Vet Bashing

[teddypops]

Sister worked as a small animal vet receptionist for several years, has now started as Student Vet Nurse. If you think horse people are the worst for bemoaning the vets, try small animal practice, that'll make you question humanity somewhat!

I’ve worked in an mixed practice and an equine practice as receptionist. The horse clients were definitely worse. Most were lovely, but some of them, if you dared chase them for money they were downright nasty. And the strop some would have if I wouldn’t put up medication for them without the vet okaying it! That’s why I no longer do the job.

 

[criso]

I wonder if some of it is that it can be difficult to get to the root of some issues and resolve them. You can spend a lot of money including lots of high tech diagnostics and still not get a definitive diagnosis and a horse you can ride.

It's more difficult with animals than people to work out where the pain is and we expect a higher level of soundness in a horse than in other animals or even ourselves. That's not anyone faults but it can be frustrating for owners and vets.

 

[ester]

See I would not dream of vets x raying guinea pigs - but suppose if that's your passion you would go to the ends of the earth for a guinea pig to. Not to de rail the thread but do vets PTS guinea pigs to ?

Of course they PTS why wouldn't they? With the choice of xray or PTS straight away I am quite able to afford the cost of an xray so that we know what is going on. I wouldn't go to the ends of the earth for one.

I think re. smalls, the fact that most are now big corporate with targets with vets to meet doesn't always help the public view of them.

 

[Tiddlypom]

What I do not understand is why the constant vet bashing?

Where, on here? I don‘t see it.

We may say to someone that you are better to take your horse to horsepital for a workup from an experienced equine vet than have multiple call outs from a less specialised vet who won’t have the right expertise or equipment. The money can soon rack up and you are no further forward.

I’m always surprised at how cheap my equine vet bills are, and I’ve told my vet that - she laughed, and said that it seems like a lot of money to her! She is always trying to keep my bills down as she knows mine are not insured, although I’ve never put her under pressure to do so. I use a local equine practice with a horsepital and with 24/7 emergency cover.

 

[ester]

Oh 1 of advantage of small pets though, you can see the whole beast in one xray image

 

[milliepops]

I wonder if some of it is that it can be difficult to get to the root of some issues and resolve them. You can spend a lot of money including lots of high tech diagnostics and still not get a definitive diagnosis and a horse you can ride.

yeah and I wonder whether my positive view of the vets on the times I've run up big bills is because those horses have been insured, and so I have know the costs I was going to bear up front- the excess and monthly premiums is my bit, and the insurers have picked up the "unknown" element.

 

[meleeka]

I don’t think it’s necessarily vet bashing, more practice bashing. I’m old enough to remember when all practices were independent and they set their own charges. These day’s, certainly round here, most practices are owned by CVS and the charges have risen accordingly. It doesn’t always feel as though the vets have the interests of the horse at the forefront anymore, it’s more about squeezing every little bit of profit they can. Of course the vets have targets to hit and that’s not their fault, but it’s affected their profession and that’s not good.

I’ve had a few instances where common sense has prevailed. When I had an old dog, the vet made it as cheap as she could for me. She valued my custom and that I spend a lot of money over a long time. That vet has gone to an independent practice now, sadly too far away for me to follow, but I’m pretty sure the current crop of vets wouldn’t be able to do the same.

 

[TPO]

I "bash" previous practices because they lied, got things very wrong, changed records, screwed up insurance claims, "forgot" to book MRI before insurance ran out because their wife was ill and do I know how stressful it is looking after children, sent a vet I'd banned who then bandaged my horse so tight he couldn't put his hoof down and I'm just lucky I arrived 30mins behind her because if she had been there first thing as planned he would have stood all day like that, a vet who couldnt poultice and I was charged £15 for "application" despite using my materials and poultice was off before vet was out the drive, a vet who didnt have a clue when my horse collapsed and I had to tell her to take bloods and other basic routine tests, that I had two vet partners watch my horse separately because I knew she was lame to be told she wasnt, when I got a referral through a different practice I asked for vet records for dates of "sound" trot ups and they hadnt even bothered noting them, a few months later they put horse to sleep with "severe" navic, shut down all suggestions of options and left me with denerving as my only choice, to tell me it had been underlying at least 7mths ...you know all the times I'd had them watch her trot up.

