Another fatal dog attack

[stormox]

You give the dog other experiences, outlets and interests and you hire a fenced area for off lead ball chasing (which isn't physically (or mentally) great for many dogs anyway), you as the owner find other ways to enrich your dogs life.

Luckily we live in a free country and I can let my dog off the lead and enjoy a nice walk.
Saying all dogs must be kept on leads in case they kill someone is like saying keep all teenagers under lock and key in case they mug or stab someone.

 

[Clodagh]

Luckily we live in a free country and I can let my dog off the lead and enjoy a nice walk.
Saying all dogs must be kept on leads in case they kill someone is like saying keep all teenagers under lock and key in case they mug or stab someone.

I agree with you… but that is exactly what XLB owners are saying. I have no problem with all dogs on leads in built up areas.

 

[poiuytrewq]

Did anyone see a programme recently, I missed the first part but it was a real life hospital type thing where a woman was attacked by 5 dogs at home while she made some food for herself.
Very nasty injuries but alive. Did anyone see that? What was the story? I assume they were her own dogs

 

[twiggy2]

Luckily we live in a free country and I can let my dog off the lead and enjoy a nice walk.
Saying all dogs must be kept on leads in case they kill someone is like saying keep all teenagers under lock and key in case they mug or stab someone.

I was responding only to your post and pointing out there is a very fulfilling life for on lead dogs if effort is put into creating it, it far more effort and can be exhausting, i know that from personal experience but it is more than possible.
I wasn't getting into the all dogs on lead debate,

 

[I'm Dun]

The BBC and, I think ITV, were saying they were not a banned breed but American Bulldogs which are a recognised breed in themselves. We have to be careful about objecting to size or several HHO members will find themselves with banned breeds, such as Great Danes, Mastiffs, etc.

Its not about big dogs, its about XL bullies

I was responding only to your post and pointing out there is a very fulfilling life for on lead dogs if effort is put into creating it, it far more effort and can be exhausting, i know that from personal experience but it is more than possible.
I wasn't getting into the all dogs on lead debate,

I disagree. I geniuinely believe that sight hounds need to run most days. They have been bred for generations to run, there isnt anything you can replace that with.

 

[CrazyMare]

I disagree. I geniuinely believe that sight hounds need to run most days. They have been bred for generations to run, there isnt anything you can replace that with.

I have greyhounds and mine walk miles on lead. They run in the garden but not on walks. I do canicross mine and take them to secure fields but I don't let them off lead day to day.

They are very happy dogs

 

[MurphysMinder]

I was responding only to your post and pointing out there is a very fulfilling life for on lead dogs if effort is put into creating it, it far more effort and can be exhausting, i know that from personal experience but it is more than possible.
I wasn't getting into the all dogs on lead debate,

I was man trailing with my GSD at the weekend. Trainer set a complicated trail with lots of tricky bits, zig zags etc . My girl had to work really hard for 12 minutes until she found the "mispa", and she was shattered at the end, straight in the car and after a good drink went to sleep. Same dog will walk/run off lead for 2/3 hours and seem to have as much energy at the end as at the start , brain work really does tire them.

 

[CorvusCorax]

Mine are only off leash in secure areas/training club and they manage absolutely fine, they are fitter and much younger looking than most of the other dogs I see tear-arsing around past my house on a daily basis.

I'm sorry, but very, very few people want to see a German Shepherd running around in public with no leash, they don't know or care if your dog is well trained, they just see a big dog running around and this can be very unsettling for a lot of people. And this has been my belief since I was a kid, having grown up with the breed and love them dearly. It's not about me or my dogs, it's about public perception. Some people don't want to see any sort of dog, off leash in a public place, I personally don't want to make people feel uncomfortable if they are out for a walk.

Society is getting ever more litigious and incidents are getting more frequent, I keep my dogs on a leash for their own protection and to protect their reputation, as much as to protect anyone else. Where leashes are concerned, it is better looking at it, than for it, as they say. It's one mechanical way to lessen the likelihood of accidents involving dogs in public.

