Another fatal dog attack

[CrunchieBoi]

Today’s American bulldog horror story is brought to you by the phrase ‘what were the RSPCA thinking?’ According to the lady fostering this one (which caused such catastrophic damage to her arm during a 20 minute+ attack that her arm had to be amputated) the RSPCA knew the dog had previously attacked two women and rehomed it with her without telling her.

Dog owner who lost arm after pet bit her is suing RSPCA for £200K

WARNING: GRAPHIC CONTENT - Joanna Harris, of Crowborough, East Sussex, said the RSPCA failed to tell her that the dog had attacked two women eight months before it set upon her.

www.dailymail.co.uk

The sheer size of that dog's head is incredible, surely it would have fit the criteria to be classed as a pitbull?

 

[rara007]

Pitbulls are actually quite lean headed.

 

[Smitty]

Another

Police shoot dog in Derby after man is seriously hurt

Firearms officers killed the "out of control" dog after deciding it posed a risk to the public.

www.bbc.co.uk

I saw that this afternoon. Its slowly becoming like Zombie Apocolypse. That sounded to me more of a drug type operation though and possible "weapon" dog.

Ah, apologies, I read it somewhere else and substances were removed from the property, along with three adjoining streets being cordoned off.

 

[skinnydipper]

The sheer size of that dog's head is incredible, surely it would have fit the criteria to be classed as a pitbull?

American Pitbull according to the Express

 

[twiggy2]

Indiscriminate breeding with little thought for the health and welfare of the dogs has always produced poor temperaments. German shepherds, rotties and dobes all went through it as have other breeds, including cocker poos and the like.
These big bully types have fighting dogs in their breeding and this can mean they fight against pain rather than backing off from it, terriers can be the same.
These days so many people want to 'save' the 'misunderstood' dog, have a protection dog with no understanding of what that is, have a status symbol or seem to think animals are disposable items.
Guard dogs of old were bred to be suspicious of strangers but were generally in a stable home, outside with acess to space and often other dog company or at least attended to by a known person or two, guardian breeds were tended to by a known person on a regular basis too as the flock were moved daily and the shepherd generally lived nomadically with the flock or at least on the hill nearby.
Combine the poor breeding, nervousness, strength of the dog, lack of socialisation, lack of exercise/mental stimulation, training, owner knowledge, increase in pet ownership, its hardly surprising that attacks are becoming more frequent it really is a big worry though.
I also do think that how the average dog is kept is not ideal, very few dogs hike out from a to b on long routes with their owner, they leave the house once or twice a day absolutely full of adrenalin and go to a local area with lot of other dog in the same mindset, then these dogs go wild and 'let of some steam' many of these dogs lack basic social skills, they don't know how to ignore other, say hello properly or how to diffuse a situation, owners often either have no control or panic, ball throwing is king adding adrenalin, high prey drive activity, a resource to guard to a group of dogs who do not know each other.
Even back when I was a kid dogs often roamed, they sorted out their status with each other with no human interference, they scrapped occasionally but rarely did anyone need attention for wounds, when I took my dog for a walk I didn't often see other dogs walking around the park, I am not sure how much dog ownership has risen or if people walked in different places then but dog ownership was different.
I dont know what the answer is, I dont believe we can turn the clock back, one thing I do know I am sure about though is that any dog that has shown any aggression driven by anything should be PTS if it ends up in a rehoming facility, to rehome them is just plain foolish, I hope the lady who lost her arm gets far more than 200k, I can't imagine going through an ordeal like that.

 

[CrunchieBoi]

American Pitbull according to the Express

Are they not a banned breed? I thought they were.

 

[stangs]

Are they not a banned breed? I thought they were.

The Express is talking nonsense. There's no way that dog would fall within the dimensions of a pitbull type, much too big and wide. If there was any suspicion that it did fall within the dimension, they would have had to measure it and PTS if it did. DDA means that any pitbull, regardless of if they've dangerous or not, can't be rehomed.

