When WOULD you hit a horse? Or would you?

[skewby]

I find it surprising as well so many horses owned by H & H forum members (as well as biting and attacking) appear to want to throw themselves in front of lorries. I would have thought that would be fairly unusual.

That's a very gross exaggeration. However point taken. Perhaps H&H forum members encounter more dangers on horseback because we ride our horses, rather than stay in a school doing "groundwork"?

Surely what matters is, that post-smack these members' horses have gone on to useful ridden careers? Would your opinion be otherwise, had they used a "whip-***"?

Surprising to me as I would have thought you would have encountered far more difficult animals than anyone has described here. Or would such animals be "vetted out" for demos?

Would be interesting to hear what you advocate doing in the situations described, rather than just condemning HHO users as a bunch.

ETA so sorry, just realised what a ridiculous question I posted - of course you won't do that. We would need to PAY for that! Apologies. I hope you recruit though.

 

[skewby]

Obviously these horses would have been got used to traffic before being ridden out on the roads and, of course, they would be schooled to the basic aids. Isn't it easier and safer to do a shoulder in towards the traffic rather than hit them which would raise their adrenalin and make the situation more dangerous?

Do your horses always remember the "basic aids" in terror?

 

[Tormenta]

A horse (or any animal) should never be hit out of temper IMO because then any sort of reprimand is completely lost in a cloud of misunderstanding and misjudgement. Trust is lost and and no lesson learned.

 

[teagreen]

I'll give a horse a damn good smack any day of the week if the situation warrants it. I would never hit a horse without a good reason, and I would never give a horse a sustained beating, but plenty of mine have hard a good smacking for being rude or naughty and they show absolutely NO ill effects from this whatsoever, the only effect they show is increased respect for me. They are large, dangerous animals who can be very clever and try to take chances, and I'm afraid I will put my safety first every single time.

If there is a reason for my horse acting up, I will naturally try to resolve it without the use of the whip. If, for example, they refuse because they are scared of the fillers, I'll work slowly to help them get over this fear, or if they won't cross a stream out hacking, I'll take my time to help them through it. But if they decide they are coming out of the stable door regardless of who is standing in front of it, they will get shouted at and a sharp smack. And then they don't do it again. If they are napping dangerously, they will get a good few reminders about who is boss and why you have to go forward for both my safety and your own.

I met a woman not so long ago who hated the whip, however was happy to thump her horse in the sides for an hour in the school. I think there is little worse than watching someone repeatedly thump their animal in the sides with their heels. Also, I've seen jockeys/showjumpers/eventers give their horse what could be described as a 'good wallop' on the approach to a fence so they get the right stride and don't turn a somersault; no one seems to have a problem with that because it's done for safety purposes.

 

[darkhorse123]

A horse (or any animal) should never be hit out of temper IMO because then any sort of reprimand is completely lost in a cloud of misunderstanding and misjudgement. Trust is lost and and no lesson learned.

i so agree with with this - my boy is very verbal and knows a verbal ah - ah - ah - if he continues he gets a slap, with my hand on his shoulder.
When he does what i want he gets a "good boy" - he loves his "good boys" and it works
I would never reprimand him after an event - its when he does it or it is pointless and temper - not good and no point
My boy is funny havign his back feet picked out - he used ot try and kick me. When he kicked he got a slap (by hand) on his shoulder and a sharp no
When he let me do he got a stroke and a "good boy" - he loves his "good boys" and i can now pick his feet anywhere - he gets a tickle afterwards and loves it, he also loves it when i praise him while im doing his feet - ok i sound daft but who cares lol

 

[Wobblywibble]

So what would you do if it was a person on the floor in this situation instead of another horse?? This happened to a friend when we were out on a long ride and untacked the ponies so we could go for a swim. When we saddled up again, hers went for her as she was doing up the girth. Very scary and it took A LOT of beating before he let go.

 

[Onyxia]

sorry my mare was a mess from being walloped battered and beatened - i never raise a hand or voice to my 2 - my little mare esp knows from my boby language and " ah ah ah " when she is stepping over line - both are well mannered - open door of stable and will standquiet till told to walk on - but sorry there is no excuse to hit a horse even a biter - 2 wrongs dont make a right - seen the results of hiting a horse to often with happa and nope never a reason or excuse - think horse and work as a horse - michael peace is my hero xx

At the other end of the spectrum are the horses who have been allowed to get away with everything because their owner did not give them a wallop when need who are a danger to themselves and eveyone around them- have been involved with three like that(free/meat money horses for VERY good reason) who were lovely animals once a few hard lessons had been learned

18HH of horse with no respect for humans is NOT a good thing to be around and will only end up one way....

 

[tallyho!]

