Welcome, Hermosa

[spookypony]

I am feeling really sad about Gypsum tonight. She is less lame than she was a few days ago, but the weakness and deterioration in her hind end is undeniable. I am hoping she will have this summer, but I don't know. I feel like I'm in the last rounds of a losing fight.

I hope this filly wasn't a stupid life choice, and that she wlll mature into something beautiful. Her temperament is impressive, so there's that.

I'm really sad to hear about Gypsum, and hope she'll rally for a while. Re. filly, temperament is such a huge important thing! My companion pony mare is not the most athletic shape, to say the least, but her extraordinarily kind temperament suggests she'd have a secure future wherever she went (she's intended as hacking pony for friends, which she is doing admirably now), and that's so very important for a horse!

 

[shortstuff99]

I have a beautiful horse with a very difficult temperament, she is easily stressed and can't take change. I have had ugly horses with an awesome attitude, I can tell you now which one I prefer ?. Also as you get to know her she will become beautiful!

 

[southerncomfort]

I'm so sorry. Its absolutely heartbreaking watching our old friends deteriorate.

Regarding your lovely filly. It might be helpful to think of her as a project and say that you'll put maybe 6 months education in to her, and then reassess whether she is going to be right for you long term.

It's very hard to think of committing yourself to a new horse long term when you have an older horse that needs lots of care. X

 

[View]

Sorry to hear about Gypsum. Your love for her, and your determination to do right shines through everything you have written about her - and I'm sure that you will always make sure she has the right care. Echo the suggestion to think of Hermosa as a project for a few months, and then take stock in six months.

And I'm another that will take temperament over looks any day!

 

[Caol Ila]

Yeah, I guess you're not married to a horse. I had wanted a youngster for years, but now that I have one, I sort of regret not buying something that could go easily into my yard's herds, although there's no saying an adult would have managed that, or buying something I could ride, even if £3500 doesn't get you as far in terms of quality.

 

[TPO]

 

[Caol Ila]

Yeah, I saw that and I think I might know which yard that is. No 100% sure, but fairly sure. If you want some light reading, check out my thread from October/November 2019 and the COTH thread I linked to.

 

[Caol Ila]

YO tells me she is "working" on getting her husband to allow Hermosa and her buddy into a field. This apparently depends on the ground staying dry enough for farmer husband to be happy putting a couple horses on it. In the West of Scotland, the one thing you cannot bet on is dry ground.

How much time would you give it before yard shopping (again)? Another move is definitely not ideal, but neither is staying in for an indeterminate amount of time. From April 4th, she will have had no real turnout for a month. Currently, she is out 1-2 hours per day with her buddy in a paddock. It's not nothing, but I am not happy about this. YO knows that, and she's very sympathetic, but it seems like she can't really control field allocation.

The filly was spooky and all over the place today. It was blowing a gale, so I hope it's that and not her getting fed up with the lack of proper horse time.

 

[PurBee]

I guess if the husband is so precious about the land, which i do personally understand being in 3000mm rain west ireland...!....id be questioning what happens in the upcoming warmer months when youve had a week of constant rain and the land is drenched - bring horse in for a week to wait for better weather and drier land again? So if its going to be that kinda setup, out when dry, in when land is saturated and will easily poach....id be looking for elsewhere personally.

I happily wreck my land - to an extent when temps are above 10 degrees, it is always recovering then. I tried to save the land but that would mean hardly any grazing time if i waited for it to be dry!

