New mare has gone wild.

Do you think that you and your daughter are perhaps more anxious than usual due to the pony you bought a couple of months ago that proved unsuitable?

Loss of confidence

We bought my daughter a pony 2 months ago and she's had a couple of falls and she has lost all confidence. She went to pieces today and got off during her lesson. The pony had done nothing wrong but she couldn't hold it together. Daughter is 11 and pony is 6. Anyone ever had similar with...
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racmun said:
I was reassured by the owner that she had been on loan before and had no trouble before whatsoever with changing to overnight stabling and settling. I specifically asked the question before purchase
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This may be the case though.
Sometimes some horses just develop a very strong connection with another horse, for no apparent reason (to us humans, anyway).
It may just be that your horse has developed one of these very strong bonds and is being a bit over the top because it’s all new.
 
ester said:
Right so if the old owner isn’t able to have her back there’s less rush to see what you actually have.
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Yes, this is true. If you know that realistically, sending her back is not an option, then I would try to take the pressure off everyone and just aim to survive the next month or so without anyone being hurt or overly distressed, and *probably* things will improve. And worst case - if they don't improve, then at least you have a better idea of the extent of the problem you're dealing with.

I'm sorry for all of you that you've ended up in this situation though, it's upsetting and no fun for anyone. I hope things improve. My guess would be that they probably will.
 
racmun said:
I was reassured by the owner that she had been on loan before and had no trouble before whatsoever with changing to overnight stabling and settling. I specifically asked the question before purchase
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What sort of set up did they have where she went on loan? Was she still on individual turnout? Or group turnout?
It may just be a perfect storm of new yard/group turnout/mare in season. I wouldn't send her away to sales livery just yet. Give her time to come out of season and settle in.

For now I wouldn't try to separate her from her friends. If it is safe, and I emphasise IF IT IS SAFE, spend time with her in the field. Groom her, fuss her, let her get to know you. She doesn't need to associate you with that person who comes and takes me away from my mates.

If the behaviour settles down, which I strongly suspect it will given time and once her season has finished, then you can begin testing the water with taking her away from her friends slowly. I'd start with just getting a headcoller on and asking her to take a few steps away from her field mates. If she's settled and not stressed, reward and let her go. Move up to perhaps leaving the field but still keeping the others in sight, reward and put her back. Build up to her being stabled away from them. She needs to understand that even when she leaves the herd, she still goes back to them. So make coming in a pleasant experience. Groom, fusses, treats, etc and take riding off the table for a while.

I have dealt with separation anxiety myself and whilst some horses may always be a bit anxious leaving their friends, it can be something you can overcome with time. But without wanting to be blunt, this isn't a quick fix and if you cannot put the work in to resolving this, then you may have no option but to sell or get a professional to help.
 
Re the pony we bought in Jan we still have him. He was too young for my DD which is why I went for a been there done it safe type pony this time round for her. (Or so I thought)

I ride the other pony and we have a 16 year old sharer who absolutely loves him. Her mum has asked if we would consider selling him to them. I might end up having to.

So no, I don't think we are overly anxious or stressed because of the other pony.

The yard owner has flagged the new pony's behaviour. She has run a yard for probably 25 years and has seen many many horses in that time. She has backed and bought on lots of youngsters and competed at a very high level. She has raised an eyebrow at the pony acting the way it is. So it isn't me being some neurotic novice horse owner that is the problem.
 
ester said:
The thing is there is no guarantee that you will actually be able to return her/it might be a legal fight to do so unless the previous owner has offered.

Realistically here you are getting the experiences of many people moving their own horses (so not even new to them) and watching their horses struggle. Some can move and be fine, some are a lot more sensitive. I had to promise my new YO my own gelding wouldn’t always be like he was for the first month and being a mare adds an extra layer of complication.
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This.

I moved my mare(whos 8 and i've owned for 4 years) from a yard where there was her and 2 geldings, in separate big fields(plenty of grass, not much going on). I moved her 4 hours away to a yard where there is 40 horses all in individual paddocks. She lost her mind.
This was in January, I am just now starting to get my chilled, long rein hacking mare back now, nearly 4 months later. Had i of not already known my horse i would have thought 'omg what have a bought!' but i knew it was out of character for her, stuck to a good routine, made sure to do the little things to make friends with her(favourite itchy spot, grooming, hand grazing) and with time and grass now coming though we are coming out the other side. We have previously moved yards a number of times but never that far and never to such a big yard but different yards have different smells and different people walking past, it's a lot for them to take in and adjust to.