 

[Errin Paddywack]

The Express is talking nonsense. There's no way that dog would fall within the dimensions of a pitbull type, much too big and wide. If there was any suspicion that it did fall within the dimension, they would have had to measure it and PTS if it did. DDA means that any pitbull, regardless of if they've dangerous or not, can't be rehomed.

Shows what rubbish the DDA is. That sort of dog is potentially even more dangerous than a pitbull.

 

[maisie06]

Today’s American bulldog horror story is brought to you by the phrase ‘what were the RSPCA thinking?’ According to the lady fostering this one (which caused such catastrophic damage to her arm during a 20 minute+ attack that her arm had to be amputated) the RSPCA knew the dog had previously attacked two women and rehomed it with her without telling her.

Dog owner who lost arm after pet bit her is suing RSPCA for £200K

WARNING: GRAPHIC CONTENT - Joanna Harris, of Crowborough, East Sussex, said the RSPCA failed to tell her that the dog had attacked two women eight months before it set upon her.

www.dailymail.co.uk

The RSPCA should PTS any XL Bully type rather than rehome them, so many much more suitable breeds stuck in kennels, these dogs are so dangerous. A local lady on her horse was attacked by one when it was being walked for an RSPCA rehoming centre - they tried to hide evidence about the dog but she took them to court and won.

 

[skinnydipper]

The man seriously injured in the Derby dog attack has died.

 

[skinnydipper]

Are they not a banned breed? I thought they were.

Yes, they are.

2015. https://www.mirror.co.uk/news/uk-news/more-3000-pit-bulls-britain-5762750

 

[Clodagh]

Indiscriminate breeding with little thought for the health and welfare of the dogs has always produced poor temperaments. German shepherds, rotties and dobes all went through it as have other breeds, including cocker poos and the like.
These big bully types have fighting dogs in their breeding and this can mean they fight against pain rather than backing off from it, terriers can be the same.
These days so many people want to 'save' the 'misunderstood' dog, have a protection dog with no understanding of what that is, have a status symbol or seem to think animals are disposable items.
Guard dogs of old were bred to be suspicious of strangers but were generally in a stable home, outside with acess to space and often other dog company or at least attended to by a known person or two, guardian breeds were tended to by a known person on a regular basis too as the flock were moved daily and the shepherd generally lived nomadically with the flock or at least on the hill nearby.
Combine the poor breeding, nervousness, strength of the dog, lack of socialisation, lack of exercise/mental stimulation, training, owner knowledge, increase in pet ownership, its hardly surprising that attacks are becoming more frequent it really is a big worry though.
I also do think that how the average dog is kept is not ideal, very few dogs hike out from a to b on long routes with their owner, they leave the house once or twice a day absolutely full of adrenalin and go to a local area with lot of other dog in the same mindset, then these dogs go wild and 'let of some steam' many of these dogs lack basic social skills, they don't know how to ignore other, say hello properly or how to diffuse a situation, owners often either have no control or panic, ball throwing is king adding adrenalin, high prey drive activity, a resource to guard to a group of dogs who do not know each other.
Even back when I was a kid dogs often roamed, they sorted out their status with each other with no human interference, they scrapped occasionally but rarely did anyone need attention for wounds, when I took my dog for a walk I didn't often see other dogs walking around the park, I am not sure how much dog ownership has risen or if people walked in different places then but dog ownership was different.
I dont know what the answer is, I dont believe we can turn the clock back, one thing I do know I am sure about though is that any dog that has shown any aggression driven by anything should be PTS if it ends up in a rehoming facility, to rehome them is just plain foolish, I hope the lady who lost her arm gets far more than 200k, I can't imagine going through an ordeal like that.

