Should I hit the panic button?

Caol Ila said:
Had a long chat with OH today about the swings and roundabouts of everything. The potential instability of Hermosa's living situation is pants. Very pants. The delay on our training is not ideal but not terrible, given her age. OH thinks she's fantastic.

But I admitted that when things are going well with Hermosa -- between the moves and the yard management fails and the raging new mom hormones -- they are awesome. I love how light she is. I love how smart she is. I love how once she learns a cue, you can breathe or flick a finger and she does the thing. I love how it feels like driving a Ferrari (having never driven one, but taking a guess based on watching Top Gear). And she's got a sweeeeeeet trot and canter. At this second, I want a Toyota to potter around the park, but I really, really don't want to lose the Ferrari. I can keep two. That was always the plan because I thought Gypsum would rally and hang in there for some time when I bought Hermosa. So I'm looking out for my Toyota. But I really like the Ferrari.
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Hi, what a traumatic few months you have been through.

Just a (heretical) thought, could you save your pennies on a second horse and just send Hermosa somewhere wonderful to be trained, where you could be trained alongside her and then maybe in a year or so you would have the amazing 'sports Toyota' horse you want (I know that the foal is going to hinder your plans a bit.)

There is a lady, not so far away from me, but miles from you, at, at Pine Lodge School of Classical Equitation who knows everybody, everywhere in the PRE world!! Her daughter, Holly, is one of the top Equitation riders and they have lots of contacts all over the world. On a good day, she is really lovely and happy to share her knowledge and maybe worth a tentative contact to see if she knows any little private yards in your part of the world who would be an option!!! They now have closed the riding school, so I think fb is the best contact.

Worth a go while you have the time.
 
No, I wasn’t told that she was out with ungelded colts. I figured it out after she started looking pregnant.

I did, however, know she was with her sire but the breeder seemed to know her stuff and be on the ball, and I was an idiot and didn’t think about it.
 
Caol Ila said:
No, I wasn’t told that she was out with ungelded colts. I figured it out after she started looking pregnant.

I did, however, know she was with her sire but the breeder seemed to know her stuff and be on the ball, and I was an idiot and didn’t think about it.
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To be honest I don't think that makes much difference to how you should approach the dealer. They were up front about Hermosa running with a fertile male last year. It was a nasty unwelcome surprise to you but I doubt it will be any shock at all to them.
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Caol Ila said:
Would you add dates? It’s not like I knew about this pregnancy for the last two months and didn’t contact her.

I’ve been advised by OH that the blunt American approach isn’t always ideal when you want British people to do things.
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Add dates if you feel that will help. Can say that you found out on x and he was here by y! Imagine that..!

I suspect she may feel some sort of way about this happening. Whether that is guilt or entitlement, it is best to remain as neutral as possible so you don't lead her to feel like she has been put in an arse-covering position.
 
I think Spanish horses are generally just very sensitive.

I’m not an expert but have worked with them in Spain and now have one here. My experience is they are best in work and, when they are focused and have a job, that sensitivity translates to a beautiful riding experience. I think the key is not to be reactive to their sensitivity, and not to take it personally. You’re not doing anything to upset her but I think they just pick up on a lot more than other horses do - or at least they react to those things a bit more.

In terms of your letter to the breeders, I’d be friendly and polite and I would give as little information as possible right now.

Stick to the facts and the question; the mare foaled, it was unexpected, can you have some assistance in identifying the sire.

Nothing in there that could give away your feelings on the matter, or any further or related thoughts about the situation. And, crucially, nothing in there that could be used against you at any point or lead the breeder to behave defensively.

That gives you the ability to push the conversation in any direction that you choose once you have the response.
 
I’ve found a classical trainer just up the road. Managed to have one lesson before sh1t met fan. She was very good but doesn’t have her own facility. She comes to you. I certainly couldn’t find any private yards like that when I had to move her in March.

If Hermosa has to go anywhere, it will be to a stud or somewhere they can professionally deal with her and foal.
 
LadyGascoyne said:
I think Spanish horses are generally just very sensitive.

