CAN YOU HELP !! :)
- Thread starter FallenAngel666
- Start date
Rosie Round The Hills
Well-Known Member
This is a very un RosieroundtheChristmasTree observation to make, as I normally accept posters without question or comment. But I can't help wondering why there are suddenly 4 new posters onto this forum, all of whom have recent positive and constructive experiences with this re-homing malarky.
CornishB, Pippamoo, Dartmoor Dennis, VKMCC what motivated you all to join?
CornishB, Pippamoo, Dartmoor Dennis, VKMCC what motivated you all to join?
Mare Stare
Well-Known Member
CornishB
Member
I often look at the forums but haven't felt the need to comment before. There was a link to this online but as I recently had a HOPE youngster I felt I could give my own experience. There was no other motivation than that I promise!
Does being new, or joining to participate in a discussion that I have experience of make my opinion less valid?
rhino
Well-Known Member
Sorry, we can be a bit suspicious here
It's not unusual for owners of horses/companies/yards to come on here under a pseudonym (or several) when there is anything remotely negative posted. The most recent was a dealer who had 3 separate usernames (although was arguing with himself on one thread ).Potato!
Well-Known Member
I wonder why is this is such a good thing then why is the farmer not named on the website.
Id definatly be interested to know who it is
Id definatly be interested to know who it is
VKMCC
New User
I have rehomed one a dartmoor hill pony from HOPE a couple of weeks ago and thought the forum needed some postivie feedback about them. Seeing as the forum was started to hopefully help rehome the final ponies that are in thought a positive comment from someone that has decided to rehome one might let other people see its not all doom and gloom in rehoming dartmoor hill ponies.
Didnt realise people actually went through the bother of making up different names for themselves must have plenty of time on there hands to be signing in and out as different people
CornishB
Member
They request you are a forever home but it would pretty impossible to police that? The website also requests that you don't breed from them but again I would guess it would be impractical to keep tabs on that. I guess that by getting references, they hope that you are trustworthy? I will definitely not be breeding and contributing to more of these ponies being about!
Also I know Zoo animals need to be fed and don't think Hope and similar can stop that. I don't have a problem with properly managed ponies on the moor. It just seems a sorry situation for the neglected ponies that are trapped in a cycle and the current over-grazing seems worse than in previous years? It is difficult to make a difference and not contribute to making the current situation even worse.
Also I know Zoo animals need to be fed and don't think Hope and similar can stop that. I don't have a problem with properly managed ponies on the moor. It just seems a sorry situation for the neglected ponies that are trapped in a cycle and the current over-grazing seems worse than in previous years? It is difficult to make a difference and not contribute to making the current situation even worse.
jhoward
Demon exorcist...
they are not neglected they are treated as WILD animals, they look awful in winter, pick up in spring, it is such that stops the natives getting lami etc.
if needed hay is put out.
it is the attitide of poor ickle skinny ponies that creates the omg we must save them, they are wild animals, that are largely bred to graze the more and end up in a lions tummy or humans..
if needed hay is put out.
it is the attitide of poor ickle skinny ponies that creates the omg we must save them, they are wild animals, that are largely bred to graze the more and end up in a lions tummy or humans..
VKMCC
New User
If he is anything like my neighbouring farmer they like keeping themselves to themselves and dont want things about them splashed all over the internet. As this forum proves there is a lot of negative comments about rehoming these ponies and you can get the odd crazy person that can go that bit too far.
CornishB
Member
I don't have a problem with wild ponies on the moor that are managed. But there is a real problem with the sheer number of ponies due to excessive over-breeding. It's not just over-grazing and poor condition, it's the irresponsible breeding that needs to be stopped.
Potato!
Well-Known Member
Why are they neglected?. They are wild so wont be in the same condition as your normal ponies, Also the photos are taken of youngstock which even domesticated youngstock can look straggy. They are Not neglected and i resent that comment. Im sorry but you cannot compare ponies that are wild with ponies that are not. Wild ponies are sometimes the lucky ones (no laminitus through over feeding etc). And the moor is not over stocked by any means.
Pippamoo
Member
Pippamoo is here because I have been following HOPE on facebook and in local press/ area , live on Dartmoor, wish I could rescue a foal but haven't got enough land, can see the arguments for and against and also the terrible ethical dilemma around rescue/ driving prices down, and plan to get involved with one of the Dartmoor pony/livestock groups. And because whatever the ethics of this, in this particular case at least I do not believe anyone is doing this for profit , as economically it simply would not be worth the effort. I also get that these are not pedigree ponies and feel ridiculously sad that they are suffering for being "scrubby half breeds ) (or whatever someone said! - not my words) and would have the whole lot if I could.
As a new horse owner, I am overwhelmed by the individuality of horses and how relationships can be built with them, and that has made me see ponies in a whole new light. I like sheep, but just don't quite feel the same about them!
As for zoo food, I have been to the zoo and know the people involved in the process - they handle it brilliantly and compassionately, but even very hungry tigers can't eat as many spare foals as there are!