Give her time, try not to be in a bad mood with her, she doesn't know any different. Keep things simple and in a good routine so she knows what to expect daily. Spend time doing some ground work, even in the stable, just getting her to move away from you will help to settle her and establish that you're her leader and she's safe with you. Look in to ground work to do to reduce her anxiety and get her focus on you. It won't take long and she will come down but it won't be over night.

I don't think you have any grounds to return her but maybe the seller will take her back, if you're going to do that then ask sooner rather than later, this isn't a quick fix so you either need to commit to invest the time now or don't.
 
I do feel sorry that you find yourself in this situation. As others have said, you haven't had the pony for long and it is unrealistic to think that there wouldn't have been any problems.

I think that the pony may well come good and settle, but I do feel that (a) she won't be suitable for your child until she does and (b) it will take time and patience that you may not have or want to invest.

Have a think and decide if you want to work on this pony together and be prepared to build a relationship up from scratch, preferably with professional help. This in itself will be a great learning curve for you both.
Or you could employ professional help and get someone to work on the pony on your behalf and perhaps use riding schools or alternatives for you child to continue riding in the meantime.
Or you could cut your losses and sell the pony. It may be easier than you think to find a home for it where it will feel settled.
 
I'm not rushing to send her away on sales livery just yet. I will obviously give her more time to settle and find her feet but I wanted to put a marker down with her old owner quite quickly.

If my much loved family pony was acting completely out of character i'd want to know and would have her back but everyone's circumstances are different.
 
racmun said:
I'm not rushing to send her away on sales livery just yet. I will obviously give her more time to settle and find her feet but I wanted to put a marker down with her old owner quite quickly.

If my much loved family pony was acting completely out of character i'd want to know and would have her back but everyone's circumstances are different.
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I suspect you overpaid as thought you had found the perfect pony so the old owners are very unlikely to give you all your money back but you might be able to do a deal for some of it ? Worth a try by the sound of things and you will end up losing money if you go the sales livery route anyway.
 
racmun said:
I'm not rushing to send her away on sales livery just yet. I will obviously give her more time to settle and find her feet but I wanted to put a marker down with her old owner quite quickly.

If my much loved family pony was acting completely out of character i'd want to know and would have her back but everyone's circumstances are different.
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I'm sure most people would in an ideal situation but not everyone's circumstances allow them to. You've asked the question, the seller has said she can't have her back, so I'm afraid that's the end of the matter as frustrating as that might be.
 
She sounds really upset and can probably tell you are too.

I'd be getting her on a gut supplement ASAP so she doesn't give herself ulcers. All the stressing will not be helping her feel any better as she'll be aggravating her stomach. A lot of mares will come into season when there are new horses living with or next to them so that's quite normal.

Make sure she's getting loads of fibre to keep her stomach settled, I'd give a course of Protexin Quick Fix and add Protexin Gut Balancer on double dose until her stress levels reduce. I don't think she necessarily needs any hormone supplements, she's just being a horse in a new place with a new routine. They don't understand things like we do, they're prey animals and they need to go through all the risk factors in their new environment all over again until they know they're safe where they are so she will be clinging to the ones that are there that she can trust and rely on to tell her if there are any dangers.

I wouldn't be doing anything with her other than your yard routine, if that's just bringing in and turning out. Right now, she feels vulnerable and scared. She's not being nasty. Reassure her, praise her and build on the positive experiences she's having, even if that's just going over to her in the field and giving a carrot over the fence. She needs time which I can see you have acknowledged and I hope you give her a chance but understandable if you don't.

Fwiw, my mare was in season last week as there were two new arrivals across the field from her and she was obsessed. She's back to not caring again now!
 
Have you asked if the old owner will take her back?

My one that didn’t like the first home we tried I refunded in full and met them half way. No way would I have willingly left her somewhere she was unhappy if I could help sort things out.
 
