Will it never end?

[PapaverFollis]

I just seem to be finding out about more and more threatening things in the horse's environment all the time. I feel overwhelmed by the responsibility of just keeping them alive. I've always just chucked them in a field after checking for big holes, ragwort and that the fences are adequate before. But now; I've been spraying alsike clover (never heard of it until I was like ooooo, what those pretty pink and white clover then? Goggle goggle...) and there's still some out there. The spray itself means I can't use their poop on the garden without killing everything once they are grazing on there... this is after feeling really relieved that I didn't have a field full of corn spurry again, but no - just replaced by a new problem.

Now I've found that the small area of grass I've got that I didn't top (because it's just the walkway between yard and field) have got patches of Ergot fungus on the seed heads. So aaaaaalll the grass on the croft that I haven't topped might need strimming, collecting and burning to try and prevent THAT proliferating. I don't know if I need to do aaaaalll the grass or just the bits they might end up eating.

Plus there's a couple of patches of horse tail fern that I'm just keeping an eye on and the sycamore seeds of course.

What's going on? Have I just been lucky up until now? Am I finding problems that aren't really problems?

I'm sure there's other things that I've forgotten too. I used to think avoiding yew and ragwort would mean everything was OK.

It seems like every time I hear about a new thing I go...hmmm I wonder if... and then... yes, yes there it is.

?

I just want to try not to kill my horses. This seems impossible!

 

[PapaverFollis]

Oh yeah, and there's the effing ticks as well of course!

 

[Labaire]

Ergot is rife this year as are ticks! I am about to turn out on summer pasture which is an interesting topography anyway consisting of kaimes and a meadow. This morning I find a badger has built a new set on one of the main horse pathways, hidden in chest deep grass. I also have some horsetail in this field. The more you know the worse it is.I pull any ragwort, fence off the worst of the horsetail and trust to their pony instincts wrt the terrain. It’s a fabulous field in many respects.

I’ve been using this field 4-5months per year for 8 years and have never seen the grass so high tbh, this after they were on it for a month in may.

 

[splashgirl45]

although i really miss having a horse i dont miss the constant worrying, is she too cold/wet, has she got enough shelter from the sun, is she too fat/thin, are the fields safe,fencing/ragwort, etc.,etc, etc......its a constant worry when you know of all the things that can go wrong, i dont envy that part of horse ownership

 

[cauda equina]

A sturdy ride-on mower with a collector is great for weed control.
I dig my ragwort and mow anything else I'm worried about
If it's not where the horses are grazing I don't bother collecting it
Most weeds give up eventually (or at least become less vigorous) if you keep at them

 

[Shilasdair]

I have been thinking of buying some land back home - but you are not a great advert for it, PF!

 

[SEL]

I've just bought some land and need to write a list of things to start worrying about!!

 

[PapaverFollis]

Ride on mower is the next thing on my list of desires. Which are many. The area with ergot that the horses will have access too is mercifully small so it'll be strip and collect. It is too long for the walk behind mowerabd the collecting bag on that would be full in about 30 seconds.

I'd never even bliddy heard of alsike clover and ergot until this year. I want to stop learning stuff now, thanks.

 

[PapaverFollis]

Also, I don't know if this is just me and my processing difficulties, but I can never find the information I need... like exactly HOW MUCH of a problem something is. If I do A can B happen? Etc etc etc.

New rule...no grass will be going to seed on this croft ever again.

 

[PurBee]

I completely relate PF!

When i found about alsike clover - which i call ‘ass-lick clover’ because when i first discovered it i read it wrong ? ….slobbers and staggers for horses…not nice…. i went hunting in my fields to identify clover. it got a bit confusing because you can have red and white clover cross breed to create a pink coloured clover. Yet not all pinky clover is alsike clover. The way to tell is the leaves. If the leaves are normal clover shaped and just green , then its alsike. If there is a ‘V’ on the leaf, its a ‘relatively safe’ clover for horses - when i say relatively i mean, they can have some but not be in a field with over 20% clover due to ALL older growth clover harbouring a toxin, which research isnt totally decided whether the toxin is in the stem or leaf. But certainly the older the clover plant , and hay clover, has a higher chance of harbouring the toxin.
So my conclusion with clovers is avoid alsike as much as possible, but a weeny bit wont hurt…most other red and white clovers safe, alpine clovers - yet only amounts in moderation.

I once got hay advertised as mixed grasses by specialist equine hay suppliers as perfect for horses - it had 25% dry weight thick stemmy alpine clover, 20% alfalfa, many other weeds and about 20% actual grass! My research about clover was due to that bodged attempt at hoping equine feed merchants actually know what horses should be eating ?

Most toxic weeds they can have ‘some of’ - except yew….a mouthful can kill.
even small mouthful of ragwort they can handle, but its best avoided as it seeds so readily and makes the risk of field full of the stuff a lot higher.

horsetail blocks vitamin B1, essential for metabolism and nerve health so a field full of it not good, but here and there is ok.

