cauda equina
Well-Known Member
Pit bull terrier then
Another fatal dog attack
- Thread starter SilverLinings
- Start date
Cortez
Tough but Fair
The bull breeds are all descended from bull baiting dogs, originally used to seize cattle by the nose and hold them for slaughter, probably since Roman times and certainly since the medieval period. Bull baiting (and bear baiting, and other misfortunate creatures, including horses) became a popular spectator sport in Tudor times. The shorter muzzle and massive jaw was bred in to facilitate a better grip.
CorvusCorax
Justified & Ancient
I agree and I know we're going round in circles, but just to remind folk that it's the terrier blood that brings the tenacity and fighting spirit. I don't know why people are surprised that a (particularly a native breed to these islands) terrier would be able to take on and kill a much bigger adversary.
Errin Paddywack
Well-Known Member
Those are English Bull terriers.
"I thought Bull Terriers are a different, smaller, Roman nosed thing?"
"I thought Bull Terriers are a different, smaller, Roman nosed thing?"
KittenInTheTree
Well-Known Member
There are already several large breeds of terrier. Airedales, Black Russians, Kerry Blues, and Standard and Giant Schnauzers, for example.I'm obviously being silly, but TBH these days it probably wouldn't surprise me all that much if someone thought it would be a good idea to breed giant terriers, and then we really would be in trouble
DabDab
Ah mud, splendid
Exactly. It doesn't take much knowledge of the breed heritage of these animals to tell you that breeding them to also be of substantial size was going to produce a worryingly formidable animal.
I love terriers but they are not guardian, retrieving or herding animals, they are hunting animals, bred to be comfortable in the thick of a scrap with the tenacity to finish the job.
And the guy who started the breed saying that he was trying to breed the terrier instincts out of the pitbull...Well personally I think he was in cloud cookoo land - trying to inbreed your way out of terrier characteristics is frankly the scribblings of a madman
CorvusCorax
Justified & Ancient
The problem with trying to breed anything in or out is that you'll have a few generations of wastage with one or two suitable for breeding in every litter, if you're lucky.
Back in the day the ones not for breeding were culled/neutered/not bred from. Now they seem to get sold for lots of money into pet homes and often get bred anyway.
Back in the day the ones not for breeding were culled/neutered/not bred from. Now they seem to get sold for lots of money into pet homes and often get bred anyway.
twiggy2
Well-Known Member
I am sorry but at an average of 15kg these dogs are hardly bred to look aggressive. Yes they are terriers, they will kill prey it doesn't mean they will hurt people or other dogs.
Dogs left to their own devices are a risk and this breed are hardly renown for being an issue.
Where I used to live the farmers boxer used to regularly kill badgers and feral cats, she was no risk to people or dogs and it wouldn't make me say the breed were a worry. She was bored and the owner was a fool.
No they are a completely different breed, bull terrier is short for English bull terrier and they don't have a negative following possibly because they are complete clowns, aloof in general and possibly less tolerant of idiots than the bull breeds.
marmalade76
Well-Known Member
That's an English Bull Terrier, a Bull's Eye dog as I call them (from Oliver!)
The only bull breed I actually like.
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CanteringCarrot
Well-Known Member
Ok so what is a "Bull Terrier" then? If that's an "English Bull Terrier"
I think I am confused re how people are using this terminology.
skinnydipper
Well-Known Member
I think it might help if people say which bull terrier they mean, eg Pitbull terrier, Staffordshire bull terrier, English bull terrier.
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marmalade76
Well-Known Member
A Staffie is a bull terrier, so is the Pit Bull.
The various new Bully types/breeds coming from the US are reported to have Pit Bull Terriers as their foundation so the XL is a supersized Bull Terrier and technically already illegal here as Pit Bull crosses.
CanteringCarrot
Well-Known Member
I agree.
Yes, this I know.
It's just when people say "bull terrier" it's so general and/or makes me think English Bull Terrier, but I guess I should not think that if there is no English before the Bull. Sometimes we've (in real life) just called them Bull Terriers (minus the English) so I think that's why I was thinking that.
Perhaps a dense me problem.
Then again sometimes in the convo, specifics may be best.
marmalade76
Well-Known Member
islander
Well-Known Member
My very large Airedale bitch, years ago, was extremely placid until she was about 2 when she had a fight with another bitch, a golden retriever. I think they were after the same stick in the woods. The owner and l kept them well apart after that.
Later in life she was uncertain with very small dogs, perhaps she thought they were vermin. I muzzled her on walks then.
