twiggy2
Well-Known Member
The ban wont come into place in Scotland in the new year unless things change
Another fatal dog attack
- Thread starter SilverLinings
- Start date
CorvusCorax
'It's only a laugh, no harm done'
It's more difficult to get insurance in RoI than in NI and GB, IME, certainly for some breeds, some dogs over a certain age (not ancient!) and I think trainers/club can struggle as well sometimes as there are very few options.
asmp
Well-Known Member
And another one
Sheffield dog attack: Boy, 12, seriously injured by bully XL
Police detain two dogs seen "reacting aggressively" at a property in Firth Park, Sheffield.
www.bbc.co.uk
splashgirl45
Lurcher lover
Once again an attack in the home, how can this be stopped? I still think too many people have no idea what any dog is capable of and treat them like babies, we need some sort of public announcement to explain how to behave around dogs and warning that NO dog however big or small should be trusted especially around the very young or very old .. it seems that common sense is in very short supply in parts of the dog owning public…
skinnydipper
Well-Known Member
Today on fb there was a photo of a rescue dog that the family had had 3 days. It was lying with its head on the baby's head.
splashgirl45
Lurcher lover
And they wonder why these dogs are attacking in the home, there’s no hope !!
I'm Dun
Well-Known Member
But its only a tiny minorty of dogs who attack people. Some do have bad starts, but most seem to have inbuilt temperament issues. Both of mine could live with an utter idiot and they wouldnt bite someone. All of my dogs have been like that, even the rescues. Clearly some of that is luck, but I imagine a bigger part is the breeds and type I like.
I dont know how its fixed. There are clearly many people capable of owning breeds of dog with the power and possibly breeding to bite, but how do you know who they are? Crappy breeders dont care.
And quite clearly rescues need to be doing a better job. I am sick of seeing them desperately trying to offload XL bullies before the ban comes in. Its incredibly sad for the dogs, but they need to be having them PTS rather than rehoming surely? Its not just XL bullies though, the amount of ads you see with a huge list of behavioural issues. The people capable of managing them are thin on the ground, its much better for everyone, esp the dog to be humanely PTS rather than be passed around and/or bite/kill someone.
CorvusCorax
'It's only a laugh, no harm done'
I know a longtime breeder, exhibitor and judge of over 30 years who I had to explain to that the dog they were holding/had just taken on, was deeply unhappy/stressed and was on the verge of biting someone (reason for rehoming in first place) and to stop letting people approach it.
They genuinely didn't realise. When someone like that can't read subtle body language, what hope does the average not-very-doggy person have, when they bring a large, powerful animal into their home?
They genuinely didn't realise. When someone like that can't read subtle body language, what hope does the average not-very-doggy person have, when they bring a large, powerful animal into their home?
Ratface
Well-Known Member
I'm 77 and won't have another dog. This is because I have M E and, due to that, have limited physical energy. I've always had GSD's or lurchers (and a one-off Afghan Hound!) and spent a lot of time and money on training, excercise and ensuring that all their needs were fully met. I'm not a fan of small dogs as I've had some bad experiences with them.
I know my current physical limitations. I miss having a dog but I accept that my overall circumstances rule it out.
Madam Carrie Cat doesn't want one either . . .
skinnydipper
Well-Known Member
Somebody on fb was offering to drive xl bullies to Scotland in their van, 4 crates, with others joining in to say they could take some. It didn't say where they were going to, just people volunteering to help with transport.
I'm Dun
Well-Known Member
Its absolute madness. The documentary was a brilliant example. Big loveable puppy desparetely needs a home, hes so lovely, perfect pet etc, and then it ends up PTS when it became aggressive. It makes me want to bang my head off the wall.
Rescues seem so hung up on helping individual dogs, when what they need to do is take a broader look at helping the life of the majority of dogs instead. Dont rehome dogs with an unknown or unsettled history that have the potential to kill people. Dont fob off dogs with serious issues. Invest the time in rehoming the nice dogs that make easy pets that any numpty can manage, because lets be honest, most of us arent professional dog trainers, and even if we are, theres every other person we meet on a walk to deal with as well.
marmalade76
Well-Known Member
What was the documentary and where can I find it?
CorvusCorax
'It's only a laugh, no harm done'
Regular reminder that you will not see the true picture with ANY dog, temperament wise, until about 18-36 months, which is when genetics and the impact of early imprinting will out.
This is why there are so many posts saying 'my puppy is perfect and does everything and recalls' and then a few months later 'my dog is a ratbag and won't come back'. I've seen extremely skilled, experienced people pick out puppies for a particular job and end up having to wash them because that early promise did not materialise. Pet dogs are no different and they are being chosen on the basis of cuteness or colour or how many are left etc, not 'how is it with loud noises and rapid movements', which to me, is pretty important in a busy, family home. Pretty much all of my dogs until this current one have been rejected by other people, I tested the litter extensively over three sessions and had pick of the females - but her sister, who I put out of the pile almost immediately, has eclipsed them all, in terms of competition results, and she was one of the last to be sold. My very confident, ballsy little puppy has become extremely circumspect about things she does and does not like, in adulthood and needs to be worked very carefully. It can be luck of the draw if you know your lines inside out, and most people don't, and in these cases, the stakes are so much higher than whether they can score more points.