The best land management i’ve experienced by experimentation is to not allow bare patches. Horses graze close and scar the top layer with their antics….so allowing rest and repair helps enormously from having mother nature filling in bare patches with weeds.
I annually have seed on hand to throw around and roll damaged areas. Also fling some muck on the soil to aid mineral enrichment. I got lime(calcium)/magnesium pellets this year and that helped thicken up the grass.

If we dont remineralise the top soil with muck or pellet nutrition and grazers keep taking grass off, the topsoil gets depleted of nutrients even to sustain good grass growth, so weeds move in which have a deeper root system to be able to pull more mineral nutrition from the lower soils, where grass roots dont reach. Hence we can end up with a field full of weeds when heavily grazed year in year our, without adding anything back to replenish top soil.

The only way au natural systems work and dont suffer weeds, is if they dont poop pick, have 1 horse for every 3 acres. So the land isnt heavily grazed, tore up and the poops if harrowed replenish some nutrition. But of course there’s the worm cycle issue at commercial yards. Works best on a home system than multi-horse yard system, as most yards dont have enough land to cater for 1 horse gets 3 acres.

So in short, dont overgraze, rotate and rest when its short, re-seed bare areas annually, apply some topsoil nutrition if you poop pick, and if there is a current weed problem, keep topping them before they are about to flower, so the weeds cant propagate seeds.

I had 1 field full of waist high bunches of rushes. 40 years of wilding, and water-logged, rushes only grew there. I kept cutting it annually, twice a year. Between the rushes grass grew. I never re-seeded this field. Continued cutting annually. More grass grew. Allowed horses to graze it once 50% grass achieved. Them stomping around weakened the rush clumps further, and grass started growing in the clumps of rushes. Year 4 i put a drizzle of rotted horse manure, and the next year. So now its a field of mostly grass with some strands of rushes growing singly. 5% at most.

We can transform bad land into good. It takes some years if its really ‘bad…..waterlogged, weedy, crap soil. Luckily i didnt have crap soil in that field. Apparently an old timer neighbour told me that field “produced the best hay in the parish”
decades ago!
Now its a really lovely field. Judicious grazing and some muck has helped loads.

 

[PurBee]

I have been thinking of buying some land back home - but you are not a great advert for it, PF!

View land late june/july to really see what grows there - weeds and everything will be in full growth by then. Worst time to view land is winter-time...everything is small, dormant and/or eaten by wildlife, so you’ll never really see what grows in abundance.

 

[MrsMozartleto]

Land management does test one's mental and physical capabilities that's for sure.

 

[Fruitcake]

Argh! I hadn’t even heard of Ergot fungus until reading this. Had a quick Google as I like to be aware of these things. Thought I’d better have a quick look at the long grass in the two fields we were planning on strip grazing this winter and low and behold, there are patches of ryegrass complete with these black bits! ?

How on Earth do I get rid of it?

 

[PapaverFollis]

Oh Fruitcake, I'm so sorry! From what I've read I think you have to top it, bale it and burn it. ? I'm going to be strimming and raking it up to burn because mine is only a walkway so not worth trying to get machines in. Thankfully we knocked the main field grass down to get at the alsike clover!

 

[PapaverFollis]

I was out today with some hand sheers filling a feed bag up with the obvious bits!

 

[Fruitcake]

I think that’s what I’m going to have to do with one of the fields as there are a few patches in there and I think that would be doable. The other one seems strewn with waist-height ryegrass though. I’m reluctant to cut to bale as would imagine the sores will drop to the ground then(?)

Argh!

 

[HashRouge]

I'm having such a nightmare with ticks, I can't cope with anything else. I think I might just close my eyes when I walk through the field and not inspect any plants too closely. I'd never even heard of alsike clover before!

 

[PapaverFollis]

I think that’s what I’m going to have to do with one of the fields as there are a few patches in there and I think that would be doable. The other one seems strewn with waist-height ryegrass though. I’m reluctant to cut to bale as would imagine the sores will drop to the ground then(?)

Argh!

The Facebook group I'm in where I discovered that this was a thing are all cutting, baling and burning I think. The fruiting bodies seem pretty firmly stuck to the seedheads.

 

[Fruitcake]

The Facebook group I'm in where I discovered that this was a thing are all cutting, baling and burning I think. The fruiting bodies seem pretty firmly stuck to the seedheads.

Thanks. I might look that group up too. Might have to cut and bale the worst field then. Luckily, the one we were starting the strip grazing on is the one with only a few clumps so I'll probably spend my Bank Holiday with a set of secateurs and a tub trug and try to at least sort that out.

I can't believe I've never heard of this! What a nightmare!

 

[PapaverFollis]

I think it is the Land Management for Horses group I've been seeing the posts on but I'm on a few different plant/horse groups so it might not be.