She was always extremely well behaved with people however.
l think the terrier instinct is always there and a big one can do a lot of damage.
Later in life she was uncertain with very small dogs, perhaps she thought they were vermin. I muzzled her on walks then.
She was always extremely well behaved with people however.
l think the terrier instinct is always there and a big one can do a lot of damage.
skinnydipper
Well-Known Member
I'm glad nobody told my dog that's how she should be. She was everyone's friend, canine and human. Very enthusiastic and eager to please.
DabDab
Ah mud, splendid
I think generally people are referring to bull terriers as a group - all the breeds originally created by mixing old English bulldog with terriers, originally intended for bull baiting. Where the original English bulldogs came from, iirc, is unclear. Mastiffs were probably the starting point, but what they mixed in to get a smaller, faster dog is unclear, and when you look at old paintings of English bulldogs they look very much like the pitbulls of today (and bear little resemblance to the modern English bulldog).
And then the other motivation behind the victorian terrier-bull mixes was fashion. They were the cockapoos of their day, so, particularly in the case of the early EBTs, there was a lot of other dog breeds added in to give the more refined look (and temperament?) to them. Whereas the breeding of Staffies around the same time seemed to be more focused on the dog fighting market than the fashionable pet market.
skinnydipper
Well-Known Member
It is interesting to see how the conformation of the EBT has changed over the years.
100 years ago.
100 years ago.
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marmalade76
Well-Known Member
Can see the terrier in it, looks like a butch jack Russell.
CanteringCarrot
Well-Known Member
islander
Well-Known Member
English Bull Terriers (EBTs) can be lovely, l have known several, especially good with people, as are Staffies, but they do try to finish fights if they are in one.
l think their small deep-set eyes make it difficult for people to ‘read’ them, they often seem expressionless though of course they are giving off signals by stance, tail, growling etc.
My sister had one which didn't like other dogs approaching but the family discovered that she was obsessed with carrying a car hubcap around with her and wouldn’t drop this for any dog. In her case the problem was solved.
l think their small deep-set eyes make it difficult for people to ‘read’ them, they often seem expressionless though of course they are giving off signals by stance, tail, growling etc.
My sister had one which didn't like other dogs approaching but the family discovered that she was obsessed with carrying a car hubcap around with her and wouldn’t drop this for any dog. In her case the problem was solved.
CanteringCarrot
Well-Known Member
The car hubcap got me 
I mean, whatever works!
I mean, whatever works!
islander
Well-Known Member
Yes, she loved her hubcaps, she went through quite a few in her long life and liked to play frisbee with them too. When she was very old her teeth were just little stumps though. She didn’t seem to have pain or to find it difficult to eat however.
skinnydipper
Well-Known Member
Basildon Dogs Trust carer rushed to hospital after dog attack at rehoming centre
The incident in Nevendon Road, Wickford, saw a canine carer at Dogs Trust Rehoming centre suffer several injuries at around 4.41pm on October 5.
SilverLinings
Well-Known Member
I wonder whether that attack will have an effect on any charity's/re-homing centre's policies regarding the re-homing of XLBs, especially in cases where the dog's full history is not known.
AmyMay
Situation normal
Any that go in to rescue should be put down. No ifs, no buts.
SilverLinings
Well-Known Member
I think that would be the sensible approach, as surely with any rescue the charity cannot know a dog's full history, or even whether anything they have been told by the previous owner is true. Obviously this applies to all breeds, but as has been discussed on this thread the XLB is particularly powerful, gives little warning of an attack and appears to be predisposed to aggression.
I wonder if the worker being attacked will make some charities realise that even if they don't like (for whatever reason) the idea of PTS physically healthy dogs they may end up in a big legal mess if they rehome an XLB that causes serious harm or death to someone in it's new home.
AmyMay
Situation normal
Well given that XL’s are imminently to be a banned breed, I can’t quite get my head around any rescue trying to re-home one.
cauda equina
Well-Known Member
Surely pts is better than a whole life spent in kennels
twiggy2
Well-Known Member
The dogs going into rescue have to be assessed to decide what breed they are, the first member of staff to see them cannot be solely responsible for deciding what breed they are.
The dogs trust had been pro active in offering free muzzle training opportunities for XL bullies, other establishments to my knowledge haven't, let's hope this doesn't put and end to that.
I feel for the member of staff it must be terrible.
The dogs trust had been pro active in offering free muzzle training opportunities for XL bullies, other establishments to my knowledge haven't, let's hope this doesn't put and end to that.
I feel for the member of staff it must be terrible.