ROG
Well-Known Member
You have indeed got it all legally correct = well done
Welcome to HHO Towing Clinic
- Thread starter tallyho!
- Start date
You have indeed got it all legally correct = well done
swright
Member
Thanks for your expertise Rog!
Skinnyminny
New User
licence they hold - B+E
2 - Unladen/empty weight of the towing vehicle - 1405kg
3 - GVW of the towing vehicle - 1820kg
4 - Towing capacity of the towing vehicle - 1500kg
GTW - 3370kg
5 - Plated MAM of the trailer or if no plate then the load rating on the tyres - 1600kg
6 - Unladen/empty weight of the trailer - 675kg
Ponies - 400kg and 220kg respectively, usually only used for the 400kg not both.
Am I legal/safe please ROG?
And am I correct in thinking that I would have to downplated the trailer to allow my boyfriend to drive it on a B license?
Thank you!
2 - Unladen/empty weight of the towing vehicle - 1405kg
3 - GVW of the towing vehicle - 1820kg
4 - Towing capacity of the towing vehicle - 1500kg
GTW - 3370kg
5 - Plated MAM of the trailer or if no plate then the load rating on the tyres - 1600kg
6 - Unladen/empty weight of the trailer - 675kg
Ponies - 400kg and 220kg respectively, usually only used for the 400kg not both.
Am I legal/safe please ROG?
And am I correct in thinking that I would have to downplated the trailer to allow my boyfriend to drive it on a B license?
Thank you!
ROG
Well-Known Member
BF to drive does NOT need trailer down plating as 1820 + 1600 = 3420 so under the B licence limit of 3500
Max load for the trailer is 825 according to the empty weight of 675 stated but that seems to low ...... if its a HB 401/3 then its 780 empty
1500 - 675 = 825
Bit odd that GTW 3370 minus GVW 1820 = 1550 and towing capacity is only stated at 1500 because it is legally 1550 so you can load 875 into the trailer
Skinnyminny
New User
Thank you SO much! Super speedy response!
It's a Bateson Derby, which is specifically designed to be light enough to tow with a car. It's a fibreglass trailer, rear unload only.
So glad I'm legal and safe. Have been absolutely attacked by the big 4x4 brigade and I was sure that it was all kosher.
It's a Bateson Derby, which is specifically designed to be light enough to tow with a car. It's a fibreglass trailer, rear unload only.
So glad I'm legal and safe. Have been absolutely attacked by the big 4x4 brigade and I was sure that it was all kosher.
ROG
Well-Known Member
You certain its 1600 and not 1700 MAM as all the ones I have come across have been 1700 ????????????
Is your vehicle a KIA CEED ?
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Skinnyminny
New User
Many apologies, it is 1700MAM, I meant to type would we need to downplate it to 1600MAM for the B license - trying to do too many numbers at once!
By the looks of it we would need to downplate but only to 1680kg is that correct?
By the looks of it we would need to downplate but only to 1680kg is that correct?
ROG
Well-Known Member
Correct = smile
As you only need to load a max of say 725 into it then I would down plate to 1400 so that if I got a vehicle in the future with a GVW max 2100 then it would not need to be down plated again
Skinnyminny
New User
I have a VW golf 
Would definitely be a good idea to downplate as you say, hadn't thought about that.
Would definitely be a good idea to downplate as you say, hadn't thought about that.
ROG
Well-Known Member
Golf is probably about 2000 kg GVW ?I have a VW golf
Would definitely be a good idea to downplate as you say, hadn't thought about that.
What towing limit does the golf have ?
Skinnyminny
New User
Plated GVW is 1820kg, tow limit is 1500kg (all other weights are in my original post)
Not sure why the GTW - GVW has that 50kg shortfall though, will check again tomorrow.
Not sure why the GTW - GVW has that 50kg shortfall though, will check again tomorrow.
ROG
Well-Known Member
Misread post - thought you had a golf as well as another vehicle = dopey me !
Skinnyminny
New User
It is Friday night! Thank you so much for prompt replies and help with such a complicated area. There needs to be some kind of website where you plug in the numbers and it just tells you!
rosieb82
New User
I hope you can help. I hold a post 97 b license. I have a 57 plate Nissan xtrail adventure expedition 2 litre diesel automatic. I have tried to find out all the necessary weights but I'm being useless! I'm hoping to tow an Ifor Williams 403 which has been replated at 1300kg and will be carrying a pony weighing 400kg. Is this legal and safe??? Thanks in advance.
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ROG
Well-Known Member
If the GVW of the Xtrail is 2200 kg or less then its legal on a B licence and you can load a max of 513 into the trailer
To find the vehicle GVW -
Top of 4 numbers on the weight plate usually hidden under bonnet or in a door frame
The maximum permissible mass on the V5 keepers form
rosieb82
New User
Thanks Rog, the top number is 2170 so looks like I'm ok. Grateful for your help it all bamboozled me!
