Emily King crowdfunding?

[Scoti1420]

If she wants to crowdfund she is entitled to, and if people want to give her money, that's their choice. But she has promised things (yard visits/course walks) that she can't deliver. For example, if I paid money, she has stated as part of the deal that I can go behind-the-scenes, pop into stables and coursewalk on ALL his big events. Do you genuinely think I can go up to her at Badminton or the Olympics and hang around for the day as promised?

Tempted to donate 50p and then ask for a wristband for stable access at WEGS/Badminton/Olympics etc in however many years! Am sure that will go down well

 

[Cecile]

She has managed to secure the money and horse

http://www.horseandhound.co.uk/news/im-humbled-support-emily-kings-crowdfunding-secures-ride-654342

 

[Nancykitt]

I'm assuming that the private investors had agreed, in advance, to make up the 'shortfall'. I wonder if they had agreed the maximum value of that shortfall? So was it a case of 'see how much the public will shell out for you if you promise them 'owner privileges' and we'll make up the rest, up to a value of £x?'

I wasn't impressed with this idea to start off with and I think I'm actually less impressed now, especially if the private investors could have afforded the full 40k in the first place (although I suppose we'll never know). I suspect she always knew she was going to get this horse one way or another so I'm dismayed that she turned to the public and promised a whole range of daft undeliverables.

One lady has donated £10 and is actually apologising for not being able to give more but 'times are difficult' at the moment. Her money, her decision and all that but this really does grate a little with me. I don't deny anyone a privileged lifestyle but if I was in such a fortunate position as EK then I would definitely feel guilty that someone who is not financially comfortable is actually giving their precious resources to me.

The 'Rich Kids' video is cringeworthy and gives the impression that there comes a point when these people actually expect to have everything provided for them. She mentions tack, feed, vehicles...things that most of us have to save for or make sacrifices in order to have. It's made me have a lot more respect for grass roots eventers who work hard and give everything because they are not yet at that level of sponsorship.

 

[ihatework]

I'm assuming that the private investors had agreed, in advance, to make up the 'shortfall'. I wonder if they had agreed the maximum value of that shortfall? So was it a case of 'see how much the public will shell out for you if you promise them 'owner privileges' and we'll make up the rest, up to a value of £x?'

I wasn't impressed with this idea to start off with and I think I'm actually less impressed now, especially if the private investors could have afforded the full 40k in the first place (although I suppose we'll never know). I suspect she always knew she was going to get this horse one way or another so I'm dismayed that she turned to the public and promised a whole range of daft undeliverables.

One lady has donated £10 and is actually apologising for not being able to give more but 'times are difficult' at the moment. Her money, her decision and all that but this really does grate a little with me. I don't deny anyone a privileged lifestyle but if I was in such a fortunate position as EK then I would definitely feel guilty that someone who is not financially comfortable is actually giving their precious resources to me.

The 'Rich Kids' video is cringeworthy and gives the impression that there comes a point when these people actually expect to have everything provided for them. She mentions tack, feed, vehicles...things that most of us have to save for or make sacrifices in order to have. It's made me have a lot more respect for grass roots eventers who work hard and give everything because they are not yet at that level of sponsorship.

I’m completely with you. It does the public perception of eventing no good whatsoever.

I have no issue with her trying to syndicate a horse at whatever price she feels justified asking BUT it has to be a business transaction with clear and transparent contractual obligations. There are so many different models this could be based on but they would require a little bit of administrative effort on her part, and why would she want to do that if she can get a free ride on the back of internet begging?

I do wonder if this might come back to haunt her down the line.

 

[ycbm]

She has managed to secure the money and horse

http://www.horseandhound.co.uk/news/im-humbled-support-emily-kings-crowdfunding-secures-ride-654342

And yet her just giving page continues to collect money to buy him, with no update. Surely that's fraud?

 

[SpringArising]

And yet her just giving page continues to collect money to buy him, with no update. Surely that's fraud?

You can't close a JG page for at least 30 days so she has to keep it open. Someone said back in the thread that any further money raised will be used for his upkeep.

 

[Nancykitt]

You can't close a JG page for at least 30 days so she has to keep it open. Someone said back in the thread that any further money raised will be used for his upkeep.

I've just re-read the JG page and I could be missing it but it doesn't explicitly say that any money taken over and above will be used for upkeep. It just says that 66% of the money has been raised, so someone who visits that page first may not even know that the horse has been purchased and will continue to give towards its purchase. There could well be people who would happily give towards buying the horse but wouldn't be happy to fund its upkeep.
Sorry but I think this is very misleading. She has updated her FB page so surely the first thing to be updated would be the JG page itself? It may not be possible to close the page yet but it is definitely possible to post an update.

 

[stencilface]

You can't close a JG page for at least 30 days so she has to keep it open. Someone said back in the thread that any further money raised will be used for his upkeep.

Any further money should be donated to a horse charity, not to pay for the upkeep of a horse that gets free feed already, and goodness knows what else.