Agree. You only used to see working dogs and some lap/companion dogs. You only had a dog if you could provide it with a decent life. Entitled us nowadays get a dog no matter if the breed or our lifestyle is suitable.
Spaniel Aid and Black Retriever x both rehome endless dogs with repeat bite and even attack histories. I know humans have caused that, and it’s a shame, but just pts. There’s plenty that haven’t looking for a new home.
Add that to it being legal to use a dog as a weapon, unlike knives and guns, and it’s beyond hope.

 

[ester]

Not sure I'd take the express as accurate on most things.

 

[Clodagh]

Not sure I'd take the express as accurate on most things.

Except the weather. They are very good about the weather. Right about every 300th headline.

 

[stangs]

The RSPCA should PTS any XL Bully type rather than rehome them, so many much more suitable breeds stuck in kennels, these dogs are so dangerous. A local lady on her horse was attacked by one when it was being walked for an RSPCA rehoming centre - they tried to hide evidence about the dog but she took them to court and won.

Putting dogs to sleep based on type is what already happens and it doesn’t work. Hundreds of potentially rehomable dogs are already killed yearly based on the same brilliant logic. You can’t just keep changing the banned type and expecting dangerous dogs to disappear. PTS XL bullies but leave behind the Akita x Caucasian Shepherds, the Cane Corso x Boerboels: do you really think that’s going to solve anything long term?

The RSPCA currently have this dog available for adoption. In March, Battersea had an XL bully for adoption who was fine with people, fine with city noises, fine with other dogs - his main problem was that he was too friendly around other dogs. You’re telling me that you’d put him to sleep, by nature of type alone, but leave the bitch be?

If you have to PTS any potential rehome, it should be dogs that have shown aggressive or highly reactive tendencies irrespective of breed. Any reactive dog has the potential to do serious damage, if not to a human then to someone’s beloved pet.

When you think of how many bull types have gone through rescue doors, the fact there there’s only been a handful of cases of this nature - all of which have been RSPCA dogs - suggests that the problem is less the breed, and more the RSPCA.

 

[Dexter]

I'd PTS that one as well I'm afraid. The second I read they don't know her history.Combined with the breed, the nervousness and sheer size means I'd PTS. As everyone keeps saying, these dogs are ok providing they are well bred and trained correctly from a puppy. No one has any idea about this one. Its a risk I wouldn't take.

 

[twiggy2]

The RSPCA should PTS any XL Bully type rather than rehome them, so many much more suitable breeds stuck in kennels, these dogs are so dangerous. A local lady on her horse was attacked by one when it was being walked for an RSPCA rehoming centre - they tried to hide evidence about the dog but she took them to court and won.

I dont agree, ANY dog of any breed or type in rescue that shows any aggression or nervous/sharp behaviour should be put to sleep, many bullies are lovely.

 

[skinnydipper]

Not sure I'd take the express as accurate on most things.

I'm not an expert but my guess would be that the dog in question is a cross, a hybrid.

It's facies seem different somehow from an American Bulldog.





American Bulldog on the left, APBT on the right.

 

[Mrs. Jingle]

I'd PTS that one as well I'm afraid. The second I read they don't know her history.Combined with the breed, the nervousness and sheer size means I'd PTS. As everyone keeps saying, these dogs are ok providing they are well bred and trained correctly from a puppy. No one has any idea about this one. Its a risk I wouldn't take.

Exactly my thoughts when I read the description, I cannot imagine why they think trying to rehome the poor dog is beneficial to anyone.

 

[Cortez]

I'm not an expert but my guess would be that the dog in question is a cross, a hybrid.

It facies seem different somehow from an American Bulldog.

View attachment 112138



American Bulldog on the left, APBT on the right.

There seems to be a great deal of variation in the bull breeds, I'd call them a type rather than actual breed. I've unfortunately seen a fair number of American pitbull fighting dogs and they varied greatly in size, musculature and head/jaw shape. The XL bullies look like an attempt to just exaggerate and supersize a pitbull.

Whatever, there is no need whatsoever to breed dogs designed to fight.