That is just the very tip of the iceberg with two horses. There is a lot, lot more that was done wrong by three previous practices.

I pay all my bills in full, have never paid up anything, my horses are clean and well behaved for visits and I'm always polite and on time. I never cause any hassle and even when their (office) screw ups have cost me lost days in leave and ruined other plans I've never said a peep in a vain attempt to be a "good" client.

It took a lot before I complained about an atrocious vet who I had to ban from visiting my horse. However when horse was getting bi-weekly visits I allowed vets to do when suited as he was box rested and easy to handle so they asked to visit when they could. I accommodated them despite not being entirely happy at not being there ans only because of another livery I found out the banned vet had been out...well the livery and the fact that the banadgaing was so bad horse couldn't put his foot down.

I've had a horse that was shot wrong and that only happened because vet wouldnt admit they weren't happy shooting. I've had a vet tell me the cure for WLD (which my horse didnt have but they didnt seem to be familiar with hooves!) was to shoe over it like they had done with their 2yr old...

I'm paying for a service and expect to get that. I have no problem with a vet saying they don't know but instead they have often ploughed ahead with a single clue to the detriment of the horse.

Do I think some charges are excessive? Yes, I'm very familiar with the cost of poulticing materials and the % put on top via the vet is ridiculous. Current horse has a ventipulmin subscription and I can get it at almost half price (including prescription charge) cheaper online. If the vet price was even at a half way ground, I dont deny anyone making a living, I'd buy from them but saving £30 per tub adds up!

I love my current vets. I've finally found a practice who's knowledge is matched by their service. They took me on as a client when I was at rock bottom because of two, although mainly one the second was just a stop gap to get away from one, previous practices. My vet said when he sisnt have a clue what was wrong with my horse but gave me options and supported my decisions. He went out of his way numerous times for that horse and while I am beyond grateful I cant begun to explain how alien that felt.

The previous equine practice treated and spoke to me, and many others, like something they had stood in. Thankfully karma seems to be doing a good job of catching up with them.

Whilst vets are human and humans make mistakes we are paying for a service. Apparently it's ok to complain if an electrician wires something up wrong but not if a vet screws up?

There is good and bad in every profession but its certainly been my experience that bowing to the superior knowledge of the expert vet doesnt always work out.

In some cases yes I do know more than the vet because not only do I know my horses I've owned, worked and been around them for over 30yrs. Some vets have nowhere near that experience.

I read, listen, watch and try to be learning all the time. Some vets knowledge ends at the date of a textbooks last edition.

I dont know what has "inspired" this post as I havent seen unnecessary vet bashing on here. Most owners are aware of the long hours and horrendous shifts with on call duty that vets work and respect that. Heck I've had vets running late because of emergencies and not had a break so went out and bought a lunch for them, I've sent cakes, thank yous and Christmas presents. I dont do that for any other trade horsey or not!

I think holding all vets up as demi-gods is half the problem because us moronic mortals are not to question these greater beings. If owners were empowered to know their opinion matter maybe certain things would get resolved quicker for the horses sake if nothing else. Theres a thread running just now on here where the vets havent been great at all but because they are vets that's just to be ok?

I reckon we need to stop bashing anyone who dares to question a vet be it their advice, diagnoses or costs. Yes you'll always get big mouths and what not but the majority of people are just concerned owners who was the best for their animals

 

[Cortez]

A very good friend of mine has just given up his veterinary practice after more than 20 years as he just cannot take the abuse any longer. He got into the profession to help animals, not make huge amounts of money (and he hasn't). A vets' lifestyle is awful anyway, and having to deal with arrogant, rude, know-it-all owners, as well as the neglectful ones, on top was just too much.

