Mrsjackson161
New User
Yes I think I have got muddled up. I am towing with a 2003 freelander 2.0 diesel and a HB506 trailer
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ROG
Well-Known Member
Trailer plated MAM is 2600 so would need to be down plated to 1450 via contact with IW
Do you need to load more than 530 in total weight into the trailer ?
Mrsjackson161
New User
No the horse is about 450/500
ROG
Well-Known Member
OK to to down plate and use it for B towing
Can be up-plated at a later date should the need arise
JenHunt
Well-Known Member
a different sort of a question....
we currently tow an old wooden ward trailer (with extra thick floor boards), c. 1500kg empty with a Merc M380 (very fuel thirsty, and coming to the end of its life) to carry 2 big horses (650 and 680kg) who don't travel/fit well in an Ifor 511 (one is too wide, the other is too long).
We are looking at the options for as and when the vehicle does get to the end of its life...
What would people advise? All drivers have B+E or are exempt having passed their test in the 70s. Only doing a max of 3000miles a year with horses. Trailer is currently stored under cover, and so would any replacements be.
Not averse to getting a small van type box, but feel it would be cheaper to get a second hand 4x4 and lighter weight trailer for the mileage we do.....
we currently tow an old wooden ward trailer (with extra thick floor boards), c. 1500kg empty with a Merc M380 (very fuel thirsty, and coming to the end of its life) to carry 2 big horses (650 and 680kg) who don't travel/fit well in an Ifor 511 (one is too wide, the other is too long).
We are looking at the options for as and when the vehicle does get to the end of its life...
What would people advise? All drivers have B+E or are exempt having passed their test in the 70s. Only doing a max of 3000miles a year with horses. Trailer is currently stored under cover, and so would any replacements be.
Not averse to getting a small van type box, but feel it would be cheaper to get a second hand 4x4 and lighter weight trailer for the mileage we do.....
ROG
Well-Known Member
I cannot help with vehicle options so you may be better to post a seperate thread on the site or perhaps take a look at the bottom link in my signature below
catherine22
Well-Known Member
ROG, Would I be able to tow this set up (Pajero and 510) empty - for example to take it to be serviced or would that still be over?
ROG
Well-Known Member
OVER as it is the plated weights which determine what licence is needed not actual weights
KdyK
New User
Hi ROG,
wonder if you can help me. I'm in the market for a 4x4 and trailer. I have not decided on either yet, I would just like to try and get my head around what the rules and regs are so I don't have to ask you every possible combination!!
So far what I have gleaned from skimming this thread is:
* Trailer MAM (5) must not exceed Unladen weight of the Car (2) [is this correct? All the trailers I've seen have MAM around 1900-2400kg, but the unladen weights of all the cars (I have a spreadsheet!) are anywehere from 1490kg(Skoda Yeti) to 1780kg (Hyundai Tucson)]
* GVW of the Car (3) + Trailer MAM (5) cannot exceed 3500kg for a B License [currently all I hold, but I am not against saving up to get my B+E in the future]
Anything else I should be looking at? (Beyond obviously not towing more than the car legally can!!!)
I am so far looking at variations on the Sportage, Qashqai, X-Trail, Tiguan (surprisingly meaty!), Tucson and Yeti. Any other suggestions? Needs to be relatively civilised on fuel as I will most like use it as my main car and I drive ~60miles a day!
Thanks in advance for any help!
wonder if you can help me. I'm in the market for a 4x4 and trailer. I have not decided on either yet, I would just like to try and get my head around what the rules and regs are so I don't have to ask you every possible combination!!
So far what I have gleaned from skimming this thread is:
* Trailer MAM (5) must not exceed Unladen weight of the Car (2) [is this correct? All the trailers I've seen have MAM around 1900-2400kg, but the unladen weights of all the cars (I have a spreadsheet!) are anywehere from 1490kg(Skoda Yeti) to 1780kg (Hyundai Tucson)]
* GVW of the Car (3) + Trailer MAM (5) cannot exceed 3500kg for a B License [currently all I hold, but I am not against saving up to get my B+E in the future]
Anything else I should be looking at? (Beyond obviously not towing more than the car legally can!!!)
I am so far looking at variations on the Sportage, Qashqai, X-Trail, Tiguan (surprisingly meaty!), Tucson and Yeti. Any other suggestions? Needs to be relatively civilised on fuel as I will most like use it as my main car and I drive ~60miles a day!
Thanks in advance for any help!
