ROG
Well-Known Member
With B+E as you have simply follow these rules - Do not go over the ....
GVW of the vehicle
Towing capacity of the vehicle
MAM of the trailer
Doing those will also keep you within the GTW
Welcome to HHO Towing Clinic
- Thread starter tallyho!
- Start date
With B+E as you have simply follow these rules - Do not go over the ....
GVW of the vehicle
Towing capacity of the vehicle
MAM of the trailer
Doing those will also keep you within the GTW
Tosca123
New User
Thank you ROG, this has helped a lot
Pixie88
Well-Known Member
Hi Rog,
I have a 401h mare and foal trailer. I will be getting it down plated so I can legally tow it, but I am struggling to decide on a car to tow it. Do you know any from this that will let me use the combo? I can't seem to find the gross weight of the 07 plate kia sportage, do you know it? I have also considered the Nissan x trail (although it feels huge) would either of them be legal?
I know i can use a freelander up to 05 plate. I am just wary of all the horror stories. Also I have been told the kerb weihts has to match the laden weight of the trailer but it is the gross that we use for total car + traile. Can you re confirm this?
I had it all set in my head as I was getting a freelander and knew my weights but I am doubting myself now I am looking at others.
Edit: I have a B license
Thanks!
I have a 401h mare and foal trailer. I will be getting it down plated so I can legally tow it, but I am struggling to decide on a car to tow it. Do you know any from this that will let me use the combo? I can't seem to find the gross weight of the 07 plate kia sportage, do you know it? I have also considered the Nissan x trail (although it feels huge) would either of them be legal?
I know i can use a freelander up to 05 plate. I am just wary of all the horror stories. Also I have been told the kerb weihts has to match the laden weight of the trailer but it is the gross that we use for total car + traile. Can you re confirm this?
I had it all set in my head as I was getting a freelander and knew my weights but I am doubting myself now I am looking at others.
Edit: I have a B license
Thanks!
Last edited:
ROG
Well-Known Member
Kerb weight rule was revoked on 19/01/2013
KIA GVW = http://carleasingmadesimple.com/business-car-leasing/kia/sportage/gross-vehicle-weight/
NISSAN XTRAIL GVW = http://carleasingmadesimple.com/business-car-leasing/nissan/x-trail/gross-vehicle-weight/
Select your exact model for the GVW from those links then
PS - cannot find a 401h mare + foal trailer - who makes that ?
Pixie88
Well-Known Member
Sorry hb 401 that was a typo. It's the ifor one.
Ah, fantastic. So I could also get a suzuki vitara. You have just made my day!
I will check the make and model. I couldn't find that part of the page when I tried it was just showing the 2016 models.
Ah, fantastic. So I could also get a suzuki vitara. You have just made my day!
I will check the make and model. I couldn't find that part of the page when I tried it was just showing the 2016 models.
ROG
Well-Known Member
HB401 is a single horse trailer and are usually plated at 1600 MAM being just under 800 empty so I need to know the weight you need to put into the trailer ?
Once I have that weight we can work backwards to find the max GVW for a vehicle
Pixie88
Well-Known Member
My boy is about 550kg.
ROG
Well-Known Member
OK so we have just under 800 + 550 + say 50+ for bits and bobs = 1400
Down plate trailer from 1600 to 1400 via contact with IW leaves a max GVW of 2100 for the vehicle
Pixie88
Well-Known Member
Fab. That is what I had worked out, but I had got to the point my mind was like mush. Thank you. Xx
ROG
Well-Known Member
Have a look at the Skoda Octavia 4x4 with a GVW of 1998 = IDEA ?
SuperCat007
Well-Known Member
Hi, another question from me... I had my first towing lesson and the instructor said that the MAM of the trailer CANNOT exceed the towing capacity of the car, irrespective of the load you're carrying (since the 2013 law changes). Meaning (due to the type of car I intend to get) I still have to down-plate. However, he referenced some flow charts and guidelines which I can't find anywhere. I've done numerous Google searches and came up with nothing.
Apparently, due to the utter confusion over towing laws, if the police pull you over they'll check the plate on the trailer, the MTC of the car and if the trailer exceeds this they'll try to fine you, irrespective of the unladen weight or what you're towing in the trailer. (This could be area specific, I don't know, but apparently VOSA have given police the authority to do this, even though it doesn't seem to conform with the actual law about towing...). Any advice, links to sites, etc etc anyone?
Apparently, due to the utter confusion over towing laws, if the police pull you over they'll check the plate on the trailer, the MTC of the car and if the trailer exceeds this they'll try to fine you, irrespective of the unladen weight or what you're towing in the trailer. (This could be area specific, I don't know, but apparently VOSA have given police the authority to do this, even though it doesn't seem to conform with the actual law about towing...). Any advice, links to sites, etc etc anyone?
