It happened again.

Caramac71

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I sent the video to my physio and, based on Nova’s behaviour and what she’s felt in our appointments, she thinks it’s likely to be arthritis of the vertebrae or damage to the supraspinous ligament (not sure if I’ve spelt that correctly). I have no experience of either but they seem pretty drastic and “ridden-life” ending
I've just come across this thread and I can really sympathise with everything you are going through. I wanted to share an abbreviated version of our story with you, in case any of it is of benefit.

We had a 5 year old (very low mileage) mare who was diagnosed with facet joint arthritis and strain to her supraspinous ligament, following a complete reluctance to go forward and nappy behaviour. We were very inexperienced (my daughter was 16 and this was the first horse we had purchased) and everyone told us it was behavioural, she should ride through it, etc. But gut instinct told us something was wrong and we sought vet advice. She eventually got her diagnosis after a bone scan (the facet joints didn't show on back x-ray). She had Tildren, shockwave and extensive rehab - she improved to a degree but was written off by the vets as "a hack at best" - which wasn't ideal as not what we'd bought her for and she was awful to hack.

We tried everything we could over the next couple of years, without any permanent improvement. Sometimes she'd improve temporarily after a treatment but then revert back. It just always felt like we were treating the latest symptoms but had never got to the root of the cause of her problems, and it always seemed odd that a young mare who'd done very little previously would have arthritis.

I eventually contacted Tom Beech (The osteopathic vet) and asked him if he would see her and tell me if she was worth continuing with. I just needed an honest opinion to tell me it was time to stop. We agreed he would assess and treat, and then see her a short time after treatment to see if any improvement. If she'd reverted back, then that was our sign to stop trying. At his first assessment, he found her to have an enlarged right ovary (she'd previously had scan of ovaries that hadn't shown up anything unusual) and he suspected she had hind gut issues. He gave the first osteo treatment, and we started her on a dietary regime and supplements to support both issues, along with inhand rehab exercises.

He returned for a follow up a month or so later, and felt she had maintained the effects of the previous treatment. So we agreed to continue. It took time but she did get back to full work; competing dressage up to elementary and jumping at around 80cm. Most of that was limited by her work ethic and temperament 😀 rather than any physical problems. She still sees Tom twice a year for maintenance checks but we know her well enough now to recognise when her issues are flaring up and how to adjust her supplements and lifestyle accordingly.

She's 15 now, we've semi retired her as she didn't enjoy the competing side of things, and my daughter has bought another horse with the aim of competing. But she's still sound and happy, and enjoys being ridden a couple of times a week.
 

J_sarahd

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Has she done any other work asides the lunging Saturday since the steriods? Lunging isn't the best for hocks/joint problems but understand it needs to be done for vet purposes. Is she sound in a straight line? Could she do some walking in hand (if she is happy enough) rather than circles and ridden work. Just thinking - to keep her using her muscles.
I can try and walk her in-hand down the lane tomorrow. She can be quite difficult but I suppose I should give it a try. Yeah I only lunged her to see if she was sound before trying to ride her as absolutely do not feel comfortable getting on a visibly lame horse haha!
 

J_sarahd

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I've just come across this thread and I can really sympathise with everything you are going through. I wanted to share an abbreviated version of our story with you, in case any of it is of benefit.

We had a 5 year old (very low mileage) mare who was diagnosed with facet joint arthritis and strain to her supraspinous ligament, following a complete reluctance to go forward and nappy behaviour. We were very inexperienced (my daughter was 16 and this was the first horse we had purchased) and everyone told us it was behavioural, she should ride through it, etc. But gut instinct told us something was wrong and we sought vet advice. She eventually got her diagnosis after a bone scan (the facet joints didn't show on back x-ray). She had Tildren, shockwave and extensive rehab - she improved to a degree but was written off by the vets as "a hack at best" - which wasn't ideal as not what we'd bought her for and she was awful to hack.

We tried everything we could over the next couple of years, without any permanent improvement. Sometimes she'd improve temporarily after a treatment but then revert back. It just always felt like we were treating the latest symptoms but had never got to the root of the cause of her problems, and it always seemed odd that a young mare who'd done very little previously would have arthritis.