 

[CorvusCorax]

I was man trailing with my GSD at the weekend. Trainer set a complicated trail with lots of tricky bits, zig zags etc . My girl had to work really hard for 12 minutes until she found the "mispa", and she was shattered at the end, straight in the car and after a good drink went to sleep. Same dog will walk/run off lead for 2/3 hours and seem to have as much energy at the end as at the start , brain work really does tire them.

I mean they are a gaiting breed, built to conserve energy, you will never tire them by walking/running.

 

[Smitty]

I was camping last year and my dog is always secured whilst on site. I went off for a shower or something and came back to a lady in the tent next to me who said that he had barked at her and she was petrified until she could see that he was tied up. She was scared of dogs, simple as that. He is about 12" to the shoulder and horribly friendly and nosey. I suspect she made eye contact with him which he took to mean that she would come and make a huge fuss of him.

There are always dogs off lead on sites, even though the rules are to the contrary. I feel so sorry for people who simply do not like, are scared of or allergic to them.

Do we really, as dog owners, have the right to potentially make people feel uncomfortable, scared or even ill merely because we think the dog needs to be off lead? I don't believe we do.

 

[stormox]

Mine are only off leash in secure areas/training club and they manage absolutely fine, they are fitter and much younger looking than most of the other dogs I see tear-arsing around past my house on a daily basis.

I'm sorry, but very, very few people want to see a German Shepherd running around in public with no leash, they don't know or care if your dog is well trained, they just see a big dog running around and this can be very unsettling for a lot of people. And this has been my belief since I was a kid, having grown up with the breed and love them dearly. It's not about me or my dogs, it's about public perception. Some people don't want to see any sort of dog, off leash in a public place, I personally don't want to make people feel uncomfortable if they are out for a walk.

Society is getting ever more litigious and incidents are getting more frequent, I keep my dogs on a leash for their own protection and to protect their reputation, as much as to protect anyone else. Where leashes are concerned, it is better looking at it, than for it, as they say. It's one mechanical way to lessen the likelihood of accidents involving dogs in public.

If I am around people my dog walks to heel, without a lead. If I am in a public place but no one is in sight she can run around. If I am in town she is on a lead.
I know dogs lives can be 'enriched' with dog sports, games, sniffari's and the like.
But I still like relaxing walks, me and my dog, around the footpaths and bridleways.
I don't do it to tire my dog out, I do it because we both enjoy it.

 

[misst]

If I am around people my dog walks to heel, without a lead. If I am in a public place but no one is in sight she can run around. If I am in town she is on a lead.
I know dogs lives can be 'enriched' with dog sports, games, sniffari's and the like.
But I still like relaxing walks, me and my dog, around the footpaths and bridleways.
I don't do it to tire my dog out, I do it because we both enjoy it.

My small dogs are put on lead if another on lead dog approaches. They are put on lead anywhere there is a sign to say to do this regardless of anyone being around etc as it is often to protect other wildlife eg. ground nesting birds. They are on lead on the pavement or in a town park. They are mainly off lead where I live on the common as most of the walkers/owners are dog owners and the dogs mainly friendly. If we see a big dog off lead we go another route.

Mine both have good recall and will sit by my side if I hold something of interest eg food/ball etc to allow others to pass. They go on lead if horses are hacking despite being really good around all horses. They are put on lead around picnics as they would likely raid the picnic if it is on the ground and I think recall may not be good! If people look or sound nervous around dogs I put them on lead.

I love walking round the woods and common with them pottering freely and went to a different area yesterday. They were on lead in the carpark and the path off the car park then had a whole hour and three quarters off lead going a bit bonkers at new smells and places of muddy water to swim in. They were put on lead 3 times during the walk when others were approaching and when I thought mistakenly that horses in the distance would be coming our way. It's not hard to hit a happy medium but it is up to us dog owners to use a lot of common sense and a bit of empathy to others to make it ok for everyone to live together.