 

[LEC]

I "bash" previous practices because they lied, got things very wrong, changed records, screwed up insurance claims, "forgot" to book MRI before insurance ran out because their wife was ill and do I know how stressful it is looking after children, sent a vet I'd banned who then bandaged my horse so tight he couldn't put his hoof down and I'm just lucky I arrived 30mins behind her because if she had been there first thing as planned he would have stood all day like that, a vet who couldnt poultice and I was charged £15 for "application" despite using my materials and poultice was off before vet was out the drive, a vet who didnt have a clue when my horse collapsed and I had to tell her to take bloods and other basic routine tests, that I had two vet partners watch my horse separately because I knew she was lame to be told she wasnt, when I got a referral through a different practice I asked for vet records for dates of "sound" trot ups and they hadnt even bothered noting them, a few months later they put horse to sleep with "severe" navic, shut down all suggestions of options and left me with denerving as my only choice, to tell me it had been underlying at least 7mths ...you know all the times I'd had them watch her trot up.

That is just the very tip of the iceberg with two horses. There is a lot, lot more that was done wrong by three previous practices.

I pay all my bills in full, have never paid up anything, my horses are clean and well behaved for visits and I'm always polite and on time. I never cause any hassle and even when their (office) screw ups have cost me lost days in leave and ruined other plans I've never said a peep in a vain attempt to be a "good" client.

It took a lot before I complained about an atrocious vet who I had to ban from visiting my horse. However when horse was getting bi-weekly visits I allowed vets to do when suited as he was box rested and easy to handle so they asked to visit when they could. I accommodated them despite not being entirely happy at not being there ans only because of another livery I found out the banned vet had been out...well the livery and the fact that the banadgaing was so bad horse couldn't put his foot down.

I've had a horse that was shot wrong and that only happened because vet wouldnt admit they weren't happy shooting. I've had a vet tell me the cure for WLD (which my horse didnt have but they didnt seem to be familiar with hooves!) was to shoe over it like they had done with their 2yr old...

I'm paying for a service and expect to get that. I have no problem with a vet saying they don't know but instead they have often ploughed ahead with a single clue to the detriment of the horse.

Do I think some charges are excessive? Yes, I'm very familiar with the cost of poulticing materials and the % put on top via the vet is ridiculous. Current horse has a ventipulmin subscription and I can get it at almost half price (including prescription charge) cheaper online. If the vet price was even at a half way ground, I dont deny anyone making a living, I'd buy from them but saving £30 per tub adds up!

I love my current vets. I've finally found a practice who's knowledge is matched by their service. They took me on as a client when I was at rock bottom because of two, although mainly one the second was just a stop gap to get away from one, previous practices. My vet said when he sisnt have a clue what was wrong with my horse but gave me options and supported my decisions. He went out of his way numerous times for that horse and while I am beyond grateful I cant begun to explain how alien that felt.

The previous equine practice treated and spoke to me, and many others, like something they had stood in. Thankfully karma seems to be doing a good job of catching up with them.

Whilst vets are human and humans make mistakes we are paying for a service. Apparently it's ok to complain if an electrician wires something up wrong but not if a vet screws up?

There is good and bad in every profession but its certainly been my experience that bowing to the superior knowledge of the expert vet doesnt always work out.

In some cases yes I do know more than the vet because not only do I know my horses I've owned, worked and been around them for over 30yrs. Some vets have nowhere near that experience.

I read, listen, watch and try to be learning all the time. Some vets knowledge ends at the date of a textbooks last edition.

I dont know what has "inspired" this post as I havent seen unnecessary vet bashing on here. Most owners are aware of the long hours and horrendous shifts with on call duty that vets work and respect that. Heck I've had vets running late because of emergencies and not had a break so went out and bought a lunch for them, I've sent cakes, thank yous and Christmas presents. I dont do that for any other trade horsey or not!

I think holding all vets up as demi-gods is half the problem because us moronic mortals are not to question these greater beings. If owners were empowered to know their opinion matter maybe certain things would get resolved quicker for the horses sake if nothing else. Theres a thread running just now on here where the vets havent been great at all but because they are vets that's just to be ok?

