Hunts woman hits proteste

[asmp]

This is doing the rounds in the newspapers this morning.

http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/201...ed-protesters-anti-hunt-confrontation-caught/

I think if anyone grabbed my horse's reins, whether out hunting or hacking I'm pretty sure I would hit them with my whip too.

(P.s. Why can't you edit headings?)

 

[OrangeAndLemon]

I watched the longer footage on the metro and they claim she was trying to ride down the sab but you can see the sab on the outside of a spinning horse (the perfect opportunity to run away if he really was being attacked) but instead he runs towards the horse with his hands up trying to grab the reins. He then holds on and pulls on the horses mouth which, for me, is unforgivable.

I suspect the sabs (they claim to be monitors but if they had no malicious intent, why were they covering their faces with balaclavas) were trespassing.

Really though, why did the woman ride over and get involved. It created a flashpoint in which no one comes out looking good. The foot supporters were doing a good job of keeping the sabs away and out of danger, they should have been left to it. There was no need to ride towards the sabs and antagonise them.

 

[Auslander]

I think she lost her temper and overstepped the mark by a long way. I don't support what the antis do in any way, shape or form, and I certainly don't think it's ok that they grabbed her reins, but it turned my stomach watching her beat another human being with a whip. They both behaved disgracefully.

 

[Sussexbythesea]

I’d absolutely wallop someone if they grabbed my horses reins in a threatening way but I’m unsure as to whether in this case it was to stop her riding at them so they were defending themselves? Not seen whole video so can’t say.

 

[ponyparty]

I read somewhere (unverified as to whether this is true) that before the film starts the sab punches her horse. I'm sure it said he did something else as well, can't remember what now. This is all just what I've read on various Facebook threads - I wasn't there, so have no idea really.
Why would he not just let go and get out of the way though?! He was clearly antagonising her.
But yeah does not make for pleasant viewing at all. No doubt will be seized upon (already is) by the anti brigade and used as "proof" that all people who hunt are violent. Sigh.

 

[Antw23uk]

I think both are to blame, both are at fault and both should be very ashamed of themselves BUT we have only seen a glimpse of what was really going on so can only judge on what we have seen/ heard. Im biased, I back the rider because although I wouldnt have put my horse in that situation in the first place I would have reacted the same had he grabbed my horse!

Riding away and laughing at these morons is better than trying to argue with them. You cant cure or argue with stupid!

 

[BeckyFlowers]

http://metro.co.uk/2017/11/21/hunt-...mashed-by-masked-people-on-quad-bike-7095150/

 

[Seville]

I'd have hit him as well if he or anyone, grabbed my horse in that manner.

 

[asmp]

I watched the longer footage on the metro and they claim she was trying to ride down the sab but you can see the sab on the outside of a spinning horse (the perfect opportunity to run away if he really was being attacked) but instead he runs towards the horse with his hands up trying to grab the reins. He then holds on and pulls on the horses mouth which, for me, is unforgivable.

I suspect the sabs (they claim to be monitors but if they had no malicious intent, why were they covering their faces with balaclavas) were trespassing.

Really though, why did the woman ride over and get involved. It created a flashpoint in which no one comes out looking good. The foot supporters were doing a good job of keeping the sabs away and out of danger, they should have been left to it. There was no need to ride towards the sabs and antagonise them.

Interesting point that I didn't see the whole picture from the Telegraph. If she did ride over to confront them then that was rather foolish.

 

[Abi90]

I agree with the sentiment that both should be ashamed of their actions.

It has always baffled me though, how people can say they are all about keeping tabs on animal welfare when it comes to fox hunting but are perfectly happy to hurt the horses! Surely that is not a love of animals

 

[Asha]

Firstly, from what understand the sabs where trespassing, what gives these people the right to go on private property ?

They grabbed her reins, which if someone did that to me, I'm guessing id either be very angry or pretty scared. perhaps a mix of both. How would I react in a situation like that ? I guess id want to protect myself and my horses and more than likely lash out too in self defence. especially as these sabs seem to have taken the law into their own hands by trespassing in the first place, my concern would be what else would they do ?

 

[Goldenstar]

The sab was a trespasser .
Why she went over I don't know perhaps it was her land .
He easily could have prevented being hit by letting go of her reins .

 

[MagicMelon]

Difficult to judge what happened before that part of the clip, but from that short piece of footage - I would say that I am very much an anti however I dont agree with sabs going out to cause harm especially to other animals - grabbing the reins is unacceptable and Id probably have smacked him once to get him off however to lay into him like that is ridiculous. I also think the rider was doing a great job of yanking her own horse in the mouth several times... and seemingly either being out of control or pretending to be but if she were thinking of her horse then surely she'd want him out of the way of harm.