Each spring, around now i hire a huge digger and have hundreds of tonnes of hardcore delivered, and continue extending my ‘dry lot paddock’ so the horses have safe turnout even in the most dire conditions. Its where they loaf a lot of time on their own choice as they have an open stable, drylot and hardcore tracks to fields. Id cover the whole acerage in hardcore and top with sand if i could afford it! Dealing with constantly wet land in a wet climate no matter what month it is, grows old. But id never offer livery without the drylot so your owners have to choose to wreck the land or give up livery to off-farm horses to be frank. Its just not fair on the Horses. You have my sympathy C, i’d be keeping eyes peeled. She’s young, she’ll adjust - especially in a place with more freedom. It does them good to have exposure to different environments when young and be travelling. My mare was a 1 yard horse, who hates change because she never had it - the gelding brave and loves ‘new’ stuff, as he had change especially when between 6 months and 18months old. You’ll be her ‘constant’ and that’s excellent natural ‘bonding’ opportunity, aiding ongoing handling/training.

 

[Caol Ila]

Those are very good points, Purbee. I suppose quite a lot of young horses bounce from the stud, to auctions, to sales yards or dealers, to breakers' yards, etc.

 

[PurBee]

Yes, it’s common, and the thinking that its stressful for them is because usually (in the down n dirty horse-trade scenario) theyve passed quickly to different handlers with differnt ways of handling them, as well as surrounded by different horses without chance to herd bond, so sometimes these changes are a lot to process for them, but in your scenario, the handler, you, will remain constant....and she’s not going from one yard full of stressed young horses to another stressful horse ‘dealer’ trade stablishment.
Fingers crossed for you, and gypsum too. I love her name - is she a salt of the earth kinda horse? ?

 

[Caol Ila]

Gypsum is sound (ish...as much she can be these days), so I'm having her turned out again. At least that's good news.

I guess it would be no worse than my filly's distant relatives ending up at an auction and/or a dealer's yard in Spain, then on a truck, then at a dealer's yard here.... And that must surely happen a lot because many PREs are imported.

 

[Caol Ila]

I also feel like I would acting like a bit of a dick to the YO, who is a very nice person. I know my horse's welfare comes first. But it goes back to my initial question.... At one point do I tell her (as diplomatically as possible), This isn't working. Another week? Two?

 

[CanteringCarrot]

I don't think it's a dick move to be like..

I really appreciate your efforts and find you and your yard to be lovely, but it is very important to me that my filly is out on a field all the time/for the majority of her day. I know it's out of your control, and I hoped that they'd be out sooner. Unfortunately I am going to have to move her.

I mean, you were under pressure to move her from the last place so that she would at least be outside in some way. This looked like a good option and you were initially under the impression that the field would be open sooner. If you find some place that is ideal/definitely offers what you want, then I would do it so I could sleep better at night ? but only if I found another place and was dead certain.

I do agree that turnout is important, especially for young horses.

 

[PurBee]

What impression were you given about the new place? That you would have turnout for the youngster? Afterall that was the issue with the last place.
If theyve basically conned you into thinking youll have turnout then youve moved there and youre told “oh the field is too wet at the moment for turnout, maybe next week” - then i’d immediately say “i was hoping for turnout, you told me it would be available, she’s young and really needs turnout, its been x weeks now so im going to have to look for a place with immediate turnout”
Maybe that will spur them into making it available?

You said shes getting a couple of hours paddock time with her buddy- is there any way that time can be extended? Why is it only short stints?

 

[Caol Ila]

It's only short stints because the paddock gets rotated around all the horses. So each one only gets an hour or two. If they'd built four or five paddocks instead of one, they would have a really good set-up for winter. There are between 8 and 10 horses at the place.

 

[holeymoley]

View attachment 68844

That sounds good

 

[Caol Ila]

That sounds good

I know it does, but if it's what I think it is, it would just add the epic drama of fall 2019 to the drama of 2021. Like I told TPO, you could probably unearth my thread about that clusterfkuc.

 

[Jellymoon]

If I were you, I would probably grit my teeth and hang in there for the better weather and more turnout, which must surely be soon. Keep on at the YO to put pressure on her OH. I probably wouldn’t move her again so soon. I know it’s not ideal, and I completely sympathise, btw, with that ‘what have I done?’ feeling. I think I’ve had that with every new horse! ESP the young ones.