 

[skinnydipper]

If you have to PTS any potential rehome, it should be dogs that have shown aggressive or highly reactive tendencies irrespective of breed. Any reactive dog has the potential to do serious damage, if not to a human then to someone’s beloved pet.

Reactivity and proactive aggression are different.

Reactive dogs are not necessarily aggressive dogs.

IMO any dog showing proactive aggression should be PTS.

 

[Moobli]

Agree with the Southend Dog Trainer in this video about the XL Bully breed.

 

[cauda equina]

I got as far as Adam saying 'There's no need for breeds to be banned - we can just educate the public'
Good luck with that then mate!

 

[conniegirl]

Agree with the Southend Dog Trainer in this video about the XL Bully breed.

Utterly disgusting that every single one of the dogs has cropped ears!

 

[SadKen]

I think he is absolutely right in his assessment of the problem. but I doubt his proposal would work. The bad people don’t care about the health of temperament of the dog they are breeding. They care about the ££££ they are going to make. Education makes no difference.

Same for dog licences. Good people will get them. Bad people won’t. If you wanted to tackle it you would have to have a police programme actively checking and seizing dogs that were unlicensed, PTS and massive fine.

Same for training. Good people train. Bad people don’t. Idiots don’t. Or they train the wrong behaviours as described in the video.

Frankly if the father of the baby described in the video really did buy a giant XL bully for buttons in order to breed it, he should have been charged with manslaughter. Stupid, stupid man.

Also weren’t the ears of those XLs in the video cropped? Isn’t that illegal never mind cruel?

 

[Moobli]

Utterly disgusting that every single one of the dogs has cropped ears!

Agree! Yuck!

 

[stangs]

Utterly disgusting that every single one of the dogs has cropped ears!

Not of all of them, but it does go hand in hand with what they’re saying about backyard breeders.

Plus, a lot of dogs - mainly ones with rarer colouring - are still getting imported to breed, hence the ears.

 

[Moobli]

I think he is absolutely right in his assessment of the problem. but I doubt his proposal would work. The bad people don’t care about the health of temperament of the dog they are breeding. They care about the ££££ they are going to make. Education makes no difference.

Same for dog licences. Good people will get them. Bad people won’t. If you wanted to tackle it you would have to have a police programme actively checking and seizing dogs that were unlicensed, PTS and massive fine.

Same for training. Good people train. Bad people don’t. Idiots don’t. Or they train the wrong behaviours as described in the video.

Frankly if the father of the baby described in the video really did buy a giant XL bully for buttons in order to breed it, he should have been charged with manslaughter. Stupid, stupid man.

Also weren’t the ears of those XLs in the video cropped? Isn’t that illegal never mind cruel?

The problem is that banning breeds or types doesn’t work either but surely something needs to change?

 

[ycbm]

The man seriously injured in the Derby dog attack has died.

And someone with the same surname, 2 years different in age, presumably his brother, arrested.
.

 

[stangs]

I think he is absolutely right in his assessment of the problem. but I doubt his proposal would work. The bad people don’t care about the health of temperament of the dog they are breeding. They care about the ££££ they are going to make. Education makes no difference.

Same for dog licences. Good people will get them. Bad people won’t. If you wanted to tackle it you would have to have a police programme actively checking and seizing dogs that were unlicensed, PTS and massive fine.

Same for training. Good people train. Bad people don’t. Idiots don’t. Or they train the wrong behaviours as described in the video.

Education alone won’t solve the issue of backyard breeders, but it could hopefully reduce the number of attacks by dogs of well-meaning owners who bought the wrong dog and didn’t know how to manage it.

I’ve posted about this case before, but look at https://www.mirror.co.uk/news/uk-news/mum-woman-killed-dog-as-27894532

This is the kind of owner who could have used a video like that - just education in general about what they’re really getting into - before they bought.

Bad people are a trickier problem but we should at least try stop well-meaning owners and their family members getting hurt.