Well this is a can of worms

diet2ride said:
I’m not even going to give the comments I’ve read on this thread any more credence, they are purely and simply ‘FAT BASHING’ made my obnoxious and rude people who it seems have nothing better to do than belittle people. Whatever your beliefs about ‘Obesity’ or ‘Welfare’ it does not give any one the right to poke fun and make nasty comments about another human being Esp so in an online environment when you know neither the person or the story behind a picture.
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Hope you get equally horrified about skinny bashing!:rolleyes:

Don't think anyone has a problem with an over weight rider riding a suitable mount with correctly fitted tack. All however should be again anyone riding an unsuitable mount (7st stick on a mini shetland included), and/or using ill fitted or unsuitable tack.

Many horses back will not accommodate a 22" saddle or even a 18" saddle, and the fact is a long back is a weak back, so if they can carry a longer saddle, they will not be genuine weight carriers (and nor should they be expected to be).
 
But Littlelegs you are missing the point. I'm not using my weight as an excuse to ride.

YOU are the one using the 'excuse of weight' to bash others in a derogatory way

What I am saying is how can you as adults make such rude and hurtful comments. based on a belief, 'your belief' that above a certain weight is too heavy for a horse.

you are of course fully entitled to your beliefs and to express them eloquently and with thought to others, this is always a good basis for discussion.

to make cruel jibes to another person because 'you Believe' them to be too heavy for their horse, is bullying.
 
diet2ride said:
But Littlelegs you are missing the point. I'm not using my weight as an excuse to ride.

YOU are the one using the 'excuse of weight' to bash others in a derogatory way

What I am saying is how can you as adults make such rude and hurtful comments. based on a belief, 'your belief' that above a certain weight is too heavy for a horse.

you are of course fully entitled to your beliefs and to express them eloquently and with thought to others, this is always a good basis for discussion.

to make cruel jibes to another person because 'you Believe' them to be too heavy for their horse, is bullying.
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Uh, don't know what you are reading, but not the same as me, because Littlelegs hasn't said you are using your weight as an excuse to ride...

By the way, if you ache after an hour on your horse, you are not fit enough to ride. I would say that to any rider, no matter what their weight.
 
diet2ride said:
to make cruel jibes to another person because 'you Believe' them to be too heavy for their horse, is bullying.
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I think some descriptions here are uncalled for BUT if these people were not riding I do not think anyone would comment on their weight at all. It is the cruelty to the horses which is provoking such feelings as they have no choice, the riders do choose whether to ride or not.

The other forum has had similar discussions, but the general level of what is seen as acceptable seems to be far greater than here, so I do think there are cultural differences. Perhaps FF would do better over there? One comment on this thread suggests that people do have a right to ride, if they can afford a horse...post 8
http://www.horseforum.com/horse-riding/too-big-ride-please-help-me-101126/
 
Clava said:
How true. They seem to really believe that 15.7 stone men on a 14.2 is OK. How can they think that ?
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I know. It's truly shocking. :(

My OH is 6'3" and has just dropped from 15 stone to 14 1/2 and there is no way I would let him on my 15.3 ISH!!!! Not because I think he's "fat" (funnily enough I quite like how he's put together ;)), but because simple science and common sense tells me it would be against my horse's welfare.

Me, yeah, I'm fat. I really need to lose a stone or two (I've put on a lot since being seriously injured, incapacitated and on a lot of steroids) but because I'm such a so short then even at 1-2 stone more than I should be I'm still not too heavy for my horse. Thats said, I'm trying to lose it and knowing I shall ride better is my main incentive. I have also given up another sport I love, purely because of my weight.
 
diet2ride said:
But Littlelegs you are missing the point. I'm not using my weight as an excuse to ride.