 

[Caol Ila]

You're probably right, Jellymoon. One of my friends from uni (in the US) said that everything near her gets a couple hours of turnout per day, regardless of age, because that's life in suburban America. They survive.

I constantly ask myself if I did the right thing. I sometimes look at my friends' cob. He goes in any field; he's easy and forgiving to handle; he hacks anywhere; he's not the pinnacle of equine athleticism and he will never do a piaffe. But he's fun and he makes his owners very happy. I could have had one like that. But after a moment of thinking, "I could buy something actually built for collection, instead of the series of quarter horses and draft crosses I have forced into a dressage career," I bought the Andalusian I could afford, which was a 2-year old.

 

[Roasted Chestnuts]

Turnout was so important to me that I have Faran 30mins drive from my house and from my work. I’m driving 40miles a day for work and horse, never have I done that. The yard has everything I need hay and straw on site, fabulous outdoor school and lovely indoor stables and more importantly all year turnout. In winter it’s out daily and in at night but they will be going out shortly 24/7 until October.

Farmer sets aside a geldings field and a mares field in winter for turnout. In summer we all have fields to our our horses in. We all share fields usually from pairs to 4/5 per field.

I wouldn’t stay somewhere I didn’t have daily turnout. Farmers are precious about their land. I would find somewhere else if I could, if they go out before you do great, if not then I’d leave.

 

[Caol Ila]

This yard was never going to be long term accomodation. I just needed somewhere to put her now, because of all the faff at Gypsum's yard. Ideally, she would go back there, and they have excellent winter turn-out provided you can safely integrate your horse into the big herds. So that's the hurdle to jump at some point (hopefully without jumping any more actual fences). And it's close to where I live, unlike 99.9% of other yards.

Don't suppose your yard is near Glasgow, Cheeky Chestnut?

 

[Roasted Chestnuts]

https://www.facebook.com/100003294335698/posts/3778568348929606

Is this close to you? New apparently?

 

[Roasted Chestnuts]

This yard was never going to be long term accomodation. I just needed somewhere to put her now, because of all the faff at Gypsum's yard. Ideally, she would go back there, and they have excellent winter turn-out provided you can safely integrate your horse into the big herds. So that's the hurdle to jump at some point (hopefully without jumping any more actual fences). And it's close to where I live, unlike 99.9% of other yards.

Don't suppose your yard is near Glasgow, Cheeky Chestnut?

Hmmmm I wouldn’t say that close to Glasgow. Airdrie area so I’d say slap bang in the middle of Glasgow and Edinburgh ?

It’s on the other side of the Dunsyston Forest near where you Liveried years ago ?

 

[Caol Ila]

Is the world that small?

To be honest, that yard near Dunsyston was not a desperate drive from the West End. It was closer than the one I moved to after I was in Airdrie, and it's probably less of a mission than where my filly is now.

That one in Cumbernauld isn't desperate, either. It's definitely worth a look.

 

[Roasted Chestnuts]

Is the world that small?

To be honest, that yard near Dunsyston was not a desperate drive from the West End. It was closer than the one I moved to after I was in Airdrie, and it's probably less of a mission than where my filly is now.

That one in Cumbernauld isn't desperate, either. It's definitely worth a look.

Only thing is where I am right now is pure DIY. No services offered at all. YO gives you your hay and straw but nothing else gets done for you that’s no maintenance. Not horsey he’s a Farmer. Suits me as I love DIY and my friend and I split mornings and evenings for turnout/bring in in winter.

 

[TPO]

Is the world that small?

To be honest, that yard near Dunsyston was not a desperate drive from the West End. It was closer than the one I moved to after I was in Airdrie, and it's probably less of a mission than where my filly is now.

That one in Cumbernauld isn't desperate, either. It's definitely worth a look.

I'd do a wee fb stalk of the people attached to the Cumbernauld yard first. It may or may not be a fit for you.

 

[brighteyes]

I can't wait for this to be a funny story rather than a huge hassle.

