horse just bolted 5 miles down the road

[Saneta]

A couple of more thoughts for you today...if you are a member of the BHS, I think you have automatic personal liability insurance??? Secondly, I'm sure there must be an Apaloosa Society/club/forum in the UK. How about posting details of your horse on there, and ask if anyone has any knowledge of him, or the 'breeder' you bought him from. You don't have to go into details, but you might find something out that will ultimately help you?
Sorry you had a rotten night sleep, but to be expected under the circumstances. Have you taken the Arnica yet, it really will help?

 

[Woody2013]

That is dreadful and such a nerve wrecking experience. So dangerous. And glad it didn't end up in a tragedy. I hope you can get some good legal advice. I would have expected the breeder or dealer to take it back too. Hope things are more settle now though

 

[lizbet]

Because blood test can reveal drugs in the system illnesses. Also a vet can diagnose further issues which can cause behaviour problems. All of those if proved the case would not be the horses fault for his behaviour to be so extreme.

So why are you taking the moral high ground and throwing peoples comments back at them as if they are stupid.

Calling people babies in here does not help this situation when most here are probably older Gthan you and had more experience.

look up maise o6 pts behaviour problems
I know why a blood test should be taken and for what reasons. Leaving a internet site dose not bother me. Giving someone bad advice would kill me go read maise 06 start

to finish and see who posted what pts behaviour problems

 

[doriangrey]

I think some people have been quite hard on the OP here. She has stated already that she's used to dealing with youngsters and difficult horses so must be quite experienced to say the least. FWIW I would be following your course of action so far OP, and you probably don't need me to tell you to take precautions He does sound like a very frightened horse rather than a nasty one and frightened horse + no sense of self preservation (which some horses seem to have is spades) is quite probably a recipe for disaster. You have the horse in front of you OP so it's your call. It's good that you have some good friends to help, if you were by yourself I'd be suggesting you return him. There has been some good advice on here so far and it's always good to have as many opinions as possible but I don't feel it's fair for anyone to presume that they would be doing better under the circumstances than the OP, although practical suggestions would be helpful Please keep us up to speed OP as it is an interesting thread and some useful information could come out of it. Glad you are feeling a little better and I agree totally that your being cautious is the right way to go atm.

 

[ILuvCowparsely]

TBH from what I've seen the cliqueyness tends to be mutually admiring groups. If a large group of people on here are telling someone they really ought to consider pts it's generally because it's the right thing to do.
I have known one horse that was extremely dangerous. I don't know why but he would lunge to attack horses in the stable as he was walked past & caused several serious injuries to handlers & bystanders with his erratic & aggressive behaviour. He was 6 & owner had bred him. He had spent his entire life on yards. Once he pulled a handler across a yard to try & attack a baby in a pushchair & broke the ribs of the person who dived to get the pushchair out of the way. This was a horse that never got ridden because it was just not safe to even get on. He was moved to another yard as YO was not prepared to have anyone else injured. Now Lizbet - what is your take on that horse?

And what about this other one I know?

1980 Horse 16.black tb type owners family owned the yard and a big company and the BHS training yard I was in. Lunged at you when you went near box you had to throw the feed bowl over the door to avoid being bitten. Going in with hay net you had to hold it in front of you as protection and once tied you had to run backwards so you could keep an eye on it while it charged at you what about this horse then??

Or Fey arab who lunged at my friend while she put the hay net up and grabbed her face??? What about this horse then??

 

[suestowford]

they cant see the point iam trying to make

I certainly can't see your point as I can't understand most of what you write. Really, I have tried but I can't follow your posts at all. Sorry.

 

[ILuvCowparsely]

look up maise o6 pts behaviour problems
I know why a blood test should be taken and for what reasons. Leaving a internet site dose not bother me. Giving someone bad advice would kill me go read maise 06 start

to finish and see who posted what pts behaviour problems

So tells us why is blood test a bad idea?

me Personally Its one thing I would do if I was thinking of pursuing a claim against them or wanting to see if there was an issue which would explain the horses behaviour.

 

[Annagain]

Where did the horse come from DA and what's his name? I might be barking up the wrong tree but the more I read, there's a couple of things starting to ring a few bells with me. I understand if you don't want to put it on a forum so PM me if you want.