YOU are the one using the 'excuse of weight' to bash others in a derogatory way

What I am saying is how can you as adults make such rude and hurtful comments. based on a belief, 'your belief' that above a certain weight is too heavy for a horse.

you are of course fully entitled to your beliefs and to express them eloquently and with thought to others, this is always a good basis for discussion.

to make cruel jibes to another person because 'you Believe' them to be too heavy for their horse, is bullying.
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However the site you are supporting find it more than acceptable to make rude remarks based on other peoples size :eek: The MD on fuller fillies has absolutely no problem encouraging people to remain obese. The people on the American Forum were, without doubt, too heavy for the horses they were riding 300lbs on a 14hh? How you can defend that is beyond me. The only reason I can see for saying that this is ok, is allow overweight/obese/morbidly obese people to feel that it is acceptable to compromise the welfare of the horses for their own self delusions.
Just another point, the horse may well appear fine the following day/week, the long term damage to joints and back tends to be cumulative.
The weight that people are or choose to be is entirely their business, provided they do not expect another living creature to pay the penalty for it.
 
Well, having had a look at the FF Facebook page, I now feel besmirched.
In fact, I am incredibly offended because apparently, since I haven't got a backside the size of England (due to effort not genes!) I am not a REAL woman. REAL women apparently start at FF size 16 (a very generous 'size 16', I suspect), the rest of us are just disgusting little skinnies who are of no appeal to anyone. Pity our poor horses, since apparently we don't have their backs and saddles checked etc because we're so smug in our non-obeseness.
I have never seen so much **** in my life.
Those who are getting incensed about the nasty comments on this thread etc... it's about the HORSES, not the riders. Can't you see that? If they just want to sit on a sofa or a Harley Davidson, they can go for it, get up to size 40, see if we care. ;) ;)
This growing obesity and the ridiculous PC-ness surrounding it is going to damage horses who have little/no say in the matter, that's inexcusable imho.
 
I know this will upset people, but I'll say it anyway, lol. Being fat is a choice. It is something people can do something about, yes with possibly great difficulty, but they can. Obesity has a lot of similarities to alcoholism and drug addiction. No one would question that overcoming these afflictions is a huge struggle, but they are all a choice in the first place and doing something about them does remain a constant option.

I mention this point because if someone posted in soapbox asking for support as they struggle with their drink problem, they'd get it with plenty of kindness and understanding advice. If they posted in here a video of them showjumping p*ssed, flopping around on their poor, confused horse, they'd get ripped into. To me that is all that's happened here.
 
Puppy said:
I know. It's truly shocking. :(

My OH is 6'3" and has just dropped from 15 stone to 14 1/2 and there is no way I would let him on my 15.3 ISH!!!! Not because I think he's "fat" (funnily enough I quite like how he's put together ;)), but because simple science and common sense tells me it would be against my horse's welfare.

Me, yeah, I'm fat. I really need to lose a stone or two (I've put on a lot since being seriously injured, incapacitated and on a lot of steroids) but because I'm such a so short then even at 1-2 stone more than I should be I'm still not too heavy for my horse. Thats said, I'm trying to lose it and knowing I shall ride better is my main incentive. I have also given up another sport I love, purely because of my weight.
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16 stone stags on 14 hh Highlands plus the large special saddle to carry them.Criollo stalliuons around 14.2 performance tested over 750kms. 14 days, minimum 10kms an hour and carrying 17.5 stone.Tested in Uraguay.
 
piebaldsparkle said:
Hope you get equally horrified about skinny bashing!:rolleyes:

Don't think anyone has a problem with an over weight rider riding a suitable mount with correctly fitted tack. All however should be again anyone riding an unsuitable mount (7st stick on a mini shetland included), and/or using ill fitted or unsuitable tack.

Many horses back will not accommodate a 22" saddle or even a 18" saddle, and the fact is a long back is a weak back, so if they can carry a longer saddle, they will not be genuine weight carriers (and nor should they be expected to be).
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You have to be fat do you to have a poorly fitting saddle and a horse with a damaged back?
 