I reckon we need to stop bashing anyone who dares to question a vet be it their advice, diagnoses or costs. Yes you'll always get big mouths and what not but the majority of people are just concerned owners who was the best for their animals

I have a discussion with the vet if I am not happy! This year the local Equine hospital had moments of being completely rubbish. They scanned the wrong bit of the leg despite strong notes from the referral vet, then charged for it. They did a few other incompetent things that they were pulled up on. Just stuff where clearly notes had not been read and there was duplication of work. What I don't then do is post all over social media how crap they have been etc. Same as I will have strong words with my farrier if he screws up, I won't post about it as its between us. There are only certain vets I will use, but again I wouldn't dream of publicly talking about it, they might be perfectly great vets but we have strongly disagreed on something or I don't like their manner. I see it as a professional relationship and if I have an issue I take it up with the regulatory board. Not on social media.

 

[milliepops]

I have a discussion with the vet if I am not happy! This year the local Equine hospital had moments of being completely rubbish. They scanned the wrong bit of the leg despite strong notes from the referral vet, then charged for it. They did a few other incompetent things that they were pulled up on. Just stuff where clearly notes had not been read and there was duplication of work. What I don't then do is post all over social media how crap they have been etc.

i have mixed views of this. on the one hand a trial by social media is not helpful to anyone. on the other hand, it is sometimes helpful for horse owners to know that professionals screw up sometimes and it's OK to speak up about that. it's OK to question what they are doing, it's OK to be dissatisfied and to raise an issue or ask for a second opinion. those of us who are a bit backward about coming forward possibly need to be reminded of that sometimes.

 

[ihatework]

^^^ This exactly.
Vets are human. Practices are business. Mistakes happen, I’d be surprised if they didn’t.

It’s how mistakes are dealt with that is critical.

My vets thankfully, despite now being a CVS vet, are brilliant. I’ve built up a good relationship with a couple and they continue to go above and beyond for my horses. I’ve also had cause to pull the practice up on a couple of things and it’s been dealt with quickly enough and to my satisfaction.

When one of my horses went to a different vets for a specialist op, he had some post op complications and stayed for 10 days, it wasn’t on insurance and I was turning green at the thought of the bill that was mounting up. I picked the horse up and was presented with a bill for the original quote, I was gobsmacked, the complications were no ones fault and they had just written off the extra hospital stay charges.

Alongside that my regular vet spoke to the specialist a number of times despite them not getting any income from it.

I really do think most vets will do their best for their client and won’t try and rack up bills if they can help it.

 

[The Jokers Girl]

I am not a vet, but I have several friends who are vets.

What I do not understand is why the constant vet bashing? Horse owners are among the worst. I am the tightest person you can imagine when it comes to horses, and I hate paying out on vet stuff but if it needs to be done, then it needs to be done and its the cost of owning animals. I don't see plumbers or electricians getting this grief for a part being replaced and it costing £90 for 2 minutes work.

Every vet thread I read pretty much bashes vets. Is it because in the UK we have socialised medicine? I always think every time someone use the NHS they should be given a copy of how much their treatment has cost to make people far more aware and to stop abusing the system.

I do think we are going to end up with serious issues in a few years where the profession stops being attractive to people because the pay vs misery they get from people is just not worth it.

I love my vet, they get decent bottles of champagne from me because they are so wonderful. I want them to know that I appreciate their skill and their professionalism in the care of my horses.

I've only heard vet bashing where people have spent a fortune and got nowhere either because a vet had a hunch or had no idea so just tried everything with no regard for the fact someone had to pay the bill. I've never heard people bashing vets in general or for everyday bills, colic, call out for cuts, vaccinations etc

 

[Silver Clouds]

I was of the opinion that the large corporates were more likely to be money grabbing that the local independent practices, but have changed my opinion on this. The SA practice I use was bought out by CVS just over 5yrs ago, and other than the run-down building being done up nothing else has visibly changed. The staff still have the same friendly attitude, and the fees have only increased in line with inflation. the price of a few drugs has actually come down due to CVS having greater buying power.