C'mon guys.. no-one here is talking about beating a horse as in a proper cruel BEATING!!!

I honestly think a thwack with a whip or a slap handed out by most of us flimsy-whimsies on here isn't going to break a horses neck, or it's bone or skin.

Honestly, you're all being quite cruel to each other on here and ENFYS it's ALL your fault.

 

[tallyho!]

I can actually imagine it now...

I have a rather funny imagine in my head of a little shetland pony creeping around a stable yard (to the theme of Pink Panther) totally unaware that.. as he edges ever closer to scrumptious 500 bags of unsoaked sugarbeet and that illusive open door.. you are hiding, crouched down behind a bag of food, sweating and brandishing a rolling pin.

..thats made my weekend

Now, If you'll all excuse me, I have a dog to beat up. He's bound to do something wrong at somepoint this evening so I'll just batter him now and get the telling off over and done with.

Ciao

Whoa - who's got PMT this week???

cptrayes is talking about something rather minor so wind your neck in abit -it might not hurt as much then.

 

[darkhorse123]

So what would you do if it was a person on the floor in this situation instead of another horse?? This happened to a friend when we were out on a long ride and untacked the ponies so we could go for a swim. When we saddled up again, hers went for her as she was doing up the girth. Very scary and it took A LOT of beating before he let go.

Im my opinion there is something very very wrong with that horse - he needs intensive trainign from a sympathetic trainer - that behaviour is not normal!

 

[tallyho!]

Im my opinion there is something very very wrong with that horse - he needs intensive trainign from a sympathetic trainer - that behaviour is not normal!

Whatever!!! Horses have a mind of thier own - ANY horse can snap and attack. They are prey animals which lots of people forget and think of them as our fluffy best friends.

They can get defensive and KILL if they really bloody wanted to.

 

[Queenbee]

I am in no means generalising when I say this but I wonder how many of the 'never people' have only ever owned 'foot perfect, been there done it got the t-shirt' horses and what percentage of the people who would hit a horse are the ones that have produced these 'foot perfect' horses to begin with.

On the other hand, there are also those who are in the 'never' club and end up not being able to cope and sending their horse to those in the 'sometimes yes' camp to be sorted out!

Finally there are those like andyspooner who say they are anti violence and would never hit a horse, yet they see absolutely no problem with whacking it around the face with the metal part of a leadrope or a stick, which is apparently ok because it is called a effing carrot stick and PP says its ok (WTF?!) So this is not barbaric, but hitting a horse who is being a git/dangerous/agreessive is?

I repeat, my mare was an off the wall flighty nervous (never been beaten in her life) thing when I got her and she has never had a hit for anything, the method would have put her and handler in more danger and she would not have learnt anything.

My 2 year old youngster is a stupid (never been beaten) thick as pig s hit plank and incredibly thick skinned, I have no qualms with using a well timed smack with him if needs be, this is not often, but I will not have anyone put in danger, and I will not have a rude bad mannered horse, he is anything but scared of me, if he lifts his leg at me, I smack it with the palm of my hand, if he tries to bite me when he is tired then quite frankly I don't give a monkeys nuts if he is tired, I will not be bitten and he will have an immediate smack on the neck and a growl, he is much better with the biting now and will only do it if utterly bored and tired out I (ie after his first bath the other week) But believe me, if he tries to kick me or behaves in a threatening way in the field I will boot him one back and I will not feel guilty for it. And as important as ever is positive reinforcement and praise for everything he gets right

 

[Enfys]

Honestly, you're all being quite cruel to each other on here and ENFYS it's ALL your fault.

and I only asked a little question! Actually it was related to the rope halter versus dually debate.

This has got a bit Topsy-ish, but has been very interesting, and hasn't descended into downright abuse. Just goes to show what a vast range of people there are on here.

 

[Enfys]

Im my opinion there is something very very wrong with that horse - he needs intensive trainign from a sympathetic trainer - that behaviour is not normal!

Bang.

Comment deleted, because it would probably start another long debate.

 

[Flame_]

OMFG at CPTrayes. Seriously? Have I missed something or was she genuinely saying she batters her loose shetland for going into an open feed room?

I've read some pretty barking stuff on here but this one is definitely for the win.

 

[tallyho!]

Bang.

Comment deleted, because it would probably start another long debate.

yarp... I think I did the same....

Simple questions are usually the best

but flippin 'eck - some comments were high & mighty indeed - makes you wonder what planet some people come from... they need a slap

 

[tallyho!]

OMFG at CPTrayes. Seriously? Have I missed something or was she genuinely saying she batters her loose shetland for going into an open feed room?

I've read some pretty barking stuff on here but this one is definitely for the win.