ROG
Well-Known Member
* Trailer MAM (5) must not exceed Unladen weight of the Car (2) [is this correct? = NO as that rule was revoked on 19/01/2013 so you can ignore all the unladen weights
For B licence towing you need the vehicle GVW added to the trailer MAM not to exceed 3500kg so the lower the vehicle GVW the greater the trailer MAM can be
GVW and MAM mean exactly the same thing = the maximum something can legally be when fully loaded
I am not very up on various vehicle suggestions apart from one which is the Skoda Octavia 4x4 as it seems to cover all the bases from towing to commuting and along with a lightweight trailer such as a Bateson Derby, down plated via contact with manufacturer, so the set up makes for a good B licence combo
Octavia GVW = about 2100
Derby MAM 1400 (down plated from 1700)
Leaves 725 for the trailer load
KdyK
New User
Thanks ROG. It's such a minefield when trying to do the right thing!
So if I had a Yeti with a GVW of 2130kg, I would have 1370kg to play with as a trailer MAM (almost OK with your Derby example!)? To stick on a B license? Like I said, happy to do my B+E but it's a longer term plan, would like to be able to transport somehow sooner rather than later
I'd only be taking my ISH at ~550kg or my youngster anyway, neither together, certainly not yet!The octavia unfortunately leaves me with the problem that I need something beefier for the roads, the samller cars are struggling both suspension wise and too much waterwise, but good to know what I can go on!
Thanks again!
ROG
Well-Known Member
You got it !Thanks ROG. It's such a minefield when trying to do the right thing!
So if I had a Yeti with a GVW of 2130kg, I would have 1370kg to play with as a trailer MAM (almost OK with your Derby example!)? To stick on a B license? Like I said, happy to do my B+E but it's a longer term plan, would like to be able to transport somehow sooner rather than later
With something like a HB401/3 it could be down plated from 1600 to 1370 and as its 780 empty that would leave 590 for the trailer load
KdyK
New User
Fabulous ROG, thank you!
One final question, then I'll leave you alone. How do you find out what each trailer can be down plated to? Is it a question of contacting the various companies and asking?
Was hoping I would be able to hire for a bit of this year, but probably not if I will need to down plate to stay within my license. Another goal!
ROG
Well-Known Member
The trailer manufacturer is the only place where a trailer under 3500 kg MAM can be legally down plated so hiring one is unlikely to be an optionFabulous ROG, thank you!
One final question, then I'll leave you alone. How do you find out what each trailer can be down plated to? Is it a question of contacting the various companies and asking?
Was hoping I would be able to hire for a bit of this year, but probably not if I will need to down plate to stay within my license. Another goal!
Chloeap
Well-Known Member
Hi I am trying to work out whether I would be able to tow with my Peugeot 407.
Any help is appreciated as I'm finding it all so confusing!
I have a B licence (passed my test in 2011) and kerb weight of car is 1635kg
I can't find some of the other info needed but found the braked towing weight is 1600 kg (not sure if this is relevant?!!) sorry I'm new to this!
I don't have a trailer yet so open to suggestions - but would probably look for a single horse trailer and think i might need to down plate it?! Help!
Thank you in advance!
Any help is appreciated as I'm finding it all so confusing!
I have a B licence (passed my test in 2011) and kerb weight of car is 1635kg
I can't find some of the other info needed but found the braked towing weight is 1600 kg (not sure if this is relevant?!!) sorry I'm new to this!
I don't have a trailer yet so open to suggestions - but would probably look for a single horse trailer and think i might need to down plate it?! Help!
Thank you in advance!
ROG
Well-Known Member
which 407 model ?
GVW or maximum permissible mass is on the V5 keepers document and is the top of four figures on the weight plate usually hidden under the bonnet or in a door frame ...... I need the GVW before going any further
greeneyebrow
New User
Hi, I am new to the forum and I am after some advice. I have asked the question on other forums but haven't had a clear answer with regards to law.
My wife is wanting to buy a small horse box and we need to know if we can use out mpv to tow it with.
Our motor is a Nissan Elgrand, 2003 model E51. it is a JDM model and has no GTW on the vin plate or on the log book.
Nissan japan say they never issued weights for towing as they never homologated it for towing.
Watling towbars sell a towbar for this model and claim that type approval doesn't apply to a JDM which is fair enough, it doesn't, but how can you tow with a car if the manufacturer doesn't issue towing weights? How would you calculate the towing limit? Surely as soon as the train weight goes over the MAM of the Elgrand 2570KG you will be overweight? or have I got it all wrong?
I cannot seem to find anything online to verify this, the DVLA and the DVSA seem to either miss understand or just don't know.
Many thanks in advance to anyone that knows the legal position regarding this.
Rob and Kerry
My wife is wanting to buy a small horse box and we need to know if we can use out mpv to tow it with.
Our motor is a Nissan Elgrand, 2003 model E51. it is a JDM model and has no GTW on the vin plate or on the log book.
Nissan japan say they never issued weights for towing as they never homologated it for towing.