I had used the same (independent) LA practice for the horses for years, until their prices just kept going up and up. They introduced separate charges for everything: so for an injection you paid a fee for the needle, a fee for the syringe, a fee for the gloves the vet was wearing (yes, really), a fee for the drug and a fee for actually injecting the animal, on top of the exam and call out fees. Their medication costs were 2x internet prices and at least 50% more than other LA practices in the area. This, combined with their most experienced vet leaving (and I had concerns about the ability of two of the other vets) made me change practices. I moved to a newly set-up corporate-owned practice, that is run by a vet I worked with 20yrs ago. I have been with the new practice for 4yrs and you would never know that they were corporate-owned; the prices are reasonable and the practice friendly.

I think it probably largely comes down to who runs the practice on a day-to-day basis and their ethos, rather than just whether they are independent or not. I have challenged vets when I didn't trust their judgement and have ultimately voted with my feet with two vets by refusing to have them out again, but I don't publicly rant about them. I think that on the whole fees are proportional, but there are a few practices that try it on. Having worked for both SA and LA practices in the past I think that some of the people who moan about prices have no idea of the true cost of drugs and equipment, and the ones who moan that vets are rich don't know how much they earn or how hard they work.

 

[Quigleyandme]

I have two vets in my family but I tend to agree with the posters who feel the trend towards vet practices being incorporated into large umbrella organisations has had an effect on cost as vets lose their discretion to shave what they can off the bills. The other consequence of incorporation is turnover of vets. They no longer have the possibility of a partnership so they don’t stick. It can be worrying and frustrating not to be able to form a relationship with a vet you trust as the practice cycles through a succession of them. I heard on the Victoria Derbyshire show that the suicide rate in the veterinary profession is concerning. Access to drugs, lone working, heartbroken clients, working hours, being the target of blame and anger, self-doubt, etc. My Devon vet who is self-employed was at my friend’s yard when I telephoned to tell him Quigley had died and my friend told me he cried. The world renown professor of internal medicine who tried to cure Quigley‘s sinusitis completely free of charge cried as she expressed her sorrow on the phone to me. My son told me she was completely devastated although she was in no way culpable for what happened. The bills can be high, the frustration we feel as clients can be high but the toll vets pay when things don‘t go well is also high.

 

[Pearlsacarolsinger]

Hmmm. I'm a bit torn on this one. I have always had the greatest respect for the vets I have used in the past but that has somewhat changed now after my horse went lame last November and I spent £1,500 for a non-diagnosis. I did not feel the vet I used listened to me at all and he seemed fixated on it being a tendon issue, which it wasn't. I then got a different vet for second opinion in June, went back to my original practice as the new vet couldn't do mobile xrays but asked for a different vet to come out. The result was an almost instant diagnosis and a treatment plan which means I have just been able to start hacking out in walk for the first time in 11 months, albeit after spending another £1,000.

I have spent months kicking myself for not having been more assertive with the original vet and insisting that he investigated my concerns. It has also been extremely costly at a time when money is tight because I consider the first £1,500 wasted!

So, while I haven't resorted to "vet bashing" in any shape or form, it has certainly coloured my opinions in a negative way. That said, the vet I am now using from the same practice has been excellent, takes a down-to-earth approach and I wouldn't hesitate to recommend him!

I usually ask for the specific vet that I want to see my animals in the first instance. There are some vets at my usual practice whom I have known a long time and respect as excellent clinicians, others less so. It's nothing to do with the cost of treatment, although I have been known to criticise when the computer system has sent me someone else's bill! Sadly the vets that I know best are now of retirement age, but there are some other excellent vets coming up behind them.

I do know an equestrian professional who refuses to speak to the receptionists at the practice that she uses and has the senior vet himself on speed dial. Sadly, he too is now semi-retired.

 

[jenniehodges2001]

. I don't see plumbers or electricians getting this grief for a part being replaced and it costing £90 for 2 minutes work.
.

You might do if you went on the appropriate websites/forums that cater to plumbers or electricians though. My vets are on the more expensive side of things compared to vets within the locality but they have an awful lot of diagnostic equipment and a modern surgery and on the whole I have been impressed with them, they have certainly extended the ridden life of my horses.

My vets are owned by CVS group and despite being told that everyday drugs like Phenylbutazone and Danillon would be cheaper its really made no difference in what I am charged.

