Brave people post "good shoeing" pix please

[ester]

bullnosing was explained to me by cptrayes, my guess is that yours are bullnosed but that they look worse because of the rasping to the toe, which is obvious by the change in colour of the horn.

my boys hinds look like this, his fronts if you look back at the posts also have a slight curve to the front wall)

CP said they are often associated with horses with metabolic issues, EMS and alike and reverse rotated pedal bones (which my boy has in front) hopefully she can perhaps fill you in a bit more.

 

[A Guilding]

ooh now I'm even more a bit worried as both hinds are like it, see

What does bullnose mean and how does it get corrected?
Can bullnose be caused by rasping the toe too much as I'm seeing that he literally has no toe but the horn is smooth anyone advise??
He definitely has a tendency to drag rather than lift his hind feet. Better after massage manipulation but reading bullnose feet whilst amongst other things can cause toe dragging

Looks like you do a lot of work in a sand school and its rubbed the toe off with his toe dragging, I doubt its the rasp. The bull nose can be an indicator of a flat pedal bone or tipped backwards pedal bone.

 

[Tamba]

This thread is brilliant..
I am totally hung up on horses feet, and my farrier, dispairs at me, as I am always questioning him and asking him how the horses feet are?, I think I drive him insane, but I think its crucial to care..and take the view that if you act disinterested then they dont feel interested either, if you know what I mean.However, I WILL HAVE to post pics of my big dressage horses feet, as when I got him, he was shod, but two front feet are different shapes, as one is quite boxy, failed vetting due to this, but I thought I was getting him for a good price, and he was a schoolmaster, which is as rare as hens teeth, up with me, so decided to go on and buy. Have not regretted, as I competed him the first time after only one month home..and he was ace. SInce then, though he has had bother with thrush, (my fields are very wet, and I decided to do the dreaded thing of removing his shoes, in hope to try and help his feet..which seem to lead to real lameness issues.. He has gone from being very lame, to being slightly lame, on his club foot.. But I see a massive difference in the shape of this foot already, and Im convinced if I keep the shoes of it will improve more.

Problem is, that my farrier, who is salt of the earth, is struggling with the trimming, as the heels of his front feet are either growing at different rates, or he is wearing them down differently, so he effectively as two front feet are different heights, as much as a quarter of an inch roughly, (havent measured).
Any one who has encountered this, would love to hear??, what way they got over this??
tambaX

 

[Ditchjumper2]

http://www.horseandhound.co.uk/forums/picture.php?albumid=151&pictureid=14894[/IMG]
http://www.horseandhound.co.uk/forums/picture.php?albumid=151&pictureid=14895[/IMG

 

[Meowy Catkin]

Do the photos work now?

 

[Ditchjumper2]

Thank you....not sure what I did wrong!

 

[A Guilding]

Here is a little horse who we got asked to look at, it had the clasic ski ramp wall from incorect position of the pedal bone, he had a sand crack at the toe and the quarter where the wall had exceeded its elastic capabilities and split, the frog had also sheared and it was 4 out of 10 lame.

we cleaned out the toe crack and drilled some holes in the wall.

The foot was so flexible we attached a steel plate with screws to immobilize it.

then filled it with a composite, we left a hole at the top to put Iodine behind the filler.

one year on and all looking good.

 

[cptrayes]

Problem is, that my farrier, who is salt of the earth, is struggling with the trimming, as the heels of his front feet are either growing at different rates, or he is wearing them down differently, so he effectively as two front feet are different heights, as much as a quarter of an inch roughly, (havent measured).
Any one who has encountered this, would love to hear??, what way they got over this??
tambaX

Yes, I have seen it on my friends horse so we got a tape measure out. She has one leg longer than the other, so she needs one foot longer than the other to compensate. I believe it's not uncommon. Your horse is sounder like this - listen to him

 

[A Guilding]

Yes, I have seen it on my friends horse so we got a tape measure out. She has one leg longer than the other, so she needs one foot longer than the other to compensate. I believe it's not uncommon. Your horse is sounder like this - listen to him

Absolutely 100% correct, do not hack the foot down to match, club feet are very difficult to maintain shod or un shod.