 

[Ladyinred]

And what about this other one I know?

1980 Horse 16.black tb type owners family owned the yard and a big company and the BHS training yard I was in. Lunged at you when you went near box you had to throw the feed bowl over the door to avoid being bitten. Going in with hay net you had to hold it in front of you as protection and once tied you had to run backwards so you could keep an eye on it while it charged at you what about this horse then??

Or Fey arab who lunged at my friend while she put the hay net up and grabbed her face??? What about this horse then??

They just need love and a special brand of knowledge available to only one or two on here!

Same as the stallion who was 20 and still tried to kill everything and everyone. Or the hunter gelding whose box you could not enter.. farrier thought he had the 'special knowledge' and marched in. Ever seen a farrier jump over a stable door, complete with his tools and tripod??

But I am sure Lizbet could have 'cured' both of these, just as she knows better than everyone else on here. Hell!! I should love to meet this paragon of horsiness!

 

[julie111]

And what about this other one I know?

1980 Horse 16.black tb type owners family owned the yard and a big company and the BHS training yard I was in. Lunged at you when you went near box you had to throw the feed bowl over the door to avoid being bitten. Going in with hay net you had to hold it in front of you as protection and once tied you had to run backwards so you could keep an eye on it while it charged at you what about this horse then??

Or Fey arab who lunged at my friend while she put the hay net up and grabbed her face??? What about this horse then??

I am sure there are any number of cases where horses attack for no reason etc. but this is not going to help the OP decide what to do!
My husband is a solicitor, you are within your rights to return the horse. If you feel out of your depth with him the sooner he is returned the better. Good luck!

 

[digitalangel]

Thanks for everyones replies. Have had a nice cup of tea with the neighbour and talked it over with her. Shes come to basically the same conclusion as me. Try my best to return as he can be worked on his issues in a place where he is safe and comfortable. Shes also going to pop around later and have a look at him with me and give me her opinion with him in the flesh.

its very easy to blame me for being overhorsed or naive or whatever, but not being in the situation i was in yesterday i dont think anyone can judge. But im not interested in a fight on an internet forum, i have bigger things to worry about right now. If some people want to have their opinion then theyre welcome to that, i dont mind. I am glad i have posted because i have recieved some very good advice and had some good ideas and perspectives about things i hadnt thought about, re bloods etc. So thank you to those who have been supportive and those that have made me consider other reasons for this behavior. Even those that think that its all my fault and things just went too fast for him. but hindsight is always 2020 and i had no idea he was going to react to that extreme. Im not interesting in aportioning blame just want to do the right thing by him. He is in one piece, i am in one piece, one way or another i must secure his future.

 

[Goldenstar]

And what about this other one I know?

1980 Horse 16.black tb type owners family owned the yard and a big company and the BHS training yard I was in. Lunged at you when you went near box you had to throw the feed bowl over the door to avoid being bitten. Going in with hay net you had to hold it in front of you as protection and once tied you had to run backwards so you could keep an eye on it while it charged at you what about this horse then??

Or Fey arab who lunged at my friend while she put the hay net up and grabbed her face??? What about this horse then??

Many years ago I bred a dangerous horse .
The mare was a strong minded but talented and hard working mare she did nine seasons with us and then I put her in foal to a TB .
The resulting foal bit and I mean it bit I worked very hard to handle it daily worked hard on it then when it was three I was preparing it to start work very carefully little things every day I must admitt I was looking forward to having her in work but it was my job to get her a life so I got on with it .
One day she went for me while I was grooming her neck when she turned on me she struck out with her forelegs and teeth and it is assumed she hit me on the head I came round sometime later on the yard I must have got myself out of the stable .
I had her shot by the hunt the next day we did not breed from the mare again .
These things are difficult judgements yes I knew people who would have taken on a horse such as her from a well bred performance proven mare but I took the choice of ending it then .
She was that perfect first teenagers horse type I just was to worried about what might happen down the road to take the chance and lose control of her.
OP's horse is afraid not aggressive that's more hopeful , easier to work with if you like.
If this horse has been a 'wrong un ' from the start shame on the breeders if you breed horses you must be prepared to cull the ones that sadly turn out badly.