The cheek to ask for money for this off joe public when their funds would be better spent on coping with the products of the horse crisis in the UK such as overbreeding and cruelty, such as cinders, a pony that was set on fire and left for dead

 

[SpringArising]

I've just re-read the JG page and I could be missing it but it doesn't explicitly say that any money taken over and above will be used for upkeep.

It's on her Instagram. It says 'The minimum duration of the JG page is 30 days. So I'm unable to close it right away. Any extra donations will go towards his running costs'.

 

[abb123]

I don't understand why she didn't just sell something tangible like a course walk or an organised yard visit. E.g £30 for a course walk at major event with some details on how to book etc. I suppose that would just be too much hard work and not have the sob story..

 

[ycbm]

You can't close a JG page for at least 30 days so she has to keep it open. Someone said back in the thread that any further money raised will be used for his upkeep.

There is an update function on just giving where she should tell people what the situation now is. It has STILL not been updated and people are donating today under false pretences. Not everyone is on Instagram or reading this thread, and that is fraud.

 

[milliepops]

Any further money should be donated to a horse charity, not to pay for the upkeep of a horse that gets free feed already, and goodness knows what else.

The cheek to ask for money for this off joe public when their funds would be better spent on coping with the products of the horse crisis in the UK such as overbreeding and cruelty, such as cinders, a pony that was set on fire and left for dead

^^ agree!

 

[Ambers Echo]

The more I think about this the more distasteful I find it. She now has private investors. She could have syndictated the horse in the first place. I agree with whoever said she was having the horse one way or another. She probably already knew she had options - but she certainly knows now that she will be able to buy him anyway so to carry on accepting donations for his 'running costs' is outrageous. She may not have 40k readily to hand (though I am sure she could have found it with a little effort) but she can DEFINITELY afford to look after her own horses! Taking more money off the public is just appalling in circumstances like these.

 

[Nancykitt]

Ah right - so the update about excess funds going on upkeep is on Instagram. But it's not on the JG page and there's not really any excuse for her not posting it there. I suspect there will be people like me who haven't seen the instagram account and if the JG page was the first thing I'd seen I wouldn't know that the £40,000 has now been raised.
It's really poor that the JG page has not been updated. People are still giving money, I know it's their money, I know it's their right to do as they please with it, but I still think there's a chance that some will be misled here, thinking that they are contributing towards the cost of the horse.
IMO taking money for upkeep is even worse. Even if she claimed not to have the funds to buy the horse, I simply cannot believe that she doesn't have the means to keep the animal. (And if she doesn't, she shouldn't have bought it!)

 

[Nancykitt]

The more I think about this the more distasteful I find it. She now has private investors. She could have syndictated the horse in the first place. I agree with whoever said she was having the horse one way or another. She probably already knew she had options - but she certainly knows now that she will be able to buy him anyway so to carry on accepting donations for his 'running costs' is outrageous. She may not have 40k readily to hand (though I am sure she could have found it with a little effort) but she can DEFINITELY afford to look after her own horses! Taking more money off the public is just appalling in circumstances like these.

Sorry AE, I think we cross posted! And we were obviously thinking the same thing.

 

[be positive]

The more I think about this the more distasteful I find it. She now has private investors. She could have syndictated the horse in the first place. I agree with whoever said she was having the horse one way or another. She probably already knew she had options - but she certainly knows now that she will be able to buy him anyway so to carry on accepting donations for his 'running costs' is outrageous. She may not have 40k readily to hand (though I am sure she could have found it with a little effort) but she can DEFINITELY afford to look after her own horses! Taking more money off the public is just appalling in circumstances like these.

I agree, she may not be able to stop the JG page but it can be updated and people can either continue to give knowing that it is going directly into her pocket, running costs, or she can pledge everything from the point she got the sponsors involved to go to charity or return it to the donor , she is going against the ethos of JG, it was set up with charitable organisations in mind not to raise funds for a professional who should be able to get the funds through their own contacts and ability, this may not technically be fraud but it is getting rather close in my view.

 

[SpringArising]

There is an update function on just giving where she should tell people what the situation now is. It has STILL not been updated and people are donating today under false pretences. Not everyone is on Instagram or reading this thread, and that is fraud.

You're speaking to me as if I agree with what's going on. I'm just the messenger!

I think the whole thing's ridiculous and I struggle to stand her.

 

[SpringArising]

Just read the comments on her FB page.

Heck of a lot of daft people out there who think they actually own a part of the horse...

 

[Nancykitt]

One person has donated £100 today and commented that they are very pleased to be part of the purchasing syndicate. Except, of course they are not. This is starting to feel a bit dodgy with people talking about fractional 'ownership' in any shape or form.
They need to understand that this is a gift and that legally EK and the investors could sell that horse next week, next month or whenever and pocket the money.
The money for purchase was raised yesterday so the person who posted might be part of a haylage buying syndicate but that's about it - they are not part of a horse buying syndicate at all and have no legal interest in that horse whatsoever.

