind owning Uthopia.Also minor considerations like loyalty for instance?He gave Carl his very first Olympic gold medal.Just after the Olympics his stud fee was a lot higher than £1500 and its not his fault he has barely competed since.In fact I THINK although I don't know that he was being lined up as a second to Valegro for Charlotte at Rio. Even very hard headed successful business people don't base all their decisions purely on financial profit.

I could point a few things out to you that counter your claims . The horse could easily have competed more but for CHs legal challenge to him being sold by the creditors and quite rightly they would not let the horse compete abroad. CH only dropped this challenge after it became obvious he would not be selected for RIO which realistically was his last chance at a major championship the horses value in this time has dropped to less than 10% of what it was at London how do you think the creditors feel? This whole thing has gone on for 6yrs!!!! All that time the creditors will have been picking up the bills.!. Indeed his stud fee may have been in excess of 1500 but how many mares took up that option?? 1500x0 is still zero I am afraid the only way you stay afloat with horses at any level is being hard headed im afraid.
I suspect that CH is indeed negotiating with the buyer to have the horse stay with him but I am sure that will be on a paying basis.
 
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popsdosh

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As an afterthought it is actually possible that CH may actually receive a % tage of the proceeds as I am sure he was actually listed as a creditors when it started all that time back.
 

tristar

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but young horses should be like young gymnasts, they should not be working hard they should be nursed along, at one time 11years was considered a youngster in dressage terms
 

eahotson

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I could point a few things out to you that counter your claims . The horse could easily have competed more but for CHs legal challenge to him being sold by the creditors and quite rightly they would not let the horse compete abroad. CH only dropped this challenge after it became obvious he would not be selected for RIO which realistically was his last chance at a major championship the horses value in this time has dropped to less than 10% of what it was at London how do you think the creditors feel? This whole thing has gone on for 6yrs!!!! All that time the creditors will have been picking up the bills.!. Indeed his stud fee may have been in excess of 1500 but how many mares took up that option?? 1500x0 is still zero I am afraid the only way you stay afloat with horses at any level is being hard headed im afraid.
I suspect that CH is indeed negotiating with the buyer to have the horse stay with him but I am sure that will be on a paying basis.

I have every sympathy with the creditors,some of whom may well have gone bankrupt themselves because of money owed to them by Sasha Stewart and her father and yes Carl is probably also a creditor.Apart from Carl none of the other creditors owe Uthopia a thing.Utopia was popular as a stud just after the Olympics and if he had carried on competing would still be popular I expect.If he had gone to Rio and been successful? Utopia wasn't the only thing they tried to hide by the look of it.It's regrettable but human nature to try to hang on to what you have got.Of course you have to be hard headed in any business to succeed but money can't be the sole arbiter or it all becomes very joyless. Out of curiosity how can creditors who have had no contact with Uthopia personally or financially be asked to contribute towards his keep.
 

eahotson

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Also they didn't actually market him aggressively as a stud did they?No doubt for good financial (to them at least) reasons but he kind of dropped from public attention.Charlotte rode him for a short while after the Olympics from memory and I always thought that was to show that he could be ridden by someone else so he would be more saleable after the Totilas debacle.
 

eahotson

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I guess I just don't understand the (emotional) investment in a horse that a)they have never met or maybe met in passing b) a horse that will almost certainly be looked after professionally. Or maybe they all just have more money than I do lol. My money goes on my horses and after them, it goes on charities for horses less well off. Had the crowdfunding people considered how to keep the horse rather than just purchasing him?Isnt that the first rule of owning a horse ;)

I don't think they would have owned him would they?Like you my money goes to my own animals first and then to a small number of other charities after.
 

ester

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I guess I just don't understand the (emotional) investment in a horse that a)they have never met or maybe met in passing b) a horse that will almost certainly be looked after professionally. Or maybe they all just have more money than I do lol. My money goes on my horses and after them, it goes on charities for horses less well off. Had the crowdfunding people considered how to keep the horse rather than just purchasing him?Isnt that the first rule of owning a horse ;)
That's very much my thought.
I think the intention would have been to gift the money to Carl so he could buy him though no one asked him if he wanted to keep him until his dying day.
 

popsdosh

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I have every sympathy with the creditors,some of whom may well have gone bankrupt themselves because of money owed to them by Sasha Stewart and her father and yes Carl is probably also a creditor.Apart from Carl none of the other creditors owe Uthopia a thing.Utopia was popular as a stud just after the Olympics and if he had carried on competing would still be popular I expect.If he had gone to Rio and been successful? Utopia wasn't the only thing they tried to hide by the look of it.It's regrettable but human nature to try to hang on to what you have got.Of course you have to be hard headed in any business to succeed but money can't be the sole arbiter or it all becomes very joyless. Out of curiosity how can creditors who have had no contact with Uthopia personally or financially be asked to contribute towards his keep.

When an administrator is appointed in bankruptcy they then become responsible for the upkeep of the chattel until it is disposed of and they have a responsibility in Law to settle those debts first. 6yrs will add up to a tidy bill. otherwise who else was to pay for his upkeep.
 