I have sympathy for everyone involved in this situation, because there is no good solution if the seller can't take the pony back. I bought my pony from a riding school and brought him into a livery yard. The intention was for my daughter and I to share him. After the move he was very anxious, barging, calling, walking all over us, terrified of anything that moved. For a month I only did groundwork, we started riding, he remains anxious in certain situations (you can see my other posts asking for help on here, he has improved a lot). But the reality is that it took six months to be able to tie him to brush him aithout him barging and squashing people, after nine months we can manage a walk in hand of 40 minutes and he probably calls three or four times and gets agitated a couple, he doesn't hack out alone, hacks in company at walk but spooks a lot, is better in the lessons but can still "leave the room", still calls his field mates if he is alone in the arena. My daughter cannot ride him, she can brush him if he is tied and she pays attention. We are well accompanied by the yard owner and his previous owner, but still, it takes time.

This is a pony from a riding school (although he was always a bit special and anxious). Will he settle one day to the extent that he will be the pony that we can share? I don't know. How long will it take? I don't know either. Is it a bit sad for our plans, yes it is. Is he happy? Yes he is, because we take pleasure in the small victories and we meet him where he is on that day and we work with it. So this is probably your choice. Do you want to spend the time that it 'might' take to have the pony in a million and do you have this time? Because nobody can tell you how long this will be. Even if you get professional help you will need to carry on the work yourself. And are you able to re-imagine your plans so that instead of being able to come up to the yard and have a good lesson, progress is that she stays tied for five minutes calmly and you brush her? Or that she walks from the field calmly. If not, this is fine, there should be no judgement for this. All the reasons as to why she is like this are useful to know but the thing that will determine if she can become the pony you want is how you deal with the pony she is now.

I believe that the worst thing would be to keep her and not be able to find these small positives, not be able to find pleasure in working through the basics with her and helping her find her confidence and always feeling frustrated about what she "should" be, because this will be demoralising for you and her. Because she doesn't know that she should be a pony in a million, she just knows how she feels at that moment. In this case, it would be much kinder to sell her, fully disclosing all that you have learnt and finding her an appropriate home.
 
Thanks grass chop. I am just going to take it slow and try and take her for some in hand walks etc.

She needs to trust us and we her so I realise it will take time. She was just so frenetic on Saturday I thought someone would get hurt.

The horse she is obsessed with is going away at the weekend and I am going to switch our pony to overnight turnout still in the same herd though so that may or may not help. She might go nuts if her friend isn't there but it will be interesting to see if she behaves differently.
 
Yes they said they can’t.

As above I’d use the time to start ticking off the basics supplements wise, I’d prob get a body worker too as she’ll be holding a lot of tension, also even with all that YO experience and there’s nothing wrong with getting a different set of eyes on the situation. Is there anyone on the yard you can lead her out with/out with your other one so she gets to see more stuff but with back up rather than being on her own. Some do seem to do better for being hacked out locally in order to settle
 
Will you be able to arrange it so that your pony is in the field when her friend leaves? Actually, how is she currently when her friend leaves the field?

It could just load the situation even more if she comes in, expecting her friend to be in the field when she goes back, to find she suddenly isn't that day, because then that's another reason (a trauma in her mind) for not wanting to leave the field and being constantly stressed to want to get back there ASAP.
 
Well despite what you may have heard this behaviour will not come as a surprise to her seller. Why was she loaned out so much anyway? I suspect you missed a few red flags but that's the nature of buying sometimes. You do seem to be accumulating them now so time for a different approach;) This may even be a trigger that goes back to her start in life, being removed from the mare/her mum too early. This happens a lot with colts for obvious reasons, so this fear for whatever reason is very real for her. And there's a hormonal issue in the mix. Can you try her on Regumate for a while just until she gets a routine and accepts that she's staying put this time. Consistent, confident handling is what she needs and she's on part livery so this should be happening. From what you say she is trying to cooperate but she's desperate for something familiar, just make sure that's you.
 
This just sounds like a mare in spring coping with a change in environment.
OP you sound very inexperienced is there someone experienced who can help in real life .
Your complaint about the mare being covered in stable stains and sweated after a 25 min lunging session makes you sound very unkind and lacking in empathy.
Frankly it made me really cross.
Horses have their lives ripped apart when they are sold and some find it very unsettling .
I have bought two horses who came from individual type management situations and I have another atm who is someone else’s .
All three have had some issues around friends but have settled.
If problems continue many mares do better medicated over the summer to stop their seasons, you should seek advice from your vet.
 
We had a new forest pony who we moved onto grass livery from a quiet family home to a livery yard. We had a huge amount of support from her old owners including folders with her summer and winter feeds. Even which hole to put her tack on as they knew she would was the first we had owned. It became obvious she wanted to be stabled (literally ran back to the yard) so we did field in the day stable at night. She was nappy for several months out hacking. Definitely wasn't herself for some time.