 

[ihatework]

It’s left a sufficiently uneasy enough feeling that I have actually reported the crowd funding page. I desperately hope she was just a bit hasty, naive and lazy rather than unsavoury alternatives.

 

[Puff]

At the very least it’s poorly thought through - the ‘what ifs’, what if we raise more than needed. All sounds rushed and dare i say it, greedy

 

[Nancykitt]

It’s left a sufficiently uneasy enough feeling that I have actually reported the crowd funding page. I desperately hope she was just a bit hasty, naive and lazy rather than unsavoury alternatives.

I did think of putting a comment on the FB page asking for an update to be put on JG, mainly so that people seeing the JG page know that they are not part of an actual purchasing syndicate. It's so misleading that the page still says that 66% of the money has been raised and people donating are being led to believe that they will 'own' part of a horse (and yes, I'm astonished that people are saying this on FB).
However, I've noticed that some people on the FB don't seem to care that the horse has now been bought - they are asking if they can still chip in and receive a 'pack'. Sigh.

What's in the pack, I wonder? Perhaps some of the donations will be used to print out the hundreds of packs. So effectively people donating now will be paying for themselves and others to receive a photo of a horse, or something like that.

I wish I knew more of the legal position here. I'm pretty sure they'll be some very disappointed people in the future who actually believed that they owned a share in an eventer and that they could turn up at events to see him, etc. Some of those donating could actually be young kids who've persuaded their parents to donate because they believe they can buy a share in the horse. It would be good to warn people - but then again, another part of me says that if they are that daft, any advice would be wasted on them.

 

[frankster]

I wonder how this is viewed at BE?

 

[Tiddlypom]

Part quote from Miss King's FB page, posted yesterday.

'Please can all donators send an email to: ***********@outlook.com with your name, email address and home address. You will then each receive a welcome pack which will include Hobby’s Autumn event plan (where you can meet him), the dates of course walks and the dates of yard visits. Plus regular newsletters and updates throughout the years ahead.

The minimum duration of the JustGiving page is 30 days. So I’m unable to close it right away. Any extra donations will go towards his running costs.


Also - 100% of Hobby’s future winnings will go to charity.'

This is dodgier than a dodgy thing.

 

[highlandponygirl]

Part quote from Miss King's FB page, posted yesterday.

'Please can all donators send an email to: ***********@outlook.com with your name, email address and home address. You will then each receive a welcome pack which will include Hobby’s Autumn event plan (where you can meet him), the dates of course walks and the dates of yard visits. Plus regular newsletters and updates throughout the years ahead.

The minimum duration of the JustGiving page is 30 days. So I’m unable to close it right away. Any extra donations will go towards his running costs.


Also - 100% of Hobby’s future winnings will go to charity.'

This is dodgier than a dodgy thing.

Just out of curiosity, and hopefully not a dumb question as don't use JG but, how will she know who has donated and who hasn't? Can any old Tom, Dick or Harry send an email/address and claim they made a donation?

 

[Red-1]

From her facebook page...

...........Please keep checking my Instagram story over the next 12 hours and cast a vote for your favourite syndicate name!...........

...So is it a syndicate or not? Very confusing.

 

[Ambers Echo]

It's not a syndicate! She has already said winnings will go to charity not to syndicate members. It just sounds better to be part of a 'syndicate'.



She writes "I am desperately looking to find owners/ syndicate members to enable me to keep the ride on Hobby as he really is a horse of a lifetime" then says "I’m looking to crowdfund him"

I think that is really misleading. The first half makes it appear as though the horse will be owned by the syndicate leaving her 'with the ride' but she does not make it clear that people who contribute to the crowdfunding are NOT joining the syndicate but donating freely and she can sell the horse on for 500K in a few years if she wants.

 

[ycbm]

Just out of curiosity, and hopefully not a dumb question as don't use JG but, how will she know who has donated and who hasn't? Can any old Tom, Dick or Harry send an email/address and claim they made a donation?

Maybe I'll send my email address and tell her I made one of the anonymous donations on just giving!

 

[SpringArising]

It's not a syndicate! She has already said winnings will go to charity not to syndicate members. It just sounds better to be part of a 'syndicate'.



She writes "I am desperately looking to find owners/ syndicate members to enable me to keep the ride on Hobby as he really is a horse of a lifetime" then says "I’m looking to crowdfund him"

I think that is really misleading. The first half makes it appear as though the horse will be owned by the syndicate leaving her 'with the ride' but she does not make it clear that people who contribute to the crowdfunding are NOT joining the syndicate but donating freely and she can sell the horse on for 500K in a few years if she wants.

She's just young and ignorant as to what a syndicate actually is!

 

[claracanter]

Is it wrong of me to want to donate a few quid to see how badly the whole thing goes from the inside?

Just checked the JG page and there's still no updates in the Update Here section.