However I agree strongly as others have said that my vet, like my physio, dentist and farrier are all part of a great team that keep my horses ticking over and I am happy to pay for that service. In terms of cost I have had bad experiences from a previous vet which I stopped using but I'd say a quarter of the yard use them as they are very cheap compared to mine. Then there is another vet who is more expensive than them but cheaper than my current vet and nearly the remainder of the yard is split between them and another vet practice who I deem to be too far away in an emergency to consider using. So there are four practices that are used within our yard of about 30.

 

[J&S]

My step daughter is clinical director of a small animal practice, she lives next door so we see her a great deal. Some times we listen to half an hour's worth of her stress before we can actually speak of any thing else. She is responsible for everything in the practice, the massively expensive equipment, the rotas, the hiring and firing and also operates and does consultations. All of those things plus the behaviour of certain clients can drive her to the edge! However she loves the animals and has clients who come especially to see her because of her dedication to her vocation. I know all the hours she spent gaining her qualifications, all the things she gave up to get her exams. Very luckily she has a massively supportive husband who can help by taking some of the strain with his calm nature otherwise I think she would have trouble carrying on. During lockdown she kept the practice going under great duress, almost single handed, changed the pricing structure to reflect how it had to be run and still had clients queuing up to see her.

So, there are good vets and bad vets, just as in any profession, for instance, there is a doctor in the practice I go to who I will not see. I would have to be on last legs!! There are dreadful cowboys in the building trade and i have been in a dentists chair in fear of my life. Value the good and delete the bad. Do not lump all together.

 

[Griffin]

I think opinions on vets are shaped by experiences. Like ester, I have small animals (rabbits and hamsters) and the experience that you get with them can vary a lot. I once had a vet who didn't recognise that my rabbit had calcium in her wee (it was chalky white) and tried to tell me that she had some sort of weird diarrhoea, I was able to put the vet straight but a less experienced owner may not have done. If I am paying a fully qualified vet, they should be able to recognise basic things like that.

With horses, I have had 'OK' experiences with my vets but some are definitely better than others. However, I do understand that their job is very demanding and what we see when they arrive at the yard is a tiny snapshot of the work they do that day.

 

[Esmae]

I certainly think that pound for pound the horse vets are better value for money than small animal vets. I always enquire and agree the fees before embarking on anything complicated (expensive). We are lucky with our horse vets. Very professional and skilled at what they do and we have no complaints. Small animal practice is far more hit and miss sadly. Some vets very good and others questionable and a lack of continuity can be a problem at times. However we always pay up promptly, albeit with a jokey comment about the vet's holiday in Barbados that we seem to have just paid for, on occasions. Fortunately they always laugh along with us and take it in the right spirit.

 

[Polos Mum]

There are good and bad in all professions. I lived with a number of vet students at uni, many of them qualified but are no longer vets (a good friend is an events manager) it's hard and doesn't pay that well if you can't buy in.

I've had some really awful vets (and awful plumbers too) I've seen some come in what I suspect is their own time, because they take a genuine interest.

There is a big consolidation of vet practices at the moment (large businesses buying up smaller practices). It has happened to my local practice and all the vets that were any good have left - prices have rocketed and every last breath is billed. I wonder whether this is what people are experiencing more recently, the pragmatism shown by an owner is totally different to a large corporate who have targets to meet and KPIs to report to 'head office'

 

[ester]

i have mixed views of this. on the one hand a trial by social media is not helpful to anyone. on the other hand, it is sometimes helpful for horse owners to know that professionals screw up sometimes and it's OK to speak up about that. it's OK to question what they are doing, it's OK to be dissatisfied and to raise an issue or ask for a second opinion. those of us who are a bit backward about coming forward possibly need to be reminded of that sometimes.

And sometimes people don't know what they should be doing, what questions they should be asking of their vets and what is ok and not ok.

 

[Shilasdair]

I'm at the point of thinking about changing to a different vet practice despite having been with them for years. I've had the following recent experiences;
1. Failure to send a bill out (by e-mail) then aggressively threatening me with the follow up e-mail. I've been with this practice for more than a decade and have paid bills for example £6k for colic surgery straight away. I'm unlikely to be fleeing the country for £129.

