sbloom
Well-Known Member
The rocker was across the centre line at D/G.
Dressage Interesting study on conflict behaviours in dressage horses and scores
- Thread starter shortstuff99
- Start date
The rocker was across the centre line at D/G.
tristar
Well-Known Member
i`m not too sure about the rocker, the object is to stop correctly then move forwards in a powerful movement, well mine is anyway!
i`ve never liked seeing people backing for long distances either
not sure that reining back after a sliding halt is the true aim of rein back either
i`ve never liked seeing people backing for long distances either
not sure that reining back after a sliding halt is the true aim of rein back either
sbloom
Well-Known Member
Most classical bods at the time didn't want it removed. Surely you can move forwards out of it in any way you chose? The first is to walk forwards calmly, then the second was whatever it was...so you could use it to prove you could power away from it...
Gloi
Too little time, too much to read.
Or even someone who hacks a route full of gates regularly ?
eahotson
Well-Known Member
not all western riding is about reining.
tristar
Well-Known Member
tristar
Well-Known Member
no it is not, the reining back a long distance was something a rider trained in portugal did, i did not necessarily mean western
Cortez
Tough but Fair
It shows all of that, plus balance, trust, lightness, obedience, impulsion: all of it really. I am shocked that it's been removed.
tristar
Well-Known Member
the odd thing is how a horse just knows how to do it when it gets to a certain stage
Cortez
Tough but Fair
Not odd at all, as it's the ultimate test of engagement. Many, many people do not understand that, unfortunately.
j1ffy
Well-Known Member
The rocker or the rein-back? The rocker was before my time of watching dressage (would love to see it), the rein-back hasn’t been removed.
tristar
Well-Known Member
personaly i find it the strangest sensation of forwardness while going backwards and love that surge into trot when it `happens good`
Cortez
Tough but Fair
The shaukel, or rein-back 5 steps-forward five steps-rein-back five steps. It was a wonderful test of, well, everything.
j1ffy
Well-Known Member
That was definitely before my time, but I came to dressage late!
eahotson
Well-Known Member
What a fascinating exercise.
Gloi
Too little time, too much to read.
It surprises me how difficult some people I know who are riding dressage at medium or similar level find things like this. General manoeuvrability of the horse on the ground, backwards, forwards and sideways to do useful things when riding out or even to open and close the arena gate while mounted.
Cortez
Tough but Fair
TBF, a proper shaukel is a lot more than just reversing and going forwards. In Doma vaquera, Alta Escuela and WE (where it is also used) at the more advanced level it is often rein back, walk forwards, rein back, depart at trot or canter.
stangs
Well-Known Member
Where I've seen the schaukel mentioned in books, I've seen in described as 4 steps forward, 2 steps back, and repeat. Were there variants found in competition or was it always 5-5?
Cortez
Tough but Fair
There can be different numbers of steps, it doesn't really matter as a training exercise.
sbloom
Well-Known Member
Spelled schaukel just in case anyone can't find it, from a quick search it looks like it could be any number of steps as defined in that particular test. I think I remember 4-2-4 maybe, the other way around.
https://forums.horseandhound.co.uk/threads/schaukel-see-saw.811662/
https://forums.horseandhound.co.uk/threads/schaukel-see-saw.811662/
tristar
Well-Known Member
not something i would be doing, does not sound productive
sbloom
Well-Known Member
It's a test, not a developmental exercise but obviously if it was in a test it would be something people would be doing occasionally to check on progress, though I suspect the brilliant, biomechanically correct trainers would barely need to.
planete
Well-Known Member
I was taught to do it as a training exercise, in hand first.
sbloom
Well-Known Member
Good to know, I guess everything has its value if done correctly (and of course so many things that are harmful if done at the wrong time or in the wrong way...poles, backing up...all the stuff I see given to wonky horses...)
tristar
Well-Known Member
halt is the test i use, rein back is more about submission and straightness, forwardness, rocking is a futile concept, to me, therefore i would never use it for either, i see it as not rewarding the horse for its obedience and understanding, as you don`t need to teach rein back it is installed by forwardness.
i get annoyed by references to mechanics ,well and perfection, i am riding horses! i never think in those terms, more in being lost in the moment when riding, having good moments and glimpses of where the horse is going and purely if it feels good and right
bio something or other is not for me, yesterday my little rescue `asked`me if he could canter for the first time, i said please do! mind you it was a good speed!, he is part trotter and goes like the clappers, but his transition was good and canter felt lovely, but i don`t over think these things, i get lost in the fun, no mechanics here sorry!
sbloom
Well-Known Member
You are clearly an educated rider with good feel, when I rode I struggled with good feel, I could have done with being taught a lot more about biomechanics. Don't diss it just because you don't need it, however I do use the term in the loosest way, a horse moving without compensatory patterns is the main aim.
eahotson
Well-Known Member
A very good way of putting it.
Cortez
Tough but Fair
The "point" of all these exercises is not to have them as an end in themselves but as tests and building blocks towards the ultimate, they are all part of the endless quest for a goal of balance, lightness and ease, for both the horse and the rider. Modern dressage competition isn't that end goal BTW, Grand Prix is really just the completion of the "campaign" training; there are levels far beyond that and that is where exercises like the rein back, piaffe and pirouette are leading towards - the higher school and airs above the ground. I realise 99.9% of riders are not interested in that, but there is most definitely a point to the training and it's never futile.
tristar
Well-Known Member
but the rocker feels not right to me . i dislike the effect it has on the horses balance.
a good halt is an end to itself, and a test, also one the best foundations on which to build
a good halt is an end to itself, and a test, also one the best foundations on which to build
Cortez
Tough but Fair
Soto voce/whisper* perchance you may not be doing it quite as intended.......
Correctly executed, the shaukel will put the horse so deeply on his hocks it should be possible to perform a lançade directly out of it.