Hope this clears up the mystery of why I began posting - nothing fishy from me at least, just a bleeding heart which loves Dartmoor and its ponies (and even its sheep, a little bit...)
As a new horse owner, I am overwhelmed by the individuality of horses and how relationships can be built with them, and that has made me see ponies in a whole new light. I like sheep, but just don't quite feel the same about them!
As for zoo food, I have been to the zoo and know the people involved in the process - they handle it brilliantly and compassionately, but even very hungry tigers can't eat as many spare foals as there are!
Hope this clears up the mystery of why I began posting - nothing fishy from me at least, just a bleeding heart which loves Dartmoor and its ponies (and even its sheep, a little bit...)
Rosie Round The Hills
Well-Known Member
No it doesn't, and nothing I said suggested that.
Rosie Round The Hills
Well-Known Member
Thank you, and to all the others for the responses. My original question wasn't meant to sound as an accusation of fishiness - just a question.
Now - back to reading the ongoing discussion.
Potato!
Well-Known Member
if over grazed then why the hell are we farmers having to set fire to the moor to get rid of the dead grass that is not grazed by cattle ponies or sheep for that matter.
Oh yes i forgot its these numptys sat in an office that think they know how to run dartmoor better than the farmers who have been doing it for hundreds of years.
Oh yes i forgot its these numptys sat in an office that think they know how to run dartmoor better than the farmers who have been doing it for hundreds of years.
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Pippamoo
Member
Am keen to understand it all from farmers' point of view instead of being a numpty! Do you have ponies and still have to burn part of the land? Which part of moor are you? If I am going to get involved with moor conservation, the more (moor! ) info the better !
CornishB
Member
I wasn't comparing wild ponies with ponies that are not! I agree that wild ponies are often healthier than overfed ponies. The hope ponies photographed have been brought in before the winter has hit and certainly are not in a neglected state- my own is in pretty good condition under the fluff and will not be fed more than some hay.
However there are far more ponies at the sales this year, and there are definitely a lot more sales than in previous years which is indicative of the larger numbers of ponies that have been bred. Lots of people would argue that the moor is overstocked with ponies.
Pippamoo
Member
To Burness
Not at all - ponies, cattle, sheep , on the moor- whatever it needs to balance it economically and ecologically! I just mind more when it is ponies that are being overbred with no real outlet for consumption - even tigers can't eat all the spare foals!
Not at all - ponies, cattle, sheep , on the moor- whatever it needs to balance it economically and ecologically! I just mind more when it is ponies that are being overbred with no real outlet for consumption - even tigers can't eat all the spare foals!
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Pippamoo
Member
Am all for ponies being well managed and looked after on the moor and appreciate the efforts made. I wonder if it is quite inconsistent on different parts of the moor ?
ILuvCowparsely
Well-Known Member
duhh how about beef - lamb - deer allot of deer that are culled in Richmond Park go to the zoo. does that answer your question????
I think only a very select few stallions should run free to breed on the moors for a limited time.
These stallions should be checked for confirmation - health and soundness- any sub standard colt should be gelded then re homed or released.
I hate the thought of ponies going to the zoo. Most are babies
Potato!
Well-Known Member
Yes we still have to go swailing even with the cattle sheep and ponies on the moor.
Back in the 50's there were a damn sight more ponies on the moor than there are today and cattle were allowed out all year round.
Now the number of ponies have drasticly reduced and cattle have to be off the moor by the end of october and are not allowed back on the moor until april. This has cause the vegetation to grow up so much become tough, inedible and in itself caused other problems like increased number of ticks etc
The moor is worse now than ive ever known it. And im on the north side of the moor and i know the area and the farmers stretching from tavistock aright the way across to chagford and down towards princetown and postbridge
Back in the 50's there were a damn sight more ponies on the moor than there are today and cattle were allowed out all year round.
Now the number of ponies have drasticly reduced and cattle have to be off the moor by the end of october and are not allowed back on the moor until april. This has cause the vegetation to grow up so much become tough, inedible and in itself caused other problems like increased number of ticks etc
The moor is worse now than ive ever known it. And im on the north side of the moor and i know the area and the farmers stretching from tavistock aright the way across to chagford and down towards princetown and postbridge
FallenAngel666
Member
how do you geld a 6 month old colt with no bits
Potato!
Well-Known Member
how do you geld a 6 month old colt with no bits
My colt was gelded when on his mother at 4 months.
rhino
Well-Known Member
how do you geld a 6 month old colt with no bits
If you are responsible you keep the pony until they have dropped and then have him cut. Otherwise you are passing on a potentially very expensive timebomb!
CornishB
Member
I'm also interested in this. Several ecology websites seem to say the opposite... I don't work in a office but admit to not knowing a lot about it.
http://www.oursouthwest.com/Wild_Hab/Countryside/Upland heathland/heathland.htm
"On Dartmoor, the primary cause of habitat loss has been the overgrazing of upland heath, resulting in its replacement with grass moorland, though here too insensitive burning may have contributed to the decline. It is estimated that such unsympathetic management has resulted in the loss of heathland from 31% of Dartmoor's upland commons this century. Furthermore, on roughly half of the remaining upland heaths, loss of heather is still thought to be occurring due to the high levels of grazing."