I eventually contacted Tom Beech (The osteopathic vet) and asked him if he would see her and tell me if she was worth continuing with. I just needed an honest opinion to tell me it was time to stop. We agreed he would assess and treat, and then see her a short time after treatment to see if any improvement. If she'd reverted back, then that was our sign to stop trying. At his first assessment, he found her to have an enlarged right ovary (she'd previously had scan of ovaries that hadn't shown up anything unusual) and he suspected she had hind gut issues. He gave the first osteo treatment, and we started her on a dietary regime and supplements to support both issues, along with inhand rehab exercises.

He returned for a follow up a month or so later, and felt she had maintained the effects of the previous treatment. So we agreed to continue. It took time but she did get back to full work; competing dressage up to elementary and jumping at around 80cm. Most of that was limited by her work ethic and temperament 😀 rather than any physical problems. She still sees Tom twice a year for maintenance checks but we know her well enough now to recognise when her issues are flaring up and how to adjust her supplements and lifestyle accordingly.

She's 15 now, we've semi retired her as she didn't enjoy the competing side of things, and my daughter has bought another horse with the aim of competing. But she's still sound and happy, and enjoys being ridden a couple of times a week.

Thank you! That’s interesting - I may speak to Tom, depending on what happens on Monday
 

J_sarahd

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The steroids don't always take effect immediately where did the vet put the steroids and I'm thinking it was done on Friday?
IMG_9841.jpeg

Not the best photo for seeing where they were done. But in the middle of those bandages on the outside. Yeah they were done on Friday 2nd
 

J_sarahd

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Did they scan her suspensories?
Not this time. They scanned them when she went back 6 or so weeks ago and he said everything was looking good. This time, he said that because she wasn’t lame on their soft, he didn’t think it was suspensories. Obviously, I just went along with whatever he said because he’s a vet and apparently one of the best in the country. I also think he perhaps doesn’t want to admit that his surgery could potentially be a failure.

I honestly feel like Nova and I are a bit of a cash cow for them at the moment. We are no closer to finding an answer than we were a year ago and we’ve spent over £10k.
 

I'm Dun

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Its ok to call it a day. I would have long ago. Theres always the odd horse that makes a miracle recovery, but you know what? You never relax, ever misstep you panic, any time they don't go as well as they should you get that sinking feeling. And realistically, most horses don't have a miraculous recovery. Some just don't stand up to being ridden. Tbs sadly fall into that category a lot. Over and slightly in bred with the only interest in short term speed. Then they break them young and work them hard. Its a recipe for disaster, and heart break for you.

As someone who kept going longer than I should having him PTS was heart breaking but I also felt the biggest sense of relief that it was over for me and he wasn't suffering anymore.
 

J_sarahd

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Its ok to call it a day. I would have long ago. Theres always the odd horse that makes a miracle recovery, but you know what? You never relax, ever misstep you panic, any time they don't go as well as they should you get that sinking feeling. And realistically, most horses don't have a miraculous recovery. Some just don't stand up to being ridden. Tbs sadly fall into that category a lot. Over and slightly in bred with the only interest in short term speed. Then they break them young and work them hard. Its a recipe for disaster, and heart break for you.

As someone who kept going longer than I should having him PTS was heart breaking but I also felt the biggest sense of relief that it was over for me and he wasn't suffering anymore.
Thank you. I think my head knows that that’s the right thing to do for both of us.

My heart just doesn’t want to let her go and almost feels like I’m failing her by not exploring every single avenue. Even though that’s not financially viable - and it puts a huge emotional and mental strain on me. I know that none of this is my fault but I do feeling like I’m letting her down.

My physio has suggested turning away for 6 months but a) I can’t afford it alongside keeping my space at our current yard and b) worry that what if she doesn’t come right in 6 months? Then it’s just prolonged everything and wasted £££ to get to the same conclusion. If I had the money, then I’d probably try retiring her out with a herd.
 