I'd heard of Ergotism in humans but thought it was one of those things like Goiter that is kind of not a concern anymore. Have never heard on it in relation to horses and grazing.

I'm glad I had a whinge though if it means your horses don't get ill now! I'm just sorry it's a pain in the backside job for you now too though!

 

[GSD Woman]

Is it possible to mow short, collect the bits and then overseed with a desirable clover? I have several bare spots in my grass and some of those spots are hard packed crud soil. I'm finding the local feed and seed has recommended excellent clovers for the area. I can't use it to seed the chicken run because the seed is treated and shouldn't be used as feed.
Also, can you rent goats to take out the weeds? They're being used in the eastern part of the US to keep invasive plants in check. I'm looking to rent some to get rid of porcelain berry and English ivy.
Good luck getting rid of those nasty plants.

 

[Keith_Beef]

I just found a video by Jason Kingsley about poisonous plants in his hayfield. In it, he pronounces ragwort at "raggit".

 

[rabatsa]

I think it is the Land Management for Horses group I've been seeing the posts on but I'm on a few different plant/horse groups so it might not be.

I'd heard of Ergotism in humans but thought it was one of those things like Goiter that is kind of not a concern anymore. Have never heard on it in relation to horses and grazing.

I'm glad I had a whinge though if it means your horses don't get ill now! I'm just sorry it's a pain in the backside job for you now too though!

I joined that facebook group but left soon after as I thought that quite a bit of it was twaddle and not suitable for me and the methods I use. I also do not recommend it for novices as I feel it can promote bad practices. The idea behind some stuff is good but easy to misinterpret and so be done wrong, as in a case of actually seeing what is meant rather than just a small snapshot.

 

[southerncomfort]

Currently trying to find someone to spray the massive patch of horsetail in a corner of my winter paddock. I grow it up as foggage so I hadn't noticed it. It's not a huge paddock as it is and I need them in there beginning of October.

I do often feel that horse ownership is at least 80% pure anxiety and stress!

Keeping them alive feels like a full time job!!

 

[The Xmas Furry]

I joined that facebook group but left soon after as I thought that quite a bit of it was twaddle and not suitable for me and the methods I use. I also do not recommend it for novices as I feel it can promote bad practices. The idea behind some stuff is good but easy to misinterpret and so be done wrong, as in a case of actually seeing what is meant rather than just a small snapshot.

I did the same, friend added me to the group. I read enough to roll my eyes and left!

 

[Labaire]

I joined that facebook group but left soon after as I thought that quite a bit of it was twaddle and not suitable for me and the methods I use. I also do not recommend it for novices as I feel it can promote bad practices. The idea behind some stuff is good but easy to misinterpret and so be done wrong, as in a case of actually seeing what is meant rather than just a small snapshot.

The Dr L Schofield one? If so I disagree-this is a professional agronomist who just takes a hard line against the idea the horses 'self medicate' on toxic plants and doesnt like to see overgrazed, weedy paddocks. There's much useful info in there, you dont have to take all of in on board. If its not that one then apologies.

WRT ergot, its not only that you have to be careful of with standing hay and mould-standing hay is something I have change my mind about over the years and wouldn't do it now if I didnt have to, and not without feeding mycosorb alongside.


OP try not to get too bogged down, I know it can feel overwhelming. If you have a croft then you're in Scotland? I am not an expert but do deal with Scottish grazing-PM me if you like, even if its just to have a moan. Thats mine gone out on the 'summer' field this morning-they of course, think its bloody Christmas come early.

 

[PapaverFollis]

I feed micosorb as standard, year round. Will push up to max dose in autumn.

We very high topped the back field with a strimmer before it went to seed but the cuttings stayed on the field, I expected them to kind of disappear into the grass in a month or so but they haven't. So I think I'm going to be gathering those up as well. I'm not confident the horses won't eat them and they are mouldy.

I just feel like I'm making a right hash of everything land related to be honest. I had such high hopes for the new planted field but its just been this after that after the other. And my original front field is overgrazed but the horses explode on lusher grass in summer, so not sure how to prevent that.

And I am trying to decide the best way to manage their grazing through the winter and I can't.

And am just so tired of finding out about something and then going out there and oh yes, there it is!! I'm not sure the livery yard experiences and environments were any healthier for the horses... just I didn't actually know about any of it. It not that I mind the work, I knew it would be work. It's the constant multiplication of hazards that stresses me out. Every time I fix something, there's something else.

 

[Pearlsacarolsinger]

Land management does test one's mental and physical capabilities that's for sure.

Put some sheep on - they will sort out most land problems - they will even show you where your fencing needs repair!

 

[PapaverFollis]

Ah but then you have sheep problems...

 

[MrsMozartleto]

Put some sheep on - they will sort out most land problems - they will even show you where your fencing needs repair!

The number of escapee sheep I see around here... ???