 

[julie111]

Thanks for everyones replies. Have had a nice cup of tea with the neighbour and talked it over with her. Shes come to basically the same conclusion as me. Try my best to return as he can be worked on his issues in a place where he is safe and comfortable. Shes also going to pop around later and have a look at him with me and give me her opinion with him in the flesh.

its very easy to blame me for being overhorsed or naive or whatever, but not being in the situation i was in yesterday i dont think anyone can judge. But im not interested in a fight on an internet forum, i have bigger things to worry about right now. If some people want to have their opinion then theyre welcome to that, i dont mind. I am glad i have posted because i have recieved some very good advice and had some good ideas and perspectives about things i hadnt thought about, re bloods etc. So thank you to those who have been supportive and those that have made me consider other reasons for this behavior. Even those that think that its all my fault and things just went too fast for him. but hindsight is always 2020 and i had no idea he was going to react to that extreme. Im not interesting in aportioning blame just want to do the right thing by him. He is in one piece, i am in one piece, one way or another i must secure his future.

Very well said! I really hope things are resolved for you and the horse soon!

 

[Goldenstar]

Thanks for everyones replies. Have had a nice cup of tea with the neighbour and talked it over with her. Shes come to basically the same conclusion as me. Try my best to return as he can be worked on his issues in a place where he is safe and comfortable. Shes also going to pop around later and have a look at him with me and give me her opinion with him in the flesh.

its very easy to blame me for being overhorsed or naive or whatever, but not being in the situation i was in yesterday i dont think anyone can judge. But im not interested in a fight on an internet forum, i have bigger things to worry about right now. If some people want to have their opinion then theyre welcome to that, i dont mind. I am glad i have posted because i have recieved some very good advice and had some good ideas and perspectives about things i hadnt thought about, re bloods etc. So thank you to those who have been supportive and those that have made me consider other reasons for this behavior. Even those that think that its all my fault and things just went too fast for him. but hindsight is always 2020 and i had no idea he was going to react to that extreme. Im not interesting in aportioning blame just want to do the right thing by him. He is in one piece, i am in one piece, one way or another i must secure his future.

Good for you , I wish you luck and good things .

 

[YasandCrystal]

I agree that horses can attack for no reason, but often there is an underlying cause. The point we all need to remember is that we are talking about a horse - a horse's life has to come below a human life, however much we may love horses.
People need to be in the correct situation, financially, emotionally, experience wise to pursue investigations of the issues with dangerous horses.

Noone can judge without walking in the owner's shoes and we cannot condemn the actions for any horse pts for dangerous behaviour. Far better horses with issues pts than passed on or injuring someone. I posted on another behaviour thread about my WB that I have now owned for 3 years - he was very aggressive and dangerous and to investigate and get to the bottom of his issues was my decision and not one I took lightly, but my family feared for me constantly around him until his problems were unravelled and addressed one by one. It also made a big emotional strain on me. If I had had him pts then it would have been right at that time.

 

[christine48]

Reading between the lines, a homebred 7 year old that is barely backed, has never worn rugs and is sold very cheaply, now they want nothing to do with him, using the excuse of bringing in germs is ridiculous, this sounds suspiciously like a problem horse they just wanted rid of rather than spend time and money getting him to be a useful animal or if there really is something amiss doing the right thing by him.

Legally you are probably onto a loser, you knew he was green, paid little for him, probably failed to ask some searching enough questions or get anything in writing, the fact that he has jumped out, kicked the dog etc can be put down to a new home and being unsettled, if he is nice enough sending him away for a proper evaluation and possibly schooling may be worthwhile if you can find the right place.

Unfortunately my thoughts exactly. There must have been a reason that at the age of 7 they have done nothing with him and he was cheap. I have seen horses bolt through fences in panic like that and they haven't been bad horses so I wouldn't write him off just for that.
Although he is 7 he is like an unbroken youngster. However the question is have they actually tried to do anything with him and failed, or just not had time?
If you think he's worth it and can afford it, would it be an option to have someone come and work with him and assess him.