2. I asked for an emergency visit for a colic (a horse that had colic surgery in the past) and they said they were 'Too busy' and I could 'Try another practice if I wanted'. I just might.

3. Asked recently for a vaccination appointment. No 'zone day' available. Ok, fine, I'll pay. So next day booked, at 12.30am. Then endless phone calls - can he come at 10am, oh no, can he come at 11am? Ok we'll not make it for 11am. Can he come at 4pm tonight? Oh - can he come at 2pm? Oh, he's coming in 20 mins.
I said yes to all of these but was somewhat caught on the hop when I got 20 mins notice - not long enough for me to get to the yard and catch in.

4. Endless billing errors, duplications, adding mistakes. Tiresome.

I miss the old days when I had a local vet, who did everything - from mice to moose. And didn't charge vast amounts.

 

[TPO]

Rubbish at multi quotes so hope this make sense.

Regarding talking to the vets if there is a problem, trust me I tried! From that practice I definitely got the patronising "you're not a vet" dismissal. Yes I could have go elsewhere, although it was slim pickings at that time, but I just believed that I was a moron and of course they knew more and were better than me.

I've since found out that was a common theme for that practice and in recent years I know of whole commercial yards and the majority of big livery yards who have left them for that reason. They also hiked up their prices even further and that put more people off.

I dont agree with trial by social media but on the flip side how do you warn others? Theres a big thing with horses to learn from the mistakes of others to save you having to make them. If we (collective) dont talk about bad (& good) experiences how can others know so they avoid the same, often costly and heartbreaking/soul destroying, mistakes?

On the flip flip side despite my awful experiences with one main practice I never have and never would publically name them. Mainly because I dont want hit with a libel suit! If I had the money for court I would have sued them when everything came to light but 1) I didnt have that kind of money 2) how do I prove it because they had already demonstrated that they would close ranks and had changed vet records 3) no amount of money would make up for what they cost me and my horse.

It's because of people like me letting thing go, not righting wrong and not warning others that the same thing plays over time and time again. I don't know how you fix that?

I know that I'm honest and genuine but even if I was to post my bad experiences all over FB why would anyone believe me?

So I guess thats the crux of it; how do you determine what internet random is quite right to be sharing their experiences, naming names and falling on their sword to save others and who is just a loud mouth trouble maker who doesnt want to pay their bills?

On a different tangent re a vets life etc I do think that vets should specialise at uni. Fair enough a year or two of general practice but then even a split between large and small animals. I know this might impact employment options later on; especially for women who chose large animal and pregnancy as I've known a few swap to small animals at the stage in life for obvious reasons. However having had general practice vets out they just can't know it all and keep abreast of every new development from reptiles, small mammals to large etc. It is asking a lot.

The taking over of independent practices by commercial ones is another issue. I guess it could be a good thing for staff who arent vets to have structure, HR etc and maybe also for vets for whom partner would never be attainable financially?

I think most people imagine that vets make a lot more than they actually do. The average vet salary was "only" around 29-35k when there was a survey result posted a couple of years ago. That's not much at all considering the length of the degree course and the work that they are doing. Imagine what the bills would be if vets were paid what people think they are/should be!

 

[Gingerwitch]

Of course they PTS why wouldn't they? With the choice of xray or PTS straight away I am quite able to afford the cost of an xray so that we know what is going on. I wouldn't go to the ends of the earth for one.

I think re. smalls, the fact that most are now big corporate with targets with vets to meet doesn't always help the public view of them.

I did not meen PTS as in they do not euthanasie small animals but how gas, inject and how would they do a budgie ?
My sister keeps large koi and often the vets is a pointless resort as not many deal with these and transporting a sick very large fish has so many more perils, she has been distraught at the lack of what she can do on occasion and has had to dispatch in the quickest kindness way she can

 

[PurBee]

Like with all trades, there’s great examples and crooks!

Through life ive come across many excellent vets, and a few dodgy ones.

