Anyone seen swelling like this?

[TPO]

That's interesting. Perhaps it shouldn't be used on certain types of wound then? A youngster I had suffered a bad injury, I used manuka honey on a dressing, no trace or scarring.

https://forums.horseandhound.co.uk/threads/manuka-honey-wounds.655296/#post-12344496

Found the post and I was remembering wrong. The thread was about proud flesh. I couldn't hand on heart remember what was said in person.

He is still to get his steroid cream applied 2x a day and I dont want to risk anything interfering with that.

I dont even know if the hole should be encouraged to heal or if it's good that there is an exit point? That's something I'll need to ask because I just accepted that I was to keep on doing what I've been doing with an emphasis on keeping the hole clean.

Yeah, I honestly dont know what to do for the best.

Hes wearing socks with his hoof boots but still the boots are rubbing his heels. Under normal circumstances there is a gradual build up to wearing his boots to condition his hooves, much like working barefoot from the field. However this isnt normal circumstances. Hes worn his toes right back and they are bruised. I dont know.whats the lesser evil. Trying to just use boots for a couple of walks a day but then his toes but then what about his heels and I really just dont know what to do for the best

 

[Britestar]

Before

 

[TPO]

Manuka can help clean up a wound. Currently using it on an abcess. Has really helped. Don't discount it.

I'll ask the vet about it. Thanks

 

[Britestar]

I'll ask the vet about it. Thanks

My friend is a tissue viability specialist. The vets ask her for advice. She recommends manuka, hence my use of it in this case.
This horse belongs to a Vet!

 

[TPO]

My friend is a tissue viability specialist. The vets ask her for advice. She recommends manuka, hence my use of it in this case.
This horse belongs to a Vet!

Just in case my vet okays it what do you purchase and from where?

Time isn't on my side and company despatch times seem to be longer (covid?) so need a reliable and quick delivery service. Thank you

 

[Britestar]

Vets should have it in stock. Activon or a generic. Failing that a pharmacy should have it too.
I just use it on a melolin dressing, then soffban over the top, cotton wool and then either a vetrap or old fashioned exercise bandage.

Just tight enough to keep it all in place.

 

[SEL]

I used incredibly expensive manuka honey from a local health food shop on a horse who tried to slice it's hoof off. We had a sterile pad and bandage over it - vet provided antibiotics too. It worked.

No use if its the right thing to do in your situation - but I really hope you get a break soon

 

[DabDab]

Holland and Barrett sell manuka at varying levels of potency.

For his hooves would it be possible to dry poultice with excess padding? Some thick leather or rubber/stiff foam pad on the hoof sole with vet wrap over to hold in place

 

[cobgoblin]

If there is still pus coming out of the hole, I would think its best to let it drain until its all out before trying to promote any wound healing.

 

[Lurfy]

I have used manuka honey over the years with success, but never on a wound like Vinnie has, so did not mention it here.

I would do as you are doing and stick to the cortisone cream and not add anything which may interfere with it.

As for the tooth removal, that would really pi** me off. The horse is having a shi* time, lets not make it shi**er!

 

[ITPersonnage]

Exactly, this course of treatment seems to be working, let's not bu**er it up shall we ?

 

[brighteyes]

https://forums.horseandhound.co.uk/threads/manuka-honey-wounds.655296/#post-12344496

Found the post and I was remembering wrong. The thread was about proud flesh. I couldn't hand on heart remember what was said in person.

He is still to get his steroid cream applied 2x a day and I dont want to risk anything interfering with that.

I dont even know if the hole should be encouraged to heal or if it's good that there is an exit point? That's something I'll need to ask because I just accepted that I was to keep on doing what I've been doing with an emphasis on keeping the hole clean.

Yeah, I honestly dont know what to do for the best.

Hes wearing socks with his hoof boots but still the boots are rubbing his heels. Under normal circumstances there is a gradual build up to wearing his boots to condition his hooves, much like working barefoot from the field. However this isnt normal circumstances. Hes worn his toes right back and they are bruised. I dont know.whats the lesser evil. Trying to just use boots for a couple of walks a day but then his toes but then what about his heels and I really just dont know what to do for the best

Insane amounts of duct tape over the stretchy adhesive bandage stuff, around the hoof only?