ROG
Well-Known Member
TOTAL RUBBISH
If anyone says that to you ask them to prove it by quoting what law under the RTA that comes ...... they will not be able to because there is no such laws
I would really like you to post a link to your instructors site please
This is 100% legal - car towing capacity 2000 towing a trailer plated at 3500 being 1000 empty and loaded with 1000
If that was illegal then as the weight laws refer to all vehicles even LGVs then LGV trailers would need up and down plating many times a week!
Laws on towing are simple - do not exceed ....
GVW of vehicle
MAM of trailer
Towing capacity of vehicle if one is listed
GTW of the combination
How some cannot get their heads around that is beyond me .............
SuperCat007
Well-Known Member
Thanks, so I haven't missed something vital here?
Knowing the police (especially around here), what he said may well be true that they'll go on the max towing capacity and plated weight of the trailer. But as long as I am still within the law I am more than happy to argue it, I've even had an argument with a police officer around here about the speed limit on a road, he said it was 40 mph, it's clearly signposted as 30 when you pull onto the road!
Knowing the police (especially around here), what he said may well be true that they'll go on the max towing capacity and plated weight of the trailer. But as long as I am still within the law I am more than happy to argue it, I've even had an argument with a police officer around here about the speed limit on a road, he said it was 40 mph, it's clearly signposted as 30 when you pull onto the road!
ROG
Well-Known Member
No need to agrue with the police - just ask what specific weight law has been broken and for them to cite that on the charge - they will not be able to do that as no law has been broken
If they try to say - not in accordance with the licence - then ask which specific part of non compliance - they must state which part
I would still like to know who the B+E school is who spouts this stuff ?????????????
Kateestar
New User
Hi is this thread still active? I'm having a nightmare with information on buying a car to tow my trailer. It's 1500kg box trailer with almost everything in (its got 2000kg on the max permitted on the frame plate). Max we load it to is around 1600kg. Single axle.
I wanted to buy something like a Ford Ranger, single cab, seen a couple at dealer but got no straight answer on towing limits. I'm not sure if this is a suitable vehicle but we need lots of space to put our gear in the back (more than our jeep cherokee currently gives us) without compromising hugely on running costs / reliability & not costing the earth. Not sure any suggestions on this?
This is the information I've found online... For a Ford Ranger, 2008, single cab, 2x4. 2.5 engine.
Gross Payload (Kg) 1190
Gross Vehicle Weight (Kg) 2800
Kerb Weight (Kg) 1610
Towing Limit (Kg) 1600
Though I have found other contradicting information on other websites these figures seem a best match to the vehicle itself, I'm not sure how best to be 100% certain though. Will the fact it says towing limit of 1600, if we are constatly towing at around this level affect the car over time? Should we be looking at something bigger?
Currently going for me B+E in the next few weeks too to help stop any problems with weight limits.
Last question, our trailer has a brake on the tow bar, like a hand brake, but doesnt have electric brakes that i know of. We bought it new 12 months ago, the manufacturer gave us lots of information and assured us its legal to drive safely for its weight. After reading its 750kg unbraked limit are we towing illegally? Can the manufacturer tell us / sell us the trailer (for a huge price tag) if it's not legal to drive (it was 1100kg when it left the workshop)
Any advice at all would be hugely appreciated, and apologies for asking stupid questions.
I wanted to buy something like a Ford Ranger, single cab, seen a couple at dealer but got no straight answer on towing limits. I'm not sure if this is a suitable vehicle but we need lots of space to put our gear in the back (more than our jeep cherokee currently gives us) without compromising hugely on running costs / reliability & not costing the earth. Not sure any suggestions on this?
This is the information I've found online... For a Ford Ranger, 2008, single cab, 2x4. 2.5 engine.
Gross Payload (Kg) 1190
Gross Vehicle Weight (Kg) 2800
Kerb Weight (Kg) 1610
Towing Limit (Kg) 1600
Though I have found other contradicting information on other websites these figures seem a best match to the vehicle itself, I'm not sure how best to be 100% certain though. Will the fact it says towing limit of 1600, if we are constatly towing at around this level affect the car over time? Should we be looking at something bigger?
Currently going for me B+E in the next few weeks too to help stop any problems with weight limits.
Last question, our trailer has a brake on the tow bar, like a hand brake, but doesnt have electric brakes that i know of. We bought it new 12 months ago, the manufacturer gave us lots of information and assured us its legal to drive safely for its weight. After reading its 750kg unbraked limit are we towing illegally? Can the manufacturer tell us / sell us the trailer (for a huge price tag) if it's not legal to drive (it was 1100kg when it left the workshop)
Any advice at all would be hugely appreciated, and apologies for asking stupid questions.
