AmyMay
Situation normal
Which have been missing from this thread (and the other) - thankfully.
New trainer in action 2.....
- Thread starter Armas
- Start date
Which have been missing from this thread (and the other) - thankfully.
*hic*
village idiot :D
ester
Not slacking multitasking
I think some, partly because I do, would struggle with this concept a bit, as most of us would have lessons on our 'pleasure' horses in order to then be able to take them out and compete more than having them trained by someone else to someone else's cues/working together as a partnership. Obviously it doesn't do them any harm to have a 'tune up' but I'd think Armas was more than capable of an entry level dressage test at this point. I just suppose that's why I don't really 'get it'
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Spring Feather
Well-Known Member
I've never seen this video before. Oh my word, what a breath of fresh air! I totally agree with Amymay; there's your rider!!
AmyMay
Situation normal
Totally agree with this, and was going to bring it up earlier.
Do you have lessons at all Armas?
ester
Not slacking multitasking
Yes sort of, am sure Frank could have made it to adv medium by now with my instructor but he's mine and it's been much more enjoyable working it on ourselves and sticking at novice/elem. (That and she'll admit to not being able to jump him 
)
)chazza44
Well-Known Member
He's a cool horse. I think he would be more than capable of a prelim, why not just enter and learn together? It would be a good learning experience for both of you and it's fun.
evehardwick
Member
Wheres your helmet? Safety first
Armas
Well-Known Member
I have been having lessons twice a week ever since Armas joined me. I am having a break from lessons on him at the moment as I want the trainers work to be consistent. Once this is achieved I shall be back to taking lessons with her on him.
However I am still hacking him out.
Wheres your helmet? Safety first
Helmets are not so common with trainers in France or Spain.
_GG_
Well-Known Member
I think we need to be careful here not to question an owners motives for doing anything or not doing anything.
I train, but hate competing, doesn't mean I can't enjoy taking the horses forward in their training, just for my own pleasure. I have loved having Fly ridden by a trainer while I recover from my fall and I will carry on letting her ride as she is able to do things I can't and that is good for Fly.
These have been verey interesting and thought provoking threads, but I am sure we all like to do what we do with our horses without being questioned by others.
James started these threads from a very genuine angle and has been extremely accommodating of very varied opinions, taken lots on board and anyone able to do that has the horses best interests at heart.
Yes, I also think the young girl rides beautifully, but we haven't seen her ride in the school or ask any real questions of the horse.
If, after lots and lots of trying a horse still cannot learn to relax into this type of work, it can be best to just accept that and allow the horse to do work that it is happy with.
I don't think we, as humans have a right to make any other animals fit around our wants and desires...full stop. This is why I don't like training aids or forceful riding. Fnd a horse that is happy to do what you want, rather than force the horse you have and make him unhappy.
That said, I don't see that this horse is unhappy to do the work...I just see that he has at some time been ridden in a way that made him learn that evasion was the only way. I do believe it is worth persevering with him. I do not believe we have the right to judge what James does or doesn't want to do with his horse....when we all seem to agree that his pursuit of good basic grounding is correct.
Hooe that makes sense.
I train, but hate competing, doesn't mean I can't enjoy taking the horses forward in their training, just for my own pleasure. I have loved having Fly ridden by a trainer while I recover from my fall and I will carry on letting her ride as she is able to do things I can't and that is good for Fly.
These have been verey interesting and thought provoking threads, but I am sure we all like to do what we do with our horses without being questioned by others.
James started these threads from a very genuine angle and has been extremely accommodating of very varied opinions, taken lots on board and anyone able to do that has the horses best interests at heart.
Yes, I also think the young girl rides beautifully, but we haven't seen her ride in the school or ask any real questions of the horse.
If, after lots and lots of trying a horse still cannot learn to relax into this type of work, it can be best to just accept that and allow the horse to do work that it is happy with.
I don't think we, as humans have a right to make any other animals fit around our wants and desires...full stop. This is why I don't like training aids or forceful riding. Fnd a horse that is happy to do what you want, rather than force the horse you have and make him unhappy.
That said, I don't see that this horse is unhappy to do the work...I just see that he has at some time been ridden in a way that made him learn that evasion was the only way. I do believe it is worth persevering with him. I do not believe we have the right to judge what James does or doesn't want to do with his horse....when we all seem to agree that his pursuit of good basic grounding is correct.