This is why there are so many posts saying 'my puppy is perfect and does everything and recalls' and then a few months later 'my dog is a ratbag and won't come back'. I've seen extremely skilled, experienced people pick out puppies for a particular job and end up having to wash them because that early promise did not materialise. Pet dogs are no different and they are being chosen on the basis of cuteness or colour or how many are left etc, not 'how is it with loud noises and rapid movements', which to me, is pretty important in a busy, family home. Pretty much all of my dogs until this current one have been rejected by other people, I tested the litter extensively over three sessions and had pick of the females - but her sister, who I put out of the pile almost immediately, has eclipsed them all, in terms of competition results, and she was one of the last to be sold. My very confident, ballsy little puppy has become extremely circumspect about things she does and does not like, in adulthood and needs to be worked very carefully. It can be luck of the draw if you know your lines inside out, and most people don't, and in these cases, the stakes are so much higher than whether they can score more points.
SilverLinings
Well-Known Member
It's linked in then talked about from post 3237 onwards. It is a BBC documentary that is on iPlayer:
BBC One - BBC Wales Investigates, Dogs on Death Row: Will the Bully Ban Work?
After several fatal attacks, will the new ban on XL bully dogs solve the problem?
blackcob
🖖
*wails in 'but I did my research'* 
skinnydipper
Well-Known Member
If we are talking about rescues, some dogs that people reject or get overlooked turn out to be brilliant dogs when given a chance.
Dogs don't always show themselves in their best light in what for some can be a very stressful environment but blossom in the right home.
Dogs don't always show themselves in their best light in what for some can be a very stressful environment but blossom in the right home.
SilverLinings
Well-Known Member
I think most pet puppy buyers think 'what you see is what you get' and are then massively surprised when the puppy either changes as soon as it's removed from the litter and taken to a strange home, or changes around the 18month mark as it's true personality starts to come out.
I've only had one dog who didn't change at all (or not noticeably), but she was also the only one I've had that was bred by a friend of mine and therefore she regularly saw me before leaving the litter, plus I knew her mother from a puppy and she behaved in a very similar way. Most dogs I've had from puppies have changed a bit as they've grown up, but I have had one who changed a lot. She was the boldest puppy in the litter, but grew into a nervous youngster and I had to put a lot of work into making her feel secure in different situations. She was the biggest softy though and always wanted to please; in retrospect I think she was bolder in the litter as she had to assert herself as she was one of the smallest and it was quite a rowdy household. When she came to me she (hopefully) felt no need to assert herself all the time, so reverted to her natural personality and let me be the one to protect her from things.
Clodagh
Well-Known Member
And I knew a red merle would perfectly match my three piece suite.*wails in 'but I did my research'*
Cortez
Tough but Fair
Whilst agreeing with selection advice above, I've always also just worked with what we get and accepted that dogs, like horses (and people) are who they are. You cannot make any one of them into something that they are not, but can always put in the work and the training. If that doesn't work then responsible decisions have to be taken (only happened once).
CorvusCorax
'It's only a laugh, no harm done'
I've owned my young female's father for almost 13 years. I watched her mother training and trialling and interacted with her socially. But some things are still 'wow, I've never seen that before'
CorvusCorax
'It's only a laugh, no harm done'
Absolutely, I'm not a washer outer, if they come here, they don't leave, all of my dogs' quirks over the years have been managed (you can't train out genetics) and if they can't be managed, I don't agree with passing the problem on to someone else to deal with.
Clodagh
Well-Known Member
Completely agree. Although my 5 are all well bred Labradors they are like chalk and cheese, training wise.
Clodagh
Well-Known Member
Unless they are spaniels
CorvusCorax
'It's only a laugh, no harm done'
Unless they are spaniels
I have the debate all the time, the men will say 'if I move it on now, the dog is young, I won't get too attached, this sport is hard enough without wasting hours of training on a dog that might not work out'. Which is fine, because that's how I got the best dog I ever had and he very much worked out
marmalade76
Well-Known Member
It's linked in then talked about from post 3237 onwards. It is a BBC documentary that is on iPlayer:
BBC One - BBC Wales Investigates, Dogs on Death Row: Will the Bully Ban Work?
After several fatal attacks, will the new ban on XL bully dogs solve the problem?www.bbc.co.uk
Cheers.
Clodagh
Well-Known Member
But it worked out better for you and the dog. Sometimes dogs do better on a new home. If I’d kept the spaniels they’d be kennelled and work but no fun, love stuff. They are spoiled rotten, still work but are family dogs in their new lives.I have the debate all the time, the men will say 'if I move it on now, the dog is young, I won't get too attached, this sport is hard enough without wasting hours of training on a dog that might not work out'. Which is fine, because that's how I got the best dog I ever had and he very much worked out
skinnydipper
Well-Known Member
I'm lucky in that I've got along with my dogs and haven't had to make the decision to rehome. I can't imagine living with a dog I didn't really like. As I have said before it isn't fair to the dog who will know and if the dog can be rehomed to a more suitable home then it is the best decision for all concerned.
I think sometimes people feel theirs is the only home and no-one could do better but you only have to see the number of rescue and rehomed dogs happily settled in a new home to know that isn't true.
webble
Well-Known Member
Yes I have seen someone posting on a lot of rescue threads saying could they swap dogs with scottish rescues. If they had their way the scottish rescues would just be full of these XL dogs
CorvusCorax
'It's only a laugh, no harm done'
Or you get told, by a rescue 'nobody wants a dog like that'. In that case, not good with other dogs or small furries, not great with strange people, propensity to chase livestock. I appreciated their honesty and would not have dreamt of not informing them of these issues. I have rehomed one dog and she went on to live a very long and happy life. The rest have stayed or been PTS. Back to the point of the thread, in the context, passing on a dog with any aggression/unstable temperament or bite history, particularly if you (anyone) don't specify it, is incredibly dangerous.
skinnydipper
Well-Known Member
I was talking about dogs that people just haven't got along with. I wasn't thinking of dogs who didn't make the grade in a specialist sport.