 

[YorksG]

I think his breeding may have something to do with it, the appies I have/have had have been incredibly loyal and 'one person' horses, although mine have all been mares. Our first mare took at least a year to settle with us, the second who had been handled and broken very well by her breeders took much less time, but is still very much of the opinion that I belong to her. The third is our three year old filly, who to be fair settled almost immediately, but appeared to have decided from day one that I am hers. It may take him some time to believe that he belongs to you, which is perhaps not what you would want for one to sell on.

 

[ILuvCowparsely]

They just need love and a special brand of knowledge available to only one or two on here!

Same as the stallion who was 20 and still tried to kill everything and everyone. Or the hunter gelding whose box you could not enter.. farrier thought he had the 'special knowledge' and marched in. Ever seen a farrier jump over a stable door, complete with his tools and tripod??

But I am sure Lizbet could have 'cured' both of these, just as she knows better than everyone else on here. Hell!! I should love to meet this paragon of horsiness!

LMAO. Wow have loved to see her try and fail.

 

[lizbet]

TBH from what I've seen the cliqueyness tends to be mutually admiring groups. If a large group of people on here are telling someone they really ought to consider pts it's generally because it's the right thing to do.
I have known one horse that was extremely dangerous. I don't know why but he would lunge to attack horses in the stable as he was walked past & caused several serious injuries to handlers & bystanders with his erratic & aggressive behaviour. He was 6 & owner had bred him. He had spent his entire life on yards. Once he pulled a handler across a yard to try & attack a baby in a pushchair & broke the ribs of the person who dived to get the pushchair out of the way. This was a horse that never got ridden because it was just not safe to even get on. He was moved to another yard as YO was not prepared to have anyone else injured. Now Lizbet - what is your take on that horse?

People do keep missing my point Thankyou for at least listening but the matter that i refering to is that one of the fact that this was a old sweetheart who had just started to bolt. So i did not think it was fair to pts till its health had been checked out.Eyes
Ears bloods chushings etc as out of charactor.I was slated by various people saying pts .The same people are on hear now saying check eyes bloods etc and dont put to sleep a horse that the owner knows nothing about.This worries me who are these people
What someone does with their horse at the end of the day is not our decission
i can accept that. But i cannot accept dangerous advise being dished out.You cannot

say to one bolter pts dont check health
To another check health and dont pts

 

[ILuvCowparsely]

Unfortunately my thoughts exactly. There must have been a reason that at the age of 7 they have done nothing with him and he was cheap. I have seen horses bolt through fences in panic like that and they haven't been bad horses so I wouldn't write him off just for that.
Although he is 7 he is like an unbroken youngster. However the question is have they actually tried to do anything with him and failed, or just not had time?
If you think he's worth it and can afford it, would it be an option to have someone come and work with him and assess him.

^5

I think the only things the OP is guilty for is:

Having a too trusting nature
a bit gullible
and easily swayed

All of which many of us could fall for in any situation

Think your right there, sadly I think OP was easy target for these people. They saw ££ in here and knew she had a soft spot and gave her info she wanted to hear, and she fell for it. Like some people who are too trusting and easily swayed for their own good.

OP you have had some very good advice here from some. (no comments on the other advice). Talk it through with your vet as a first thing.

For the record I never said PTS

 

[lizbet]

perhaps she should keep it in her living room?

How dare you presume that the op is overhorsed, were you there to see what happened? What advice can you offer? Any? No i thought not, just like you attacked the poor poster who had her horse pts without offering anything practical.

Roofy you are the last one to talk about horse welfare and i thought you had been banned from this forum anyway?

Op i am sorry, you must have been terrified, there is nothing quite as bad as a blind bolter. I too would try to return the horse, but, in the meantime you do seem to have a good plan. Baby steps.

clique

 

[lizbet]

LMAO. Wow have loved to see her try and fail.

Clique

 

[Tiddlypom]

Everyone, just ignore lizbet's posts, she'll get bored eventually and go off and invent another new persona to wind people up.

DA, all the best, take care and stay safe.

 

[hairycob]

I'm with Leviathan on this one. I don't know what it is about selling horses that brings out the worst in people & I expect the OP is noticing all the warning signs. I often say to people that if you have been to see 12 horses then at least 11 people will have lied to you.