TheMule

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You have given SO much to this horse to try to get her physical issues sorted, please don’t feel at all guilty that you aren’t going to keep looking. Some horses just are not made to cope with ridden work and her body has broken- it's not your fault in any way and it's a total money pit trying to fix horses like this because you cannot change what nature gave her originally. You've already done far, far more than most people would have done and you have given her a really fair chance. I personally would give her a nice month of just being a horse and then let her go at peace before the weather becomes more challenging.
 

J_sarahd

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His put it in the suspensories by the sound of it.

Has she had the hocks x rayed?
He says yes and that he saw some bone spurring on the left but in all honesty, I’ve not seen the x-rays. (I didn’t see the back x-rays until I asked for them so it’s not unusual)
 

J_sarahd

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You have given SO much to this horse to try to get her physical issues sorted, please don’t feel at all guilty that you aren’t going to keep looking. Some horses just are not made to cope with ridden work and her body has broken- it's not your fault in any way and it's a total money pit trying to fix horses like this because you cannot change what nature gave her originally. You've already done far, far more than most people would have done and you have given her a really fair chance. I personally would give her a nice month of just being a horse and then let her go at peace before the weather becomes more challenging.
Thank you. I think you’re right and giving her the rest of the summer to be a horse is probably the best thing to do.
 

Hormonal Filly

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His put it in the suspensories by the sound of it.

Has she had the hocks x rayed?

I agree, interesting bandage placement for hock injections. Unless he medicated the lower hock joint?

@J_sarahd Can you request a telephone call with the vet that saw Nova? You can discuss your concerns and listen to his thoughts, what work he advises if she still isn't right or does he advise field rest until he sees her next. I really find a call with a vet really helps - I'd do this before making a decision on turning away although agree it can really help having a period of field rest.
 

J_sarahd

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I agree, interesting bandage placement for hock injections. Unless he medicated the lower hock joint?

@J_sarahd Can you request a telephone call with the vet that saw Nova? You can discuss your concerns and listen to his thoughts, what work he advises if she still isn't right or does he advise field rest until he sees her next. I really find a call with a vet really helps - I'd do this before making a decision on turning away although agree it can really help having a period of field rest.
I wish I’d got a photo of the lil patches they shaved. I’m completely new to all of this so I have no idea.

He recommended a few days off and then a return to work. I can try and give him a call but he’s extremely hard to get hold of and only works Mon, Weds and Fri - and Weds is surgery day so I doubt I’ll be able to contact him then.
 

Hormonal Filly

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I wish I’d got a photo of the lil patches they shaved. I’m completely new to all of this so I have no idea.

He recommended a few days off and then a return to work. I can try and give him a call but he’s extremely hard to get hold of and only works Mon, Weds and Fri - and Weds is surgery day so I doubt I’ll be able to contact him then.

Ah okay. You could try calling or leave him a message. If no luck, possibly ring the office and ask if another vet could fit you in for a telephone call, might be able to advise how to proceed for the next week until your vet next sees her.

ETA Is the insurance covering the hock injections?
 

J_sarahd

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Ah okay. You could try calling or leave him a message. If no luck, possibly ring the office and ask if another vet could fit you in for a telephone call, might be able to advise how to proceed for the next week until your vet next sees her.

ETA Is the insurance covering the hock injections?
Yeah I’ll give him a call tomorrow. Another vet probably won’t speak to me - I tried that when I sent the videos of Nova a few weeks ago.

Thankfully, yes. Hocks are still covered. Not much else of her is though at this point
 

PinkvSantaboots

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I only ask as when Arabi had his hocks and suspensories medicated he looked better but not right so my vet put steroid in the si, he had 10 days off work and he immediately looked so much better afterwards.

The back leg issues can cause si pain.
 

SEL

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I only ask as when Arabi had his hocks and suspensories medicated he looked better but not right so my vet put steroid in the si, he had 10 days off work and he immediately looked so much better afterwards.

The back leg issues can cause si pain.
mine too

they didn't find anything on the SI scan but she was a lot happier after a bit of steroid there
 
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