Watling towbars sell a towbar for this model and claim that type approval doesn't apply to a JDM which is fair enough, it doesn't, but how can you tow with a car if the manufacturer doesn't issue towing weights? How would you calculate the towing limit? Surely as soon as the train weight goes over the MAM of the Elgrand 2570KG you will be overweight? or have I got it all wrong?
I cannot seem to find anything online to verify this, the DVLA and the DVSA seem to either miss understand or just don't know.
Many thanks in advance to anyone that knows the legal position regarding this.
Rob and Kerry
ROG
Well-Known Member
They only way is to contact Nissan UK https://www.nissan.co.uk/customer-service/contact-us.html
greeneyebrow
New User
Thankyou very much for the speedy reply.
Nissan UK state that as it is a JDM I would have to contact Nissan Japan on postoffice@nissan.co.jp who sent back the reply about them not homologating the Elgrand for towing hence no weights were issued.
Nissan UK state that as it is a JDM I would have to contact Nissan Japan on postoffice@nissan.co.jp who sent back the reply about them not homologating the Elgrand for towing hence no weights were issued.
ROG
Well-Known Member
I know little on this type of law but I seem to remember that if no GTW is shown then no towing can be done with it - BUT NOT SURE
greeneyebrow
New User
Thanks again for the prompt reply. It seems a very grey area and with tow bar manufacturers happy to produce tow bars it could lead people into a whole heap of trouble, possibly, it id very difficult to find someone at the DVSA who knows the rules.
I am wondering wether to rock up at a vosa weighbridge with the motor and see what they say there.
Thanks again..
I am wondering wether to rock up at a vosa weighbridge with the motor and see what they say there.
Thanks again..
Molly_Magic
New User
1 - Pre - 1997 licence
2 - 1678
3 - 2200
4 - 2200
5 - 2340
6 - 905
I currently tow one small pony <500kg. Am interested in what additional weight I could tow.
Many thanks in advance
2 - 1678
3 - 2200
4 - 2200
5 - 2340
6 - 905
I currently tow one small pony <500kg. Am interested in what additional weight I could tow.
Many thanks in advance
ROG
Well-Known Member
You can load a max of 1295 into the trailer (2200 towing capacity minus 905 empty trailer = 1295)
Joyous70
Well-Known Member
ROG
I have a quick question if you don't mind?
I have a Nissan X trail, which I use for towing max towing capacity 2000kgs
Am I right in thinking that I am breaking the law if the maximum weight of the trailer fully laden exceeds my vehicle's towing capacity even if I am not towing up to the full weight?
Thanks in Advance
I have a quick question if you don't mind?
I have a Nissan X trail, which I use for towing max towing capacity 2000kgs
Am I right in thinking that I am breaking the law if the maximum weight of the trailer fully laden exceeds my vehicle's towing capacity even if I am not towing up to the full weight?
Thanks in Advance
ROG
Well-Known Member
Joyous70
Well-Known Member
Thanks ROG I will be back later with some more questions as I am looking at different trailers.
I will be back later with some more questions as I am looking at different trailers.
ROG
Well-Known Member
that link did not go directly to the post so .....
There is no law or rule which states that the towing capacity of a vehicle must be able to accommodate a trailer plated MAM but there are plenty of internet myths on this
This is legal
B+E licence
vehicle towing capacity 2000
trailer plated MAM 3500
trailer empty weight 1000
trailer loaded with 1000
There is no law or rule which states that the towing capacity of a vehicle must be able to accommodate a trailer plated MAM but there are plenty of internet myths on this
This is legal
B+E licence
vehicle towing capacity 2000
trailer plated MAM 3500
trailer empty weight 1000
trailer loaded with 1000
Joyous70
Well-Known Member
ROG
Well-Known Member
Hi folks can some smart cookie help me out?
I have a Kia Sportage 1.7 and am wondering if I can legally tow without B+e as I passed my test in 1999
Gross weight 2000kg
Max trailer load braked 1400kg
I want to tow an ifor Williams single trailer at 767kg + horse no more than 550kg
Is it possible & legal?? I will only be going to local events so max 30 mile journeys once per month. If you need any other vehicle stats I can give them too you if it helps work it out
Car GVW 2000 ???? are you certain that is the 'maximum permissible mass' on the V5 keepers doc or the top figure of 4 on the weight plate usually hidden under the bonnet or in a door frame ????
ASSUMING 2000 is the correct GVW then contact IW and they will guide you through the down plating from 1600 to 1500
With the trailer at 1500 MAM but the towing capacity at 1400 means that a max of 633 can be loaded into the trailer (767 + 633 = 1400)
2000 vehicle GVW + 1500 trailer MAM = 3500 = legal for B licence towing
pinkypug1
Well-Known Member
I got the 2000 from the online specs of the vehicle not under the bonnet. Is 2000 low or high?? Will have a look there later. Mare is def below 600kg