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Alec Swan

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When an administrator is appointed in bankruptcy they then become responsible for the upkeep of the chattel until it is disposed of and they have a responsibility in Law to settle those debts first. 6yrs will add up to a tidy bill. otherwise who else was to pay for his upkeep.

You're right in your assertions. Six years even at £5k per year would account for half the sale price, or there abouts! :)

A sad end, when we think about it.

Alec.
 

Damnation

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Biting my nails wanting to know who bought Uthopia...

I know no announcement will be made until the money has been paid and the legalities dealt with, apparently they believe the buyer to be Irish? (According to the statement issued by CH)

Regarding Heather Moffett - she always stated it was rumoured the PS had bought Uthopia, never stated it as truth which is the crux of it. The rumours didn't originate with her, she was merely saying what had been heard by her. (I was following the original thread).

It is a lesson in ensuring your privacy settings are infact private, and you never post anything you will not admit to in a court of law ;)
 

Ceifer

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I'm interested to know the full details of what Heather Moffett said. Was she misquoted?
I've been on the receiving end of her opinions before and she almost ruined my career because of her assumptions.
 

lula

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I'm interested to know the full details of what Heather Moffett said. Was she misquoted?
I've been on the receiving end of her opinions before and she almost ruined my career because of her assumptions.


was she misquoted? If you were a lawyer you'd say yes but she started the trouble by saying she had it on 'very good authority' Carl Hester had not bought Utiopia, then on the same thread she said - and i cant remember the exact words here, so someone may correct me- that she was pretty sure PS had bought him.

She implied strongly she was in the know, so when she said PS had not bought the horse people assumed, naturally, she had inside information.

Her back tracking saying she said no such thing on the British Dressage fb page while people provided screenshots of her exact words proving her wrong was rather entertaining and did her credibility no good at all in my opinion.

Sometimes HM really would be better off keeping it shut.
 

DragonSlayer

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I'm interested to know the full details of what Heather Moffett said. Was she misquoted?
I've been on the receiving end of her opinions before and she almost ruined my career because of her assumptions.

That's awful. As I said before, I couldn't believe what she was posting on here once, I was quite shocked! Glad your career wasn't destroyed!
 

GoblinPony

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All she said was she heard a rumour that PS had bought him.

No, she didn't say she heard a 'rumour'. Had she put it like that, there probably wouldn't have been all that hullabaloo. She said she had it on 'very good authority' Carl Hester had not been able to secure Uthopia, and in the following post she said she heard PS might have bought the horse. Her post was misleading because of how it was presented. It looked as if she heard the PS bit from the same trusted source.
 

9tails

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No, she didn't say she heard a 'rumour'. Had she put it like that, there probably wouldn't have been all that hullabaloo. She said she had it on 'very good authority' Carl Hester had not been able to secure Uthopia, and in the following post she said she heard PS might have bought the horse. Her post was misleading because of how it was presented. It looked as if she heard the PS bit from the same trusted source.

Didn't the charmer also suggest that someone secretly geld Uti too?
 

MotherOfChickens

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No, she didn't say she heard a 'rumour'. Had she put it like that, there probably wouldn't have been all that hullabaloo. She said she had it on 'very good authority' Carl Hester had not been able to secure Uthopia, and in the following post she said she heard PS might have bought the horse. Her post was misleading because of how it was presented. It looked as if she heard the PS bit from the same trusted source.

and as she's says herself, CH is a personal friend of hers so it's no wonder people thought she knew more than she did.
 

JanetGeorge

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No, she didn't say she heard a 'rumour'. Had she put it like that, there probably wouldn't have been all that hullabaloo. She said she had it on 'very good authority' Carl Hester had not been able to secure Uthopia, and in the following post she said she heard PS might have bought the horse. Her post was misleading because of how it was presented. It looked as if she heard the PS bit from the same trusted source.

But she didn't SAY that - everyone jumped to conclusions. If you had to type everything you put on FB after a legal look at your words, FB would die. She made a mistake - who CARES!!
 

GoblinPony

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You are right, technically she didn't say PS definitely bough Uti. However, she is a public person with a big following. She claims friendship with CH, too. One would think a person in that position would be more careful with what they put out there and how their words come across. She said she heard something from a reliable source (strongly implying inside knowledge) and then posted another update shortly after that. It led people to believe that both statements were based on information from the same source. She didn't say that the latter was a mere rumour or speculation.
 

Booboos

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OK guys I admit it, I've bought Uthopia. It's part share with Lord Lucan to keep Shergar company in retirement. I've bought an extra large freezer, let me know if you could use some semen.
 

tristar

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lord lucan is still wanted on suspicion of murder, poor shergar was stolen by gunmen from the aga khan stud, and never found, he won the derby by the longest distance in the history of the race, and thoughts always stray to him when passing the stud, not really funny.

no doubt you will be retraining uti with rollkur, as you are well known as a defender of such methods.
 
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