The fact he was trespassing or not really has no relevence here IMO. Im pretty sure you're not allowed to go pelting a trespasser on your land with a whip repeatedly... She shouldn't have approached the sab at the end of the day if she didnt want trouble or to possibly risk her horse.

Edited - just seen the longer video on The Sun website, she very clearly is threatening the man by riding at him. He probably felt he had to grab onto the horse as it was somewhat safer to try and control the horse himself. Her riding is appaling of the poor horse, booting him with spurs, yanking him in the mouth. Horrid woman.

 

[Spiritedly]

In the longer video she is heard telling them to get back to the road and you can see in a field behind her the rest of the hunt so I'm not sure if she was trying to move the sabs from the path the hunt was meant to be following.

 

[ponyparty]

grabbing the reins is unacceptable and Id probably have smacked him once to get him off

But he didn't get off, did he? That's the point. If he'd let go, and moved away, she would (one would hope) have stopped hitting him...

It is impossible for any of us to know what really went on, unless we were there. Both sides appear to be in the wrong to some extent. Not pleasant viewing at all

 

[Judgemental]

In the longer video she is heard telling them to get back to the road and you can see in a field behind her the rest of the hunt so I'm not sure if she was trying to move the sabs from the path the hunt was meant to be following.

In the event anybody so much as touches a British police horse whilst on duty, at say a football match or elsewhere, they will be summarily 'whacked' with a nightstick. I.e the long batons that officers carry. To grab the reins would be a criminal offence.

In my opinion the originating individual on the ground, put the rider and horse in danger.

I have been in exactly that situation and it is extremely alarming.

My advice, never ever get within striking distance of any saboteurs, because some have a strip of leather sewn into the inside of the neck of their boots. Into which they can slip a ladies hat pin. When they are stopped and searched by the police, remarkably the hat pin or the place is secreted, is never found!

 

[southerncomfort]

I think regardless of who was to blame hitting someone with a whip is assault. She lost her temper and lost control of herself. I don't doubt for a minute that I'd have been tempted to wallop him one too, but you just can't do that. There are penalties to be paid for hitting someone.

 

[MagicMelon]

But the thing is, the woman clearly rides at the man several times not leaving him alone before he's made any attempt to grab the reins / touch the horse - in the video she clearly means it and at one point he very nearly trips under the horse. From that footage I would absolutely say the rider caused it and was putting the guy in danger in the first place, then he reacted accordingly.

 

[ponyparty]

But we don't know what happened before that! I have definitely read on FB that before the filming started, he punched the horse in the face and did something else, I can't remember what now and don't have time to trawl back through all the comment. I think perhaps it was something to do with the children in the field, attempting to pull them off ponies or spook their ponies? I can't remember. Anyway, I have no way of knowing if that is true - but IF it were (or he had done something else similarly heinous) then in my view it would most definintely have been HIM at fault, and not her.

There's no point speculating I guess. As I said above, we can't possibly know what actually happened unless we were there at the time.

 

[Judgemental]

I think regardless of who was to blame hitting someone with a whip is assault. She lost her temper and lost control of herself. I don't doubt for a minute that I'd have been tempted to wallop him one too, but you just can't do that. There are penalties to be paid for hitting someone.

The law is such that the lady rider was well within her rights to defend her horse. I stress horse. No matter what happened or indeed the causation, once the saboteur took hold of the reins, they were at fault.

If this goes to court I am sure I will be proved to be correct.

Technically under all sorts of old established historical laws, the individual was trying to steal the horse.

 

[MagicMelon]

The law is such that the lady rider was well within her rights to defend her horse. I stress horse. No matter what happened or indeed the causation, once the saboteur took hold of the reins, they were at fault.
.

No, by law the man also has a right to protect himself! And as we know in law, a human will always come before an animal (whether thats right or wrong).

We can't tell what has happened before, we can only judge based on the video online. Of course it would be different if he had punched the horse - however, yet again I would say that if that were true if she was any type of genuine horse lover she would have cantered off in the other direction! Id never ever put my horse at risk like that, I certainly would not turn round and then start tying to run my horse into the man who had done it - thats insane.

 

[cobgoblin]

There is a longer clip on YouTube

https://youtu.be/FhHi8Yh1_5o

The Metro clip is very edited.

 

[Hexx]

I was quite surprised reading the comments section following this article - a lot of support for the lady for defending herself and her horse. Although I think she was excessive in her actions, I would have probably done the same thing if someone had grabbed my horse.