Hooe that makes sense.
Armas
Well-Known Member
I also get immense pleasure from watching him work properly. I suppose it is the same as a parent watching there child compete at a sports day.
I love watching my boy do well.
The girl is a lovely little rider but thats it.
I love watching my boy do well.
The girl is a lovely little rider but thats it.
AmyMay
Situation normal
I can understand that. Sometimes we need a break ourselves, to almost get our head around what we're being instructed to do.
Absolutely know where you're coming from on this one.
ester
Not slacking multitasking
yup my comment wasn't to question it, more just explain my thoughts on why some might not understand what you are trying to do/aiming for.
Zero00000
Well-Known Member
What is going on??
HAHA I read this like that.... CT strikes again,
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=X86HsD-O15Q (5 - 7 secs)
*Maddy&Occhi*
Well-Known Member
Yet again I very much agree with your post. I'm not experienced enough to comment on the rider. But what I can say is that having an Iberian horse is very challenging, and can be very difficult- it seems as if OP is doing his very best by Armas, and only trying to provide him with the very best education possible. I'm also having similiar issues with my andalusian so I really can relate to you.
Wish you the best of luck in your journey and do keep us updated- Armas is absolutely stunning.
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Mongoose11
Well-Known Member
Armas why aren't you dealing with the fairly sensible posts that question what is happening here and only engaging with those that support? Your choice, but interesting to watch. I thought I made some validish points but you cant seem to handle anything other than the fawning!
Oh and I didn't realise that the slang term for sodomy was so offensive to your eyes that it was infraction worthy it wasn't the F word - or can't you spell/count stars?
Oh and I didn't realise that the slang term for sodomy was so offensive to your eyes that it was infraction worthy
it wasn't the F word - or can't you spell/count stars?*Maddy&Occhi*
Well-Known Member
Ouch!
Armas
Well-Known Member
Armas why aren't you dealing with the fairly sensible posts that question what is happening here and only engaging with those that support? Your choice, but interesting to watch. I thought I made some validish points but you cant seem to handle anything other than the fawning!
Oh and I didn't realise that the slang term for sodomy was so offensive to your eyes that it was infraction worthy
I am engaging but thank you for your observation. Why on earth would I want to count stars ???
AmyMay
Situation normal
Armas why aren't you dealing with the fairly sensible posts that question what is happening here and only engaging with those that support? Your choice, but interesting to watch. I thought I made some validish points but you cant seem to handle anything other than the fawning!
Oh and I didn't realise that the slang term for sodomy was so offensive to your eyes that it was infraction worthy
Billie, why so inflammatory? These threads have been really interesting. 99.9% of the responses have in some way been critical, and Armas has responded to many of them (he can't realistically respond to them all).
_GG_
Well-Known Member
Armas why aren't you dealing with the fairly sensible posts that question what is happening here and only engaging with those that support? Your choice, but interesting to watch. I thought I made some validish points but you cant seem to handle anything other than the fawning!
Oh and I didn't realise that the slang term for sodomy was so offensive to your eyes that it was infraction worthy
I'm not sure where he isn't dealing with it to be honest...save to not repeat himself
I myself have made a fair few points that have been in direct opposition to his decisions, but he has taken them well and has indeed called for changes following the first thread.
What would you like to see here? Genuine question. There are a fair few posts where he is answering questions about what he is doing, even posting additional videos.
Armas
Well-Known Member
Rather long video from today. I deliberately left it longer so those that are interested can watch what they want.
Billy I don't wish to fight I don't wish to argue.I try to answer as many as I can.
http://www.horseandhound.co.uk/forums/showthread.php?p=11940775#post11940775
Billy I don't wish to fight I don't wish to argue.I try to answer as many as I can.
http://www.horseandhound.co.uk/forums/showthread.php?p=11940775#post11940775
Mongoose11
Well-Known Member
Probably because I am so irrationally irritated that I want to scratch out my own eyeballs? Unhealthy - yes. UI blah blah blah - I know all of that. IMO (doesn't count for anything and I'm ok with that) Armas has ideas above his station (right now) and the horse is taking the brunt. Please don't misinterpret this and suggest that I am saying goals aren't appropriate etc. That would be foolish. I'm saying IMO this isn't necessary and with him being unable to continue the work then... Why?