Lizbet, you are still not seeing the difference in the 2 horses.
a) has been known by it's owner most of it's life & any pts decision will not have been taken lightly. Vet & pro rider are in agreement with the decision. Owner loves the horse & wants the best for it & if that is an end to suffering so be it. By the way cataracts would often be a reason to pts as some horses just can't cope with impaired vision & a younger horse with Cushings doesn't have much chance of a brilliant future either. The chances are that a confirmation of either of the things you are grasping at would merely confirm the owners decision. I'm lucky my horse with a cataract gets on just fine but some are too easily panicked.
b) is a totally unknown quantity. It may just have been a frightened horse. It may have a manageable condition. It may be so dangerous it is best pts. However there are several things about it that are ringing alarm bells that the OP has been sold a horse known to have severe issues.

 

[Goldenstar]

Everyone, just ignore lizbet's posts, she'll get bored eventually and go off and invent another new persona to wind people up.

DA, all the best, take care and stay safe.

Good advise .

 

[ILuvCowparsely]

Good advise .

I found most people here helpful to OP. Yes a few have been abrupt / rude/ unhelpful. I think between all of the positive posters we have give OP as much info /advice to work with as we can, and now we need to sit back and see where it goes from here.

 

[AmyMay]

Thanks for everyones replies. Have had a nice cup of tea with the neighbour and talked it over with her. Shes come to basically the same conclusion as me. Try my best to return as he can be worked on his issues in a place where he is safe and comfortable. Shes also going to pop around later and have a look at him with me and give me her opinion with him in the flesh.

its very easy to blame me for being overhorsed or naive or whatever, but not being in the situation i was in yesterday i dont think anyone can judge. But im not interested in a fight on an internet forum, i have bigger things to worry about right now. If some people want to have their opinion then theyre welcome to that, i dont mind. I am glad i have posted because i have recieved some very good advice and had some good ideas and perspectives about things i hadnt thought about, re bloods etc. So thank you to those who have been supportive and those that have made me consider other reasons for this behavior. Even those that think that its all my fault and things just went too fast for him. but hindsight is always 2020 and i had no idea he was going to react to that extreme. Im not interesting in aportioning blame just want to do the right thing by him. He is in one piece, i am in one piece, one way or another i must secure his future.

Great post. Keep us updated.

 

[digitalangel]

seemed a little more calm. went in the stable with him, was careful with the door though as i think he would shoot out if he could! petted him chatted to him quietly and lifted his feet and checked his legs which seem fine given that he ran on the road for 5 miles. hes moving around his stable fine too. doesnt seem stiff. so just baby baby steps now. hes tolerating me but not engaging yet. thats OK its all new. Am glad i was able to get in the stable with him this time without him presenting his bum to me. All is quiet on the yard and the horses who are in are quietly munching their hay. If he progresses well this afternoon i will try to turn him out in the pen for an hour where i can watch him and make sure he stays calm.

 

[Slightlyconfused]

seemed a little more calm. went in the stable with him, was careful with the door though as i think he would shoot out if he could! petted him chatted to him quietly and lifted his feet and checked his legs which seem fine given that he ran on the road for 5 miles. hes moving around his stable fine too. doesnt seem stiff. so just baby baby steps now. hes tolerating me but not engaging yet. thats OK its all new. Am glad i was able to get in the stable with him this time without him presenting his bum to me. All is quiet on the yard and the horses who are in are quietly munching their hay. If he progresses well this afternoon i will try to turn him out in the pen for an hour where i can watch him and make sure he stays calm.

that's good.

op did you get my pm?
x

 

[justabob]

Well done DA, at least you are prepared and can put things in place for both your safety, things will never be as bad as yesterday again. I would not be in too much of a hurry to turn him out, get him on your side a bit more. Lets face it you both had a trauma yesterday and you both need to get your levels of anxiety down. He is taking no harm at the moment, just take one step at a time. I am sure you are more than able to manage this horse and give him a chance, the achievement to get him to settle will be huge and this test for you will go even further to making you into an even better horsewoman. We learn nothing of much value from easy. Good luck.