I’m not an expert but have worked with them in Spain and now have one here. My experience is they are best in work and, when they are focused and have a job, that sensitivity translates to a beautiful riding experience. I think the key is not to be reactive to their sensitivity, and not to take it personally. You’re not doing anything to upset her but I think they just pick up on a lot more than other horses do - or at least they react to those things a bit more.

In terms of your letter to the breeders, I’d be friendly and polite and I would give as little information as possible right now.

Stick to the facts and the question; the mare foaled, it was unexpected, can you have some assistance in identifying the sire.

Nothing in there that could give away your feelings on the matter, or any further or related thoughts about the situation. And, crucially, nothing in there that could be used against you at any point or lead the breeder to behave defensively.

That gives you the ability to push the conversation in any direction that you choose once you have the response.
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Yes re the Spanish horses. I roll my eyes and sometimes laugh. It's ridiculous the things mine comes up with. Fine with me flapping around a bedding bag today, but totally offended by a brush on the ground. He's 9 ?‍♀️ he's got a lot of jokes, but still the best horse I've ever had.

Just ignore it, basically. They can be drama queens.

If they are spooking and acting a fool together, I'd just be like, right, I'll be back later when you all sort yourselves out ? while training is important, you've got to have a sense of humor.

Mine is 9, so I do tell him "stop" and he pulls himself together, but Hermosa is young, and there is plenty of time to choose your battles. Sounds like you ended on a good note today nonetheless.
 
I would not get to hung up on how to register him as he is what he is and I am guessing he will be gelded in time. Maybe if he had been a filly yes it would be more of interest to find out its true parentage. You can get a passport without informing the previous owner who you seem cross with so why upset yourself
 
hobo said:
I would not get to hung up on how to register him as he is what he is and I am guessing he will be gelded in time. Maybe if he had been a filly yes it would be more of interest to find out its true parentage. You can get a passport without informing the previous owner who you seem cross with so why upset yourself
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I sort of thought this myself.

I'm not sure of the benefits of registering a gelding. Are there benefits when competing (certain classes)?

I am not sure that this would do a lot of favors for the horse in terms of finding the best home, or selling value, although CI could keep him and if not has someone already interested. If he's a good horse, he's a good horse, a gelding, and a horse who is not eligible for ANCCE anyway (which IMO holds more value and weight), so I'm not sure that documenting his paternal lineage will be incredibly useful or worth it. I could be wrong and missed something though.

If the breeder says, yeah sure, and is easy to work with, then I'd be like, sure why not, but in this case, could be more hassle and drama then it's worth.

However, if CI thinks it's worth a shot, then she should try it. Just be ready to brush off any weirdness from the breeder.
 
If the future owner or CI wants to do showing or the BD associated champs then he will need to be BAPSH registered. Also registered PRE fusions can also do the MCI UK champs and the PRE fusion performance awards.

I would say it would definitely be worth doing and would increase his value significantly.
 
I really don't think it matters what the breed is when it comes to handling a young mare with a new foal (or any other horse at any other time tbh). Whether it is hormones, the weather, noisy neighbours - you just need to be the same - calm, relaxed and consistent with them. Eventually that will take the steam out of any situation.

As regards approaching the breeder - write it as if you have a smile on your face at the lovely surprise Hermosa has given you (;)). It doesn't matter what you are really thinking, just as long as it gets you the result you want - her cooperation. If she gets possessive about the foal, then time enough to change your approach later.
 
shortstuff99 said:
If the future owner or CI wants to do showing or the BD associated champs then he will need to be BAPSH registered. Also registered PRE fusions can also do the MCI UK champs and the PRE fusion performance awards.

I would say it would definitely be worth doing and would increase his value significantly.
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This is the exact answer I was looking for. I didn't know all of this. Thanks for the info. Gives the owner (whoever that may be) more options for competition, so I can see that as a benefit.
 
Wow that’s crazy I nearly bought a horse that was pregnant before thankfully someone told me before I bought it. Unfortunately your yard owner doesn’t sound to happy with you having a foal. There is no shame in selling a horse and the foal if you’re not able to manage.
 
Caol Ila said:
When it rains, it pours. Nothing like putting your best friend to sleep, then going to see your (hopefully) new friend and feeling suspicious that they've been knocked up.