Spring Feather
Well-Known Member
Billie, don't get yourself all worked up
I say this to you kindly. I see and read lots of things on this forum that I disagree with, I'm sure we all do, but you have to realise that people will still do what they want to do regardless of how much one may disapprove. Live and let live is what I say 
Equilibrium Ireland
Well-Known Member
I was not questioning the owners motives by asking what the end game was for Armas. Just more information. I hate competing myself which is why I sent my mare away to begin with for jumping. Funny enough I didn't want to be one of those owners that felt my was the only way. I thought seperation for me and Abba would be a good thing. It backfired badly. Never again. I just don't care if I "do it right", a happy horse is what I want. So I just had to up my game. Lessons and maybe someone to compete only at shows. I also learned that no matter how much someone has accomplished, if I don't agree with how they get there, that is perfectly ok. There are more horses that just get on with things without complaint and make people look like geniuses. Anyway from now on I just have to work harder to be the rider my horses need. Not the other way round. Sounds simple but far from reality.
So I was not questioning motives of anyone.
Terri
So I was not questioning motives of anyone.
Terri
Armas
Well-Known Member
I find that statement rather rude and am disappointed that you would think that. I have ambition and goals, I am not sure how you translate that in to ideas above my station.
What makes you think I will not be continuing the work ? What would be the point ?
_GG_
Well-Known Member
Not quite sure where this comes from but is there maybe a chance that you know of have been annoyed by others trying to do too much with their horses and that frustration is rubbing off in here? I can't see any reason within these posts that you would feel so strongly about this.
I don't understand why you feel James as ideas above his station? He wants to start entry level dressage and have a go at low level equitation.
He wants the horse to be able to do the above...not a big ask of any horse.
He wants the horse to be able to relax into his work...don't we all?
He wants to be get a trainer to help his horse learn these things. Isn't that responsible? In just two sessions, the trainer, regardless of who she trains with has improved the horses general way of going into a more relaxed and harmonious one. Might not be as relaxed and harmonious as we would like to see...but any start is a good start.
In my honest opinion...if James is unable to teach his horse how to improve, I would much rather he get someone in who can do so than he carry on trying and likely make lots of mistakes along the way. It is not fair for a horse to be taught by a novice when they are only novice themselves.
Not calling James a novice rider by the way, but that he is not as experienced. Thank god some people can recognise that and not just carry on regardless.
Off to watch the new video now but Billie...I do understand where you are coming...look through my posts and will see me say that I believe if a horse really doesn't enjoy something, we have no right to make them do it...BUT I also don't think this horse suffers from lack of enjoyment, just lack of knowledge.
angelish
Well-Known Member
but why wouldn't somebody want to improve there horse ?
i know lots of people who would rather pay me or someone else to ride there horses just to simply watch and they enjoy watching rather than riding
they don't even have an interest in competing or learning to ride the horse once it has been re schooled , they simply enjoy the journey and why not ?
i'm liking this trainer better than brown boots Armas
i "get" the way she is riding him but that is maybe because the other trainer was spanish and i have little experience in that way of riding but it is still all very interesting Feival
Well-Known Member
Horrid, over bent and rushed!! she is haling him in with her hands rather than pushing him into the right shape from behind, the opposite of long and low. I fail to understand why you picked this rider.
Mongoose11
Well-Known Member
Why the naïve assumpptions that I could possibly mean that anyone shouldn't want to improve their horse? That's just silly. My point is why push it to a place it needs to get to using a method it so clearly rejects?
As for Armas continuing the work - at what level? Fight the horse until it accepts the seat and legs of a Cornellison (sp - sorry) student and then transfer it back to owner with neither. Has to start his education all over again.... Like we've already seen him do.
As for Armas continuing the work - at what level? Fight the horse until it accepts the seat and legs of a Cornellison (sp - sorry) student and then transfer it back to owner with neither. Has to start his education all over again.... Like we've already seen him do.
Armas
Well-Known Member
Sorry but your assumption is incorrect she is not hauling him in the slightest.May I suggest you read through the thread to have a better understanding of what is going on.
Billy your posts are becoming irate and rude. You are making statements that are not based on fact and are based on assumption. Please don't take this the wrong way but I am not going to get drawn in to a bun fight with you.
Please don't scratch your eyes out just step back and relax.