ROG
Well-Known Member
Very active thread with Email alerts when a member posts on it
Any trailer over 750 kg must by law have over-run brakes so your trailer plated at 2000 will have such brakes
Trailers over 3500 plated MAM weight must have electric or air brakes not those under 3500
If the vehicle says it has a 1600 max tow limit then towing a trailer including the load at 1600 is what that limit has been designed to do
At the moment on your B licence the total of 2800 + 2000 = 4800 is well over the 3500 limit but is fine for B+E when you get that
Kateestar
New User
Really appreciate that! Thank you for the very clear advice. Tempted to purchase this one then... 
Ssac1
New User
thanks for taking the trouble to put it together.. and Rog for making the generous offer to help people , now we just need to get admin's opinion and see if they will do a sticky.
ROG
Well-Known Member
this thread is already a sticky
tallyho!
Following a strict mediterranean diet...
Lots of them do ROG! Thank goodness we can run things by you. How have you not got a spot in H&H yet?
tallyho!
Following a strict mediterranean diet...
Got that covered... this thread has been a sticky for nearly 4 and a half years! Thanks ROG!
ROG
Well-Known Member
Which Passat is your from this list ? = http://carleasingmadesimple.com/data/volkswagen/passat/gross-vehicle-weight/ as I need to know the GVW
The Cheval touring trailer here = http://www.jswhorseboxes.co.uk/tran...lers/cheval-liberte-touring-horse-trailer.htm is 830 empty but has a MAM of 2000 and that 2000 is the number needed for licencing
ASSUMING your Passat has a GVW of 2000 and the trailer has a MAM of 2000 then that totals 4000 so is 500 over the B (not B1) towing limit of 3500
LICENCES go on the PLATED MAX WEIGHTS and not the actual weights
SOLUTION = if those are the figures then simply contact Cheval who are the only people who can down plate the trailer from 2000 to 1500 leaving a max load for the trailer of 670 (1500-830=670) so plenty for your 440 horse
Down plating procedure is usually this -
You contact trailer manufacturer with the trailer details
you remove current plate
you send plate plus fee to manufacturer
manufacturer sends you new plate
you fit new plate
you need access to drill and pop rivet gun
Rose&Arnie
New User
Thank you for the help! Really appreciate it!
My car is the older version of the Volkswagen PASSAT DIESEL SALOON 2.0 TDI S 4dr (106g/km, diesel, manual) so it's 2,020 gross weight?
I rang cheval and the guy didn't know anything about down plating, should I ring back and see if I can find out more?
Thanks
My car is the older version of the Volkswagen PASSAT DIESEL SALOON 2.0 TDI S 4dr (106g/km, diesel, manual) so it's 2,020 gross weight?
I rang cheval and the guy didn't know anything about down plating, should I ring back and see if I can find out more?
Thanks
Rose&Arnie
New User
Thank you for the help! Really appreciate it!
My car is the older version of the Volkswagen PASSAT DIESEL SALOON 2.0 TDI S 4dr (106g/km, diesel, manual) so it's 2,020 gross weight?
I rang cheval and the guy didn't know anything about down plating, should I ring back and see if I can find out more?
Thanks
ROG
Well-Known Member
Get another guy on the phone because I know they do know about down plating as they do it quite often
I just tried to call them but nobody is answering = http://www.chevaltrailers.co.uk/contact.html so perhaps you can try emailing them to ask what their down plating procedure is
At 2020 GVW you need the trailer down plating to 1450 so that will leave a max trailer load of 620
Rose&Arnie
New User
Mike007
Well-Known Member
Vosa ,now DVSA are only interested in the actual weight of the combination . Some FIVE YEARS ago they issued a memo to that effect. Down plating is a load of cock!
ROG
Well-Known Member
True because DVSA cannot deal with licence issues - the police deal with that
Often the DVSA and the police work together so if presented with this scenario .......
B licence
Vehicle GVW 2100 and weighing 2000 with 2000 towing capacity
Trailer MAM plated at 2500 and weighing 1400
The outcome will be no penalties issued by DVSA as all weights are legal
Not driving in accordance with the licence penalty issued by police as total MAM/GVW is 4600 which is 1600 over the 3500 B tow limit
If the trailer was down plated to 1400 then no penalties issued at all
DVSA will call the police if they suspect a driver is not driving within their licence limits
catherine22
Well-Known Member
Rog, can I tow a Ifor 510 with an approx 700kg horse with a Mitzubishi Pajero 2.5l with a B (post 1997) license or do I need to do the trailer test?
ROG
Well-Known Member
Please can you tell me the GVW of the car ? - this can be found as the top figure of four on the weight plate usually hidden under the bonnet or in a door frame OR as Max Permissible Weight on the V5 keepers form
I know the HB510 is 2584 MAM and 1000 empty
The GVW of the car added to the MAM of the trailer cannot add up to more than 3500 so its unlikely that you can tow this combo on a B licence even if you down plate the trailer to 1700