ROG
Well-Known Member
Archie07
Well-Known Member
B Licence
Ford Transit 85 280
Kerb weight (unladen back but includes full tank of fuel) - 1699kg
GVW (laden, although the van would always be unladen when towing) - 2800kg
Payload - 1101kg
Towing weight/ GTM - 3500kg
Trailer weight - 770kg
Trailer MAM - 1600kg
Pony - 550kg
Ford Transit 85 280
Kerb weight (unladen back but includes full tank of fuel) - 1699kg
GVW (laden, although the van would always be unladen when towing) - 2800kg
Payload - 1101kg
Towing weight/ GTM - 3500kg
Trailer weight - 770kg
Trailer MAM - 1600kg
Pony - 550kg
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ROG
Well-Known Member
Towing it loaded or empty makes no difference for licence rules as licences go on the max of the plated max weights such as GVW & MAM
The max trailer you can tow on a B licence with a vehicle which has a GVW of 2800 is 750 kg MAM
What you need is a vehicle with a max GVW of 2150 so you can down plate the trailer to 1350 leaving a trailer max trailer load of 580
winstonator
New User
Orignal post is #2741 for my vehicle and trailer details
Hi ROG
I was hoping you could help with a confusion I have on two things (my details are in the menioned quote).
1. Until today I havent heard of anyone mention the Maximum Rear Axle Weight when talking about pulling trailers. My vehicle's max rear axel weight I have just found out is 1100kg. My trailer and its cargo is approx 1217kg. Does this infact mean that I'm loading more on my real axle than the car can handle? If so, how vital is this rule, how flexible is the weight allowance, because I would presume that if it has not been mentioned in DVLA's legal limitations etc then its more of a guideline? What effect will pulling the extra 150ish kgs have my driving safety?
2. For the purposes of tyre pressure on my vehicle (laden and unladen) - does the trailer and its cargo count as fully laden weight and therefore my pressure needs to be modified to fully laden? Or does fully laden only count with cargo 'inside' my vehicle, and not weight pulling at the back of my vehicle? At present im not sure which tyre pressure to use - fully laden or unladen.
Many thanks
Hi ROG
I was hoping you could help with a confusion I have on two things (my details are in the menioned quote).
1. Until today I havent heard of anyone mention the Maximum Rear Axle Weight when talking about pulling trailers. My vehicle's max rear axel weight I have just found out is 1100kg. My trailer and its cargo is approx 1217kg. Does this infact mean that I'm loading more on my real axle than the car can handle? If so, how vital is this rule, how flexible is the weight allowance, because I would presume that if it has not been mentioned in DVLA's legal limitations etc then its more of a guideline? What effect will pulling the extra 150ish kgs have my driving safety?
2. For the purposes of tyre pressure on my vehicle (laden and unladen) - does the trailer and its cargo count as fully laden weight and therefore my pressure needs to be modified to fully laden? Or does fully laden only count with cargo 'inside' my vehicle, and not weight pulling at the back of my vehicle? At present im not sure which tyre pressure to use - fully laden or unladen.
Many thanks
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ROG
Well-Known Member
1 - how you load the trailer will make a difference to what weight is being put on the rear axle - the towbar max load will usually sort that out
2 - same with tyre pressures - no need to increase or decrease for trailer only for vehicle if recommended by manufacturer
winstonator
New User
Hi ROG
Sorry I should have clarified I am referring to my towing vehicle tyre pressure. Does towing place my vehicle in the fully laden classification? Or does fully laden only count for items actually inside the vehicle, not items being pulled by the vehicle?
Cheers
ROG
Well-Known Member
Load in the vehicle refers to vehicle tyre pressure
towing does not affect vehicle tyre pressure
frankyfroo
New User
Hi Rog
I'm totally new to forums and am not sure I'm doing this right but I hope you can help me!
I wish to confirm the legality of my husband and myself towing a horse trailer on our current driving licence. We both hold B licences and passed our tests in 2005. I am unsure about the wording on the DVLA site -
"You can: tow a trailer over 750kg MAM as long as the combined MAM of the trailer and towing vehicle is no more than 3,500kg"
I took this to understand that the MAM of the car and the MAM of the trailer combined must be under 3500kg and contacted my trailer manufacturer to request to downplate my trailer so that it fell below this limit. On speaking to my trailer manufacturer (Bateson) they told me that the law had changed and now, as long as the combined weight of the car and trailer are below 3500kg when in use that is now legal....please could you confirm if this is now the case?
The details of our trailer and car would be:
Bateson Derby
Unladen - 650
MGW - 1700
Kia Sportage 2016 1.6 Basic
GWL - 1895
Max Kerb Weight - 1546
Min Kerb Weight - 1454
Horse weight - 450
Many thanks for your time.
Frankly
I'm totally new to forums and am not sure I'm doing this right but I hope you can help me!
I wish to confirm the legality of my husband and myself towing a horse trailer on our current driving licence. We both hold B licences and passed our tests in 2005. I am unsure about the wording on the DVLA site -
"You can: tow a trailer over 750kg MAM as long as the combined MAM of the trailer and towing vehicle is no more than 3,500kg"
I took this to understand that the MAM of the car and the MAM of the trailer combined must be under 3500kg and contacted my trailer manufacturer to request to downplate my trailer so that it fell below this limit. On speaking to my trailer manufacturer (Bateson) they told me that the law had changed and now, as long as the combined weight of the car and trailer are below 3500kg when in use that is now legal....please could you confirm if this is now the case?