Is there any chance this horse could be pregnant, or is she just enjoying the grass too much? I'm about to make a panicked phone call to the vet tomorrow.
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I literally have the same issue! Calling vet on Monday. Two escaped colts last summer and one covered her. Very stressful but she has been in season loads so not 100% sure. Good luck
 
when it rains the grass grows quicker, which reduces the amount of magnesium in their diet. this in turn changes how neurone transmitters work, hence some horses whose diet is low in magnesium can become spooky etc, with mares which are feeding they are actually loosing a lot of magnesium through the milk, talk to your vet maybe a basic Magnesium supplement might help
 
I've been giving Hermosa the homeopathic stuff I used to give Gypsum when she went into season, which reliably made the latter less batsh1t (don't question it....I'm not). Hermosa has de-fruitlooped a bit and has resumed being amenable towards us playing with her and the baby. Caso is becoming ballsier. We can scritch his bum and work our way along his topline, along his mane. He's a bouncy wee thing, and he's increasingly curious about the weird two-legged things that come into the field every day.

Got Hermosa's headcollar on and off a couple times without faff. Caso is getting bolder, but Hermosa is still an anxious mum. When he runs off, she trots after him. While I had the headcollar on, he bounced away, and I whipped headcollar off before she noticed, and then she ran after him. It seems pointlessly messy to even think about holding her when she wants to chase her baby. That obviously doesn't work for anyone.

But maybe this will be the making of this mare. She's the Queen Bee in her little herd, and she bosses Caso and Old TB around. Made Old TB move off yesterday from 'her' humans. Quite a change from being a wilting lily. Her mum was bottom of the herd, and I've been told that mum was bullied by the other broodmares. So more confidence cannae be a bad thing.

Here are pictures I took today, for those of you saddened by lack of photos.

IMG_0543.JPGIMG_0544.JPGIMG_0545.JPGIMG_0546.JPGIMG_0547.JPG
 
KTPsurrey said:
I literally have the same issue! Calling vet on Monday. Two escaped colts last summer and one covered her. Very stressful but she has been in season loads so not 100% sure. Good luck
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Yeah. My horse turned out to be in foal. Very, very in foal. Now, I have a foal. See above thread.

(as an aside, I totally thought my mare was in season a few weeks beforehand, because she was being tricky to catch, planting, acting uncharacteristically difficult. I've only had her since March, so I didn't know what 'normal' heat behaviour was for her, but my old mare used to lose her mind completely, so I was prepared for anything. She wasn't in season. Obviously. In hindsight, the 'tricky' behaviour was probably due to late-term pregnancy hormones and the baby kicking around).
 
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Thanks for the photos. Hermosa does look quite relaxed in her eye so hopefully things will settle into a routine soon. Not sure this flip-flopping weather is helping anyone at the moment - certainly not my arthritis - and even the plants in the garden are looking confused!!
 
Red-1 said:
They are both so beautiful. I know you are not feeling particularly lucky about all this at the moment, but I do think that you are lucky. Even if you decide to sell.
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I think you are beyond lucky. No way could I ever sell either of them especially Caso. It is many people's dream to breed (which you have in a way) their own foal and to rear it, break it and make their own riding horse right the start.
 
they are both beautiful, you sound a little calmer now and more settled about the whole thing. losing Gypsum will have made your mind stressed, i have just lost one of my dogs and i cant believe what a state i am in, she was 15 so i should have been prepared but i think its still a shock and it takes time for your mind to settle. you then had the added shock of a foal which you didnt want so your mind has taken a second hit...hope all goes smoothly
 
He is very cute, and my friend, the lass with the blue hair in the photo, is keen to buy him.

I just don't want to raise two babies. If Hermosa were an older, established riding horse, then it would be totally different and I'd be far more tempted to keep him. But by the time she is established, it will be time to start bringing him on. I think I'll want a nice, trained horse (or two) to play with, show, and ride for a while and not feel like I'm breaking in babies all the time.

Now that I know she's a good mum, very fertile, and has a functional uterus, I can breed her again for myself, to a stallion of my choosing, some years down the line.
 
that's fair, the reason i was so happy to get a rising 3yo to wean my foal with was to avoid having 2 to back at the same time. a few years between them is more manageable. and as you say not everyone would even want that.
 
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