Elf On A Shelf
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I stayed out of that one. The boss put that post on the page for the nostalgic nature of it and most people obviously chose to ignore the less pleasant side of the race because things were done differently in those days.
Gordon Elliott
- Thread starter Clodagh
- Start date
I stayed out of that one. The boss put that post on the page for the nostalgic nature of it and most people obviously chose to ignore the less pleasant side of the race because things were done differently in those days.
Cherryblossom
Well-Known Member
I think the difficulty I have with this is that the racing fraternity claims to take good care of their horses. If that horse had died during a race Elliot would have been interviewed with a sad face talking about how upsetting this was for all involved. Instead it shows just how much contempt he has for the animals under his care.
AdorableAlice
Well-Known Member
I wonder if JP will leave his horses with Elliott. JP has such respect in the racing world.
It is not a surprise O'Leary isn't bothered, but JP is a very different man.
It is not a surprise O'Leary isn't bothered, but JP is a very different man.
Elf On A Shelf
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I have to say I would be disappointed if he didn't take them away from there. I can see why Chevely Park are waiting for the results of the investigation. They have some very good horses going to Cheltenham and moving them 2 weeks before is not a good idea but they will if they have to. I doubt the horses will return there next season regardless.
McGrools
Well-Known Member
He cant come to Cheltenham surely. The whole meeting would be totally overshadowed
brighteyes
Pooh-Bah
Not whilst cheerily waving the parts about, phoning a mate and being filmed. presumably!
I do not get why he had to sit on the poor creature. It was a pointless, distasteful and disrespectful idea.
I'm even sadder because I have one of these beautiful, intelligent, willing, 'ex-industry' animals.
AdorableAlice
Well-Known Member
I so hope you are right.
brighteyes
Pooh-Bah
My sons had occasion to bury a deceased horse some years ago. They asked if there was a towel available to place over the head as they laid it to rest, so soil didn't get in its eyes...
I am once again dismayed about how blatantly disrespectful some people are. He needs a damned good 'shake'.
I am once again dismayed about how blatantly disrespectful some people are. He needs a damned good 'shake'.
ester
Not slacking multitasking
I thought that might be part of the reason not to move them, if he isn't permitted to go can they run under someone else's name if they are already entered or no? Do they have to be with a trainer a particular length of time first?
Elf On A Shelf
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It used to be 14 days but I think it may only be 3 or 4 days now. So no the trainer who enters them doesn't have to be the one who runs them.
Kipper's Dick
Well-Known Member
I don't envy them either, but to my mind it must be along the lines of licence revocation. Even if it's to take effect at the end of this season. This man's behaviour is indicative of an attitude that speaks volumes about the man himself, and I can't see this attitude changing, although he may well try to hide it in the future. The IHRB and the BHA need to decide if they want this individual as a representative of the sport. A fine, even a hefty one, would be missing the point, somehow, wouldn't it?
Blondiecopper
Well-Known Member
That’s the worse part for me.
you know where you’re sitting.
I don’t buy the fact that he forgot where he was. It’s completely disrespectful to the owners of the horse and to the staff who looked after it day in day out.
JulesRules
Well-Known Member
To a certain extent, I'm in the camp that thinks once a life is extinguished, what remains is essentially for respectful disposal.
However, can anyone imagine a scenario in any other sport where the trainer decided to sit on the unfortunate body of an athlete who died whilst training?
However, can anyone imagine a scenario in any other sport where the trainer decided to sit on the unfortunate body of an athlete who died whilst training?
MyBoyChe
Well-Known Member
A fine, even a hefty one, is IMO, not the way to go here. He has some wealthy owners so it wouldnt impact on him in the way it would a smaller trainer. He needs a ban, although again, it will be his staff who will suffer the consequences
cauda equina
Well-Known Member
If other events are examined as a result of this (I'm thinking of the alleged fight in his 'bar') that might attract a stiffer penalty than what's in the photo
COldNag
Wasting my time successfully....
I know nothing about racing and honestly had never heard of him until this story.
I hadn't seen the photo until just now.
I have read his statement. I don't buy his version of events, they just don't add up.
It's really disgraceful and I hope he that owners will vote with their feet.
I hadn't seen the photo until just now.
I have read his statement. I don't buy his version of events, they just don't add up.
It's really disgraceful and I hope he that owners will vote with their feet.
Cortez
Tough but Fair
I am also in the "it's a dead body" camp, but he has been exceedingly stupid to do what he did. However banning him for life, etc. is a little over the top. It's not as if he has been exposed for being cruel to his horses. Bringing racing into disrepute, certainly, and he should be sanctioned for that and made an example of. The other stuff re bars and brawls is hardly life-shattering, and people's private shenanigans are just that; private.
Crazy_cat_lady
Well-Known Member
What's the LR?
I'm not a member of, but am browsing, a racing forum which id guess the main audience of is those who gamble. I'm annoyed to see most of them coming out in support of GE and saying how people are unnecessarily outraged and he shouldn't have a ban or horses taken away- not adding well to the image to be honest- shows what most punters think of the horses as well
https://theracingforum.co.uk/forums/topic/gordon-elliott-2/page/12/
The one who's user name has ship in seems especially unpleasant
Crazy_cat_lady
Well-Known Member
He should or at the very least get a long ban.