 

[brighteyes]

I used incredibly expensive manuka honey from a local health food shop on a horse who tried to slice it's hoof off. We had a sterile pad and bandage over it - vet provided antibiotics too. It worked.

No use if its the right thing to do in your situation - but I really hope you get a break soon

Gram-for-gram the H&B stuff will be bargain basement in comparison!

 

[Pearlsasinger]

I have a vague recollection that endurance riders carry emergency shoe replacement, rather like plaster of Paris. I hope someone on the forum knows more about it than I do but it could be useful in your position

 

[ester]

honey encourages granulation, sometimes you want that, sometimes you don't and then you end up debriding. I would definitely be led by my vet on that. I think usually it is more of an issue when people carry on using it too long.

The rest of the leg looks a lot better, not sure which hoof boots you have but they're definitely not interfering with the pussy bit when moving?

Unbelievable of the other vet to faff around with teeth *right now*

 

[PapaverFollis]

I was going to suggest duct taping thick foam hoof pads to his feet but didn't know if I was being stupid.

 

[ester]

Not stupid at all but poss slippy in the current conditions.

 

[DabDab]

Not stupid at all but poss slippy in the current conditions.

Vet wrap is usually fine slip-wise though

 

[ester]

yup I was only thinking duct tap

 

[Marnie]

Keeping the healing vibes coming, you and your dad are doing an amazing job.

 

[misst]

Only just caught up again TPO and I can't believe what an awful time you and Vinnie (and your Dad) are having. He must be a fighter to be still going. You and your dad deserve a medal. As for the lady vet - words fail me and I'd like to say I'm shocked. But I'm not - seen too many like this - no empathy and no real understanding of what the owner might be needing/wanting. I've been lucky and only really had this once, all the other vets I've had have been amazing - but it only takes one naff one unfortunately. Several friends have had similar experiences to you.
Keeping everything crossed for you and Vinnie, if effort counted for anything he'd be the fittest horse around.xx

 

[Roasted Chestnuts]

I get my manuka from Aldi ?? Did wonders
For the wee guys legs when he caught caught over the fence. No scarring and no granulation and all the hair grew back ??

 

[The Fuzzy Furry]

I hope you've all got through the weekend ok TPO?
Any improvement in him and that hole? Xx

 

[SusieT]

I actually think if you go back and look at your first photos that leg has massively improved and its good the gunge is getting out and natural it would burst out at the bottom. Just checking is your vet very experienced with more difficult leg wounds as horses don't do anything fast in my experience - wounds take weeks to heal and thats only once they have deigned to 'declare' themslves (think of all those abscesses that grumble on then pop). Ask your vet about cleaning the hole with something , flushing it out. It is hard work I'm sure - and if the horse is miserable and going to be miserable for weeks nobody would blame you for quitting, but I think I would see light at the end of the tunnel if you go back and look at your previous pics.

 

[SO1]

I admire your dedication, you and your dad are doing a great job.

I too would be very annoyed about the vet trying to take out the tooth without your permission. If she had removed it that would have probably required daily flushing which on top of all the treatment you are doing would be a lot of extra and if that got infected you would have another problem to deal with, at the moment tooth not causing any harm, and he is on bute so even if it was an issue he would having pain relief and it could wait until he had got better from his leg infection, same with his back.

 

[Gloi]

My nurse friend told me never to use that in a wound. She used to post on here (Kez1001) and I think she linked to papers about it. I think it can cause over granulisation (if that's even a word). I'll search for the post but since we discussed it I've always had a fear of using it ?

My sister who had very fragile skin had a lot of treatment with manuka honey patches on wounds (NHS wound clinic) and they worked wonders.

 

[Gloi]

Insane amounts of duct tape over the stretchy adhesive bandage stuff, around the hoof only?