 

[cptrayes]

There are in my experience 2 main types of bull-nose or’ dome’ wall as I call it.
1) If the ‘dome’ is in line with the nails then this will be caused by the farrier having to roll the rasp over when finishing off, otherwise they will rasp through the nail head thus loosing the clench, theses domes will often be accompanied by small cracks going from the nail down. This is solved by dressing the wall before the shoe is fitted, thus creating a straight line from the top to bottom of the hoof.
2) The dome is caused by a conflict in the horn production, concussion is sent up the horn tubular but is unable to stimulate the growth due to a deviation in the wall secreting papillae, in other words the horn is being made to bend, this in turn will create a weakening in the laminae and so the position of P3 can be compromised.
There are other factors that will make the wall wear in this fashion and sand schools are one of them.
Please not that when this type of hoof is allowed to go barefoot, even if for a while the fault will usually go.

My one I bought in early January took over six months to lose his bullnoses but they have gone completely now. I'm certain that he was late broken because of laminitis issues. There was no evidence of this except bullnose hind feet, but I was proved right in the spring when the grass began to make him very sensitive on stones until I got him onto yeast and a prebiotic. I've seen bull noses in other horses who don't manage grass well and they went when the diet was got under complete control. I think that fits with the barefoot thing, because horses on an incorrect diet (for them) don't do barefoot well, so the correction for both issues is the same thing in that case, a reduced sugar diet.

 

[Ditchjumper2]

Do the photos work now?

Despite your expertise in showing my pics they get no comment.....probably for the best lol!!

 

[cptrayes]

Do the photos work now?

Ditchjumper2, the trouble is that the photos are at angles where it's actually impossible to see the really meaningful stuff - you're going to have to grovel in the dirt and get the camera down at foot level I'm afraid . Head on and exactly side on and directly down on the sole from on top.

Has your horse got a spot of white line disease/seedy toe on the foot there? Has your farrier discussed it with you?

 

[cptrayes]

A G I don't understand this hoof, can you explain it to me? To a barefooter like me it looks just like a foot that was not doing well in shoes that has either had the shoe removed c.2 months before or a drastic change of shoeing c.4 months before, hence the more upright growth at the top. I though, in theory, that the top half indicates the proper angle of the pedal bone and suggests that there is good attachment with the laminae.

What I don't understand is how this foot got like this if it did not have a big change in its shoeing 2 months ago, if barefoot, or 4 months ago if still shod.

I'd love to know if you can help?

 

[A Guilding]

In truth i dont know how this happened I guessed way to long between shoeing intervals and it looked to me like it had foundered. (Laminitic) but only in the one hoof, it was so unstable I had it in a heart bar for a while, but it mended and hasnt take a lame step since.

 

[Tamba]

fascinating... thanks, going to take some pics tomorrow, of him
and my other 17.3hh dutch, who is shod. Currently in talks at min with farrier, about putting gel pads on him, as Dick vets noticed he was getting solar pain, when they did his scieotograpthy sp?, scan.
He is bit low on heel, and has quite flat footed thoroughbredy feet. Also been discussing eggbars?, Hes quite a sensitive soul, and struggles without shoes, even when he loses one, or is being shod..Anyone else used gel pads for this reason? opinions gratefully recieved
tambaX

 

[Tamba]

Quick question to anyone who wishes to answer??, or has any idea
Do, I let farrier take some of the toe of the non boxy foot, and leave the boxy foot, or do I encourage him to take off some heel of the boxy foot?, poor farrier doesnt seem sure, but he has told me he is worried about taking too much heel off? (mega confused)

 

[A Guilding]

Quick question to anyone who wishes to answer??, or has any idea
Do, I let farrier take some of the toe of the non boxy foot, and leave the boxy foot, or do I encourage him to take off some heel of the boxy foot?, poor farrier doesnt seem sure, but he has told me he is worried about taking too much heel off? (mega confused)

Neither! is the easiest answer, and depends is the other, Asymmetric feet are very complex because every thing from the withers down is involved.

 

[SophieLouBee]

Here we are, I'll post two of the beasties feet.

Murphy, crumbly feet, issues with one hind (mild stringhalt type symptoms when not exercised regularly), 15yo, stiff on cold days, has never had a days lameness despite this!

Ruby, wish I had photographed her feet when she came, they look like my nan had had a bash at putting them on. The one hind pictured, had bizzare growth flaring out to the outside, then the shoe nailed onto the foot. She had the hinds off and some serious seeing to, and her way of going has improved. She had a locking stifle when she arrived, which has gone, she's trotterxtb. She also is a serial shoe puller-offer, although she has kept them on full term this time.