She settled and became the most fantastic family pony who we kept until the day she died eleven years later. She coped fine with other moves but I think it was the combination of new owners and a new very different yard was just a lot for her.
 
I’ve owned my mare for 14 years. When I moved her to her current yard, she exploded with anxiety and stress. She went through a stable door, banged her head into the stable walls, couldn’t be kept in a field and was generally like nothing I’d ever seen with her before. I had everything checked, she also got worse as the days went on. She couldn’t cope with any horse leaving her. Some she was more obsessed with than others. Until eventually, with time, she settled.

The cause? She’d been on turnout with just one other horse for a few years, and had a couple of moves in a short amount of time. It was simply too much for my beautiful, stoic mare and she lost her mind for a while.

After a few months, she settled and gained confidence in new surroundings and routine.

It happens, especially with mares. I’ve been the sole carer of mine for 14 years and it still happened with her when it never had before.
 
So we've been this evening just to spend some time with her and the demon like pony appears to have disappeared.

She was happily standing dozing in her stable when we arrived. We groomed her plaited her mane as she was hot and gave her some of her lickit which she didn't seem too interested in.

She wasn't box walking or calling so literally a different horse to a couple of days ago.

It might be that it was her season which triggered the extreme reaction and is some ways that will be easier to manage with supplement or Regumate.

Re my comment re washing her she was in a bit of a state yesterday it wasn't a complaint just a statement explaining what I had done with her and why and I didn't want to leave her like that. How does that make me an uncaring horse owner?? Quite the opposite, I washed her down properly with shampoo etc make sure she was clean comfortable and not attracting flies
 
That’s really good, I agree with so many others that time and understanding that she needs that time to settle is the key here. She’s literally had her life turned upside down and need to try and understand things from her view point rather than being in the mindset that she’s being difficult.

Spend quality time with her, not riding her but being in her company with your child also. Grooming, scratching her itchy spots, leading her out to tasty places to graze etc etc.

You need to learn about her, and she needs to learn about you. With this you will both learn you can trust each other.
 
racmun said:
So we've been this evening just to spend some time with her and the demon like pony appears to have disappeared.

She was happily standing dozing in her stable when we arrived. We groomed her plaited her mane as she was hot and gave her some of her lickit which she didn't seem too interested in.

She wasn't box walking or calling so literally a different horse to a couple of days ago.

It might be that it was her season which triggered the extreme reaction and is some ways that will be easier to manage with supplement or Regumate.

Re my comment re washing her she was in a bit of a state yesterday it wasn't a complaint just a statement explaining what I had done with her and why and I didn't want to leave her like that. How does that make me an uncaring horse owner?? Quite the opposite, I washed her down properly with shampoo etc make sure she was clean comfortable and not attracting flies
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Can you imagine being wound up to the top of the tree, for whatever reason, and having someone whom you barely know and certainly don't trust trying to wet you all over with stuff that smells completely unfamiliar and certainly not like a horse?

When dealing with mares you absolutely must have empathy.

I'm glad for all concerned that she is more settled today and you can see a probable cause for her behaviour.
 
Have you started her on the Oestress? It can work wonders quickly! Regumate is an option but do so under vet advice, it’s nasty stuff to handle and definitely not for your daughter to handle feed/buckets etc..your vet would probably recommend a short trial period first in any case.

So you have bloods from your vetting? I would run them personally to check previous owner hasn’t given her anything to cause the more sedate behaviour…hopefully not but you would have very strong grounds to return regardless of whether they have room or not.

Very pleased she was better today!
 
racmun said:
So we've been this evening just to spend some time with her and the demon like pony appears to have disappeared.

She was happily standing dozing in her stable when we arrived. We groomed her plaited her mane as she was hot and gave her some of her lickit which she didn't seem too interested in.

She wasn't box walking or calling so literally a different horse to a couple of days ago.

It might be that it was her season which triggered the extreme reaction and is some ways that will be easier to manage with supplement or Regumate.

Re my comment re washing her she was in a bit of a state yesterday it wasn't a complaint just a statement explaining what I had done with her and why and I didn't want to leave her like that. How does that make me an uncaring horse owner?? Quite the opposite, I washed her down properly with shampoo etc make sure she was clean comfortable and not attracting flies
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Great news , she may well still be a one in a million children’s pony just an unsettled /hormonal one. I have a gelding but a few friends use Angus cactus and chaste berry which seems to make the seasons less hellish!