I'm not missing the point at all. Rather I think you are. If my only aim was an excuse to make derogatory comments about overweight people, there are plenty of threads about diets, 'am I too big for my horse' etc, plus posts on this thread from larger, suitably mounted riders that I could have used as an excuse to be rude if I was that way inclined. As I have already said, if someone of 17 stone has a suitable horse I don't see an issue. 8 stone on a mini I have a problem with.20 stone on a fine pony, outrages me. I hardly think I'm alone in believing individual horses have weight limits. It's also bullying to call thin people cruel names if you take that pov. If someone believes its acceptable to inflict themselves on a too small horse, which is something I find deeply upsetting & distressing, its only natural I will express my anger in the only way possible. If I started a thread with pictures of me battering a pony with a lunge whip & inflicting pain, & encouraged others to post similar pictures of their 'bravery' in hurting animals, I would justifiably come in for a lot of personal insults by outraged animal lovers. I wouldn't have a right to respond by saying 'thats just your personal belief, & not an excuse for bullying'. Exactly the same for me with regards asking a horse to carry a too heavy rider. It might make those who are riding horses far too small better about their cruel actions to say its just 'my belief' or I'm a bully, it doesn't make it fact. I'm not getting all outraged & upset about the insults being used about thin people, because I really couldn't give a ****. But making animals suffer really gets my back up.
 
diet2ride said:
YOU are the one using the 'excuse of weight' to bash others in a derogatory way
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Riders size and weight is what the crux of this topic has come down to.

Some people have bashed others, but this in reaction to viewing pictures of severely overweight adults riding horses which are clearly too small for them- in a lot of peoples minds, this is cruel. Some of these riders have shown and expressed blatent disregard for their animals which may have caused people to comment in the way they have.
 
diet2ride said:
who says horse riding has to be a sport? Where does it say you can only ride if you are an athlete!

I just want to leave you with one more thing, this was me and Nas earlier this year in the five years of owning him I don’t think there has been a happier day for either of us. I was on his back for over an hour. And yes it was me hobbling around like a cowboy the following day. But Nas strode out of his box like he was ready to do it all again.
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This is precisley the reason you need to be fit to ride most people I know ride for an hour a day without even thinking of it let alone being sore from it. The only reason for being that sore after riding for an hour would be after years out of the saddle. And thats not fat bashing as you like to put it, riding is a sport and therefore requires a level of fitness to be able to do it.

I'm not against larger people riding as long as they are suitably mounted but I am against the MD of FF saying that those that arnt a size 16 or above arnt real women! For some thats just not a natural size and never will be, if the comments were against larger ladies then there would be uproar but its ok to insult those that are naturally small.
 
Baggybreeches said:
That's a pretty ignorant comment, I know of an 11.2 lead rein pony who had an 18'' saddle specially made for her due to a number of issues, it didn't look out of place. I have a 15.2 and a 17.1 and they both have 17'' saddles because that's the size that I prefer/am best suited to.
I don't think that overweight people should feel that it's OK to continue to ride whilst being too heavy but it depends on what type of horse they have and what they are doing with it, and don't forget it could be the incentive they need to get fit and lose weight.
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It's pretty ignorant that as a horsey person you don't realise something as basic about back length and weight carrying ability/strength as pointed out by many already. Perhaps read some of the information. I would love to see an 11.2hh in an 18" saddle; that's the most ridiculous thing I think I have read on this forum yet! Maybe next you will be claiming it could carry 14 stone.
 
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Flame_ said:
I know this will upset people, but I'll say it anyway, lol. Being fat is a choice. It is something people can do something about, yes with possibly great difficulty, but they can. Obesity has a lot of similarities to alcoholism and drug addiction. No one would question that overcoming these afflictions is a huge struggle, but they are all a choice in the first place and doing something about them does remain a constant option.