One of the comments asked whether the article would have read differently if the headline had been "woman defends herself from attack" - which is really what she was doing.

I just find it incredible that the police do not come down harder on these people - regardless of what you feel about hunting - the fact that men and women can trespass on property with their faces covered by a balaclava and not be dealt with by the police seems totally wrong. If that person was to walk down a London street, dressed in black with a balaclava on, you could bet they would be swamped by police.

 

[ponyparty]

I just find it incredible that the police do not come down harder on these people - regardless of what you feel about hunting - the fact that men and women can trespass on property with their faces covered by a balaclava and not be dealt with by the police seems totally wrong. If that person was to walk down a London street, dressed in black with a balaclava on, you could bet they would be swamped by police.

Cannot agree more!

 

[Judgemental]

No, by law the man also has a right to protect himself! And as we know in law, a human will always come before an animal (whether thats right or wrong).

We can't tell what has happened before, we can only judge based on the video online. Of course it would be different if he had punched the horse - however, yet again I would say that if that were true if she was any type of genuine horse lover she would have cantered off in the other direction! Id never ever put my horse at risk like that, I certainly would not turn round and then start tying to run my horse into the man who had done it - thats insane.

The old established law of horses and pedestrians puts the horse first and the safety of the rider first. As with horses and motor vehicles.

Bet the police (Crown Prosecution Service) take no action against the rider because Counsel for the rider will 'trot out' a whole variety of laws and precedents going back 'donkey's years', giving the rider the perfect right to dispense a summary defence when they are put at risk. (A few puns for good measure)

The laws were established in the 1800's

Allow me to revert to my earlier post in connection with police horses. They are used to herd crowds and the public must not touch the horse.

The lady rider was perfectly within her right to herd the saboteur off her land, under old established laws, that are seldom used but they are still on the statute.

Counsel would have a 'field day' on the subject.

 

[Asha]

One of the comments asked whether the article would have read differently if the headline had been "woman defends herself from attack" - which is really what she was doing.

I just find it incredible that the police do not come down harder on these people - regardless of what you feel about hunting - the fact that men and women can trespass on property with their faces covered by a balaclava and not be dealt with by the police seems totally wrong. If that person was to walk down a London street, dressed in black with a balaclava on, you could bet they would be swamped by police.

totally agree ^^^.Put yourself in the same situation. Someone trespassing - already breaking the law, therefore in my opinion shows no regard for the law, dressed in balaclava grabs your reins. You'd be pretty scared. You would probably do something out of character to defend yourself.

 

[ester]

Tempers seem to run very high on both sides when this sort of thing happens, understandably so and I think people then make poor judgements.

I would like to know why she decided to continue to engage with them, given that the rest of the field other than the chap and the terriermen/footfollowers seemed to be well out the way at this point. They want a fight, and they want footage, why give them what they want.

 

[MagicMelon]

I just find it incredible that the police do not come down harder on these people - regardless of what you feel about hunting - the fact that men and women can trespass on property with their faces covered by a balaclava and not be dealt with by the police seems totally wrong. If that person was to walk down a London street, dressed in black with a balaclava on, you could bet they would be swamped by police.

I dont want to open a can of worms here, but I imagine the sabs arguement would be that they cant believe the police dont do more to stop illegal hunting which is still continuing in many hunts... I guess they feel they have to take the law into their own hands to a degree. I dont support either - both are very much in the wrong. I do believe that hunts need closely monitoring though, but not by people like this.

 

[mle22]

How anyone watching that clip can defend that woman is beyond me!

 

[Cecile]

Tempers seem to run very high on both sides when this sort of thing happens, understandably so and I think people then make poor judgements.

I would like to know why she decided to continue to engage with them, given that the rest of the field other than the chap and the terriermen/footfollowers seemed to be well out the way at this point. They want a fight, and they want footage, why give them what they want.

I agree ^^

Trespass is a civil matter and even on a PRoW if someone is causing a disturbance to the landowner within law you may use reasonable force to remove them but what is reasonable force, doubt its keep trying to run them down with a horse whilst waving a whip.
If you are easily goaded then keep away, keep your cool, don't respond and let anyone get footage of you acting like a mad person, why hand over what they want? They now have the footage that they wanted so happy days for them...
The rest of the field didn't even come to help her or her horse, if a loan woman was surrounded by people and she was using force to keep them at bay in any reasonable situation I would expect the people I was with to come to the rescue, obviously they didn't wish to get involved and at any time she could of just ridden off and taken herself completely out of that situation.
They didn't even try to upset the other rider as he remained calm and non reactive

She gave them what they came for and for now its big news