 

[splashgirl45]

I walked through my local park this morning completely forgetting it was bank holiday. Usually my dogs are off lead in the park as all of us are locals and know all of the dogs so never a problem, there were families with children so my dogs were on lead most of the time , although they are no threat to children you never know if children are scared of dogs so the best thing is dogs on lead.. if everyone thought about other peoples feelings there wouldn’t be this bad press about dogs

 

[Clodagh]

People are so astounded if your dogs are under control, it’s a sad indictment of the majority.

 

[I'm Dun]

If I am around people my dog walks to heel, without a lead. If I am in a public place but no one is in sight she can run around. If I am in town she is on a lead.
I know dogs lives can be 'enriched' with dog sports, games, sniffari's and the like.
But I still like relaxing walks, me and my dog, around the footpaths and bridleways.
I don't do it to tire my dog out, I do it because we both enjoy it.

same, mine go all over, on buses and trains, through city centres, in cafes, etc etc. they are never any bother, but i wouldnt have them if they couldnt be off lead. mine will ignore people and dogs unless told otherwise, and we walk miles. we rarely see anyone else after the first mile. the youngest is absolutely miserable with no running, hes fine for one day, but the second day hes depressed and flat. a lot of badly behaved dogs would be better with some hard exercise every day

 

[Cortez]

I know I am privileged to have my own land so my dogs can run their arses off whenever they feel like it, but I never have my dogs off lead out in a public place. One of them is very good to recall, one is a bit variable, and the other is a saluki lurcher ('nuff said). Most of my acquaintances are doggie people but some are not, and a few are terrified of dogs. I'd never think of subjecting other people to my extremely friendly and not-entirely-controllable crew, and I don't enjoy meeting other peoples off-lead dogs either.

 

[CorvusCorax]

There's also a bit of realism required for everyone, not just people on this thread. Dogs aren't robots, recall isn't always 100% reliable, we all think our dogs are lovely but neither we as trainers nor they as prey animals are perfect.

A long time ago I lost a dog out of sight (for under an hour, admittedly) in sheep country, next to a fast road, and my Mum had a dog missing for days in the same territory after a visitor let her off the leash.
To me it's too big a gamble, neither of those are experiences I personally wish to repeat, especially when they appear pretty fulfilled by 'doing' and working with/engaging with me rather than belting off in the opposite direction.

I'm not naive enough to think that my current dogs, well, one of them certainly, wouldn't get themselves into some sort of bother if they ran off, so I'm not going to expose them or anyone else to that risk.
The other one is pretty deaf and I'm not sure he can see too well either and it would be irresponsible of me not to be attached to him.
I quite frequently see old, infirm dogs reported lost and wonder how it is allowed to happen.

 

[cauda equina]

It's so much easier for owners to let the dog make its own entertainment than to do it for them

 

[stangs]

a lot of badly behaved dogs would be better with some hard exercise every day

Pretty sure training and some mental stimulation does much more to remove most problem behaviours than the dog running itself ragged.

Trainer I help says they see more dogs with issues because they’re over-exercised than because they’re under-exercised.

 

[I'm Dun]

Pretty sure training and some mental stimulation does much more to remove most problem behaviours than the dog running itself ragged.

Trainer I help says they see more dogs with issues because they’re over-exercised than because they’re under-exercised.

Long walks off lead in different places is mental stimulation, its just one of the things I do. But as I've said a few times, after the first mile out away from a village or town I rarely see another soul and even less often do I see anyone with dogs. I live on a boat and see the same dogs being walked past me every day. The same short walk day in day out, ambling along a tow path looking bored to tears. I see an awful lot of fat dogs as well. I've lived all over the country and its the same everywhere.

I genuinely can't believe anyone would say they have more issues with dogs over exercising than under exercising. Where are they finding all these over exercised dogs with huge issues?!?