Past few years, the vets local to me, no matter what i need for minor stuff the charge is 50 euro!
To drive An hour there with dog, say, Have a quick look over and everything ok, but must charge something, so there’s suddenly a ‘lets try an antibiotic shot’ and the 50 euro charge is justified.
Travel there to pick up common antibiotics, 50 euro for 10 tablets i later find online for 80p each.
Vet travels to me to check mare and give tetanus shot - only 50 euro!

Find a 5 week abandoned kitten on the road with gummed up eyes, rush to vet, explain ive just found it on the road, Im new to the are and ask of any cat charities etc as at the time caring for it would have been a struggle due to other commitments, antibiotic shot given, 5 minutes time taken up... “sorry cant help, 50 euro’s please”.....whaaaa?!!

Making 500% profit on drugs is the crime of most vets, that i find intolerable.
I’ll happily pay for their time If they’re more focused on doing the best for the animal rather than thinking of the drug list to get into the animal to justify the exhorbitant charges.

Recently had my Alsatian husky full hysterectomy due to pyometra infection...i like this vet, he was great, as we also considered maybe rat poison caused the lack of appetite.. Dog stayed overnight and had op, picked her up next day, 380 euros. Got a free can of food! Not bad...for surgery and overnight care....she was howling when i left her, they saved her life. Their skills were essential and they charge reasonable for such rare skills.

 

[smolmaus]

I did not meen PTS as in they do not euthanasie small animals but how gas, inject and how would they do a budgie ?
My sister keeps large koi and often the vets is a pointless resort as not many deal with these and transporting a sick very large fish has so many more perils, she has been distraught at the lack of what she can do on occasion and has had to dispatch in the quickest kindness way she can

Depends on the vet and the animal. It's only recently I've come around to the realisation that injection-only is unnecessarily painful (they don't use a vein, it's into the heart with hamsters) and will in future always ask for gas first. I just wasn't aware that was an option before. In my experience (3 hamster euths) and anecdotally, most vets will do injection only unless specifically asked. My last poorly ham (big massive tumors) I enquired over the phone and they said they would gas first but she went downhill rapidly overnight and passed at home in the end.

Budgies I would guess would have to be gas but I'll defer to a budgie person. Transporting a koi for treatment sounds like a complete nightmare

 

[shamrock2021]

I feel someone made this thread to cause a stir . Like how op made made a why do people have fat horse Thread .

 

[Tarragon]

I think that any workforce that is largely demoralised, overworked and undervalued will not be at their best. It is incredible to think that their qualification is an equivalent to that of a medical doctor but that career prospects are completely different. Something has gone wrong here in the system.
I think that rural vets probably have a better time than urban vets because I feel that as a whole, rural people are more grounded with their animals, sort of a combination of a good understanding about their welfare and a more pragmatic approach to keeping animals.
I think that rural small practise horse vets are probably the best because they are animal specialists and they can get to know their clients and their animals well, so can make judgments based on criteria other than the vet textbooks.
Small animal urban vets probably have the worst deal as they are expected to have a knowledge of a huge variety of species and deal daily with people who perhaps are not that well informed. Huge generalisations here I know!
However, I do question the role that insurance plays in treatment, and I also question the changes to practises that are run by huge corporates who are not vets and who are only driven by profit margins.

 

[meleeka]

I think most people imagine that vets make a lot more than they actually do. The average vet salary was "only" around 29-35k when there was a survey result posted a couple of years ago. That's not much at all considering the length of the degree course and the work that they are doing. Imagine what the bills would be if vets were paid what people think they are/should be!

it’s interesting that there is such a difference in pricing, depending on the species being treated. Small animal vets seem to come out highest pricewise, followed by equine vets and then farm vets. All those vets have presumably done the same degrees and should he as competent in their field as each other. I think the reason farm vets are cheaper (I’ve used one quite recently and despite the practice being an hour and a half away vs my equine practice 10 minutes, the callout was £10 cheaper, as was the vets time) is that they know if they charged the same as a horse vet then farmers would vote with their feet. They have to think about costs. It’s the same as a black bucket costing £1 in B&Q but £3 in a tack shop.