They had new shoes on yesterday.

 

[SophieLouBee]

SOOOORRRRYYYY they are so huge :\

 

[Frozen Hoof Boots]

Looks like you do a lot of work in a sand school and its rubbed the toe off with his toe dragging, I doubt its the rasp. The bull nose can be an indicator of a flat pedal bone or tipped backwards pedal bone.

There are in my experience 2 main types of bull-nose or’ dome’ wall as I call it.
1) If the ‘dome’ is in line with the nails then this will be caused by the farrier having to roll the rasp over when finishing off, otherwise they will rasp through the nail head thus loosing the clench, theses domes will often be accompanied by small cracks going from the nail down. This is solved by dressing the wall before the shoe is fitted, thus creating a straight line from the top to bottom of the hoof.
2) The dome is caused by a conflict in the horn production, concussion is sent up the horn tubular but is unable to stimulate the growth due to a deviation in the wall secreting papillae, in other words the horn is being made to bend, this in turn will create a weakening in the laminae and so the position of P3 can be compromised.
There are other factors that will make the wall wear in this fashion and sand schools are one of them.
Please not that when this type of hoof is allowed to go barefoot, even if for a while the fault will usually go.

I really appreciate your help and advice so far.
You are correct we do alot of schooling in the sandschool 4-5 days a week. Would you say in your opinion that this wearing of his feet is sandschool work alone as he is a toe scrubber until you get him working properly from behind or is there something more sinister going on?
There are no obvious ridges in the hooves. FYI, He was barefoot on his hindfeet but cracked his N/S hind that has taken over a year to grow fully out. I used to go hacking quite often but less recently so only hack once a week. He was shod purely for hacking/roadwork.

 

[Tiffany]

Interesting and informative thread

 

[LucyPriory]

as two front feet are different heights, as much as a quarter of an inch roughly, (havent measured).

photos?

 

[GinaGem]

Would someone tell me what they think of my boys feet? He had cracks down the fronts when i bought him, there are still ridges which you can just see in the pics.

Thanks

 

[cptrayes]

If I am not mistaken, on the end of the left hand branch of this shoe, there is a flat area of heel plane which has not been covered by the shoe, in other words, part of her heel is completely unsupported and hanging off the end of the shoe. Since these shoes have been on only one day, this may even get worse as her feet grow and I would not be happy with that shoe unless your farrier can explain to you why it has to be that way.

 

[cptrayes]

Thanks

The hairline on this foot suggests that it may be taking too much pressure on the shoe back towards the heel. It should, in a perfect world, be a smooth line from front to back, but you can see a distinct rise towards the heel and at the bottom of that rise his foot is cracking away which would also be a warning for me. I would ask your farrier if he thinks there is an issue.

By "bottom" there, I mean that you need to follow the line of the horn tubules down the foot. The crack looks as if it is some way in front of the rise, but start at the top, pick up a horn tubule line and follow it down and you will end up at the crack at the bottom. Pressure transmits up the horn tubules, not only directly upwards from the ground.

 

[GinaGem]

Thank you. I thought the lines were odd on this foot when i took the pic but stupidly it's not something i've looked at closely before. I will have a word.

 

[cptrayes]

Thank you. I thought the lines were odd on this foot when i took the pic but stupidly it's not something i've looked at closely before. I will have a word.

There are quite a few horses who don't want ground pressure at the quarters (sides). Your may be one of them. If you take the shoes off those horses they will often break that bit of the foot off completely and stand only on their toe and heels/frog. Don't faint if your farrier shoes the horse next time with a gap between the top of the shoe and the bottom of his foot on the side there

 

[stormybracken]

Phew, just caught up, excellent Thread, thanks cp!

 

[Garnet]

Hi there, here are some photos I took last September about two weeks after shoeing. I am very happy with my farrier who has been shoeing my boy for the last fifteen years. Syd will be 27 this year and has ringbone in both front feet (and various other suspected arthritic changes going on), so foot balance is critical to him.
NF

NH

NF

NH

NF

OF

NH

OH

 

[Tamba]

now for some really odd feet, poor boy!
Any views welcome?, Just had this fellow since August last year, he was shod, hes 17.2 short coupled Westfalian gelding.http://s256.photobucket.com/albums/hh162/horses01466/