Umm no, come on! I think thats what someone boiled it down to surprise surprise...

 

[tallyho!]

I am in no means generalising when I say this but I wonder how many of the 'never people' have only ever owned 'foot perfect, been there done it got the t-shirt' horses and what percentage of the people who would hit a horse are the ones that have produced these 'foot perfect' horses to begin with.

On the other hand, there are also those who are in the 'never' club and end up not being able to cope and sending their horse to those in the 'sometimes yes' camp to be sorted out!

Finally there are those like andyspooner who say they are anti violence and would never hit a horse, yet they see absolutely no problem with whacking it around the face with the metal part of a leadrope or a stick, which is apparently ok because it is called a effing carrot stick and PP says its ok (WTF?!) So this is not barbaric, but hitting a horse who is being a git/dangerous/agreessive is?

I repeat, my mare was an off the wall flighty nervous (never been beaten in her life) thing when I got her and she has never had a hit for anything, the method would have put her and handler in more danger and she would not have learnt anything.

My 2 year old youngster is a stupid (never been beaten) thick as pig s hit plank and incredibly thick skinned, I have no qualms with using a well timed smack with him if needs be, this is not often, but I will not have anyone put in danger, and I will not have a rude bad mannered horse, he is anything but scared of me, if he lifts his leg at me, I smack it with the palm of my hand, if he tries to bite me when he is tired then quite frankly I don't give a monkeys nuts if he is tired, I will not be bitten and he will have an immediate smack on the neck and a growl, he is much better with the biting now and will only do it if utterly bored and tired out I (ie after his first bath the other week) But believe me, if he tries to kick me or behaves in a threatening way in the field I will boot him one back and I will not feel guilty for it. And as important as ever is positive reinforcement and praise for everything he gets right

There ya go, some sense.

 

[Queenbee]

There ya go, some sense.

Than you

 

[Lady La La]

Tallyho, my comment in which you quoted was clearly (I thought) meant as a lighthearted joke. I dont really think she hides behind bins and batters her pony with rolling pins...
Apologies for being unable to requote it - iphone dictates that I cant, for whatever reason.

If you have a little read back, you'll see I've got nothing against a well deserved smack in order to get horse and or rider out of trouble... but hitting a lose shetland for wondering into an OPEN feed shed as a
PREVENTATIVE method to stop him killing himself on unsoaked beet? Its ridiculous. Just shut the door? Surely?
I dont think i'I've 'boiled it down' to anything other than what it is - mental.
.. Up until that point I'd agreed with most of what she'd said

Also... Not entirely sure as to why you're enquiring about my menstrual cycle - but no, as it goes, I'm not on my period right now

 

[Queenbee]

Dear Forum users please don't escilate and get nasty and dear TFC if they do please don't pull the thread. Unlike some on here I have been quoted loads and am feeling very important and want to get up tomorrow and carry on reading the thread. So please play nice because I am off to bed now.

Ta very muchley

Em AKA God


P.S. the never people will be pleased to hear that ben was good today and only received praise and no brutality, Eb's on the other hand was hot and bothered and stood in the corner of her field well away from me because she didn't want to do exercise in the heat so both horses remained unbeaten tonight


Night all

 

[Queenbee]

Also... Not entirely sure as to why you're enquiring about my menstrual cycle - but no, as it goes, I'm not on my period right now

couldn't go to bed without saying PMSL at this ^^

 

[smiffyimp]

I did this when I was riding my 5 year old along the usual route and he decided he'd go sideways. Put my leg on to move him back over and he was totally ignoring it - and I could see a very nasty and deep ditch that any minute now we were going to disappear down. Yes - he had a real, sharp whack and was told to move forwards not sidewards - which he did and a bad accident was averted. He's 7 now and never had a repeat performance, I'm glad to say.

Yes in this kind of circumstance. But TBH this is probably the worst ive ever had to deal with and a good slap sorted it. Ive never been 'attacked' thankfully but I'm sure I would do what needed to be done at the time - survival!

 

[tallyho!]

Tallyho, my comment in which you quoted was clearly (I thought) meant as a lighthearted joke. I dont really think she hides behind bins and batters her pony with rolling pins...
Apologies for being unable to requote it - iphone dictates that I cant, for whatever reason.

If you have a little read back, you'll see I've got nothing against a well deserved smack in order to get horse and or rider out of trouble... but hitting a lose shetland for wondering into an OPEN feed shed as a
PREVENTATIVE method to stop him killing himself on unsoaked beet? Its ridiculous. Just shut the door? Surely?
I dont think i'I've 'boiled it down' to anything other than what it is - mental.
.. Up until that point I'd agreed with most of what she'd said

Also... Not entirely sure as to why you're enquiring about my menstrual cycle - but no, as it goes, I'm not on my period right now

Ok, I shouldn't have referenced menstrual cycles you're right there. Sorry. It could have explained your outrage...