Potato!
Well-Known Member
I wonder how many of these experts actually go out over the moor and walk through the grass, My OH always complains when coming back in from the moor with yet another dent on his quad from hidden rocks in the grass. And the lambs that are covered head to toe in Ticks. When walk from the back of the landrover to the drivers door and have to pull off a dozen ticks before they attach themselves.
also when we turn out the cattle we had to spend weeks driving them back out onto the middle of the moor due to them coming back hungry and looking for food because they have spend all winter on good feed to be turned out on crappy grass which results in staggers.
bugbee717
Well-Known Member
Breeder are breeder no matter what they breed, I have 2 Dartmoor hill ponies, they came from the sales not hope, tbh my warmblood from the only breeder in the uk, came to me in worse condition than both of the dartmoors, he has more faults than both of them. My dartmoors will always be semi ferrel, no matter how much training they have, one thing they are are show winning ponies, and fab kids ponies. They mix well with my other 10 horses, if you want a push button pony u don't get a Dartmoor hill pony. Over breeding will always happen until some control is put in place, it may be tb or warmbloods or scabby hill ponies, it does not make one better than the other, and it sure as hell does not give people to put them all mongrels.
Potato!
Well-Known Member
duhh how about beef - lamb - deer allot of deer that are culled in Richmond Park go to the zoo. does that answer your question????
I hate the thought of ponies going to the zoo. Most are babies
Well as people eat beef, lamb and venison that means the value is much higher as there is a bigger market.
Why is it ok to slaughter lambs which are babies but not ponies. Thats the attitude that really bugs me the majority of these ponies have been bred for meat.
Yes i dont like it either but im sorry but horses get slaughtered for meat too thats life
Ravenwood
Well-Known Member
"all college - no knowledge" This quote has suddenly jumped to the front of my mind
Please correct me if I am wrong, but I get the distinct impression that Cornish B (you write very eloquently and diplomatically I must say ) and Pippamoo have very recently moved to the Dartmoor area and are trying to get involved? Pippamoo, did you say you have only very recently got into horses but have rehomed one of these ponies? Just trying to get it all straight in my mind.
Swaling as Burness says, is very important and the quote given by CornishB somewhat smacks to me as being written by someone who does not make their living from the moor!
You have to remember that National Parks etc have only been around for a very short period of time in the history of the area which was infact shaped, farmed and managed perfectly successfully for centuries by the "locals" to make it what it is today.
My OH farms on Exmoor (much smaller with a vastly different topography and vegetation ratio to Dartmoor) and his farm is organic, in the higher level ESA, has SSSI areas etc - all done for the payments, its costs an absolute fortune (think several tens of thousands of pounds) to keep up with their wishes and demands (personally I don't think its worth it) but actually at the end of the day - is the farm any different to how it was 50/100 yrs ago? I suspect not!
So a very long, rambling and boring post to simply say - don't dismiss the management and judgement of the generation of families who have worked the area.
As for the ponies - their value has been in decline for a while, we are in a recession, people haven't got the time or money to buy them all up for children's ponies anymore, riding schools/trekking centres have vanished so it doesn't take much to work out why there is no market for them. Unfortunately it is another result of our world's progression into the 21st Century.
I applaud anyone who is dedicating their life to trying to redress the problem and I guess we will have to wait a few more years yet to see if it works or not.
Please correct me if I am wrong, but I get the distinct impression that Cornish B (you write very eloquently and diplomatically I must say
) and Pippamoo have very recently moved to the Dartmoor area and are trying to get involved? Pippamoo, did you say you have only very recently got into horses but have rehomed one of these ponies? Just trying to get it all straight in my mind.Swaling as Burness says, is very important and the quote given by CornishB somewhat smacks to me as being written by someone who does not make their living from the moor!
You have to remember that National Parks etc have only been around for a very short period of time in the history of the area which was infact shaped, farmed and managed perfectly successfully for centuries by the "locals" to make it what it is today.
My OH farms on Exmoor (much smaller with a vastly different topography and vegetation ratio to Dartmoor) and his farm is organic, in the higher level ESA, has SSSI areas etc - all done for the payments, its costs an absolute fortune (think several tens of thousands of pounds) to keep up with their wishes and demands (personally I don't think its worth it) but actually at the end of the day - is the farm any different to how it was 50/100 yrs ago? I suspect not!
So a very long, rambling and boring post to simply say - don't dismiss the management and judgement of the generation of families who have worked the area.
As for the ponies - their value has been in decline for a while, we are in a recession, people haven't got the time or money to buy them all up for children's ponies anymore, riding schools/trekking centres have vanished so it doesn't take much to work out why there is no market for them. Unfortunately it is another result of our world's progression into the 21st Century.
I applaud anyone who is dedicating their life to trying to redress the problem and I guess we will have to wait a few more years yet to see if it works or not.