 

[CorvusCorax]

I absolutely see dogs who have been over-exercised/over-stimulated.

 

[Cortez]

Vet friends see this all the time, dogs chasing tennis balls being a least favourite activity.

 

[stangs]

Vet friends see this all the time, dogs chasing tennis balls being a least favourite activity.

The classic “we play fetch for two hours every day in the park; I don’t understand why she won’t calm down” usually accompanied by a shepherd/spaniel/collie acting like it’s on cocaine and lunging at anything vaguely ball-shaped that moves.

Long walks off lead in different places is mental stimulation, its just one of the things I do. But as I've said a few times, after the first mile out away from a village or town I rarely see another soul and even less often do I see anyone with dogs. I live on a boat and see the same dogs being walked past me every day. The same short walk day in day out, ambling along a tow path looking bored to tears. I see an awful lot of fat dogs as well. I've lived all over the country and its the same everywhere.

I genuinely can't believe anyone would say they have more issues with dogs over exercising than under exercising. Where are they finding all these over exercised dogs with huge issues?!?

As a reminder: the post of yours that I had responded to stated hard exercise was beneficial for badly behaved dogs.

a) A long walk is not hard exercise.
b) Ambling while looking bored to tears is not a bad behaviour.
c) Being fat is not a bad behaviour.

(Besides, I’m willing to bet many fat dogs will live sounder lives than the dogs who spend hours every week doing somersaults trying to catch tennis balls moving at stupid mph.)

 

[skinnydipper]

Besides, I’m willing to bet many fat dogs will live sounder lives than the dogs who spend hours every week doing somersaults trying to catch tennis balls moving at stupid mph.)

Lugging excess weight around day after day?

Neither are good for dogs' joints.

 

[CorvusCorax]

Broadly agree, but I've never seen a fat dog that wasn't also unsound, it's almost always usually linked, either strain on the joints from the extra weight, being over-walked or exercised to try and get the fat off but still feeding too much/feeding crap or not being sound means the dog is not moving freely and will therefore never get fit.

 

[maisie06]

I was man trailing with my GSD at the weekend. Trainer set a complicated trail with lots of tricky bits, zig zags etc . My girl had to work really hard for 12 minutes until she found the "mispa", and she was shattered at the end, straight in the car and after a good drink went to sleep. Same dog will walk/run off lead for 2/3 hours and seem to have as much energy at the end as at the start , brain work really does tire them.

Same here with spaniels - they will run all day doing their own thing, but get them working, hunting for you, stopping and waiting to be sent for retrieves, stopping and redirecting so they are always waiting for instructions tires them out!! Mine did 20 mins sitting steady this morning with some direction work thrown in, he's knackered now!

 

[maisie06]

The classic “we play fetch for two hours every day in the park; I don’t understand why she won’t calm down” usually accompanied by a shepherd/spaniel/collie acting like it’s on cocaine and lunging at anything vaguely ball-shaped that moves.


)

Part of my spaniel training involves sitting and watching other people chucking balls for their dogs and watching at the local tennis courts while sitting still. I only use tennis balls as a find to get them hunting nicely, never throw them!

 

[Teaselmeg]

Exercise tires the body not the brain. People think wearing out a dog with separation anxiety will help when you want to leave it alone, it doesn't.

A heavily exercised dog will be full of adrenaline and likely sore somewhere, all that contributes to reactivity. Scent work, enrichment etc tires the brain and keeps the cortisol/adrenaline levels low, so you have a dog that can learn and think.

 

[equinerebel]

Mine is always on lead unless at home or in a secure dog paddock for her own safety as much as anyone elses. I'm not willing to risk someone misreading a situation and accusing my dog of something that could cost her her life.

She is a collie and is also not allowed balls anywhere near her for the reasons stated above.

 

[Clodagh]

Mine are very rarely on a lead, but I do live very rurally. I disagree that all dogs can become out of control. My five now, at their state of training and life, would never fail to stop or recall. Their life can depend on it so it’s instilled.