bonny
Well-Known Member
That was the what the dangerous dog act said some 30 years ago, it’s not exactly worked has it !
The breeding and selling of banned breeds
- Thread starter SecretSquirrel80
- Start date
Cortez
Tough but Fair
I didn't realise you guys don't have dog licenses over there. That's a bit mad, makes any kind of regulation almost impossible. We have to have licences to own dogs here, and they are checked by the dog warden - do you still have those?
Smitty
Well-Known Member
There was the very sad and shocking case of a great grandmother with dementia who was attacked and killed in her own garden by 2 dogs that had gotten out of their home and broken through her fence. This was over Easter in the Midlands I think.
I believe they were American bulldogs, but one report I remember said the police had removed them to do tests!!! Err, to what end? In my mind they ought to have been destroyed there and then and any tests could be carried out after.
I believe they were American bulldogs, but one report I remember said the police had removed them to do tests!!! Err, to what end? In my mind they ought to have been destroyed there and then and any tests could be carried out after.
skinnydipper
Well-Known Member
So am I, up to a point.
I can't see any good reason for owning a Tosa, Fila, Dogo or APBT in the UK.
CorvusCorax
Justified & Ancient
Tests include how a dog reacts to certain stimuli, bite strength etc. A boxer or lab cross may not react the same way as an American Bulldog.
Smitty
Well-Known Member
But, I'm happy to get one for my pet terrier. Not sure your average dog fighter or drug dealer would bother for his 'weapon' dog ..
CorvusCorax
Justified & Ancient
Realistically, how many of the other breeds apart from APBT were actually in the UK when the legislation was put in place? Or now, even?
skinnydipper
Well-Known Member
Sorry, I can't make much sense of or agree with this.
skinnydipper
Well-Known Member
Well, I've never seen any of those breeds but I think I must lead a sheltered life
Cortez
Tough but Fair
Yeah, then he'd lose his dog, that's what the dog warden does.
Clodagh
Well-Known Member
I completely agree with you.
Fellewell
Well-Known Member
Fellewell
Well-Known Member
Skinnydipper, I was trying to say that we have a responsibility to be able to contain all that drive if we fancy that type of dog. They're untrained dogs but they're not necessarily bad dogs. That's all.
stangs
Well-Known Member
I wouldn’t be able to distinguish between a Fila and most mastiff breeds, or a Tosa and a dog with a lot of Rhodesian Ridgeback blood. Dogo Argentinos are probably the most distinctive but could easily be mixed up with a white American Bulldog cross. I mean, I doubt that there are many - if any, in the case of the Tosa - but who would be able to tell if there were?
Smitty
Well-Known Member
I believe we have a part-time one here!! I do entirely agree with you by the way but not sure it would be a deterrant in practice.
splashgirl45
Lurcher lover
interesting report on bbc east tonight, family pet stolen from southend, they showed cctv footage of her being taken and she has now been recovered...the dog is an american bulldog with cropped ears and they have another in the home, couldnt see if that had cropped ears as well...both dogs look very friendly but also have that tough look....
Clodagh
Well-Known Member
I’m glad she was found. A friend shared her missing post. I thought she was gorgeous
. Which makes me think I need to make my mind up!
Cortez
Tough but Fair
Are cropped ears not illegal?
cbmcts
Well-Known Member
I feel that there might something that could work in real life if the law was to link training with certain freedoms and obligatory third party insurance and a license to own a dog. No particular breeds targeted, make it universal.
All dogs to be microchipped - already in place but should be enforced.
Mandatory PL insurance - underwriting risks linked to levels of training once the dog is a year old i.e. small reduction once the dog reaches the equivalent of bronze KC, big discount once KC silver is achieved, practically no or minimal cost once the dog is trained to KC Gold level as those dogs are going to be as safe as is reasonably possible.
A dog licence with some sort of ID like a tag that the dog has to wear in public so easily checked and the money raised by this route ring fenced for enforcement. One chance to comply or the dog is removed to kennels and a fine issued - a bit like car tax - the fine paid and a valid license and insurance in place before the dog is released. There will be some hard luck stories and potentially some 'innocent' dogs PTS to start with but in saying that, PTS is never a welfare issue.
Dogs have to be on a short lead unless they have a certified minimum level of training in public places.
Breeders and rescues should have more responsibilities in law to ascertain where their dogs go and a lifelong obligation to either take the dog back or pay a hefty fee to another organisation for them to fulfil their obligations. Rescues to have a legal liability to responsibly rehome and a need to document their decision making. That would limit any 'misunderstandings' between new owners and the rescue. Rescues should also be licensed with minimum standards.
In return, with these controls in place dog walkers should be given areas that they can use freely. No more blanket bans of dogs in public spaces such as parks unless another space is made for them very locally. Complaints about dogs to be treated fairly with a right of appeal and a move away from the current hysteria about certain breeds/types.
If only I ruled the world...
All dogs to be microchipped - already in place but should be enforced.
Mandatory PL insurance - underwriting risks linked to levels of training once the dog is a year old i.e. small reduction once the dog reaches the equivalent of bronze KC, big discount once KC silver is achieved, practically no or minimal cost once the dog is trained to KC Gold level as those dogs are going to be as safe as is reasonably possible.