I did think you took it out of context and I'm sure cpt was having a bit of a laugh - I can't imagine her battering ponies tbh, not anyone here. I just think you were rather ott about it and probably didn't need to be quite so umm personal and I think you just wanted to get riled up about something and picked on her. Unfair imo. At least that's what it looked like to anyone who could be bothered to read it.

Anyway, nuff said. I'm just defending the pragmatics (i.e. the slappers) on here and if you are one then great and I can sort of see your point but then it just got too far and quite sour...

 

[Tormenta]

Whatever!!! Horses have a mind of thier own - ANY horse can snap and attack. They are prey animals which lots of people forget and think of them as our fluffy best friends.

They can get defensive and KILL if they really bloody wanted to.

I actually agree with Darkhorse to an extent. I don't think she/he was trying to be fluffy/pink/soft whatever. I do not think it is part of the norm for a horse to be extremely aggressive. There has to be past circumstance/triggers/defence etc.

If a horse shows that extent of aggression, then they do actually have a problem be it towards geldings/mares/stallions/foals/people. The situation should then be assessed and outcome decided upon.

I once walked into a stable with a horse because I was up helping my Sister and helping her skip out. She had started at the stalls and when I went to pick up a muck fork further down I saw a lovely gelding (Just my type) and made a start on skipping his stable. Ten minutes later she came down looking for me, took one look and told me to get out. Apparently he was a completely and utter barsteward who would attack people and it took two to muck out. For some reason that day, he kept on munching his haynet even when I asked him to move, when I gave him a clap on the neck and walked round him. He never touched me. I think he sensed I had absolutely no idea of what he was supposed to be. He was blind in one eye and had apparently lost his eye after being hit in the face with a shovel from a previous abusive owner. He was great on the yard and the school with people but not in a confined space. I went to see him quite a few times and he offered me the same respect. I still have his photo, 19 years later.

 

[Lady La La]

In all fairness, I'm not the only who despaired totally at her behaviour...
Yes I have a tendancey to be a bit ott with the sarcasm, but it was never intended to be a personal attack - indeed anyone claiming to wack their horse around in a feed room to make it seem like a 'scary place' would get the very same reaction from me. I dont think I took what she said out of context, and I genuinely do think she's a bit bonkers... but I'll try and conduct myself in a less idiotic manner next time. You have my word

 

[tallyho!]

I actually agree with Darkhorse to an extent. I don't think she/he was trying to be fluffy/pink/soft whatever. I do not think it is part of the norm for a horse to be extremely aggressive. There has to be past circumstance/triggers/defence etc.

If a horse shows that extent of aggression, then they do actually have a problem be it towards geldings/mares/stallions/foals/people. The situation should then be assessed and outcome decided upon.

Yes but again, out of context. Darkhorse commented on a horse that went mental that was otherwise lovely and was happy to go swimming etc - sounds like a dream horse. Without knowing the history darkhorse said that horse needs help.

Agree, but I'm not gonna stand there and assess what my horse needs whilst it's kicking the **** out of me. I'm going to either defend myself or run away. THEN decide to to either put it down or try again.

MY point was that you can't walk around assessing things methodically when things like that happen, you just react. You cant help it, it's in your very nature. Just like a horse does and you CANNOT control that however well you train a horse. Rather, you need to be walking around remindeing yourself that the horse has free will and could turn and bite you despite giving you a soft whicker that very morning.

 

[rubysmum]

i've obvioulsy had a super bad day [ & no - i am NOT on any menstrual cycle] as i have punched one & hit another with a lead rope
as i weigh 12 stone & the mare weighs in at over 600kg & baby cob at over 500 - i dont think they are physically or emotionally scarred
they both know the rules for leaving a stable/being brought in from the field
& both clearly needed reminding today that I choose the speed & way of moving them around the yard
incidentallly, they may not have been scarred but i have some very attractive purple toes now from the barging at the gate incident

 

[Enfys]

Anyway, nuff said. I'm just defending the pragmatics (i.e. the slappers) on here QUOTE]

Oh Good grief! Did you really call some Slappers?

Right then, do you all consider yourself a Slapper, a Petter, a Growler or something else?

 

[tallyho!]

Anyway, nuff said. I'm just defending the pragmatics (i.e. the slappers) on here QUOTE]

Oh Good grief! Did you really call some Slappers?

Right then, do you all consider yourself a Slapper, a Petter, a Growler or something else?

Yes I did!!! I'm most definitely a happy slapper

But you've just labeled GROWLER!!! LMFAO!!!! :