The filly went out with 'nanny mare' today in the arena. YO sent a video. They look calm and happy. Hopefully they'll graduate to the field in the next couple days.

While talking to people during this clusterfkuc, it has struck me that everyone is obsessed with horses having the lushest pastures possible, hence the drama with 'not enough turnout' or 'not enough grass.' But while a horse like Gypsum needs the lushest pasture possible, a lot of these British natives (and PREs) definitely do not. They are much healthier on rougher grazing. People seem genuinely baffled by this revelation. How is this not common knowledge?

New to this thread and am sitting here, opening and closing my mouth like a stranded fish. I have my own place and NONE of mine graze together. They are all in adjacent paddocks, split by electric fencing and I have had zero injuries' inflicted by the 'characters'. How is this not the obvious solution?

And as to the 'rubbish' grass is the best grass thing, look at all the obese and laminitic ones we have because owners really do not have the basic knowledge of nutrition. That combined with the inherited predispositions to metabolic disease and PPID.

Most livery clients have no clue about land management either. It's a precarious business at best with the vagaries of our weather and many are outraged if the fields don't open on the day of pronouncement because there was a deluge on the preceding five days... Or 365 turnout, you know because fields repair themselves overnight. I'd be unhinged by uncleared fields, too, and worming schedules and herd dynamics being constantly upheaved.

Finally, I had a VERY nasty gelding because he was herd leader - a very stressful position - who settle immediately he left to be part of an established herd and was relieved (literally!) of his duties as field manager!

Now I will finish reading the thread...

 

[brighteyes]

For some people what’s their fields look like is more important than how good they are for horses

Aye, but with effort both can be achieved!

 

[brighteyes]

I reckon that either the fields look well, or the horses look well, but very rarely do the two coincide.

Sheep, on the other hand... though sheep only want to escape or die, so preferably someone else's' sheep.

Is what I do - from another ex member on here.

Oh yes it’s definitely about how they look. They’re mad on fertilising too. If it’s not green enough then boof, horses off right away!

Our natives were evolved to survive off the moors with heather,gorse, thistles etc etc not fields of just grass.

Most people have forgotten this. Farmers have a hard time understanding they don't need feeding like meat of dairy cattle.

I'm not a fan of grass! A good space to roam around and have a pick here and there seems the best way for mine.

It's the very devil, isn't it!

Mine are already on a track system for summer. I’m hoping they murder the grass the moment it emerges. Spanish and Araby ones here. The Araby one can look at a blade of grass and expand.

Lol!

The yard staff at Gypsum's yard don't seem to be speaking to me at the moment. That's cute. I can't figure that one out. I did what you fkucking wanted -- I got my baby horse out of your hair.

Livery people can be very strange.

I guess if the husband is so precious about the land, which i do personally understand being in 3000mm rain west ireland...!

Each spring, around now i hire a huge digger and have hundreds of tonnes of hardcore delivered, and continue extending my ‘dry lot paddock’ so the horses have safe turnout even in the most dire conditions. Its where they loaf a lot of time on their own choice as they have an open stable, drylot and hardcore tracks to fields. Id cover the whole acerage in hardcore and top with sand if i could afford it! Dealing with constantly wet land in a wet climate no matter what month it is, grows old. But id never offer livery without the drylot so your owners have to choose to wreck the land or give up livery to off-farm horses to be frank. Its just not fair on the Horses. You have my sympathy C, i’d be keeping eyes peeled. She’s young, she’ll adjust - especially in a place with more freedom. It does them good to have exposure to different environments when young and be travelling. My mare was a 1 yard horse, who hates change because she never had it - the gelding brave and loves ‘new’ stuff, as he had change especially when between 6 months and 18months old. You’ll be her ‘constant’ and that’s excellent natural ‘bonding’ opportunity, aiding ongoing handling/training.

Stop permanently wrecking your ground and get Mudcontrol mats!!!