I mention this point because if someone posted in soapbox asking for support as they struggle with their drink problem, they'd get it with plenty of kindness and understanding advice. If they posted in here a video of them showjumping p*ssed, flopping around on their poor, confused horse, they'd get ripped into. To me that is all that's happened here.
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I don't honestly think true alcholism is a choice.Its totally different from just heavy drinking.Heavy drinkers can control or stop if they have to whereas alcholics have a life long b attle on their hands.Even the best and most motivated can slip and slide a bit.Gross obesity has its roots in other things I think and we don't always know yet what that is.Just as one example, girl I knew.Doing stages at college.From memory about 5ft 5.Weighed at a conservative estimate about 16 stone.Lovely girl actually.Sister about the same.Mother perfectly normally sized.Horrible childhood with ongoing issues.Very violent father.
 
Whoa, for all the people saying that people are "fat bashing" it is a case of what is right for the horse. As said by others, a suitable sized horse will be fine but a 22 inch saddle could be ill fitting. Theres no argument that a light person will not damage a horse if the saddle is ill fitting or too long on a weight carrier with a short back. The thread is about 22 inch saddles, nothing else. It does all depend on the mount and rider. Im tall and light but i would not ride something that was not capable of taking my weight. Think some peoples are taking it a bit to heart when people are only trying to think of the horses!
 
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jesstickle said:
No, she/he said the exact opposite of that? :confused:

No one should ride in ill fitting tack.
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A huge number of people do though.One BHS student who had, even to my untutored eye, a very badly fitting saddle, said to me, when I said getting saddle fitter out, Well we have been taught saddle fitting in college so I know what I am doing!!!!!
 
littlelegs said:
Yes, the good old 'fat bashing excuse'. Obviously being overweight means you can't possibly be wrong, cruel or responsible for your own actions, anyone who comments negatively must just be picking on you because of your size.
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By Their definition I am being cruel to ride my horse. and using my weight as an excuse to do so.

as for supporting a group, I am not a member of a cult. I am an overweight rider who wishes to enjoy a hobby. I am on the sites and enjoy talking to like minded people.

when you attack on such a personal level then you should expect like wise back. it is not my place to say how others conduct themselves.

but if you are attacking a group of people because they don't confirm to your ideals, based on your beliefs. in such a derogatory manner Then yes I will stand up to that. and say Hang on I ride, and my horse is fine.
 
Nobodys said that obesity doesn't have deep seated issues or that people can easily drop to a healthy weight. But the why's & wherefores aren't actually relevant to the horse carrying them. I have actually let a morbidly obese person ride my 14.2 connie x tb, let her jump & canter too. And it was my suggestion she do so, despite the fact she weighed more than double what she should. A morbidly obese child, with various complex medical issues that were in no way the parents fault. Morbidly obese novice small child, I was very happy to help. Would I let a tall, thin, 12stone man on her now she's older? No way.
 
I've not read all of the replies, but my thoughts, based purely on reading the article, are that it is probably not very likely to find many riding horses that are able to withstand a 22inch saddle. I own a 17.3hh who wears 7ft 3inch rugs and he owns a 17.5" dressage saddle and an 18" jumping saddle, both were fitted to him and there is no way even a horse his size would want anything bigger than an 18"!

The comment by the H&H vet, is also a little odd isn't it? Surely, in the days when horses were used to carry men wearing armour into battle, the standards of animal welfare, and what was and what wasn't acceptable for animals to endure in those past times, can hardly be compared to animal welfare standards in 2012 ????
 
newera said:
I've not read all of the replies, but my thoughts, based purely on reading the article, are that it is probably not very likely to find many riding horses that are able to withstand a 22inch saddle. I own a 17.3hh who wears 7ft 3inch rugs and he owns a 17.5" dressage saddle and an 18" jumping saddle, both were fitted to him and there is no way even a horse his size would want anything bigger than an 18"!

The comment by the H&H vet, is also a little odd isn't it? Surely, in the days when horses were used to carry men wearing armour into battle, the standards of animal welfare, and what was and what wasn't acceptable for animals to endure in those past times, can hardly be compared to animal welfare standards in 2012 ????
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well said! what most people have been saying all along :)
 
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