A dog licence with some sort of ID like a tag that the dog has to wear in public so easily checked and the money raised by this route ring fenced for enforcement. One chance to comply or the dog is removed to kennels and a fine issued - a bit like car tax - the fine paid and a valid license and insurance in place before the dog is released. There will be some hard luck stories and potentially some 'innocent' dogs PTS to start with but in saying that, PTS is never a welfare issue.
Dogs have to be on a short lead unless they have a certified minimum level of training in public places.
Breeders and rescues should have more responsibilities in law to ascertain where their dogs go and a lifelong obligation to either take the dog back or pay a hefty fee to another organisation for them to fulfil their obligations. Rescues to have a legal liability to responsibly rehome and a need to document their decision making. That would limit any 'misunderstandings' between new owners and the rescue. Rescues should also be licensed with minimum standards.
In return, with these controls in place dog walkers should be given areas that they can use freely. No more blanket bans of dogs in public spaces such as parks unless another space is made for them very locally. Complaints about dogs to be treated fairly with a right of appeal and a move away from the current hysteria about certain breeds/types.
If only I ruled the world...
AmyMay
Situation normal
Yep
cbmcts
Well-Known Member
Yes but dogs with cropped ears can be imported. All the dogs I know with cropped ears had them done abroad - allegedly
splashgirl45
Lurcher lover
I’m glad she was found. A friend shared her missing post. I thought she was gorgeous
agree, she looked like a nice natured dog and im glad she was recovered but if i saw her being walked in my area i would keep my little terriers on leads and go the other way, she could do significant damage if she felt like it..i still think we cant ban certain breeds but do need more controls for any dog who has an aggressive nature and is not safe around people or other dogs
Smitty
Well-Known Member
Stolen with the intention of what I wonder.
stangs
Well-Known Member
Agree that breeders should have more of a legal responsibility in where their dogs end up, which hopefully would reduce the amount of 'breeders' that have popped up recently making money off their bitches, but where in the country do rescues not responsibly rehome? Maybe it's just my area, but all of mine have very high standards - I'm yet to find a single rescue that would rehome to me, and I don't think I'd be a bad home.
bonny
Well-Known Member
Selling on, these dogs are worth thousands
Pearlsasinger
Up in the clouds
I would hope that you would put your dogs on a lead when you see me and my Labs. My dogs don't approach others and I don't expect other owners to allow theirs to approach mine either.
skinnydipper
Well-Known Member
and if anyone wants a mastiff/cane corso, she is a snip at £12,345
From the ad "This dog breed is known for its intelligence and loyalty to owners family and friends but will protect from predators"
Hmm, predators - in Essex?
From the ad "This dog breed is known for its intelligence and loyalty to owners family and friends but will protect from predators"
Hmm, predators - in Essex?
stangs
Well-Known Member
There must be some elusive Essex lions around that only locals know about. That would explain why I've just seen a Cane Corso x Boerboel for sale in the area too.
some show
Well-Known Member
This was the post from Hope Rescue about the guy from Cardiff who was recently prosecuted regarding his 'pocket bullies', who were all having their ears cropped, and I've seen numerous others on instagram/facebook who just seem to be getting away with it (and selling the pups for a fortune). I wonder whether it's some unscrupulous vets who agree to do this or the breeders themselves do it?
This sentence was very telling: 'One dog in particular, Gryff, who was described by the breeder as the future of his breeding line, was referred to a specialist vets and was shown to suffer from a number of inherited conditions including hydrocephalus and curvature of the spine. He struggles to walk on hard surfaces and his legs will often give way.' Great breeding, there.
This sentence was very telling: 'One dog in particular, Gryff, who was described by the breeder as the future of his breeding line, was referred to a specialist vets and was shown to suffer from a number of inherited conditions including hydrocephalus and curvature of the spine. He struggles to walk on hard surfaces and his legs will often give way.' Great breeding, there.
cbmcts
Well-Known Member
It's not a given just because it's a big dog that it's aggressive. I think that there should be more of an opt in that we let our dogs interact with random dogs rather than the common assumption that our dogs should/can mix with all and sundry unless told otherwise. Yes it's lovely to see a pack of dogs playing together but far too often there are all sorts of issues caused by dogs bounding up to others and playing in packs. You're relying on all present being able to read their dogs and other dogs body language and have the control and training in place to intervene before it all goes badly wrong. IME sadly that is rare. I have a dog who wants to be friends with everyone and everything but it's both rude and too high risk to allow him to go up to other dogs without clear owner agreement. Even then, lots of people say their dog is friendly and one look will tell you it's really not!
It's a small minority of rescues that do not evaluate their dogs properly before rehoming and do not do their due diligence on applicants. I see it in breed rescues, especially those who rehome directly from the original home to a new home as well as the foreign dog rescues. It is often to owners who have previously had a dog from them, maybe quite a few years before and who knows if their circumstances (health/children/other animals in the home) have changed since then? But no new home check is done... Then there's the applicants who talk a good talk, manage to hide all sorts during the checks and then kick off big time to the rescue and on social media when the dog does exactly what they were told it might do. Good documentation would protect the rescue in those circumstances and it might make potential applicants think a little harder if they had to sign paperwork that laid out the good and the bad about this particular dog. I'm not especially confident about that though...