Unfortunately not a chance this happens especially with Tiger Roll and all the stories they could write about him winning 3 grand nationals on the horizon (personally I think TR should already be retired but unfortunately all his trainer and greedy owner care about is the publicity around 3 grand nationals potentially happening.) If it was a small trainer they'd get the book thrown at them. Not a chance one of the "big 4" gets this. Money talks...
Elf On A Shelf
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Here's what will happen if they ban him - he gets handed a ban, he appeals, he can carry on racing whilst on appeal. Appeals can take month's. By the end of the appeal he could "win" it and be handed a fine. Thus the authorities appease the public with an x month ban but it would also allow him to still race at the big meetings.
CCL - the LR is the Lucinda Russell Racing Facebook page. A couple of weeks ago she put up an old video of schooling at home, life in the yard and Oxo winning the Grand National way back when with Michael Scudamore.
CCL - the LR is the Lucinda Russell Racing Facebook page. A couple of weeks ago she put up an old video of schooling at home, life in the yard and Oxo winning the Grand National way back when with Michael Scudamore.
Kipper's Dick
Well-Known Member
Bringing racing into disrepute is the issue here, and needs severe penalty. His behaviour confirms what many (rightly or wrongly) believe. That racing is a numbers game, that horses are dispensable and are seen as commodities in a ruthless business. NH racing has serious PR work to do right now. And they could start by disassociating themselves from Elliott and trying to repair the considerable damage that he has done. Though I have a feeling that this episode is going to hang around racing for a long time and will be like the veritable turd that won't flush.
honetpot
Well-Known Member
I in the once your dead your dead camp, but we should have respect for both animals and humans, animals are often alive and then dead because of our needs and desires.
They are our servants, and a lot of people make their living from them, and they shouldn't forget that. After the other revelations this week, it doesn't give professional horsemen a good name.
doodle
Well-Known Member
It’s just awful. I kind of see the once they are gone it is just a shell but the lovely lady who collects the horses once they are gone takes time to say hello to them, call them by name and give them a stroke and a pat. It takes nothing to have a little respect.
From the little I have dealt with the racing industry the attitude I have come across is once they have decided they are no good they just want rid. There is always another horse to fill the stable. Once they are dead then move on to the next. I am not saying this is everyone in the industry just what I have personally come across.
From the little I have dealt with the racing industry the attitude I have come across is once they have decided they are no good they just want rid. There is always another horse to fill the stable. Once they are dead then move on to the next. I am not saying this is everyone in the industry just what I have personally come across.
Kipper's Dick
Well-Known Member
Oh thank you, honetpot, for posting that. He rode a winner for a very dear friend of mine once (on her wonderful homebred mare), and I got to meet him (briefly!) after the race. What a lovely guy.
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Crazy_cat_lady
Well-Known Member
What other revelations?
Bellaboo18
Well-Known Member
So, so very sad.
If this is how he sees the horses he trains, he's missing out on something pretty amazing.
I hope his punishment is something he really feels.
If this is how he sees the horses he trains, he's missing out on something pretty amazing.
I hope his punishment is something he really feels.
Velcrobum
Well-Known Member
I have an ex-racehorse I bought via ROR website direct from the very very small string trainer. I was "interviewed" in depth as they wanted him to go to the best home that was suitable. They did not want him to go to someone who would school him some more get some results and sell for profit. They were horse people through and through all their horses are started correctly ie long-reined, lunged, go on the bit, hack alone, stand at a mounting block, do pole work/ show jump then learn to race. I got a basically schooled, well mannered bargain who is with me for life. There are many trainers who are of this mind set, then there are the Gordon Elliots and his main owner very very sadly.
doodle
Well-Known Member
It is maybe the difference between small and large strings. I contacted my horses trainer. He was plain rude to me, didn’t give 2 hoots about where the horse was now and actually couldn’t remember him despite only being out for a year and having him in training for 2 years.
Pearlsacarolsinger
Up in the clouds
I cannot speak for minesadouble or ycbm .
I have 3 times had a dog be pts on the operating table. I have not asked for the body to be returned or individual cremation, I do not want the ashes back, although I have asked for the collar and lead. As soon as the animal is dead , it's gone. Our dogs showed me that on the day that we had a 15 yr old Lab bitch pts at home, because she was terrified of the vets' surgery, having had to stay overnight previously. Vet did the deed with the Lab in front of the fire, with the other dogs out of the way. Then we let the other dogs in to see what had happened. They trampled all over the body, as if it were a rug, trying to get to talk to the vet. They would never have trampled on her when she was alive but a couple of minutes later, at most, and they knew that she wasn't there.
I, too have held horses to be shot, I usually go into the house for the winching, because I really don't want that to be my last memory of the horse - that certainly isn't a dignified/respectful process.
I wouldn't have sat on the dead horse, nor do I think that anyone else should but that is because I think of the owner, rather than because I think it is intrinsically wrong to sit on a dead horse. It is pretty obvious from the photo that the trainer was showing off to someone and that most definitely does make his actions wrong on that day.
I must admit that I am more concerned about living horses being treated properly than dead ones. It makes me very cross when I read on here about people riding horses when they know the tack doesn't fit, because they can't get an appointment with a saddle fitter. I would rather get het up about that tbh. But if my horse was in training with GE, I would be moving it pdq, because of the attitude, rather than because of the action, iyswim.
Steerpike
Well-Known Member
Good to see the BHA have banned him from running his horses here until the Irish racing board have finished the investigation