Or duct tape camping mat onto hoof.
A couple of layers of hoof armour may do though

 

[TPO]

I've started measuring his leg; if I had any functioning brain cells left I would have done that from the start ??‍

So his good hind is 9" around the cannon and 10" just above his fetlock.

On saturday bad leg was 10 & 12, today it is 9.75 ish & 11.5

The leg has gotten hotter again, more so on Saturday, but I'm putting that down to the vet palpating it and probing into the hole ?

He's playing up to lead (mainly taking advantage of Dad!) and when I've had him out in to top paddock hes been having a good old time rolling in the snow with some snakey head, leg flailing and even some trot. Hes on 2 bute a day, plus steroids and antibiotics, but he appears to be ok in himself?

He is, understandably, less keen to go out on all these walks as time goes on. SuperDad announced today that he "knows the secret how to get Vinnie to lead". I asked what it was and apparently he doesnt actually know but there must be one because V walked up and down the track 8x with no dramas and was marching out ??‍?? so if anyone does know "the secret" please let me know!

I'm feeling a lot more positive and I really think he will be ok. I'm putting a lot of hope on the poor supplement and socks. I just hope that they arrive soon. The postwoman was saying that they have a massive backlog due to the weather ??

I am a bit concerned about the 2wk deadline too for all the reasons mentioned above. The vet said 2wks and possibly 3 if hes made good progress. Mum said today its 2 and that's it. I really don't think all of the swelling will be totally gone, the hole healed, whole leg healthy/scab free and he'll be ok to return to life as normal in 2wks.

My vet is very straight down the line and I think if he offers V an extra week it should be taken.

I'm sure I've demonstrated in here enough that I'm not against pts and would definitely choose it over an animal suffering. When things were at their worst my vet still said he thought V deserved a chance.

So I'm having a *slight* stress over that potential situation but I just dont have the energy to argue about it right now. I'm trying to do the groundwork being very enthusiastic about his progress and cueing dad to day the same sort of thing. The improvements on the measuring tape are helping so far.

The steroids finish on Wednesday night so I guess it's a case of seeing how he goes once he's off them.

Thanks for asking after him, I do really appreciate it ? I told dad tonight, when we were talking about the reduction in the swelling, that the reason for that was the (at that point) 12 pages of <<vibes>> and well wishes for V! He thinks I'm mad but its probably genetic so jokes on him ?

ETA yes, vet is extremely experienced as is the other partner who first attended. My vet also consulted with a leading orthopaedic specialist; said specialist, alongside referral work, is the vet for a racing yard. He is experienced with TBs that get/have cellulitis. The specialist said out of all the many cases he sees there are 2-3 a year that just don't get better. It was looking like Vinnie was one of them but I'm hopeful that we've finally turned a corner...and I'm an eternal pessimist so ???

 

[Red-1]

It all sounds very positive! I'm also sure the vet never intended the 2-3 weeks to be for a healed Vinnie, just that he was making improvement.

Your dad sounds great. I have often found that your bond with a horse (yes, I do believe that exists) only comes when the horse has been ill. Several of ours have been good horses, but not until they know they are seriously ill do they become 'yours' on the inside. I spoke with some people about it when one of ours changed, they said it didn't matter what you did, but the horse will see that they were ill ad vulnerable, you kept turning up and they stayed safe and got better, ergo you saved them.

 

[TPO]

It all sounds very positive! I'm also sure the vet never intended the 2-3 weeks to be for a healed Vinnie, just that he was making improvement.

Your dad sounds great. I have often found that your bond with a horse (yes, I do believe that exists) only comes when the horse has been ill. Several of ours have been good horses, but not until they know they are seriously ill do they become 'yours' on the inside. I spoke with some people about it when one of ours changed, they said it didn't matter what you did, but the horse will see that they were ill ad vulnerable, you kept turning up and they stayed safe and got better, ergo you saved them.

Could you please let Vinnie know this? He's his usual crabbit self again; he was sooky and cuddly when he was really ill initially but that's a distant memory now! Ha ha