I did have a gelding once who got obsessed with another gelding in the herd, having never had any issues with separation anxiety etc before. No idea why this one pony caused him to become so obsessed. So owner could be telling the truth and not have seen this before, as I hadn’t either till I did.

I would avoid lunging hard etc and make coming away as pleasant experience as possible , we don’t even lunge the fit ones for that long.
 
racmun said:
I was reassured by the owner that she had been on loan before and had no trouble before whatsoever with changing to overnight stabling and settling. I specifically asked the question before purchase
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Oh I feel for you! Take a breath. And then a deeper slower one. Have a sigh.
Notice how you’re sat, or how you’re standing. Is your weight evenly spread evenly, or are you slightly, or very, wonky? Notice it, correct it, notice how the correction feels and notice your breathing again.
How far down in your body does your breath go? Can you draw a deeper breath?

Then think about your new horse, the YO and previous owner of the horse for a moment or two. Think about the things that have already happened, things you think might happen tomorrow..

Then notice your breathing again, and how you are sat or stood. Deep but relaxed breaths down, relax your eyes, correct your balance, and breathe, sigh, yawn and stretch your lips and jaw, breathe.

When you start flustering about the all too common situation you’re in, do the breathing etc as described. Do it on the way to the yard. Then stand with your horse and do the same. Try not too look at her, especially in the eye. If she reacts to anything around her then you look down, don’t look to see what’s worrying her or distracting her, you need to redirect her focus in a calm way - the aim is to teach her that you are the one to look to for advice if she’s worried or stressed. If you ‘say’ there’s nothing to fret about, then she will learn to believe you.

Her current excitement and over enthusiasm about having friends would have happened if she’d had the chance of the same at her old yard. But in this instance she’s at a new place, having had the stress of travelling, then totally new friends, new smells and noises. Putting a new horse, especially one that’s had to live on its own, into an established settled herd, is a social education for that horse.
How long had the existing group been together? Spend plenty of time watching how they all interact, and note how the relationships between them change. You may well spot that your issues are being instigated by another horse. Always make a point of taking time to say a smiley but chilled hello to all of the horses that yours shares a yard with. It’s important that all parties are calm in order to accept separation.

Then there’s the effect of the emotions and actions of the other humans around you all. When the humans around her are worried, uptight, thinking about what bad thing just happened and what might happen, wouldn’t any horse’s behaviour change, even on a good day?


Cow parsley. And it’s the season for it. Brilliant stuff for distracting in skittish moments - pick it, and hold low down to get stretch her head and neck, and breathe. Cow parsley is also very beneficial mentally and physically long term - check it out.
 
Let me share some of my experiences….When I bought our oldest mare for my daughter a decade ago the viewing was fab, daughter caught mare, tied up groomed tacked up and went off jumping and came back with broadest smile. Mare was bought and came home. Introduced to my mare and they were “cool” towards one another then I took my mare out of field first and new mare ran straight through electric fence to follow. Next day jumped it. We then discovered she was grumpy in the stable and has a bubble in front of it which she doesn’t like invading ..cue ears back and threatening to bite, once in the stable she would pick a hind leg up to threaten.
Now this was different behaviour to that which we d seen but she settled, got used to us and all her behaviours have softened and she loves my daughter who can go under her belly and hang all over her. The only thing I can’t do is take my other horses away first…she ll still go through fences to follow and she ll call if I ride out and she’s on her own but settles quickly. We got through the getting to know one another stage.
Recently a new livery arrived with a gelding who became attached to my youngest mare, they were stabled next to one another and in adjacent fields. The geldings behaviour had his owner of 12 years in a ball of anxiety as he tore up and down fence lines wrecking the fields when I brought her in first, he called and called, became a hot and sweaty mess and difficult to handle. Yard manager insisted he had to come in at the same time as my horses which caused difficulties for his owner. Eventually gelding was moved in with other geldings a couple of paddocks away and moved stables. He can see her, and calls occasionally but it’s taken a month and he s settled, less attached and doesn’t mind when she goes to and from the field. (My young mare doesn’t give a stuff about him).
What I’m trying to illustrate is..hang on in there, tweak the situation where you can and things may come so right you forget the problems at the beginning.
 
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