The details of our trailer and car would be:
Bateson Derby
Unladen - 650
MGW - 1700
Kia Sportage 2016 1.6 Basic
GWL - 1895
Max Kerb Weight - 1546
Min Kerb Weight - 1454
Horse weight - 450
Many thanks for your time.
Frankly
ROG
Well-Known Member
I think you mean GVW 1895 kg for sportage ????
That being correct then 1895 + 1700 = 3595 so over the 3500 limit for B towing BUT there is an easy solution .....
Contact Bateson trailers 0161 426 0500 and get trailer down plated from 1700 to 1600*
You remove plate
You send plate and about £10 to Bateson
Bateson send you new plate
You fit new plate
Need a drill and a pop rivet gun
*If it was me I would down plate to 1300 so that if you get a vehicle in the future with a GVW of 2200 or less then it will not need to be down plated again
At 1300 it will leave at least 600 for the trailer load
frankyfroo
New User
Hi ROG
Thank you for such a quick reply and the helpful info. Yes I meant GVW sorry - so many acronyms!
I have been following the info on this thread for a while and so did call Bateson the other day. I was told that there was no need to downplate as the law has now changed regarding this. I just wondered if you'd come across this yet? I have contacted the DVLA to clarify too as I don't want to downplate unnecessarily. Bateson told me that the law was brought in to make it easier to quickly check the legality of commercial vehicles and that they hadn't anticipated the issues this would cause (Bateson said they have loads of requests for downplating weekly) and that this has now changed...
On the DVLA site it has different wording for those who hold a licence from 2013 than those who hold an older licence but I'm unclear what the very subtle wording really means so I've asked them to clarify! I doubt I'll hear back any time soon!
I did ask how much downplating would be etc but he was insistent that I didn't need to so now I'm really confused!
Thanks
Francesca
Thank you for such a quick reply and the helpful info. Yes I meant GVW sorry - so many acronyms!
I have been following the info on this thread for a while and so did call Bateson the other day. I was told that there was no need to downplate as the law has now changed regarding this. I just wondered if you'd come across this yet? I have contacted the DVLA to clarify too as I don't want to downplate unnecessarily. Bateson told me that the law was brought in to make it easier to quickly check the legality of commercial vehicles and that they hadn't anticipated the issues this would cause (Bateson said they have loads of requests for downplating weekly) and that this has now changed...
On the DVLA site it has different wording for those who hold a licence from 2013 than those who hold an older licence but I'm unclear what the very subtle wording really means so I've asked them to clarify! I doubt I'll hear back any time soon!
I did ask how much downplating would be etc but he was insistent that I didn't need to so now I'm really confused!
Thanks
Francesca
ROG
Well-Known Member
Dunno who you spoke to at Bateson but if they said the law had changed then they are mistaken
Who did you speak to ?????????????
The Gov sites have kept the old laws from 1997 to 2013 on the internet when there is no need to as the new 2013 laws are the same for all B licence drivers no matter when they got a B licence
Slight difference for B+E as after 2013 they are restricted to a trailer with a max MAM of 3500 but as that affected almost nobody then its not really worth mentioning
frankyfroo
New User
I'm not sure - he was northern and very nice but was quite convinced I didn't need to downplate! He said if I were to be pulled over by police for any reason and they questioned it I could say take me to a weigh bridge and that would prove I wasn't over the 3500. He said people want to chop and change who is driving and people have to downplate unnecessarily when sharing a trailer and then change plates etc so it has now changed. He was the only one in that day but he did seem quite well informed and knew about why I was asking for the downplating etc and could have just taken my tenner I suppose...! I'm gunna call back next week to double check so I'll let you know the result of Bateson and the DVLA.
Thanks for your help
Francesca
Thanks for your help
Francesca
ROG
Well-Known Member
I will call them next week to find out where there got bogus info from on B licencingI'm not sure - he was northern and very nice but was quite convinced I didn't need to downplate! He said if I were to be pulled over by police for any reason and they questioned it I could say take me to a weigh bridge and that would prove I wasn't over the 3500. He said people want to chop and change who is driving and people have to downplate unnecessarily when sharing a trailer and then change plates etc so it has now changed. He was the only one in that day but he did seem quite well informed and knew about why I was asking for the downplating etc and could have just taken my tenner I suppose...! I'm gunna call back next week to double check so I'll let you know the result of Bateson and the DVLA.
Thanks for your help
Francesca
I reckon they were talking about the laws on B+E where some police forces have recently been saying, incorrectly, that a trailer cannot be plated more than a towing capacity
frankyfroo
New User
He may well have been! It was quite confusing as I was very clear why I needed to downplate as had done my research. I'd be interested to see what they say to you. I'd rather be safe than sorry so I'd happily pay the tenner!
Thanks again
Francesca
Thanks again
Francesca